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Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Posted by OntarioMom (My Page) on
Sun, Sep 25, 11 at 8:54

Hi all,

Does anyone have any experience with Inline Fiberglass windows? I realize they are Canadian made, but I believe they share some characteristics with Serious Windows (not sure how similiar they are though).

My other question is in regards to what SHGC I should be looking for in a window (here's hoping the US tests SHGC in a similar fashion to Energy Star Canada). I live in Ontario, Canada so we have long winters. However, many of the windows going in our addition are south facing (with others facing east and west). We are not changing the north facing windows. There are no mature trees close to these south windows. Any guidance to give on SHGC given these conditions?

Thanks. This window decision is driving me crazy!

Carol


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Inline makes a great product.

Given that you are a very heating degree dominated climate (i.e. you spend much more to heat your home vs. cool), you should look to choose a proper SHGC glass that will allow for maximum passive solar energy. Doing so will allow you to get the most free energy from the sun.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

What rating of SHGC should I look for? On the Energy Efficiency ratings from Natural Resources Canada I see Inline offers a 3 pane window with a SHGC rating of 0.41. The listed U is 1.14 and ER is +41 for the same window. However, from an early response to another one of my postings, I gathered the U.S. rates windows in a different manner from Canada, so perhaps these scores are meaningless to those of you who use the US rating scores. What rating agency do you consult to compare energy ratings on windows in the U.S.? Maybe this U.S. agency rates Inline Windows.

Thanks for your help!

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

The higher the better.

You want as high an SHGC as you can get on those South facing windows.

Inline is a very solid company and I know that they will be happy to answer you questions via the phone as well.

I am not sure how the Canadian ratings translate or what the different glazing options are for up there. Given that they are based in Canada, they should have the right package for your exposure and climate region. They are certainly a well thought out design and have the proper glass packages as well.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Hi windowsonwashington,

Thank you very much for your reponses to this post and the one on French doors. I will be speaking to Inline Fiberglass today for their recommendation on SHGC and will seek to get as high a SHGC as possible for the south facing windows as you suggested. It is good to know you like their product.

I appreciate your help!

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

My pleasure.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

you can actually get SHGC numbers in the 50s if you go with a dual pane on the south. While the u will not be as low as the triple pane option, if you run the numbers it may work out to be a higher heat net gain positive then the small amount of heat it loses due to being double pane vs the triple pane option. North and other elevations I would still go with the lowest u triple options if budget allows.
With that being said, Inline windows are great. Great infiltration rating, good design, good service and a pretty decent price for. Also check out Fibertec windows. Thermotech are also great, but will most likely be significantly more cost.
I would avoid Serious windows. They put a lot of faith in their suspended film windows, a technology that may be great, but IMO is not proven yet. They have pros compared to triple pane, but being in Canada, I would stick with Inline or Fibertec.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

+1

Look for a window with a hard coat low-e.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Great thread! +1 WoW and +1 Izerarc

As WoW pointed out, many window companies, particularly in Canada, use a hard coat LowE for high solar heat gain applications. But in some cases the window company may not offer hard coat and may offer a soft coat option such as Cardinal's LoE-180 which is at least equal to, if not a little better, than the best hard coat HSHG performance and with a little better U-value than any of the hard coats.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

This is all very helpful information! Thank you everyone for your responses!

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

+1

I don't recall if Inline is using Cardinal (I think they are) but that glass offering would be the best in your case (LoE 180)


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Hi everyone,

Now I am very confused. We went to the Inline Fiberglass showroom yesterday. I liked most about their windows - with the exception of their screens which were not that attractive and a bit flimsy. However, the saleman gave me conflicting advice as to where to use hard coat low e glass versus soft coat. Here is what he advised:

East facing windows: Hard coat

South, west and North facing windows: soft coat

Note: Inline Fiberglass uses Cardinal as their glass supplier

This runs contrary to the input received here that recommended getting windows that offered a high SHGC on the south facing windows. Our south facing windows are not protected by much shade - minimal roof overhang. The 12 year old trees will be, after the addition is built, around 25 - 30 feet away from the south windows. We live an hour outside Toronto Ontario, so winters are long, but we do get lots of heat in the summer as well (very late may to very early sept).

Can you make any sense of this conflicting advice? Is our best compromise to get awnings over the south windows and still go for the high SHGC windows for south facing windows?

It sure is hard to make all these decisions.

Thanks for your help!

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Familiarize yourself with the Cardinal glass performance statistics and re-open the discussion with Inline after that.

http://www.cardinalcorp.com/technology/reference/loe-performance-stats/

Here is a link that might be useful: Cardinal Glass Performance Data


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

my guess is the sales person slipped and misspoke....at least I would hope so. Anytime I have ever talked with them they have always referenced the correct glass for the specific elevations.

Also, not sure if it has been mentioned, but casements are also a better choice over hung windows, and fixed windows are even better then casements (and a lot cheaper!) if you do not NEED to vent.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

+1

Casements are a better option if they are aesthetically acceptable to the customer for both ventilation and air tightness.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Hi Izerarc and WindowsonWashington!

Izerarc, I gather you were also surprised the saleperson only recommended hard coat for east facing windows, and that he recommended soft coat for the north, west and south elevations. We double checked with him and he was still confinced these were the best e-coatings for us. He is a very experienced window saleperson. It is true that our old builder special south facing windows (without any low e coating)do let in a great deal of heat even on warmer October days -- not to mention summer days. It is not always cold in Canada.

Still confused as to what to do re these hard vs soft coatings.

I appreciate your input.

BTW we are doing casement windows on the main and second floor levels and still working out the style for the basement windows.

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Call Cardinal and talk to them.

I would venture a guess that they are more informed than your salesperson.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Great idea! Why didn't I think of that! A call to Cardinal should settle the debate for sure.

Thanks windowsonwashington!

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

I know this discussion is a little old- But Carol I've been a buyer and seller of high performance windows over many years- and in my experience many sales people really don't understand well when high SHGC glass should be used.
In all canadian climates we have a much higher need for heating than airconditioning. And the solution is basically the same in most of canada.

From a salesperson's perspective the 'I can't go wrong advice' is high SHGC on the East only- because no one will ever complain about the result- but you end up missing out on lots of free heating all winter.

Typically I have always selected high SHGC on the East and South, and low SHGC on the North and West.
However - it is possible to overheat a house in the winter and summer with too much south facing high SHGC, If you have a very large amount of south facing glass, you may need a fan system to recirculate surplus heat in the winter, or sufficent massive materials. So this caveat is always there.

But recently I was speaking with researchers at CMHC. They said that tests done at the National research council recently found that high Solar Heat Gain glass (SHGC) was beneficial on all faces in the canadian climate. Even in the winter - the north windows will get reflected heat gain from snow etc. And in the end this always was a net benefit - with the heating savings easily much more than the increase in cooling costs.

So my current reccomendation would be go for high Solar Heat Gain on all sides.

As for a manufacturer- I have bought windows from Serious Windows, Thermotech, and Inline, I have used triple glass and the SeriousWindows Suspended film glass. My preference is for the suspended film windows from Serious because you get lighter weight which will give you longer life on operable windows- And higher VT (visibile light transmission)

They have been used in a lot of leading buildings including the empire state building and have a lifetime guarantee. (they have distributors now in canada-SeriousWindowsCanada.com)

My second choice would be Thermotech, they are more expensive but are very knowledgeable about windows and will give good advice.
Third is Inline- because there custom service has not always met my expectations in the past. But the product is a good quality product.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Thanks GreenWindowMan for your advice. I will contact CMHC. We tried to get a quote from Thermotech, but they were too swamped to both with our email enquiry. I have heard they are a lot more money than either Fibertec or Inline, so at this stage I won't bother with them. Have you any experience with Fibertec windows (they also make fiberglass windows). Their frames do seem stronger than Inline's. I also thought the inside profile of their windows was more attractive than Inline windows, and their screens were much nicer. We need to get these windows order ASAP (i.e. within the next day or two).

Thanks for your reply and help.

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

He will probably tell you no doesn't as he is spamming this site pushing his products. He sells Serious Material's products and heat Mirror glass which is why he is attempting to push you in that direction.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

GreenWindowMan,

Most of your information about SHGC is rational and mostly correct but that is where it stops.

After that, you are pretty much wrong on nearly every point.

Question 1.
- What windows are in CMHC's Healthy House....Inline. Seems like a ringing endorsement of Inline in my estimation.

Question 2.
- Who makes the lineals for Serious Windows....Inline. Intersting. If the window that is so well recommended is comprised on Inline parts, seems like a pretty good indication of a solid material.

Question 3.
- How much of an offset in weight is there for triple pane glass....13% and well within what a well designed fiberglass window can accomodate.

Question 4.
- Does Thermotech make a double hung and if not, why....No they do not and the air leakage rate on their casement (should inherently be a tighter window than a double hung by comparison) is higher than Inline's double hung. If you can't make a casement window tighter than a double hung, you should stop now.

Question 5.
- Why wouldn't GreenWindowMan recommend an Inline window....Probably because that window is not available to him in that territory.

Question 6.
- What has a better reputation for longevity, heat mirror or triple pane....triple pane.

Question 7.
- What is the warranty on the Inline window....Lifetime on all residential applications.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

OntarioMom,

I can tell you that the Fibertec window is not stronger than the Inline. The Performance grade on the Inline is out of this world and unmatched in its structural numbers.

If you didn't like the screens, that I something that is a personal preference and you have to be true to what you think your preference and tolerance are.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Hi Windowsonwashington,

Thanks for your input. The Fibertec saleman was sure convincing that his frame was stonger (big demos etc). He claimed his frame was a closed back frame and Inline's was not. Inline won't sell us triple pane for some of our larger windows as their frames are not strong enough for three panes. Fibertec sells almost exclusively triple panes. Fibertec has a longer warranty, nicer and much stronger screens and their windows look nicer to us. My sister has Inline and has loved them, so I know they are good windows too. Have you ever seen the Fibertec ones?

We are now investigating Thermotech Fiberglass as well. The salesman from Thermotech did want high SHGC on the south windows that you guys on GW have been telling me would be best -- he is the first salesman who shared your wisdom on the low E coating issue.

This is one of the hardest purchases we have every made. Other than our house it is our most expensive one as well!

I am so appreciative of everyone taking the time to help me make this decision.

Carol


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Hi Carol,
We're a few years behind you in our build, but considering the same window options you did.
Who did you end up using? Were you happy?
Our top contenders at the moment are Innotech (vinyl Tilt-and-Turns, out of Germany) and Cascadia (fiberglass Tilt-and-Turns out of BC).
We're building in Calgary.
I'd love your input.
Thanks.


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RE: Fiberglass Windows - Inline?

Miriam,

Just for clarification, although Innotech does use German extruded fiberglass (Kommerling) and hardware, their windows are manufactured in Canada.

Both Cascadia and Innotech use Cardinal IG for their glass packages.


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