If we're talking saving money - which we are - that seems to be an idea that some might choose to consider.

But it seems to me that some of the ideas that I hear in various churches seem quite bizarre - not the kind of stuff with which I'd want my kid's sponge of a brain to become indoctrinated.

While I don't like the ideas promulgated by some of the fundamentalist Islamists, I don't care for some of the ideas that fundamentalist Christians espouse, either. They claim to be so absolutely right about everything! Or their methods.

Remember the recent story about the folks picketing the funeral in a small town in Iowa of a family's son who'd been killed in Iraq, and a younger one about to be posted to Iraq and killed on the highway, in what seemed a suicide? The picketers saying that such results were God's punishment on us for support of gay rights, abortion, etc.?

Not my idea of basic Christianity.

joyful guy

Normally if I disagree with a poster I'll just scroll down, but I have to respond on this one.

Unfortunately the practice of using VBS as a babysitting service is becoming more and more common. My children have always attended the one week VBS at our church - but we are members of the church. I appreciate that the program gives the church an opportunity to teach Christianity to children but it bothers me that people take advantage of the program and use it for free child care - going to a different VBS program every week of the summer. Free babysitting is not the purpose of the program.

To follow up on Joyful's post, you (the OP) didn't mention if the programs you enroll the kids in are all from the same denomination - otherwise wouldn't you worry that they get conflicting doctrine? Or does doctrine matter as much as the free child care?

Don't you feel guilty taking money to babysit children and then dropping them off for the church to babysit them for for free? It's one thing to bring the children under your care to attend a one week VBS program at your home church, but to cart kids to every church in town - that's another story. Don't the parents of these children care that this is going on?

This particular VBS takes children of any faith. I don't have a problem with that. It's interesting to learn about different faiths. I would think that these kids after attending one or two of these events especially after one or two with the same theme, the kids get tired of it. Thats when they start acting up and causing problems for others like these kids did. The babysitter lied about the age of a child who was too young to attend. The volunteers ended up having to devote a full time person to that child.

I'm am not the person who did this. I think it's wrong. The babysitter was getting paid to take care of those kids. My friend who got to "babysit" the kids got an earful on other ways the babysitter cheats the system like taking in too many kids and them sending them to the playground to play when the childcare inspection people showed up.

I just posted this story because the boards are slow and I remember the long threads we had about this type of stuff a couple of years back. The threads at that time were humorous. If we don't laugh at some of the stupid things people do, we'd cry all the time.

Anyway, this type of "free" babysitting doesn't just apply to VBS. It could apply to any type of summer program or unfortunate neighbor mom where mom, dad, or the babysitter wants to pawn off the kids for a while.

My "kids" having recently achieved the ripe old age of 40 ...

... the possibility of my bending their opinions, attitudes and emotions has become somewhat tenuous - though perhaps somewhat more possible than when they were teens!

On the other hand - the possibility of them telling me what to do at my ripe old age of 75+ becomes slightly improbable, as well.

But ... we were talking impressionable tots.

Have a great weekend, all.

Ain't retirement great? Every day being weekend!

ole joyful

AdellaBedella - I'm so glad to hear that you were talking about someone else! I hope the parents of the children she's babysitting get wind of all of this so that they can speak up and put a stop to it!! I know women who do this so that they can spend the day shopping or having lunch with their friends, it just makes me mad!

Sorry to rob the unconventional money saving tips post!!

I recently sent my kids to a day camp run by a local Christian school, and enjoyed the week, knowing they were having fun. It wasn't free like VBS, but it was so seriously cheap it might've been free - $65 for 2 kids, including a field trip to a pool that charges $5 each, including lunch and snacks too, 8:30 -5:00, all week! That is CHEAP. The next best day camp deal I've found was at the YMCA, where we pay membership dues and would still have to fork over $100 per kid per week, and pack their lunches.

I heard about it from a friend who was also sending her kids. But I did feel a bit ambivalent about sending mine, because this church/school is not MY particular doctrine - I'm not a fundamentalist/born-again, they are. But hey, I thought, it's only a week, what could it hurt? They went to chapel twice each day, learned Christian songs, and played some really weird games. :) They had a good time, but agreed some things were a bit odd to them (they're 7 and 9). As the OP said, it's interesting to learn about different faiths. I wonder if this isn't a ploy to lure them in (said in a playful tone)...but my kids are quite comfy with our own church.

Anyhow, obviously this is completely ethical, unlike the OP's acquaintance's activities. I guess I just had to confess. :)

pcock,

Confession's good for the soul, I've heard.

Good wishes for ongoing life that doesn't require confession later. Haven't known many who've qualified, though

ole joyful

Joyful,

I went to school in Topeka, KS with the Phelps' kids. The church group you mentioned in your post. Their church is primarily made up of their family. They were weird even 30 years ago. Just different targets.

They came up here to Anchorage a couple of years ago and it ended up being a non-issue. No one would give them the time of day.

Did your paper report how every time they started chanting the bagpipes would start up and drown them out?

Gloria

I assumed you (AdelladeBella) were being facetious.

You know there are so many other issues going on in that family. To allow one's paid babysitter to send one's children into daycare/childcare/church situations that one hasn't screened and where one has NO IDEA of who is taking care of one's children should be criminal. Perhaps, or maybe obviously, those parents and that babysitter are not aware that pedophiles target church situations for the exact reason that everyone assumes "Oh, we are all nice Christians. We all love children. We don't do background checks of our workers."

There was a report about a church within the last month on one of the three major networks (I think it was a major national story) about the pastor and all of the elders sexually molesting the children, even the infants. They only caught them because the pastor went to the police and confessed.

I have worked in VBS as planner, director, games leader, etc. and my children are going to be safe and well-cared for as the first issue.

Boy, I now need to cool down. I feel sorry for those children, who don't seem to be very wanted by anyone, even the church. You know, I'm sure that it was a hard situation for the VBS staff, but truthfully, I think dying on a cross for all of the workers, and those unwanted kids, trumps that bad situation.

Church's aren't always the safe havens for our children that we may think they are.
This past week a pastor who has been in our town quite a few years was convicted of numerous counts of sexual abuse on young children over quite a long period.
Unfortunately,Yes....some of the incidents took place during VBS.
I realize that this is the exception to the rule,but parents should keep their eyes and ears open and watch for any strange behavior in their children.
In this day and age it's unfortunate that we have to think this way,but blind trust can have devastating results.
As we have seen recently with the BTK killer,being a member of a church doesn't automatically mean that person can be trusted.

Eliza Ann

My friend is divorced with one young son. She hated sharing custody with her ex. One summer she enrolled the boy in as many vacation bible school weeks as possible, then told her ex he should not take the kid during those weeks. It worked, but I think it was a little morally unquestionable.

I live in a very small town where during the summer young children are left to roam the streets while mom and dad work. My son is nine and many of these kids ended up at my house. They were basically camped out in my living room until I told them we were leaving and they had to go home. They told me that no one was home and they knew I was home and hoped they could stay here. How nice that they felt the need to look for a parent. Free babysitting did not happen here. I sent them on their way and told them they could come down only when their mom or dad was home. Heaven forbid if one of these children got hit by a car or fell and broke an arm. Where are people's brains?

WHY don't we adjust school hours to working hours? Kids start at eight or nine and go home at four or five? Especially adolescents -- who need more supervision than some little ones! They'd have fewer "latchkey" hours.