This one has grid lines.

http://209.211.71.58/ePrevueNet/eEasyPlanPrint.aspx?action=get-rplan-image

Sorry this might be easier.

Here is a link that might be useful: New Room/Kitchen plan

The link asks for a customer log-in...

I was only able to open your link in the original post. Your other links ask for a password. It looks like you are going to have really nice space. Are you working with your existing layout? Can windows be moved? If its all new cabinets, etc., I think the kitchen layout could be improved. But layout is not my strong point. Good Luck!

The link you provided has the ability to measure. The layout to me looks fine but it seems you have some pinch points with the overhang seating. I don;t know if the seats are shown as if someone is sitting in them or not. If not, then you only have about 2' between the seats and rug and seat and hutch. I'd suggest a rectangular rug and place the seating at the sides of the rug. I know you want to place them looking them at the fireplace but it makes it cramped. Also... the addition of the column is going to take away probably about 8" square somewhere. That may be a factor.

Thanks for the responses, sorry about the password thing. I will try to post a drawing of the specifics of the kitchen later, but have included some info below. I appreciate your input!

Some more info:

- This will be a new space (well old and new combined). Will be totally open except the column needed for support. Kitchen will be gutted and all new everything to be put in, so I pretty much have a blank slate there.

- Windows: The one in the kitchen over the counter and the one directly accross from it in the family room area will stay. The others can be moved, they will be in the new addition part.

- The rug and other furniture are not set in stone, since we don't have most of that yet. I just added to the drawing for space planning. I believe I made the rug a 9 x 12 but it could be smaller. The "fireplace" is actually an entertainment unit w/TV, so probably want to face that.

- Some kitchen specifics: Wall side/base starting from the right: 24" cabinet, 36" drawers, 18" drawers, 30" stove, 21" cabinet, 36" fridge cabinet.

- Island side: About 4' isle between island and wall cabinets; right now I have the island at about 54" wide. Starting from the right again: 24" cabinet, 30" sink base, 24" dishwasher, 18" trash bin. I have other cabinets behind the front row for support of countertop but all that has not been determined yet. Allowed a 15" overhang on the long side and a 12" overhang on the short side to the left.

According to the little measuring tool...
Corner of sofa side table to wall - 11"
Distance between corner of sofa and island - 1'3"
If island and table are in use, chef or other guests cannot reach outside deck because the in use furniture blocks every way to get there.
If island and table are in use, no one can use the aisle on that side of the island to do anything.

I wonder if you would want to try a "one wall" kitchen on the north wall (as drawn) placing a lengthly but not very fat table in front of it running in the same direction as the wall run, with a prep board on top on the kitchen side to raise the working height to something comfortable to you.

With the table being something like 38" x 96", the prep board shouldn't be small - maybe around 30"-36" long and 18" wide and 6"-ish tall. You get the working effect of an island - facing family and company, seating right in front of you for 5 normally and 8 if you wanted to. You get better end clearances because its smaller than the doubled up seating but still not great to the sofa. You don't HAVE TO maintain a large aisle between the table and the counter edge because it doesn't have cabinets to open or chairs to sit in.

But you'd have enough room for a large hutch, hunt board, welsh cupboard or buffet thing on the wall opposite the deck side - I'm guessing those two openings are doorways to the rest of the house?

I don't know if that voids one of the no move rules. I guessed the add-on is to the width of the space. I pretty sure that one of those two window openings on the top wall would need to move or be removed, too.

In any event, you might want to move the sliding glass door closer to the kitchen if you do the a wall plus table plan - put the door in a place that's easy for guests and for kitchen access if you plan to cook out frequently. Then maybe put a wider window unit for the family sitting area?

Hth

bmore... I'm really not sure I even know what you mean by a table with a prep board?? I've never heard of that.

As far as the furniture. I just placed the furniture in the picture for demo purposes. In real life we can move the furniture around to make it work.

My main concern is the island and the width, it may be too wide, but I can make it smaller. I can also make the aisle in the kitchen smaller. But I like the layout the way I have it and I do think it will work, it may need to be tweeked some is all.

I think your island is well-planned.
What I think is a little awkward is how your fridge/range/sink are all close together. I'm just wondering about maybe putting your range on the other side of your 18" of cabinets. You have 6 1/2' of counter on one side of the range and then only 21" on the other side between it and the fridge. It seems a little appliance-heavy to the left hand side. By moving the range over to the other side of the 18"of cabinets it balances out the wall a little better.
By spreading it out a bit it also gives more counter space areas for people to work at. Just my opinion.

blfenton... The problem is if I switch the 18" and the range that will put the range right in the middle of the window. I could reconfigure the cabinets on that side and maybe move the range right after the window, that would give me an extra foot to the left of the range. Except that would put my OTR microwave right next to the window and that might look a little funny. As far as work space for others, I still have the whole island for others to work at.

I thought you were asking for opinions about the layout and didn't realize that you only wanted them a specific issue. Maybe that's what the others were thinking too. Hopefully, this will get you a few more opinions on the topic you wanted.

A prep board is simply a large cutting board - extra thick, sometimes with legs. It provides a removable place to work - so the table can become the full table when needed. But on an everyday basis would seat people on 3 sides. I have seen photos of islands in Europe actually built that way - mostly a table with a raised area. I would post one if I only I remembered where they were.

I had much the same thoughts about multiple users as blfenton. The problem with helpers is that they need the ref, the water, prep tools, the micro, etc and everybody could get all balled up in the arrangement of appliances and sink. Maybe you hand somebody washed veg and say chop away? And I'm not being snarky, that's the only way I think it would work well, but perhaps you work in a different way.

I think the area (kitchen + dining + sitting + counter seating) is a little small for everything you want there. The storage, accessibility and flexibility for furniture all seemed kinda tight to me.

bmore...I appreciate your comments, and I didn't think you were being snarky, I just didn't understand the table/prep thing, I'm not sure I still do since I've never really seen what you are talking about.

Anyway, you may be right about things being tight. However, if this won't work, we may have to scrap the whole idea. We are not big cooks in our house, and if anyone is cooking it is usually just me. So I'm not really concerned with multiple cooks being able to move around.

I have another layout with everything in the "family room" facing the west wall. It seems to give more space. The sofa with the chaise on the end is not even something we have, I was just playing with furniture.

How did you post my design in your post... if I could figure out how to do that, I could show you.

Looking at your entire layout I have a suggestion that you probably won't like but here goes.
Your eating area at 8'x8' is going to be too small and putting stools at the end of the island will just not work space-wise.. You really need a 9'x9' area, at least, and that's with a small 36" wide table. You are going to have a collision/pinch point on the left side of the island - people coming from the deck, from the family room and, of course, the eating area are going to go into the kitchen from that side. Plus all the appliances - the fridge, stove and sink are also at that end.

That makes the very empty, non-useful space on the right side of the island wasted. So, move the island down to the wall and make the kitchen a u-shaped one with a peninsula. If you still keep it 9' long you really open up the area to the left side which is where all your traffic to and from the kitchen is going to be and it gives more space for an eating area especially with those stools.. No one is going to go in and out through the right side.
I see you have a window at the end - you can keep it and run the counter under neath thereby getting more storage into the kitchen. If you don;t like the idea of lazy-susans (as you now have 2 corners) have one corner open from the family room or put in shelves from the family room side for cookbooks or collectibles.

The other option is to get rid of that window and put the stove there while at the same time making the window on the fridge wall bigger if you wanted to. You can leave the sink in the peninsula.

I know that people think that islands are the greatest thing since sliced bread but not at the detriment of useful functional design. My 2cents.

I think the redoubtable Buehl covers screen shots in the readme post, but here is the Q&D windows way.

When you're looking at the layout, hit the print screen button on the keyboard. Open up just about any picture program. I use Microsoft Paint or Paint.net usually - so I press the start button and type mspaint into the run box.

After it opens, use the menu and press edit and then paste. It may ask if you'd like the screen area enlarged - say yes. Your picture should appear showing you entire desktop. Carefully press and hold the left mouse button, (you should see a four-sided arrow cursor). Move the mouse to cut off the "extra stuff" by moving the picture so the top and left edge align to show just the layout. Let go of the mouse.

Next you have to do something stupid (don't ask me why it works this way) to deselect the entire image. Click into the white area you just revealed on the right side. The dotted lines around the edge of the image should go away, and a new little black box should appear on the white edge. Pull the box back towards the image until it just shows what you want it to. Do the same thing to the bottom edge.

Use the file menu and save it as a jpeg file and upload it to a photo site.

Here is a link that might be useful: Mac Instructions.

bmore... I'm shocked I was able to do this much! Thanks for the tutorial! I still couldn't get it to show up directly in the post. And I couldn't just get the room itself, I got the whole page. Ignore all the extra stuff outside the room, those were things I was playing with.

Anyway, I have made the island a little smaller, I'm not sure why this won't work??

blfenton... I was having a hard time figuring out the whole peninsula thing... I'm not sure I understand that without out seeing it. I'm sorry I'm a little slow today. :-(

Here is a link that might be useful:

My apologies. I knew that there was a doorway off the family room but it looked like that what is a window in the kitchen is actually a doorway as well. A peninsula isn't going to work. I obviously need new reading glasses for the computer.
So then, to get an eating area, the island will have to be smaller and probably no seating at the end, just along the long side.

Thanks marcolo... sorry it is such a mess, I've farting around with this stupid thing all day!!

blfenton... I made the island smaller in the drawing above, you don't thing that will work?

Gosh, sorry, I feel like we're "talking" at cross-purposes here. Yes, I do think that the smaller island will work better. You don't have any stools drawn however I think you have enough room along the long side to put a couple but not along the short side by the table.

I know that the space to the left of the kitchen area is the outside deck, what is the space to the right of the kitchen area? Do you need two entrances into it?

Mercymy, I've been in your shoes and I have scrapped my kitchen extension problems many times and suffered with a dysfunctional kitchen for almost 15 years always thinking there has to be a better, cost effective way. In the end, we do the best with what we have and can afford to improve. Since this is a major renovation, I'll throw an idea out to you. What if you flipped the couch/ tv area and the kitchen? Run a u shape of cabinetry along the back wall with a fabulous island just like you plan, then have your eating area and couch area in the remaining space. If you did that, you would eliminate having the doorway into the working area of the kitchen. Just an idea.

These are just doodles of what I was thinking and what blfenton might have been thinking about a peninsula. Neither one is finished. I'm only showing them to give you ideas, even if they are "don't want" - because there are a dozen other floor plans hiding in that space and two or three of them are probably good (but not the ones I drew).

I was actually thinking of the peninsula coming out from the wall on the other side, directly opposite from where you have it drawn now. But I think there is an entrance into the kitchen there, but am wondering where it comes from. I'm wondering if that entrance can be closed up and the lower one into the family room made bigger.
The peninsula, I think, won't work from the left side because of the sliding glass doors to the deck.

Thanks everyone... I actually have a plan with the frige on that short wall like bmore has. I then turned the island to face that wall. It may work.... and if I can figure out how to get it posted here, I'll show it to you!! LOL!

maybe this will work

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen Plan #947

Just bumping so someone can comment on my new plan!! The one in the above post. Please!

What else is on the fridge wall? Is that going to be a pantry/fridge wall? How wide is that wall? Can you post that plan on a measured grid plan?
I think I would try to move the stove a little to the right if possible.

mercy, can't open your latest, but we have a small eat-in nook that's approximately 8' x 8' with a 42" expandable square table. This is the smallest nook we've ever had, but it works fine for us. However, I agree with blfenton that you won't be able have a seat on the DR side of the island, but think you could on the right side.

You original question was about the size of the island and whether the set back was enough for the sink not to interfere with those at the island. In reality, will people be eating at the island while the sink is in use for clean-up? Since you don't need to worry about multiple cooks and like your original plan, it may be fine with the switch of seating at the ends of your large island.

What did you change with the latest version?

A couple of comments about your addition: if this were my project I'd see about a header and scrap the column. Though you'd have to shift the sliders over, you could hide the header by incorporating it into a coffered or tray ceiling over the FR. I'd have more glass to the deck -- doors preferred to windows. Good luck!

I'm so excited... I got the picture to post!!!

Ok, so this is my new plan. The wall on the east side is 68 inches long, on that I have a pantry cabinet and the refrig. I really can't move the range down too much further because of the window. The right hand side of the layout is the original house, the left is the addition.

I really think there is more than enough room for everything in this layout. I really want a table area. We don't have one in the house we are in now and I miss one. We only have a peninsula.

The island will have a trash cabinet, the sink and the dishwasher and maybe another cabinet.

abundant...I don't think we can do what you suggest about the ceiling. Every contractor we had look at the house said we would need a column somewhere along the width for support.

I think you need to ask another contractor how you can do a header to spread the load. Even if you ran intersecting headers, you can avoid the post.

Depends on how you want to live in the FR, but I'd prefer the 1st layout with as much deference to the FR as the kitchen. Also, with the 2nd, I don't like the stools with their back to the view and being cut-off from the table if you have overflow company. Just how I view it FY consideration. As always, YMMV.

I like that.

Maybe either a pantry cab in the range corner by the entrance or wall cabinets for dry foods that comes down to the counter?

Also, the column could be an opportunity to build some dish/glasses storage if you did mirrored columns on one end of the island and then range shelving between them - still reads open.

If would you go with the latest, would you consider placement the entertainment armoire cross-wise where you have the plant? I know furniture is optional at this point, but you've given up a window in the addition. Another option if you kept the armoire next to the sliders is to add clerestories along that wall if you like lots of natural light.

I agree with bmp, if you're foregoing the DR buffet you have room to expand kitchen cabinetry. Also, if you have to have one column, it'd be better to incorporate as a design feature whether island shelving or arches or anything else to prevent it from looking like one of those ugly basement poles. ;-)

My favorite is Bmore's second plan (of the two posted together) because the angle of the island works so well with the angled furniture. You might have room for a table if you moved the chair down a bit, maybe even put it in the corner. What is BB?

If you added a small table and chairs you'd have easy access to the beverage area and fridge and could see the TV when you're in the kitchen, at the table or sitting on the small sectional. It's a nice plan :)

Wow!! Okay, you guys are keeping me busy with all these plans...LOL!! That's ok, keep 'em coming.

I'll have to update my plan again when I get home from work. I'll post later.

I do not know what BB is????

Ok, I stole this from NYSteve... how about this design? This may look a little redundant, but I want a table in this room. But more than likely we will probably spend more time at the island. I've linked NYSteve's island pic below.

Here is a link that might be useful: Island