3lb sledge directed at the middle of the door.

Have you thought of Craig's List?

Icepick
Shotgun
Smith&Wesson 357
Dynamite
or wait 3 more years - average life expectancy is 8-10 years.

A bag of small gravel in the wash cycle? :)

Great ideas! Two months a go, my BFF needed a dishwasher and wanted a black one.. I wanted to sell it to her but my husband wouldn't budge. Oh well. ;)

I went through the EXACT SAME THING!!

4 years ago we bought a new dishwasher. Top of the line. Works well. I was going to keep it, and re-use it in my new kitchen. At one point, I had jokingly hinted that maybe we should get a new integrated dishwasher for the new kitchen, but DH blew that off.

After the base cabinets were installed (door fronts not even on) I looked at DH and told him I am going to buy a new dishwasher. I called my cabinet maker to make sure it was still possible. It was. I called the appliance store and ordered a new dishwasher.

2 days later, one of the workers in my home noticed the dishwasher (the one I was not putting in the new kitchen) and asked me if I planned to keep it or if he could buy it. We agreed on a fair price, and the rest is history!

Did it cost a little more money? Yes. Was I lucky to sell a used dishwasher so easily? Yes.

How badly do you want that new dishwasher? One of the reasons I decided to splurge is that you see the dishwasher as you enter the kitchen, and I would not have been happy with the stainless steel of the old dishwasher when all my other appliances are integrated.

My husband thinks I'm nuts most of the time, so I just try and live up to his expectations :) (kidding!)

Actually, what I think I really need to do is write everything down for him. How much things COULD cost vs how much I'm actually spending on them. So when I insist on the dishwasher he can see that I've saved elsewhere to make it happen. We've got a meeting with our cabinet guy on Tuesday to go over options.. I can probably save enough with the cabinets alone to rationalize it.. maybe??

It will look extremely odd as it is... I don't feel that everything needs to be integrated, but it ends up sitting right next to the stove and I think it will be a real eyesore.

Odd is in the eye of the beholder! I personally find paneled appliances odd - I hate walking into a kitchen and having to hunt for the fridge and DW. I know the people who live there know where they are, but I was recently in someone's kitchen and I really thought there was no fridge because it was too well integrated :-). Kitchens contain appliances - that's their purpose!

By the way, I've been told by a KD friend that paneled appliances are favored by women more than men so I can understand where your husband is coming from.

weissman your comment is funny b/c my goal is that others entering the kitchen will not have any idea where any of our appliances are. If I could have paneled the ovens, I would have!

When I first went to the kitchen cabinet designer, I basically told him that I wanted a china room, like the one in the white house, and that some appliances could be thrown in if necessary...

Good luck w/ the dishwasher breakage joyjoy. You could always tell your husband that if you have to keep the black one, you will be too upset to ever load or unload it so he'll have to take over that duty permanently and forever :)

Weissman - I never thought I'd want a paneled appliance either.. sometimes I think it looks great, other times it just looks odd. In my situation, I'm doing lots of "mismatched" - my pantry wall will be stained oak, the base cabinets white, the cabinet above the hood will be black, and the wall cabinet (shown here in green) will be yellow (and much cuter IRL) I just think the black dishwasher will be visually very strange there, and there isnt anywhere better for it.
Here's an extremely rough mock up done on Ikea software. There would likely be a spacer of somekind between the two appliances and they definitely wouldnt overlap!! There will also be an undermount sink in the cabinet next to it.. so moving it to the end isnt an option.. I really dont want the sink next to the range and there isnt room for anything else on that wall.

{{gwi:1384085}}

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weissmann, does that mean if I don't integrate my appliances my friends will cook for me and unload the dishwasher for me because they will be easier to spot?!
I'm really just kidding here. Hope that doesn't come out as obnoxious. But seriously, as long as I know where the appliances are, I am happy. No one else is using my kitchen.
joyjoyjoy, from the pic above, I don't actually think the black will look odd. Maybe you can keep that one and then see if you can live with it. If not, then you can deal with buying an integrated one and having a panel made. I wouldn't get a panel made yet because different dishwashers have different specs and sizes.

You might want to post your layout on the kitchen forum - people there are really good at suggesting alternate layouts - in general it's a good idea to put your DW next to your sink - it will simplify the water and drain hookups.

research_queen: don't you ever have visitors or guests who want to help themselves to a tasty beverage or put their dirty dishes in the DW -:)

My friend's parents have a kitchen that is floor to ceiling blond wood. Is that what its still called? I think it is oak that is whitewashed.. not solid white, and not solid wood. the countertops are a very light pinky beige Corion. They have super tall ceilings and upper cabinets. All their appliances are integrated and my friend can never find anything when she is there to visit.

There is actually a small (15x15) undermount sink to the left of that dishwasher. Its just not in this photo. I'm doing two separate sinks to keep cleanup people out of my way. I have driven everyone crazy with my layout in the Kitchen forum. lol. It's not a dream layout, but my best option in order to get everything I want.

I guess I haven't followed your threads on the kitchen forum. How does having a cleanup sink and DW right next to the stove keep clean up people out of your way? Where will you be? I think the kitchen is probably too small for 2 sinks to be needed. I'd suggest looking at one large bowl and 2 faucets.

It was suggested more diplomatically above, but I'll be blunt and say I'd fix the layout before worrying about a panel for the DW.

My layout is as fixed as it's gonna get.

From a pure appliance performance aspect... your dishwasher is too far away from your sink and you will have pump out issues. Unless your putting a drain next to or possibly behind the d/w I wouldn't recommend this setup.
My last house I remodeled, I had a similar layout but I put my d/w in the peninsula, I'd strongly recommend swapping sides with your cabinets.

I fixed the photo to include the 2nd sink. Given my priorities and limitations with this room, this is the only way to do it.

{{gwi:1384087}}

Choose your favorite WMD?

Or maybe wait and see how it looks? With, e.g., a range and hood, I can see a strong temptation to get things straight at the outset: ranges come in all sizes and moving counters and/or cabinets a couple of years down the road to make room for something new is a big deal. But a standard-sized dishwasher? You could make the swap 6 years or 6 days later, no? If it bugs you when everything is set, maybe he'll see it too? Or maybe you'll love the new kitchen and the machine won't stand out or bother as much as you think?

In the end, you'll want what you want. But it seems as if there might be lots of ways to find a wait-and-see middle ground.

Personally, I think it looks fine the way it's depicted in the graphics. If you had a different color hood and counter tops, then it would be a different story. The dishwasher ties in the hood and enhances the counter tops above it as well as the dark areas on the cooktop.

It seems odd to me that a kitchen this small would have two sinks.

lallallanotlisteninglalla

Is there a way to delete this thread? I really need to move forward here, and all the comments make me rethink everything.

I've been over this layout a million times. Please trust me that it is the only way to get our "must haves" into the space. I have paid very close attention to what does not work in our current set up, and what I really need to happen with this kitchen so it fits this family and our needs. It may not be perfect, but it is what it is.

You can't delete it but if you stop posting to it, it will eventually drop off the forum. Or you could just stop reading it :-)

Yea, what's killing this kitchen isn't the black dishwasher. I suggest waiting and seeing also.

Re: " ... comments make me rethink everything" ... isn't now the time to rethink rather than after everything is in place?

joy, no kitchen is perfect unless you level structures, have your pick of the spot and can fix the direction of the sun and the trees in it. but if you wind up with a kitchen with 6 cabinets of which 1 is a wine-cubby and 2 are sinks cabs, I wonder if there isn't a disconnect between the space and your "must haves". I mean to say ... that's living large in a jolly tight space.

Joy, it's your kitchen. You have every right to do what ever you wish. If I dragged something out or caused an 'issue', I apologize.

Forget I ever said it.

I know I have. ;)

2 sinks = good.
They can both be small. A 21" to 24", and a micro sink.

I promise not to post to this thread again if

I will let this thread die after I point out, perhaps redundantly, that the DW is so close to the range that no one can get into the DW while you're cooking (and vice versa), you can't open the DW and oven doors simultaneously, etc. Is it truly impossible to put that DW on the other side of the kitchen, more or less opposite to where it is now, and draining to the main sink?

thanks everyone. I know you are all trying to help. I have been through all these issues and questions a thousand times, and I am sure what I have is my best option. If we were moving in the near future, we'd cater more to the "norm", but this kitchen will be mine for years, probably decades.

mindstorm - My only must have is the peninsula/seating area, and not having dirty dishes/clean up area between where i prep and cook. the dishwahser where it is, and bringing in a second smaller sink, gets it out of my way. Also, not shown here is a wall of floor to ceiling cabinets with my fridge that will serve as the main storage area. The cabinet above the range hood is quite deep, it goes back into that wall void created by the diagonal wall. What you see here though, is actually pretty close to what we have for storage currently, and the "wine rack" will actually be a narrow cabinet for cookie sheets, the Ikea software didnt have any other option that narrow.

david - my farm sink is 24", and the smaller one will only be about 12" wide (the same width as one side of our current double sink).. big enough for most dish cleanup. On the occasion I have something larger (right now only my baking stones which cant be around soap anyway) I can always use the other sink.

ideagirl.. this is the one thing that bugs me too, but having it on the other side will bug me more. That is where the dirty dishes will collect, and I dont want "dirty" in between where I am preparing and cooking. I dont anticipate too many times where I'll need both doors open at the same time. Cleanup happens AFTER we are done cooking and eating. Quite often though, my son is emptying the dishwasher while I am prepping for dinner, and where I am prepping (the far right side of the big sink, is on the opposite side of the dishwasher.

You may not want to read this or consider it, but is there a reason the range has to go in the corner? Changing that would allow you some better options.

If you have to do the lalalalala thing, I question whether you are ready to commit to any plan. I agree with mindstorm that this is exactly when you want to consider everything, listen to every possibility, take another dose of asprin, wine or whatever, and leave no stone unturned. I am so glad I took the time, head spinning and all, to make sure I did the best I could.

I think you can have what you want and have a better functioning kitchen, perhaps as simply as switching the larger sink and range and dropping the second sink or putting in a small beverage/prep/trough sink near or into the peninsula. You don't have to do it, but as someone who thought she'd considered everything and then had an ah-hah that made so much difference, I'd urge you to take the time to think, back away when needed, rethink, open another bottle of wine, mock it up, map it out, get as much input as you can (which is likely to be at least 10% more than you think you can stand), ask friends and family who have been in your kitchen and see if you are still in the same place.

I'm sorry if it upsets you, but I'd really regret not saying something if you hadn't considered all your options. Beyond that -- at least it's free. ;-)

Thank you... the lalala thing was a joke, sorry if I offended. I do consider every everything mentioned on here, I guess I just thought I was done with that part of process.. maybe not.

The range where you mentioned was my first plan, but there was a reason why it couldn't go there.. I don't for the life of me remember what that was though... it was so long ago. The windows are a huge pain, but moving them is not an option, so the only place for the stove was the corner.

I am actually, as I type this redoing my layout with the sink and stove swapped, and hopefully i can figure out what the problem with that was to begin with...

I really wish I could take a 2 month vacation and come back to the perfect kitchen.. but if I could afford to do that, I wouldn't be in this house, and just might not be cooking for myself either!! :)

Thanks for your help everyone.. sorry if I came across as ungrateful.. that wasn't my intention.

Ok, I think the reason why I opted for the stove in the corner, instead of where I show the apron sink, is because I was frustrated with the sink in/near the corner. Also, I hoped to use the peninsula as the main prep area, and was nervous having the stove under my elbow (I'm a lefty)

With that said, Im not sure those reasons are good enough to limit that as a possibility.

Thanks!!

No, no, no -- I wasn't offended. I just want you to get the best kitchen you can, and don't want to offend you either. Sometimes some encouragement, experience, insights or even just a different pair of eyes seeing things in a different way can make all the difference.

Look at taking the angle out of the corner to give a little more room and put the DW on the end, then the sink, a corner cabinet for storage and another under your window, then the range. I think you can work that corner so your elbow won't be right over or bumping a burner. Your windows a would give you a view at the sink and to the side from the range. If your dirty dishes go to the left of the sink and in the sink, then you have potential prep areas on either side of the range.

Give us some dimensions and let's see what would work in that corner by the peninsula -- maybe you can steal a few inches from the breakfast room if needed.

It would be even better if you posted your floor plan and dimensions over on the kitchens thread. There are DIYers, designers, folks who've done a number of kitchens and folks like me who have done one or hope to do one -- a lot of great ideas and a lot of experience.

Ok thanks everyone. Let's put this thread out to pasture.. I've linked the new one below!!

Here is a link that might be useful: New thread for layout fixes!!

You people are nuts!