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tlbean2004

Does this mean that my pipes have burst or are frozen?

tlbean2004
9 years ago

It was very cold last night. Below freezing. Anyways, i sometimes get my dogs water from the outside spigot.
When i went to turn it on it was hard to turn but finally turned and water came gushing out from the spout and also from the top(pressure relief part). I turned the water back off and it stop flowing like normal. I then went to work.

The pipes are copper.

Since it was kind of hard to turn on does that mean that the pipe is not broken?

I went to check the water meter but the top was froze shut and i did not fool with it because i was late for work.

Please advise.

Comments (13)

  • User
    9 years ago

    If the outside spigot(sill cock) is a freeze proof type, you should be ok---unless you left a hose connected.

    If the pipe freezes and splits, it will leak when it thaws.

    Checking the water meter does little good, since the fact you hasd water means it is functioning.

  • kudzu9
    9 years ago

    It may have been frozen, but not to the bursting point, or it could simply have been hard to turn because metal parts shrink when cold. If you did not hear any water flowing in the wall after you turned this off, you are probably ok. Make sure you do not have a hose attached to this spigot, as doing so can increase the heat that drains from the spigot and make it freeze more easily. You also need to have an insulated protective cover over the spigot, and just remove it temporarily when you need to use it (the one in the link below is much faster to put on and take off than the ones that have a screw mechanism). You're probably ok, but check the meter tonight for any movement, especially the little colored spinner in the center.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Hose bibb insulation

  • randy427
    9 years ago

    It sounds like there may have been some residual water that froze in the outflow side of the sillcock's valve. This usually happens when a hose, other device, is left attached when temperatures drop - not a good practice.
    It may have just frozen the valve shut and temporarily defeated the vacuum break, or it may have also burst the water tube.

  • kudzu9
    9 years ago

    handymac-
    First, I agree that it won't help to check the meter for movement if the spigot is frozen, but if there is any warming, it should be checked, and it sounds like continuous freezing is not typical for the OP. Secondly, I had a frostproof spigot but it was in an uninsulated wall and it did fail from freezing one winter. We rarely have freezing weather where I live, but it froze at some point and burst the valve mechanism. Since the break was after the valve seat, it didn't leak until I turned it on in spring: water came out normally, but I heard some weird sound in the wall and discovered it was spraying out of the break inside the wall as well. I agree that it's better to have a frostfree spigot than not, but they aren't 100% insurance against a break.

  • tlbean2004
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I actually have some of the hose bib insulators but am not using them at the moment. (stupid i know).

    I just cant wait until i get home to see if everything is ok.

    I dont know if the spigot is frost proof or not but it was installed about 4 years ago.

  • klem1
    9 years ago

    kudz said "Since the break was after the valve seat, it didn't leak until I turned it on in spring:"

    Aaah but the frost proof facuet didn't fail. That is proved by your above statment. The facuet was either installed wrong preventing it to drain or a hose was left on it during freezing weather.

  • kudzu9
    9 years ago

    klem-
    Your statement is logical, but, actually, neither of those is exactly correct. The frostproof hose bibb was mounted in a garage wall that was uninsulated and the garage was unheated. So, although it did offer better protection than a non-frostproof hose bibb, it finally got cold enough inside that wall that the hose bibb froze anyway. It was mounted correctly, but it was attached to a piece of cold water pipe that was poorly located.

    I've since cut into that wall and re-plumbed by soldering in an additional shutoff valve and a drain valve near where it comes up through the concrete slab so I can drain the piping in the fall and leave nothing to freeze in the wall no matter how cold it gets.

    I guess you could argue that it was installed wrong in the sense that it was attached to piping that was poorly thought out, but, it took 5 years before anything bad happened, and I then realized what a bonehead the contractor was. Well, it almost worked...:-)

    The moral of the story probably is that no frostproof valve is idiotproof, especially if it gets cold enough.

  • bus_driver
    9 years ago

    It is crucial that frostproof faucets have hoses removed in freezing weather. Leaving the hose connected can prevent the faucet from draining properly.

  • klem1
    9 years ago

    I have been a student of life and the trades for a number of years and that accounted for learning some valuable things. I have never been content with knowing the answers,I want to understand why. It is in that spirit I hope to learn something new about frost proof facuets. Regarding a facuet that leaks inside the wall when it's turned on but will not leak otherwise. My theory is that a new facuet stops water flow inside wall about 12" away from bib where hose connects. When facuet is turned off water in the 12" conduit between stop and bib runs out leaving conduit dry. Freezing temperatures don't occur at or beyond the stop because it's much warmer there than at hose bib. Additional heat is constantly conducted from earth to stop via water line. The bib and 12" conduit are certainly exposed to and reach ambient outdoor temperature but there is no water in conduit to freeze. If facuet is installed with bib higher than stop,it's obivous that conduit will not drain dry when facuet is turned off. It;s also obivous that having a hose connected prevents conduit draining dry. In either of those cases where water continues standing in conduit,freezing temperatures will freeze the standing water. Water expands as it freezes and cracks the conduit. All is well until stop is opened and cracked conduit fills with water.
    Kudz,will you please explain how you believe a frostproof facuet works and/or fails?

  • bus_driver
    9 years ago

    "Water expands as it freezes and cracks the conduit."
    Yes. But the location of the pipe split is not necessarily where the freeze occurred. If the hose connection threads are where the initial freeze occurs, it would seem that the burst would occur there. The outside is obviously where the initial freeze does occur as that is the coldest point. But the water freezes gradually and the liquid water in the center of the pipe is forced along the pipe as the water adjacent to the pipe walls freezes first and expands. After the full cross section of the pipe is frozen at one point, that forms a plug and as freezing continues, hydraulic pressure builds between the ice plug and the closed faucet valve. The hydraulic pressure ruptures the pipe, often back in nearer the interior of the house.
    This is well documented in laboratory studies.

  • klem1
    9 years ago

    Why did you chase that rabbit bus?

  • bus_driver
    9 years ago

    Klem, you introduced the subject. Your rabbit.

  • sdello
    9 years ago

    explanation with pictures

    Here is a link that might be useful: How a Standard Frost-Proof Faucet Works