Yes, I know a couple, and the husband always does extreme specialty orders. Cheeseburger, hold the cheese, salad, hold the tomatoes, Coke and bring me two glasses because I drink it too fast for you to possibly refill, etc etc etc.

Typical order has at least 8 specialty requests. Then it's like he sets them up to fail, pitches a fit, and shouts that they are so inept that he deserves a free meal.

It's so embarrassing that we rarely go out with them.

I worked at a fast food place in high school, when salad bars first came out. I would see tons of people not paying for salad bar, but eating salad. What I found was that most older people didn't realize you had to pay for it (this was when salad bars were a new idea) but most younger people were cheating.

My experience is that petty thiefs raise petty thiefs. We were taught that this is stealing and is wrong. Others I know will laugh and "beat the system". They have a hundred ways to justify it.

I get upset at my wife eating a few grapes in a store before checkout. She agrees that it would be wrong to eat a cookie out of a box and then put the box back, but doesn't see that both are stealing and equally wrong. It's all in how you're raised. I guess I just don't see anything wrong with being "too honest".

People thought I was crazy when I would buy a Slurpee at a store for my son and wouldn't let him drink it while we were standing in line to pay for it.

I would explain to him (loudly, so others would hear),"Until you have paid for an item, you do not own it. If you eat something or use something before it's paid for, then you are stealing."

I've had cashiers tell me, "It's okay, we know you're going to pay for it."

I would reply, "How do you know? Maybe I forgot my wallet, or I had no intention of paying for it."

Others standing in line would inevitable stop eating or drinking after hearing this exchange!

It is so sad seeing parents raising their kids to be dishonest. Our kids are very small for their ages and often get mistaken for being younger. So I know we could get away with paying less at movies, fairs, buffets, etc., if we would lie about their ages. I know people do this all the time. But raising men of integrity is more important to me than the small savings now. It is sad how people abuse the systems. It is also that abuse that makes prices continue to sky rocket.

I also sell on ebay and have many people claim not to get their item and request a refund! I only use Fed Ex and they give me a tracking #. I pull it up on the internet and everytime without exception have shown delivery date. Usually it was even signed for! So they have the item and now are wanting money back! It is sad to have to need this proof, but since dishonesty is so prevalent, I am glad to have this protection.

Brenda

And the excuses! I know an eBay-er who receives emails from people who have won auctions, but haven't mailed in payments on time, and they send her ridiculous sob stories which may or may not be true (methinks they are not). After winning auctions, so many people are suddenly knocked into comas, or are in life-threatening car accidents, or there's a death in the family, or they have to leave the country suddenly on "business," or their bank account is rendered inaccessible by a cartel of bankers out to get them, or somesuch ...

Before you demolish me for being a cynical one in making fun of people with these kinds of issues ... 'tis not true. I've experienced my share of tragedy -- it sucks and it's no laughing matter. I just don't believe that such tragedy can strike so many people who win my friend's auctions on eBay, exactly at the moment they win the auction. My goodness, such a proportion of the random strangers buy stuff from my friend are suddenly afflicted with unforseen, life-altering changes that prevent them from paying for what they bid on.

If it's true, may lightning strike me, and may my friend stop selling stuff on eBay, as apparently it's a death-wish to win one of her auctions! Hee hee.

P.S. The "friend" is not me. Personal opinion? I can't stand eBay.

I'm always amazed at how the people on the bus will go out of their way to lie or scam the bus driver in order not to pay the .40 fare. That's right, forty cents! And I always have to bite my tongue when they do this in front of their children, why are you teaching them to lie and cheat? I was in a conversation recently about this, and the other person said she asks them if their integrity is only worth 40 cents? Good question!

bbonnn,
Boy can I relate! The stories I have heard! It is tragic that once my bidders agree to buy my item, they are all hit with such earth shattering disasters! I know some may be legit, but not the amount I get. Plus, most of us, even when going through personal loss or tragedy still manage to pay our bills. It is frustrating, to say the least!

Brenda

Mercy, perhaps I should stop bidding on Ebay! There is obviously some disasterous evil cosmic force at work waiting to strike me down if I win an auction...should I get extra bidder's health insurance coverage? ;-)!

Karen

I know a guy and his wife that go to a buffet all you can eat resturant every Friday night its Shrimp night.So they get there at near the end of the lunch buffet time period witch is not Shrimp and is cheaper.They just hold off eating until they bring out the Shrimp then they get it for the lunch price.The same guy goes to the Burger King 2 times a day orders a small drink because it is a self serve drinks place and he hangs out there and drinks a gallon probably a day.He gets the senior citzens discount so it costs him 26 cents.When he fills the cup he thinks it has to be full to the top then he spills it on the floor while he returns to his seat.

How about an obnoxious store clerk! My teenage son only had $3 in his pocket and needed to put gas in his car. He pumped the gas and went inside to pay for it and the cashier told him "don't bother coming here anymore if you are only going to buy $3 worth of gas". My son told him that's all he had. I would have announced loudly something very rude for all to hear but DS is more polite than me, suppose he got that from his father, lol.

I saw abumpersticker yesterday:

Mean people produce little mean kids.

I had to laugh at the eBay statement. I sell childrens clothes on eBay and am amazed at the number of horrible things that happen to my bidders as soon as they win an auction. I believe I've heard almost every sob story there is. I always respond nicely and tell them how sorry I am about their troubles and that I will have their item in the mail as soon as I receive payment. They appreciate the kindness and 99% of the time I complete the transaction. I always try to give people the benefit of the doubt.

Once I was at a small restaurant with a seafood buffet. I did not witness it but they had a son there who might have been 12. When the waitress brought their check they called her back because they had been charged for too many seafood buffets and the son had a regular meal. She had seen them sharing shrimp with him. They were embarassed and paid it but I bet he would have eaten better if they knew they were going to pay for those shrimp! Good for that waitress but I bet she lost her tip that day.
Another time a woman I recognized as a big yard saler came into a Golden Corral with her family. All of them ate a full salad and other things and then started whining about their food was cold when they got it. They walked right out of there when the manager told the waitress not to charge for the meals. The food was just fine and we told the waitress that too. Jerks. Kathy_PA

Kathy, Not only did they walk out, but I'm sure that they didn't leave the waitress a tip for all the time she spent with them bringing them salads, drinks, etc, and keeping her away from legitimate customers. Many people think: tips=extra money. Waitresses make $2.19/hour here. The reality is: tips=income; paycheck=extra money (which is usually less than $40/week after taxes, uniforms, etc.)

And the saddest part is, these people don't even realize that they are stealing!

As far as the gas station, when I was in college, I would frequently buy $2 worth of gas at the self serve station. I wouldn't do it here in NJ because we don't have self serve, and I wouldn't want to take up the attendant's time. But who gives a d*mn if it's self serve. I would boycott that business, and tell all my friends, family, and acquaintances to do the same. I wonder if the owner of the station advocates such an attitude. Probably not. Perhaps he needs a letter to inform him of what's going on when he's not there. Lately, I've taken to writing letters when I get annoyed by these little things. Helps me feel better, and gives the business a chance to make amends and win back my business. Sadly, I rarely get a response, even though most of these letters are via e-mail.

janetwilson,
I do the same thing, in responding nicely, telling them how sorry I am for their troubles, but also don't budge on when and if they pay. Because of my "niceness" I have a great feedback record, but it doesn't mean I really believe all those tragedies! But I have a friend who works for a collection agency and boy does she have stories! I guess some people will always make up a good story to save having to pay. Kind of pathetic, but true. What is sad is that I get so cynical that when the legit excuses come, I probably can't see it.

Brenda

I just HAD to post this. The group of people I mentioned in the opening post came in the restaurant last night, and of course, I got stuck waiting on them. Again, they let the kids run wild. I had the manager keep an eye on the kids at the salad bar. Of course, they didn't order 6 salad bars, but again, they all had it.

But, alas, life seems to work its problems out. They let the two boys go into the lobby and wrestle. Yes, WRESTLE IN A RESTAURANT LOBBY. Well, the grandma came up to me to inform me that the one little boy THREW UP on the 200 year old antique desk that is there as a decoration. One that has been passed on for 8 generations in the owners family. She came to tell me so that I could RUN AND CLEAN IT UP BECAUSE THE SMELL WAS MAKING HER NAUSAUS. I went to the manager and told him that there was no way I was cleaning it up. Not my child's vomit, not my place to clean it. He completely agreed and asked them to leave and to not return. Oh yeah, he DID make them pay for their food.

In a few months, we'll probably be reading about this event in one of the lawsuits where they will get awarded $100 million or something totally out of whack because they got "discriminated against" by the owners. And the said thing about it is, they will probably WIN. I certainly hope this is the end of that family's shannigans, but they will just take it elsewhere.

john deere,

Does the guy with the thin wallet but multiply-refilled cup who has to fill it to the brim think to put out the sign that says, "Wet Floor"?

artmom,

Did son (and, possibly, hubby), have to learn politeness in order to stay in business around your house, perhaps?

lazygardens,

"Mean people produce little mean kids."

That they like to palm off on others to take care of frequently, maybe?

Kathy,

"Another time a woman I recognized as a big yard saler ..." As in someone who wears size 234 dresses? (I intended to write "24" - but didn't have the heart to alter the error).

bouncingpig,

That is the problem - as more and more people become self-centred to the point of being heedless of others, the temptation on the part of many good-spirited people is to become hard-hearted, as well. It takes emotional and intellectual strength to maintain good humour and a generous spirit.

Thanks for recognizing the problem and making an effort to compensate for it - at some emotional cost to yourself, no doubt.

Years ago a theologian, referring to various paradoxes in Christianity, said that many of us, guilty of rather sloppy intellectual activities, felt that we needed to develop a hard heart to compensate. But - that we should be intellectually as sharp as tacks - which would allow us the luxury of having a soft heart (when indicated).

Enjoy a glorious weekend, all.

joyful guy/Ed

Sadly, I rarely get a response, even though most of these letters are via e-mail.

Email is often considered "expendable junk" when you write to corporations. Don't expect a response. Complaints by electonic media are not generally heard by anybody except the one who deletes the email inbox every month or so.

My recommendation, if you ever have a legitimate complaint against a company, is to send via U.S. Mail copies of a printed letter to the customer service department, and another to the Better Business Bureau. Although the BBB cannot do much legally for you, they can hassle the company, and, if the company cares about its reputation and relationship with the BBB, something will be done. If the company is a fly-by-night operation, unfortunately, there's not much you can do except go to small-claims court, or call the local news station. Sometimes the threat of publicity -- whether substantiated or not -- is enough to spur the company into action.

I say all this, not from an "angry consumer" viewpoint, but from having lived a former life as a customer relations person, and knowing what got action and what was ignored. :)

Thanks all, for listening (or reading). Turns out, the clerk at the gas station IS the owner and also has a car wash which damaged sons paint and broke his license plate cover. He demanded his money back but only received a free wash (he didn't take it). He normally wouldn't have gone there for gas but it was on his way to work and he was coasting on fumes.I'm very proud of him for standing up for himself. (he will be 18 next Sat.) We have all given someone a second chance but this place doesn't deserve a first. Yes, we normally are a very polite family and have raised the kids that way but sometimes.....GRRR!

The comments about Ebay buyers got me thinking about the sellers that sell multible items with a buy it now price.They have 2 dozen or more to sell.With a much lower starting price.Then people bid on the first one on the list instead of one of the same that have not been bid on.These sellers have people working with them bidding on these items.Because who would be stupid to bid on one that has a bid when there are more of the same thing from the same seller.See this all the time wonder how stupid people could be not to see what is happening.

Well Guess what John Deere. They are that stupid because I see it all the time and I wonder myself. So unless you know for sure, please do not accuse us sellers of being dishonest when it is just stupid buyers sometimes.

Johndeere,
I have never understood that multiple listing mentality either. I mostly sell old plates and other china type things and I do sometimes list two matching plates on separate auctions, because many people want a pair. But I always reference this in the auctions, saying something like,"check my other listings as I have an identical plate listed on a separate auction if you want a pair." To list a dozen just seems stupid! I sometimes am amazed at why sellers do that! It sounds like you are suggesting sellers bid up the items themselves. I suppose this could occasionally be true if the seller had a second ID (you can't bid on your items with your own ID) but I really believe some people just bid before they go down the list and see the other 12. I guess when I play the role of buyer, I am so tight that I only bid if I know it is the absolute cheapest of whatever it is I am after on ebay! I would rather look carefully and thoroughly than pay more.

Brenda

Weebus gee wiz you act like im accusing you.But really it is there it is real it is easy to spot.They have friends bid on there own acount on there own computer.Only a fool would not catch on to this.Im talking things like replacment remote controls for say a satelite reciever.There will be the same guy selling 12 with a low start with a buy it now option.If you bid on the next to the last day and your the first bidder there will be a second bid and the others set untouched.Then you bid on another open one same thing happens.There could not be that many people needing the same replacement remote.And if there were there could not be that many stupid people to bid on the sameone when there are more to chose from the same seller.Excuse me but I did not fall off the turnip truck.

Whatever. I do know for fact that I make squirrel feeders and they are $17.95. I will list them multiple times and it naver fails that I will get 3 or 4 bids on one and others are left untouched at the lower price. They are all in a row and obviously the same thing. I have no idea why they do this, but stupid is as stupid does.

bbonnn: I laughed out loud reading your post. I like ebay because you can really get good deals.

mandy: I'm glad those idiots are banned from your restaurant. The problem is there are SO many people that have NO SHAME!

pyano

Weebus,
I've had the same thing happen before, where one item gets several bids and the other none. I do know if I do a gallery picture, I get a lot more bids than if I only do the auction picture. I guess it is greater exposure. But I rarely list more than two of an item at a time. I know there are those like Johndeere is referencing, but not ALL are. Some of them truly did just fall off the turnip truck (apparently landing on their heads?!)

Brenda

Getting off e-bay and back to the salad bar. Last Sunday we took my mom to a steak house and she ordered the 'one trip to the salad bar'. Half way thru her salad, she realized she didn't have enough dressing. She agonized over getting up to get some more because she was only authorized 'one trip'.

Out of Grandma, Grandpa, Mom and three kids.. .four out of six ordering the salad bar isn't bad... how much salad can anyone eat... certainly not the $4 or so that's charged for the salad bar. If the kids are a problem, fine... throw them out, ban them forever, spray them with that indelible dye that banks use. But don't complain that they eat more than they pay for on a 4/6.

Point is Gina, if you don't think it's worth $4.00, don't order it. But, don't order 4 salad bars, and then 6 people get up for the salad bar. They were intentionally trying to steal (your Grandmother was not.) If I think an item is overpriced in a store, I don't drop what I think it's worth on the counter, (when the clerk isn't looking,) and walk out with the item.

And, maybe the salad bar is worth $4.00. I can tell you from first hand knowledge, that the highest expense in the restaurant business is not food (or food waste: i.e. having to throw away food from the fridge before it ever gets served.) The single highest expense in the restaurant business is labor. How much do you get paid to do your job? How much do you think that the poeple working in the kitchen need to get paid to pay their bills? Someone has to cut up all those vegetables. And keep the salad bar full, and clean. And clean it all up at the end of the day. All that work could keep one employee busy for a full day. How much do you think it costs the restaurant to pay the salary, payroll taxes, unemployment insurance, disabilty insurance, etc, etc, etc for one employee to maintain the salad bar? And, after all that, the restaurant still needs to make a little money to make it all worth while. Don't forget, there will always be a little waste in the kitchen that never makes it to the salad bar. And some of the food off the salad bar will be discarded at the end of the day (having never been "served," although time was spent "preparing" it.)

So, yes, I do think that the salad bar is worth $4.00. And if I didn't think it was, or didn't want to pay $4.00, I wouldn't order it. But, I would never try to steal it!

Probably the easiest way to handle the "lack of dressing" problem would be to ask the waitress if she would mind if you got a bit more dressing, or, if that is a problem, if she would get it for you. While I agree, you shouldn't go back for more if it isn't all you can eat, something as minor as needing a bit more dressing could easily be resolved. As a former waitress, I can't see any restaurants having a problem with a gently asked request such as this.

Brenda

I think this thread isn't about obnoxious people as much as dishonest people.

A waiter at our local Thai restaurant told us about a group of 6 people that came in one night. One of the group was loud and complained through every step of the meal that the food wasn't good, it was cold, service was slow, and on and on. The group apparently ate ALL their ordered food, then the complainer announced that they were not going to pay for the meal, and they walked out!

Grrr! If I were there that evening they would NOT have gotten away with that crap. I would have challenged them to pay for their food or called the police. And I would go so far as follow them out to the parking lot and get a license plate number! I don't like to stand by while folks are cheated or wronged.

One Sunday I asked a parishioner to join me at the front, we joined hands, and engaged in a pulling match to see who could pull the other off of his feet.

Then I lifted one leg in the air and we started another match. Which didn't last long.

I suggested to the people that it is important to build your life on a solid, strong foundation. - like having two feet on the ground.

Then you can take some of life's difficulties, including dealing with obnoxious people, without getting all bent out of shape.

And even seeing a bit of humour in it.

It keeps me busy being responsible for what I do, let alone taking on responsibility for the actions of others.

Though some of you may have noticed that around here I sometimes encourage others to build a lifestyle which will be more fulfilling for themselves, others and the community, e.g. quitting smoking.

Hope you're finding some joy in life (without causing others a day of shrunken joy).

joyful guy/Ed

OK, windchime... the salad bar is out there, the labor's already paid for. There's no way in hell you can convince me that the two extra people eating off the salad bar is going to cause an extra hour or so in labor costs. Restaurant accountability accounts for losses not only in the 'kitchen waste', (which you keep referring to), but also in other areas.

GoodWill is another area that could be addressed when you have Grandma& Grandpa taking the kids out to eat. They're on a fixed income, and the kids got dumped on them by the parents.

Lighten up!

If grandma and grandpa are on a fixed income and cannot afford to take the children and pay for the children's meals also, they can wait to go out to eat when the obnoxious little heathens are at home with their parents.

grandpa and grandma may be on a fixed income, which does not necessarily mean it's a small income. There's no excuse for being cheap and abusing restaurant owners who are making a living.

Small people, old people, whoever eats it , pays for it, IMO.

Gina -
The waiters should have called the police ... leaving a restaurant or hotel without paying is a FELONY in most states.
A group tried that at a local restaurant during the Fiesta Bowl - they ate a LOT of food, complaining the whole time, and walked without paying. The restaurant staff did their usual "skipped out" drill and the cops got them a few blocks away, booked them, and they not only missed the game they had tickets for because they were in the holding cell (ROFL-no TV in the cell and the tickets cost hundreds of dollars), they are having to come back for the trial and will probably be convicted. If they don't come back, they WILLbe convicted in absentia, get a "bench warrant" issued, and their next traffic stop or background check will be an unpleasant one.
When security tapes show them entering, leaving an hour or so later, and the manager's snapshots show the plates licked clean ... they came, they ate, and they defrauded. Hard to claim you did anything else. And they were NOT college students, just stupid fans who thought the laws didn't apply to them.

We had one buyer on ebay claim that a relative had died and she had to spend her ebay money on a ticket out of town to their funeral. I got suspicious and checked to find out that she had bid on about 100 other items in the time she was supposed to be at the funeral. It was the only time I gave out a neg. and explained why. She wrote to me that she was buying for her boss and it wasn't her money she was spending. I noticed that within the week she was kicked off ebay......I wonder why.

Gina w, earlier this month a waitress at Bennigans followed a group outside to get their plate numbers when they left without paying. They backed into her and she ended on the truck of the car. The driver then proceeded to start and stop several times till she was knocked off. She died. It was in Dallas. So following people outside isn't always such a good idea. By the way, the driver was a 18 year old girl.

So, Gina in Fl, you're saying that sometimes stealing is justified?

Hi all,

There's so much fun on here that I though you newbies would appreciate it - and oldtimers would likely have forgotten it by now.

Before you read this next, check out "blincoln"'s post of Jan. 6 at 11:46 or so.

He was upset that his wife would eat some grapes while standing in the checkout line at the store - he felt that dishonest.

blincoln,

Maybe you could do as the farmers do when delivering grain to the elevator.

Weigh the truck when it enters the elevator, loaded.

Then unload the grain.

Weigh the truck again.

The difference is the amount of grain that was on the truck.

That should work for your wife - weigh her when she enters the store.

Weigh her again on leaving, then add the difference to the weight of the grapes she declared.

Should work O.K. - unless she visits the bathroom in the meantime. In which case - the store might owe her!

Have a joy-filled weekend, all,

ole joyful

P.S. Just remember - when one's retired - every day is weekend.

As I've said to a number of prospective clients for my personal financial advisor (also retirement consultant) business over almost 20 years - give me 10% of your money, and I'll have you retire early.

Actually, that's only partly true - my purpose was to help them learn how to manage their own assets - effectively.

People said, "But, Ed - you'll work yourself out of a job!"

Not likely.

As my clients became more adept at managing their money in their best interest, I'd have more time to look for others who know so little about how to make their money work well for them (rather than primarily for the store(s) - or the bank).

oj (not drinkable)

I work in a family place that's 'famous' for it's steak, pizza, and fresh salad/soup/dessert bar, its all homemade.

During lunch customers can order the plate lunch specials...which are the same portions of food as the dinner, but minus the unlimited salad bar...it's plenty of food for most people.
OR you can add the salad bar for 3.49 which many people do if they are very hungry.
The cost of just the salad/soup/dessert bar at lunch is 4.99...very reasonable.
And if the cost of the plate lunch plus salad bar exceeds the amount of the dinner price, the waitress will simply charge the dinner price. There is only a few pennies difference on a couple items but we don't want to overcharge anyone.
A couple months ago, a youngish very nicely dressed couple came up to the cash register to pay their bill. He said "I had the spicy sirloin dinner, and I only ate some soup off the salad bar, my wife ate 'my' salad so take 'her' salad off the bill."
I asked him to repeat what he said, just to make sure I understood correctly what he was saying before I answered.
I said "I'm sorry I can't do that"
"But I didn't eat the salad! Only the soup..."
"Well, you were welcome to have whatever you wanted from the salad bar, if you only ate soup, that was your choice. If your wife ate a salad from the salad bar, she will be charged 4.99"
He refused to understand why I wouldn't change his bill...he asked me what if it was ME and MY situation and I looked him right in the eye and said "I would pay the 4.99, because I understand the restaurant business and I know you don't 'share' food, it's not fair"
he said "You wouldn't pay it!" he was ARGUEING with me about MY integrity and I was soooo mad, he really threw
a tantrum...
Finally I offered to go get the owner who is a hot headed greek who would have had plenty of choice words for him...he finally told me to 'just ring it up already!" which I did...and as he was leaving he said "I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything..." um, to late!
I looked at his credit card slip to see what his name was...when I got home I looked in the phone book, he was listed as "Reverand So&So"!

Can I, a former "Reverend", apologize for those who show? have? less integrity than one might expect.

Actually, sometimes when I hear folks making a big thing of their religious connections ...

... I get a bit of a feeling that it might be a good thing to hang on to my wallet.

Hope you all enjoy a week filled to overflowing with ... integrity - both yours and others'.

ole joyful

You're so sweet, so need to apologize on anyone's behalf...
his poor wife looked mortified, she actually went out to the lobby in the middle of his tirade, I'm sure she's seen it before. It just makes me thankful for my own husband who would never dream of doing such a thing!

I have a little comment on the salad bar. If one eats at the bar and didn't pay for that "service" most of us would agree that this is dishonest. What about the folks that load up the plates to the hilt, piling so much food on the plate that food drops on the floor as they return to their seat? I guess that approaches the abnoxious part of the discussion, but I think that annoys me more then a dishonest person... going out of your way to skirt the rules or finding a loop hole in the rule to satisfy their own moral integrity.

Another pet peeve of mine is insensitivity, namely in the health care profession. Having spend more then my fair share of time in the hospital, I have encountered many number of excellent nurses that cared for me in a time of need and without them I wouldn't have known what to do.

On the other hand I have nurses that were just careless or refused to help. Having a IV line tossed up on my stomach just after coming out of surgery, abdominal surgery none the less, was one that jumps out at me. After seeing me gasp in pain she realized what she had done and said a half hearted "sorry" and told me to press the button on the morphine drip like it was the solution for everything. Yes, two minutes later I wasn't feeling much of anything, but that wasn't the point.

Now, if we can just get consumers to write or notify the company when they've had excellent service or a good/exceptional experience versus a bad one, perhaps that's just too much to ask for!

Back in my college days, I worked as a waitress in a restaurant with a salad bar. The owner had a rule that each waitperson was responsible for each ticket in their order book. If any customers left without paying the bill, the waitress was charged $15 off their salary. The first week I worked I had to pay union dues,buy my own uniform, and was fined for so many lost tickets, I only made $9.00 for a full weeks work.

I work with a woman who told me that they go to an all you can eat restuarant, where you pay as you are going in. There's a door at the rear of the restuarant where patrons leave. They always try for a large table near that door, order their drinks and then when no staff member is around they open the door to let the rest of their party in.

Another takes her kids to the swimming pools, she'll often make the kids mix with another families group - who have bought a family ticket.

With ebay, my husband was bidding on something and close to the end there was a bidding war going on. He won it but as he said it was a bit more than he wanted to pay. When the seller contacted him, he noticed that he used another account instead of the one the item was under but that the other account looked familar. Turned out that the account was the same as the other bidder's. He wrote back refusing to pay, told why and then reported him.

Wouldn't it be nice if everyone that we dealt with was "well-bred".

Well - not only "well-bred" - but "well brought-up", as well.

I call the ones such as have been referred to here as "PITA bread" (i.e., "Pain In The Patoot"), if you'll pardon the expression.

By the way - I wonder whether such people teach their kids not to lie?

And how they deal with it if they catch them doing it?

I've sometimes wanted to go up to a car that stopped ahead of me at a red light, whose driver passed me speeding substantially, crossing solid yellow lines, sometimes double ones, to pass, to ask them whether they taught their children not to lie, and what they felt the difference might be between kids lying and Dads speeding, crossing double lines (on curves, hills, etc.). If there might be kids in the car, whether they valued their kids' lives, let alone their own - and mine.

Have a safe, honest, blessed, happy, healthy week, everyone.

ole joyful

Wow...what postings! My DH and I used to own a retail business and the stories of obnoxious people would make your head spin.

I've encountered the most obnoxious people at Costco (like Sams club in other places). On Saturdays they have free sample stations set up all over the store, and Heaven forbid you get between someone and the free sample of deviled ham dip. You'll lose an eye!

Or try to get one of the hot, roasted chickens after 5pm...you'd think they were made of gold. I had one guy SCREAM at me as I tried to pass him on line. I was trying to get to the dog food which was next to the roasting oven (I wasn't after the chicken at all!) He screamed that he was waiting on line and that I was trying to take cuts...this was a guy in a business suit, mind you! He kept grumbling after I picked up my dog food and walked away...and I heard others griping too. Scary.

I went to a live auction house, they do weekly auctions, and it took me just about half an hour to figure out they had their plants bidding up things. Coincidentally EVERY item I was interested in was bid up by one of the same 5 people. Yet the obvious regulars in the crowd never had competitive bids. Oh well, I guess that stuff just carried over to the next weeks auction. So it wouldn't surprise me in the least that this same thing goes on in Ebay. Not everyone who sells is a crook, just like most people practice ethical restraurant tactics. It's the bad eggs that spoil it for the rest of the crowd.

As I read this thread, I was saddened by the stories. Kids learn what they observe and hear. People will continue to do what they once got away with doing.

On the flip side, I was once at a big warehouse store that hands out free samples. My son enjoyed one and asked for a second. A crabby old lady narrowed her eyes at him and said, "Go away. You had one." My son is four years old. I called the woman by name and in a normal voice I said to her, "Don't you ever talk to my son like that again. My cart is full of purchases and my gas tank is full of gas from the store's pumps. You have no right to be nasty." Was I out of line? Maybe...but when a grown-up is nasty to my kid, I step in. Period. I also reported her to management.

PAM