Barb, I'll try and state my practices briefly, along with the thinking about them and a description of the conditions in which I garden. Use whatever of it you want, and feel free to quote if that's useful. I live in Italy, in the northern foothills of the Apennines. I have a large garden with a current population of probably 500-600 roses, along with many other plants. Mine is not a rose garden but a garden with a lot of roses. The garden is on steeply sloping ground with a southern exposure, most of it open to sun and wind, a part of it in part shade. The soil is a heavy gray clay, probably neutral to somewhat alkaline, and adding organic matter to it one of my major concerns. The climate I would describe as on the cusp between Mediterranean and continental. We have long, usually wet, chilly but not very cold winters, and hot dry summers with low humidity and fresher temperatures at night. Every year we have two to four months with little to no rain. My roses are mostly old or older varieties: once-blooming old roses (Gallicas, Albas, Damasks, Centifolias, Mosses), warm-climate old roses (Teas, Chinas, and Noisettes), and other old classes, plus Hybrid Musks and an assortment of shrub roses, species roses, ramblers and climbers. We have no well and public water supplies can run low in the summer, so from the beginning I knew that I would have to be sparing in my water use. I already had some experience with dry summers from gardening in western Washington state, and I knew that roses can easily live through many weeks without rain or watering, though they stop flowering after a while. So I planned on growing roses without summer water after the first year in the ground. We buy roses bareroot, grafted or own root, or I propagate them from cuttings or am given plants that gardening friends have propagated. I plant almost everything in fall, after the rains have started and the weather has cooled off, usually in October, and try to finish by Christmas. This way the roses have time through winter and spring to grow roots before the summer drought sets in, generally late May to June. I have to admit we are scanty in our site preparation. We add some compost and perhaps some sand, mixing it in with our pottery-quality clay, then mulch afterwards, not touching the stem of the rose, with hay. Lately I've been doing mini-terracing around the rose planting site, leveling the area so as to catch rain that falls in dry seasons, but encouraging drainage during extremely wet periods by adding more hay and compost to the ground and creating a steeper drop below the rose. The terraced ground looks like steps rather than an even slope. About the worst way to plant a rose (or anything else) is to dig a hole in the ground and fill it with a completely different kind of dirt. It's like growing a rose in a pot, with all the difficulties that entails. We water our roses the first year they're in the ground. We use a hose, which is uncomfortable enough that we don't do it unless it's necessary. If the ground seems moist under the surface--I stick a finger in to check--I don't water. If the plant looks reasonably happy, I don't worry about it. We keep a permanent hay mulch on our beds. We use hay, usually old or spoiled, because it's locally available, cheap, and nutritious, though of course it sprouts grass by the millions. I've recently realized that for years I've been making the mistake of applying it too thickly, so that rain and other water can't get through and the ground beneath actually stays dry. The mulch should be permeable. It should be organic, so that it breaks down and enriches the soil. Mulch can be a lot of different materials, depending on what's available locally: grass clippings spread thinly, chipped pruned branches from the garden. There's always something that doesn't come from a thousand miles away. In the last few years I've gotten interested in organic mulches. These are just little plants that grow under the roses and in the beds, often annuals. They can be wild plants. The beds in my garden are full of volunteer annual geranium, spurge, vetches, violas--also annual grasses. I weed out ugly plants and leave attractive ones. Or the gardener can plant herbaceous perennials or annuals of his or her choice. The organic mulch keeps the ground cool and moist; when the plants die their growth gets recycled into the garden. In the case of annuals, the roots die as well as the top part of the plant, and remain as organic amendment in the soil with no digging on the part of the gardener. I haven't noticed a problem with water supplies in my garden: the roses are deep rooted and the annuals aren't, so they aren't grabbing water from each other. On an aesthetic level my preference is greatly for roses mixed with other plants; and I've heard it argued that mixed plantings are healthier than monocultures. There are gardeners who argue that leaving the soil undisturbed after the initial preparation and planting allows a web of soil microlife do develop that's highly beneficial to the garden. I think this idea has merit, and lately I've been avoiding disturbing the soil, just adding mulch and pulling or digging only the worst weeds. I began doing this after I noticed that in a couple of places where I had planted roses and just left them, the roses were doing quite well, better than in some places where I fussed over them. Undisturbed ground is also less welcoming to weeds. I grow my roses lean, with a minimum of watering and with almost no fertilizer beyond the hay and living mulch. The clay is basically fertile. They grow more slowly than roses that get regular abundant nutrients. But I think this way the roots develop in balance with the top growth, and are capable of supporting the rose even in dry periods. With longer intervals between watering and more water when it does come, the roses root deeply. I can grow roses this way because the garden has deep moisture retentive soil and because I grow mostly thrifty varieties of roses. I grow roses mainly for garden effect rather than for cutting, and it doesn't bother me if they don't bloom during the summer if that's what the weather brings. I rarely lose a rose after the first year and I don't believe I've ever had a rose defoliate because of drought. Another thing to think of is protection from excessive sun and drying winds. Most roses don't love windy areas, and some hate it. Okay, this isn't short. It's also not quite complete. Also it may not be what you're looking for, though I hope you can mine some ideas from it. The part I wanted to add but got too tired for is how to move roses from a regimen of frequent light watering to rare deep watering and otherwise prepare roses now in spring for a possible drought in summer. I hope this is helpful. Let me know if you have questions about any of what I wrote. Melissa

I've searched and searched and also used google. In one of the threads, not necessarily in this particular forum but on gardenweb, somebody posted a photo of a trellis they had made. I don't remember what was growing ON it, if anything. It had regular lattice only double with narrower slats, don't know if it was plastic or wood. If I remember correctly, it had edges made with fairly large diameter pvc pipe, possibly with rounded and not square corners, and was tied or wound with some kind of twine every so often in some fashion. Does anybody remember that photo and where it might be? I lot get taken off, but some people (like me) leave their photos out on their server for quite awhile. I think the photo was embedded into the post and not an external link.

Maddielee, what a kick that you had a rosary like that. Now I'm feeling like the only nuked protestant. Hehe. We had a sun lamp and those weird little eye cap goggle things too! I had forgotten about that so thanks for the memories. Dunno why we had it because we lived in La Jolla, but we did spend a lot of time under that silly sun lamp. Nobody had any idea they weren't safe beyond the eye caps thing. Yes, there are still some of those machines out there. If you google 'fluoroscope' and hit 'images' you'll see some pics and some articles. Technicolor, we used to go to Knotts Berry Farm too back when it was free, though not nearly as often as you. You must have loved that. I don't remember that chapel, but I was very impressed as a little kid by the room with the slanted floor. Remember that? Great fun. And their jam was great. Sorry I missed the chapel -- what a hoot! Roselover, no kidding. Awww, you're just a baby! Yeah, the machines were gone way before you came on the scene I'm sure. Why not just google 60s and 70s toys? If you do it in 'images' you'll probably see just what interests you. I'm sure there is some fun web sites. It's a hoot to look at pictures from our childhoods, and see old TV shows and ads, isn't it? I'm sure the toys you played with weren't radioactive. They'd wised up when you got here, or gotten caught is more like it. Dedtired, yep those x-ray machines were fun, weren't they? They were like a big magnet for kids. Denali, oh that's not fair that you didn't get a turn! Just as well though, now that we know. Yeah that was radium paint. They were cool how the numbers all glowed in the dark. Mary do you think moving the clock across the room helped? I doubt it but that's funny. Your dad sounds like a fun guy. Lukkirish, maybe my memory is faulty but it seems to me we all knew it was radium paint. We just didn't know it was dangerous. I agree. Those clocks were much cooler than digital clocks. I'm sure your dog's ball isn't radioactive but it sounds like a great toy. One of my dogs would go nuts for that. Where did you get it? Kristine, you're right about the tritium, I think. Wiki says of tritium, "While these devices contain a radioactive substance, it is currently believed that self-powered lighting does not pose a significant health concern." I'm sure the toys were radioactive (and still are). They came out at the same time as the radium clock and watch dials. It was all the same paint. I remember that. Interesting about your grandmother's dishes. The thing with the Radiation Girls happened in the '30s. But even today there are food-safe glazes and non-food-safe glazes (I think they have lead in them).

Yeah I remember those. My Dad had one in his basement workshop. Only used it to hold a key for the door lock (never locked and only one key anyway). I imagine it was thrown away or else sold at his auction a few years ago. I would have liked to have had that. Actually several things I would have liked but I wasn't told about the sale of his house and auction.... Oh well, only material things. Still have the memories. I usually would toss a note into peoples' mailboxes. Even to this day I sometimes do. All too often I wouldn't have pen and/or paper though. Used to have some little business cards made up to leave. On one side I had made up a nice graphic saying "This must be your LUCKY DAY! You MISSED me!", then on the other side the days of the week and a time indicator to say what day/date and time I was there. Was really handy. Should print some more, although I seldom use them since gas prices went up, I don't chance things too often. More often I'll call to see if they're home.