I don't get too upset if roses die back to the snow line. That is pretty much the norm around here in Michigan with most roses. As long as they bounce back I keep them. I think recommending roses is *very* subjective as I have grown many so call "hardy/vigorous" recommendations that have failed to thrive for me but since I'm in a rural, low spot and might as well be Z4 I do make some recommendations such as the roses above. My main problem is roses that do well the first year and then just never do much after that. I rarely lose any to the winter. In fact, our most recent winter was the worst in recent times and I swear my roses loved it. Many were loaded with blossoms, throwing up alot of new canes and grew like weeds this spring. I secretly think roses love a long, cold dormancy. Predfern I've grown a ton of Bucks and only Applejack and Prairie Princess have done well for me. Same with growing lots of Austins, Romanticas and Generosas. I don't have any Generosas left, only one romantic (Eden cuz I love it so much) and several Austins. BUT... sometimes I think you just get bad clones. Some of the pathetic band roses (twigs) you get are a waste of time IMO. I don't buy them anymore and only buy roses from Roses Unlimited and Pickerings. I've tried many name brand vendors roses and they've all been shovel pruned. I haven't noticed that ownroot does any better for me than grafted. Really, I think its all a matter of "hit & miss"...seeing what will grow well for you in your unique environment.

grizzman I guess it came out wrong, it was late and I needed to get to bed. I meant that growing in soil generally takes about ten times more water than growing hydroponically. With soil you pour water on them and it all drains down through the earth (pots etc.), that takes continual watering (often daily). Where hydroponics makes use of all the water in the system (unless it's a run to waist type system). So really the only water used is what the plants drink, and some evaporation (depending on location and setup design). jfd986 I simply cant tell you how much it will cost to build and run the system that you decide to build. That's why I wanted to explain all the variables to consider when making a decision. If you decide to use a water culture system that only uses one or two air pumps, you wont notice anything on your electric bill. Unless you decide to grow inside, then you would need to factor in the cost to run the lights as well for the same plants. Bottom line * Water pumps, timers, and air pumps cost almost nothing to run, unless you are using a lot of them. * Lights I would go with what grizzman said with respect to cost to run, I don't use lights myself, I grow in sunlight (its cheaper that way). But you would need to factor in the cost of equipment. It isn't just the cost of the bulb. As bbrush said there's the cost of the ballast, and metal halide, and High pressure sodium ballasts are not interchangeable to the best of my knowledge. So if you are needing both type, for different phases of plant growth, well that adds up. Also you will need a light reflector to direct the light down to your plants. * The cost to build the system depends on how you build it, how elaborate you want it, as well as what the cost of the materials you need are. What type of system you decide on etc.. I can tell you that I built a system using 4, 5 gallon buckets for the plants, a 18 gallon reservoir, all the tubing and parts needed to build it, including the water pump and timer, even both black and white spray paint to light proof the system (as well as the growing medium), for under $100. But again I use natural light so I get great growth, without needing to buy expensive lighting (much less the cost to run them). This system cost just about nothing in electricity to run, and I had 4 large broccoli plants growing for about 6 months in it. do I really have to keep the light on for 24 hours? No, the lights don't need to be on 24/7. Everybody has a different lighting cycle for their plants, and they often change the on/off times (cycle) as the plants grow. Some plants like more light than others do, so lighting cycles should depend on the plants you grow. 1) Change the water Here everybody has their own preferences. Some change it once a week, some ever other week, some once a month, and others change it once or twice a year. The size of the reservoir, as well as the size of the plants is a big factor in those decisions as well. I personally chance it between one week and one month. There are a lot of variables in my decision, and I always pay attention to how the plants look. 2) Add nutrients (Are there instructions on the bag for that? Should I just comb through previous posts?) Again here everybody has their own preferences, and each situation is unique to that situation. I'm not sure what nutrients you plan to use, but any manufacture of hydroponic nutrients should have mixing directions with the product (and online as well). But generally you can mix them a little weaker than the manufacture directions. There is also a difference in how strong they should be depending on size of the plants, but manufactures list that as well, they refer to it as the growth phase. 3) Water them (Do they even need watering?) Every plant needs water, so I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking if you need to hand water them? That would depend on how you designed and built your system. But that's why people use pumps in the first place, so the watering cycle is automated. In the case of a water culture system, the roots are always in the water, and the air pump provides much needed oxygen, and air bubbles to the roots so they don't suffocate. 4) Expect them to yield edibles I must of mist it, I'm not sure what plants you decided to grow after all. But generally speaking about the same as growing in soil. They will probably (and likely) grow a little faster than in soil. It all depends on how well you control the growing environment, that makes a big difference in both plant health, as well as yield. The better the conditions, the faster the plants grow. Any pet supply store will carry air pumps (and air stones) in the fish tank department. You can get an air pump designed for a 30 to 60 gallon fish tank at Wal-Mart for about $12 (air stones $2-$3). If you are planing to build a big water culture system and more air output, they do make high output air pumps, starting for about $80 and up that you can find online. P.S. I have some good links to strawberry information, but you say you decided not to grow them after all, so I guess I wont post them after all. If you want to keep track of the electricity costs get a Kill-A-Watt, you can get them at almost any home improvement store inexpensively. They will tell you exactly how much each electrical device is costing to run. You just need to know how much you pay per kilowatt hr (that's on your electric bill), and is programmable into the device.

Oh gosh, I'm sorry! I keep forgetting most areas don't have summer kitchens. Most homes that have a summer kitchen are old. This house was built in 1850. Back in those days, without the luxury of moderen heating and AC, some homes would have two kitchens. In the winter they would use the kitchen that was located in the house so the heat from cooking would help keep the house warm. In the summer to help keep the house cool they would use the summer kitchen. Some are attached off the back of the house and others are seperated by a breeze way. Now days they seem to become junk magnets.lol Mine is seperate from the house as you can see in this photo. BTW that is a before picture. I have since cleaned up that area and painted the summer kitchen. Foxy.

I have mixed feelings — they provide more use of our porch than if we’d just gone with a screened porch. This year we started opening only the bottom panels and using our ceiling fan. The ventilation was excellent and they were easy to open and close. However, I miss the big open effect of opening them down from the top. To close them when they were opened from the top, my husband had to use a stepstool and, at 5’4”, I couldn’t close them completely. After having them for 5 years we still haven’t tackled cleaning the vinyl so our view is getting more blurry — we’re afraid something will break. In retrospect, I wish we’d originally paid the extra $15-$20k for windows and winterizing so we could enjoy the room year-round — to retrofit now would probably cost 2-3 times that amount. Live and learn!