In the great scheme of things, I think I'd prefer an overly involved parent than a hands-off, I'm too busy with my own life and having fun type of parent.

Wow.... gag.

I would prefer that too, Piper--if it were sincere. Something tells me that Love's SS's BM isn't necessarily so sincere....

There's definitely a difference between a parent that's involved and a parent that is dependent on the child for validation. This particular BM seems to NEED validation that her son loves her & constant reminders to the son that she loves him, as if he'll forget. That kind of severe parental insecurity is very smothering to a child. It makes the child feel responsible for the parent's feelings. (ie. mom is sad because I'm not with her!) IMO, it's a form of emotional abuse disguised as "love".

Whether or not she's 'sincere'.... if she isn't, then she is doing it to irritate, thus "using" her son. Personally, I think she is sincere... but that doesn't mean it's in a good way. I believe she sincerely wants her son to know she loves him & not forget when he's with dad.... BUT the extent that she goes to in order to make her point is done in a sick way, not a healthy way.

I think she is *sincere,*too but, like Ima said, not in a healthy way.

In my therapy, I am beginning to learn just how damaging that kind of smothering dependency on a child can be.

My doctor has said to me---summed up----that it is SCARY for the child when the parent NEEDS the child. Children need their parents in ways the parent simply should NOT need the child; on the other hand, the parent actually LOVES the child MORE than the child loves the parent, in ways the child just can't because the child is not a mature adult.

The parental love should be a strong, emotionally healthy love, but NOT a dependency. Dependency/Need and LOVE are not the same things.

BM means what she says to SS---but it's *too much* if that makes any sense. She does not give SS enough independence and she definitely has consistently sent him the message over the years that SHE is *not okay* without him.

She has twisted that into love, which is unfortunate. :( Reminds me of the first 4th of July we had SS after the custody battle---SS was all upset (he was six) because BM had repeatedly told him she was going to be sooo sad that he wasn't with her. She even went so far as to tell him that she was not going to celebrate and was going to buy a bunch of fireworks and save them for when he came back because she just COULD NOT celebrate without him.

So---you can imagine how HE felt: guilty, and like he was responsible for her having a *crappy 4th.*

THAT is how she is, and it's really damaging.

LH, what it reminds me of is the movie Fatal Attraction. Any woman or man that was that needy, dependent, obsessed, etc. on their partner (assuming the partner is normal) would probably result in the end of the relationship & maybe even a restraining order. But, their child has no escape. That is their parent... they are more likely to feel obligated to be loyal to the parent.

Oh yeah, Ima, totally.

She snagged DH on the phone last night. She was saying goodnight to SS and then said, "I need to talk to your dad."

DH told SS "I'm busy, I will call her back,"but SS thrust the phone in his face and got all upset. "Please talk to her, Dad! She needs to talk to you!"

ARGH.

DH answered---I know, I know, he should have clicked off or something---and BM said that she was out shopping and "If I buy SS a cell phone for Christmas, are you going to let him use it?"

This has been an *issue* for them. She actually did buy him one a year ago and DH refused to let SS use it at our house. He thinks it's ridiculous.

She dropped the matter, but last night, ughhh.

She was arguing that she just does not get to talk to him enough, and she would feel better knowing he has a phone so she can get in touch anytime she wants.

DH said absolutely not, I will not let him use it at my house. He is eight years old and does NOT need a cell phone!

We have a home line that runs through the computer that is STRICTLY for BM to call! NO ONE else has that number! No one.

So anytime that rings, we know it is BM and SS knows it, as well. It's fab because then he can make the choice to answer or not. Usually, he does, but sometimes, if he's in the middle of something, he will say, I'll call her back later."

DH is in car sales and he HATES his cell phone---he hates how cells have made it so he is *expected* to be available at any freaking time. It's really constraining. I am sure MANY of you know what I mean. With cells, it's like you can never just get away, unplug.

THAT is what DH doesn't want happening with SS. Because then it will be this big thing.

"Oh, make sure you bring your phone to the pool, SS, so Mommy can call you!"
"Make sure you take your phone to the store with you so Mommy can call you!"

It's unnecessary and inappropriate, particularly for an eight year old. Then I guess BM was complaining that HER stepdaughter has a cell phone---and DH said, "Yeah, she is 13!"

BM got all huffy and said fine, you're the boss, I'll put it back.

We'll see. I really hope she doesn't get him one.

"There's definitely a difference between a parent that's involved and a parent that is dependent on the child for validation."

or a parent who uses "emotion" to control the child.
hard to tell what's going on in another person's head sometimes.

sounds icky anyway.

I totally know about that! Last year, when we got married, SD's beach bag (that I decoreated for her) spilled out in the car when we were getting out of the car to go on a waverunner tour. There was a picture of BM, SD and sister in there.

It really bothered DH, but we let it go. Just another one of BM's attempts to control SD. She had a great time with us, and that's all that matters.

it is excessive... but who knows

I certainly would not write such card to DD, but we do express affection that could appear excessive to some...It is hard to tell how much affection is appropriate. It is very subjective

Barf.

On the cell phone thing I completely agree. SD was on her phone 3-4x a day with BM over the vacation. When her phone died, she used mine. Or my dad's. And then BM called her back, on Dad's phone.... how weird is that???!!!

Double barf.

It's insecurity, plain and simple. SS might, for one second, forget about his BM while having fun with you and his dad and she might not be number 1 in his world. He might enjoy time with you more than time with her, and that just can't happen. So, if she can't use guilt to make him think of her, she'll stalk and smother him as much as possible so she can't be forgotten.

It's so sad.

"stalk and smother"

that's priceless....