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dont_trust_the_dog

Thank you for this forum!!

It is nice to see some unbiased information.

For any future readers, this site is owned and run by a completely impartial entity (i.e. one that you can trust for informational accuracy). Kudos to this board for running a great site.

I spent hours reading up on another website about windows and later found out that this site that supposedly offers "unbiased" information as a courtesy is owned and operated by a person that owns a company that sells a window that they tout as one of the best on their site.

As the good book says: "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are savage wolves."(Matthew 7:15)

Chock it up to lesson learned and thankfully I figured it out before I make a costly mistake.

Thanks to the contributors to this site as well.

Comments (25)

  • Karateguy
    9 years ago

    DTTG, you are on the right track. Unfortunately there are several "unbiased" sites out there that are not at all what they seem. The Window Dog in particular (I assume that is what your screen name refers to) used to post here, but apparently he decided to start his own site where nobody could question his comments which could be perceived as self-serving. Its a shame that he tries to portray that site as unbiased, instead of just being upfront about the clear conflict of interest. I believe that the company affiliation is Window Universe. Best I can tell, they sell the same product (different name) as Window World and operate under a similar business model. I know that I've tried to post there before about some of his claims that I found to be untruthful and my posts were deleted and/or not approved. Pretty shameless IMO.
    When considering recommendations, I'd definitely stick to great sites like this with an open format. There won't always be "one right answer" to your question, but there are no less than a dozen professionals that contribute time and talent here for no personal gain, as well as open comments from any and every consumer across the country that wishes to chime in.
    To each their own though I suppose, just my $.02.
    Best of luck in your search.

  • websnooper
    9 years ago

    That is so funny. I was reading that site a bit as I continue my 10 year foray into replacing my windows.

    I couldn't quite put my finger on it but that is what it felt like to me. There was something not quite right about it.

    So that person that manages that board and it marketing it as informational owns a company?

    What window do they sell?

  • HomeSealed_WI
    9 years ago

    I'll reserve my comments on any other sites, but I'd agree that you found the right place here. Glad to hear that you've found it useful :)

  • mmarse1
    9 years ago

    The window dog !!! That website is a joke. He deletes any post that mentions anything negative about the window he offers which i think is either the berkshire elite or alside mezzo. That is the most biased window site i've ever seen. The self serving theme is deafening.

    This post was edited by mmarse1 on Wed, Dec 3, 14 at 19:30

  • Jason
    9 years ago

    I got a quote from his company a week or two ago - they quoted me the Berkshire Elite.

    The one good thing about them was that they were low pressure and laid everything out with all the options for the windows on one sheet of paper. But, as I'm learning in another thread, the Berkshire isn't very well thought of around here.

  • Karateguy
    9 years ago

    Jason, you will not find a more diverse and larger group of window industry professionals than you do here. That product "not being well thought of here" is just a microcsm for the industry as a whole. No matter how anybody many spin it, the old addage of you get what you pay for is alive an well, and certainly applies here. If you just want a low cost alternative with some sense of security, you may as well go to Window World and get the same thing for less, and from the largest window company in the country. That is not a recommendation by the way, but if I didn't care about quality or performance, only low price, that is what I would do. Skip the "jonny-come-lately" wanna-be companies. Window World --> Window Universe, Window depot, etc. All of the companies that have tried to mimic WW have failed eventually and will continue to do so IMO. Its like trying to be another walmart. How did that ork out for kmart?
    Perhaps the most ironic thing is that in reading some of the "objective " recommendations over there, the reasoning to avoid manufacturers like Sunrise, Okna etc ($50+million dollar companies in the top 100 manufacturers in the nation) is that they aren't as big as a company like AMI (Alside/Revere/Gentek). Wouldn't that same logic then apply to choosing between two companies like WW and WU? (what a shameless rip off of the name btw, very original)

  • mmarse1
    9 years ago

    Jason
    This guy " the window dog" seems to have created WHAT APPEARS to be a website meant for homeowners searching for unbiased info on various window brands., that site is NOT unbiased, it favors alside and berkshire windows and he indiscreetly puts down other windows and claims they cost too much ect.....
    He created the website for his self serving purpose.. To pump up a not so good brand of windows.
    If you attempt to post anything that is perceived as negative regarding alside or berkshire, that post is immediately deleted. there is nothing unbiased about that.

  • Jason
    9 years ago

    Karateguy / mmarse1,

    Please understand I'm not trying to defend him / WU. I was merely responding to websnooper's question about what window they sell and that I appreciated not having the hard sell sales tactic I had to suffer through with another company.

    As for the website, I appreciate knowing now that it isn't really unbiased, I just didn't realize that when I first came across his site in the Google results.

  • websnooper
    9 years ago

    Jason,

    Don't mind mmarse1. He is passionate from my readings of his posts before but he wants folks to have a good experience in the window industry.

    Having sat through a bunch of these myself, I can tell you that it is worse than buying a used car in some cases.

    Sounds like your process was a bit easier but from what I read, there are some disturbing tendencies out of this Window Dog site.

    So if I read this correct, The Window Dog site is owned and operated by a guy that owns a Window World type company? If that is the case, that is pretty darn shady.

    Jason...did you get a quote from the Window Dog's company? What company is it and where they pushing Alside?

    Browse this forum and basically every other forum in the WWW (with the exception of the one that is run by a guy that sells Alside) and see what the reviews on that window are like.

    See my post above. My neighbor got Alside windows and they are abyssal. Really terrible quality units all around and they change IGUs like most people change the channel.

    This post was edited by websnooper on Tue, Dec 16, 14 at 7:47

  • Jason
    9 years ago

    websnooper,

    I did find buried in his website that he owned a company called Windows Universe. I did receive a quote from the Baltimore franchise of that company for Berkshire Elite windows. They did not mention Alside but from what I have learned here, the Alside Mezzo is basically the exact same as the Berkshire Elite that I was quoted.

    Below I linked to a different thread in this forum that has information on the quotes I have received so far (I didn't name the company there, but the quote for the Berkshire Elites was this company).

    Here is a link that might be useful: My Window Replacment Options Thread

  • Karateguy
    9 years ago

    not a fan

    This post was edited by Karateguy on Sat, Dec 6, 14 at 20:35

  • websnooper
    9 years ago

    That is so shady its not even funny.

    Who is going to take all the time to read that forum and try to figure that out but this person claims all the information is unbiased and legitimate. Jeez Louise. Never a more perfect example abusing the information.

    The Vytex is worlds better than the Mezzo, Berkshire Elite, everything that Alside makes. Seeing them "at work" in my neighbors home is all I needed to see.

  • mmarse1
    9 years ago

    I agree, very shady. That guy seems to prey on unsuspecting home owners.

  • Karateguy
    9 years ago

    Conflict of interest to say the least. I for one wouldn't have a problem (even though I may disagree with his views) if he was upfront and honest about the company affiliation on the front end of the site. Unfortunately, we all know that would result in less site visits.

  • dont_trust_the_dog
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Just read this on the forum as well.

    Sounds like the board owner is somewhat owning up to it but I wonder how many people will read that section that is buried in the site.

  • dont_trust_the_dog
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Continued

  • dont_trust_the_dog
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Continued

  • dont_trust_the_dog
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Any irony is this person stating "Selecting an Installation Company, TRICK SALES TACTICS EXPOSED"....

    I think that fits the definition of Irony.

  • jonnyp
    9 years ago

    When I worked in the trades 20 yrs ago, Alside was a quality window. Even their cheapest window was well built. Probably got bought out by a fund who brought
    "quality to the investor". Aka screw the consumer.

  • toddinmn
    9 years ago

    From Briefly reading the Dog's site he does seem to make some pretty fair comparisons and does rip the Mezzo and Alside a bit. It is also disclosed that Windows Universe has an established relationship with the site

  • dont_trust_the_dog
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    toddinnm,

    I thought the same thing until you really read the forum and delve into the details. They are coy about it but hardly honest.

    It appears (knowing but I have learned now) that the board operator slightly undermines the Mezzo in an effort to promote the other version (Revre) of the product. See if you can find the same criticisms of the Revre as you can the Mezzo. You won't.

    It is all very carefully done and wasn't until I really started to dig deep and try to cross compare that I noted it.

    I have invested way too much time in this apparently but I more than a bit jaded once I realized that the information was biased at best and nonfactual at worst.

    The disclosure about their involvement with the window company is a new development and I think in response to some information that came to light on this forum. I think it is a bit disingenuous to say the least as a casual reader of the site would never locate or realize that information.

    You appear to be a window pro based on past posts and certainly know your window. Would you use a Mezzo or Revre window?

    Happy New Year everybody.

  • bpchiil
    9 years ago

    WINDOW DOG -

    The website is a joke and the moderator is a clown.

    I do have to say he did put up some nice circus tents though.

  • rgrpark
    9 years ago

    It was funny that I posted about choosing between the okna 500, soft lite imperial ls and the vytex potomac on his forum and he sent me an email suggesting the berkshire elite. I don't think they are in the same class.


  • PRO
    HomeSealed Exteriors, LLC
    9 years ago

    For the record rgr, I'd say that your assessment is correct. We all have our favorites, but the three windows that you were considering are all at the top level of performance and pretty widely respected. That Berkshire /Alside mezzo/ WW $189 window cannot be put in the same category.

    The tactics used in that situation speak volumes.