Omg!!! How flipping awful!! Teenagers are rough but that was uncalled for by BM... So what's going to happen? How do you deal with situations like these with a 15 yr old?

It has to be awful for SD to have her own mother say something like that to her. I can't even imagine. >> to your SD..

BM is projecting. Deep down, that's how she thinks of herself.

The worst part of it is that apparently BM thinks that "keeping a man" should be the pinnacle of her 15 yo daughter's aspirations. How awful is that?

Almost every time I've been referred to as a "b!tch" is when I outshone a man at work, who was unhappy that I didn't keep to "my place". (I work in an industry that still tends to attract a number of misogynists.) Being a "b!tch" is quite an admirable accomplishment in my opinion. Plus, if SD does well enough at work she won't need to "keep a man" when she gets older - she can just buy herself a new one whenever she wants. LOL!

How disgusting.

My mom called me a slut when I was 18---I was bulimic and she actually said I was "a slut who throws up."

(The reason she called me a slut was b/c I had confided in her days earlier that I'd just lost my virginity; I thought I was "in love." She was warm and accepting at the time, but then lashed out later on.)

When I was 11, despite the fact that she was in the throes of alcoholism, and in intense psychotherapy, she told me I was "the crazy one in the family who needed to see a shrink."

Sorry to hijack---my heart just goes out to your SD, aches for her. Those kinds of comments from mothers like that have a way of burrowing deep in the heart, like a poison dart.

What did your SD say after? Is she upset, or was she able to brush it off as her mother's problem?

Caphill is dead on: it's projection on BM's part.

Sigh. :(

Caphill - you are so correct. I can't keep straight the list of boyfriends/husbands she has gone through anymore. Getting, having and keeping a man really are her priority one - something SD long ago figured out. Her mom has said so many nasty and hurtful things to her - she makes me sick.

SD was hurt and mad, but she doesn't let her mom's statements get to her as much now (that she shows) We had a long talk about her worth not being defined by anyone - man or woman - but herself. We stress constantly that she needs to find her own happiness, her own security, and her own life. If a mate fits into that at some point, great.

Sadly, we see SD making choices regarding the oposite sex more and more like her mother would. I want to chalk it up to the 'boy crazy' age, but really I'm scared. I want to believe in nurture over nature, but I just don't know. . .

at 15?...can't keep a man?...sick woman, sick...

Things almost never get better, they only get worse, so...

Keep records of every interaction.

well if her mother keeps putting her down like this, she'd go look for acceptance elsewhere: most likely males.

why is she even allowed visitations if she calls SD names? she called her names and said nasty things to her before? Does SD want to see her? I keep reading on this forum how nice parents do not even get to see their kids and kids don't even care to see their parents, and yet this woman gets to see her kid and kid clearly does not mind spending time with this crazy person. Unbelievable!

"well if her mother keeps putting her down like this, she'd go look for acceptance elsewhere: most likely males."

It's a good thing she has JNM in her life to guide her down the right path & reinforce her self worth. I had a mother that was an alcoholic & said inappropriate things but still chose to live with her. It's called DYSFUNCTION. When you are raised with it, it becomes comfortable and normal... even if it hurts. Kids love their parents and want the parents to love them back. If the parent treats them bad, I believe sometimes the kid will try harder to get the parent to change or keep going in hopes it will be different next time. At 15, I hope she can understand how toxic it is for her mom to say stuff like that to her. She is old enough to limit her time with mom and even control it as in saying "I want to go home now" and remove herself from the visit. If BM refuses to let her go home, she is old enough to decide not to go back. She should be allowed to feel empowered enough to not subject herself to verbal abuse from anyone. Unfortunately I stayed with my alcoholic mother because I didn't feel I had other options, I didn't want to leave the area & all my friends to live with dad. It wasn't until I was in my 20's that I finally stood up to mom when she said something bad to me. Your SD has the right to tell her mom that she does not have to allow anyone to talk to her like that.

Thanks Ima.
PO1 - she doesn't often want to see her mom, and does cut their visits short. But, it's a two sided problem. For her school year last year she saw her mom maybe 12 times - mostly lunches and such - UNLESS she was mad at us or restricted to the house for something. THEN she would call up 'mommy' and be missing her SO much she needed to see her that day. It got to the point that we couldn't disciplne her because 'mommy' would swoop in. Five minutes after returning from BM's SD would be talking about how horrible she was, and we got more and more frustrated with how SD was using her mom to get what she wanted.

At the end of the school year SD was upset about our reaction to her grades and the restrictions we were going to put on her because of them. She threatened that she would go live with her mom, so we picked up the phone, called BM and said to come get SD. SD was shocked, as was BM. We were more shocked then anyone though, as 'mommy', who "never sees her baby enough" flat out said "I don't want her." She didn't even want to go back to a set visitation schedule! Long story short, all four of us ended up in our living room laying down the law. There would be no more 'soft' parenting because we feared SD would want to be with her mom. If BM and SD didn't like the way it was at our house, they were welcome to do it their way in BM's home (with the latest boyfriend). If SD was going to stay with us our rules would be THE rules, and BM couldn't swoop in to save SD from them any more. We would have a set visitation schedule - we left it to them to set - but it would be SET. No more escaping with 'mommy' and then trashing on "her mother' upon her return.

What I've done a long job of explaining is that no, SD doesn't have to see her mom. There is a visitation order that says she does, but BM has been ok in the last few years letting it slide if it fits BM's wants as well. Most times SD does not want to go, and if she and BM agree to it, fine. BUT, we do make them stick to the set out schedule. If she opts not to go see BM on a set weekend, she doesn't get to then escape the following weekend if she gets in trouble at our house. She waits until the next scheduled weekend. KWIM?

SD has gotten pretty good at standing up to her mom when she gets nasty. . . which just makes BM meaner. With this last round about keeping a man, BM actually started texting me that SD was saying horrible things and ruining her Christmas and what should she do? I asked her what she expected SD to do if she's setting the example that saying hurtful things is what you do when you are mad. To her credit, she actually admitted I made a good point. Ya think??

Yes, i think BM's comments will have a lasting effect on SD. But what I also fear is the lessons and ideals BM role models will have a more damaging one.

Sorry I'm rambling. Haven't had coffee yet. :)

You said she texted asking what to do, and you explained if you say hurtful things when you are angry, SD will think that's how to treat people...

I had this conversation with DD last night as she slammed younger DS into the wall and yelled to get out of 'her' bathroom while she brushed her teeth. I said 'he looks up to you and if you treat him like that he will think that is how he should treat his friends and loved ones as he gets older and then we will have a huge mess because he will be mean and treat people bad and say 'well my big sister does it, I should too'". She actually got it and apologized and it hasn't happened today at all ... So if 9 yr old DD gets it, shouldn't 15 yr old SD's BM??? Ironic she acts more like a 3 yr old than an adult.

I hope your SD overcomes her mother's abuse. I tell you what... I am amazed more and more each day reading of these BIRTH mothers that act this way and I wonder, what in the world did kids do before it wad 'normal' for 'dad and sm' to be custodial parents? And this is exactly why it's happening more and more... These women with their 'i gave birth I can be a jerk and I don't care who it effects'. Bless you stepmom's. I wish we had a loving SM... But then I might have to be crazy and I am not willing to go there lol. I can't imagine not having my babies with me.

What often happens with bad fathers is that they just don't see the kids, or see them very infrequently. Although it is sad, sometimes it could be a blessing.

It seems that some bad mothers still want to see the kids (for number of reasons like moms are pressured by society to be involved...). Sometimes I think it would be better if they do not see them and just stay hands off as uninvolved fathers do.

I think there is less pressure in our society for fathers to be involved. I always knew number of divorced women whose exhusbands had minimal if any involvement with kids and nobody seemed to be surprised. Normally if dad does not care about child's well-being, he would not bother with visitations(and it could be for the best). Horrible mothers would insist on visitations and then just damage the child.

"It seems that some bad mothers still want to see the kids (for number of reasons like moms are pressured by society to be involved...). Sometimes I think it would be better if they do not see them and just stay hands off as uninvolved fathers do. "

Parent of One, I've thought this as well. I wonder if part of it is because, especially with younger kids, it's still the exception for men to have primary custody - and too often that only happens if the BM is borderline unfit. Nobody seems to question why a man does not have custody of his young children, whereas a mother (deservedly or not) must always feel the need to explain why she does not, and to make this public appearance of being "involved".

In addition, I've noticed a lot of deadbeat dads try to excused themselves by claiming that the mother was promiscuous and they're not sure that the children are theirs - it's a bit harder for a woman to claim that!

exactly....nobody seems to question when man is univolved... more so too often kids' mother is blamed for dad being uninvolved: she makes it difficult, she took kids away, or like you said she is promiscous.

Some differences in gender expectations are understandable, but too often men are off the hook just because society is not expecting much from them or expects to pay child support but not bother with actual involvement. Too bad.

And true about unfit mothers. I cannot imagine one semi-decent not unfit mother not seeing her children. Yet plenty of upstanding citizens- males don't even bother.

"What often happens with bad fathers is that they just don't see the kids, or see them very infrequently. Although it is sad, sometimes it could be a blessing.

It seems that some bad mothers still want to see the kids (for number of reasons like moms are pressured by society to be involved...). Sometimes I think it would be better if they do not see them and just stay hands off as uninvolved fathers do.

I think there is less pressure in our society for fathers to be involved. I always knew number of divorced women whose exhusbands had minimal if any involvement with kids and nobody seemed to be surprised. Normally if dad does not care about child's well-being, he would not bother with visitations(and it could be for the best). Horrible mothers would insist on visitations and then just damage the child."

It was a blessing to ME that my two younger kids' fathers were not involved. With my oldest, we had years of court battles, attorneys, bickering over stupid stuff, counseling for my son, etc. It was so horrible, I was thankful my younger kids didn't have to go through what my oldest did. There were definitely behavioral problems with my oldest but not with my younger ones. Today the younger ones are 20 & 21. Both have bad feelings about their fathers not being in their lives or seeing them. Both have tried to reconnect & it's been very difficult... on BOTH sides. It's difficult for the parent that chose to stay away for years, most likely because he feels guilt. My son's father blames me & says it is MY fault he didn't see him. My son knows how supportive I have been of him trying to get his father to be in his life. Heck, he was 16-18 when I finally got the court to order a DNA test that finally proved paternity before his father would have anything to do with him. Still, my son was willing to start fresh but all he got for Christmas this year was a text message saying "hope you have a good Christmas". It's very hard on my son, he admits to me that he has trust issues that are affecting his ability to have relationships. My daughter has also gone through difficulty. Her father, when they talk, can't stop apologizing. She says she doesn't want to hear his apologies, she wants him to start getting to know her so they can move forward. But, a few times he has abruptly stopped contact, which leaves her hurt & she doesn't trust him. From what he's told me, he feels guilty but it's too hard for him to face her after all these years. So, I disagree that it's better if a parent stays hands off or is uninvolved.... unless the parent is a criminal that would endanger the child. Both of my kids' fathers married & had a family with their wives. They chose to raise kids, just not see these ones. That's probably why it strikes a nerve with me that BM went off & had another baby with BF & is not very involved with her DD. It would be easier for US, peaceful for US, better for US... but it devastates the child & creates issues for the child to have to deal with. I don't think it makes too much difference whether it's a father or mother, IMO. However, I would agree that society is less harsh on a man than a woman... but women are supposed to be the nurturers that carried the baby for 9 months, felt him/her kick & gave birth.

I didn't read everyone elses reactions but I find that quote to be absolutely ridiculous for a mother to say to her teenage daughter!!! Poor sd having to hear her own mother make such stupid comments to her.

"So, I disagree that it's better if a parent stays hands off or is uninvolved.... unless the parent is a criminal that would endanger the child."

I do agree that it is better for kids to have both parents actively involved unless abuse present. But I think some cases that are not qualified as abuse per se do fall in that category: like when a woman calls her daughter names, it is borderline abuse, or when a parent shows up once in a blue moon, gives child hopes and then again no sign, it is borderline emotional abuse...So I do wonder what's better..

I don't think men and women should be treated differently. I think it is disgusting that we have such different expectations. If a man is too busy at work to see his children then nobody thinks of him poorly, but if a woman says she has no time to see her kids then no one would have much respect for her. It shouldn't be this way.

I feel bad for your kids imamommy because they give their dads so much chance....

"My son's father blames me & says it is MY fault he didn't see him." Of course he blames BM. Much easier then actually make an effort to be a father