Shop Products
Houzz Logo Print
shellipgw

update on pool tear out due to elevation error

shellip
12 years ago

Update!

Thanks again everyone for all your info. PB has taken responsibility and is in the process of tearing out new pool.

pool demo from shallow end

{{gwi:2041077}}

He has taken out the gutter for the infinity edge, the walls of the shallow end, weir wall and the splash deck.

PB is requesting to leave the walls that are pictured below, and frame around or inside of them. He said he wants to do this so he can reuse the plumbing. The walls he wants to keep are the wall with the light in the deep end and the wall where the skimmer was placed.

skimmer wall & deep end light wall

{{gwi:2041079}}


This will change the size and design a bit which is not huge for us, but it pushes it to with in 6' of the trunk of a 100+ year old live oak. We are concerned with the gutter/catch basin being so close to a tree who is notorious for root invasion, especially since the basin will be in the ground, with the coping just above yard level.

Any thoughts on if it is ok to keep those walls and plumbing, and if you would be concerned about a catch basin that close to the tree. The original design has the pool a little over 10' from the trunk.

To save $ on the rebuild, we offered to omit the 10x10 splash deck and instead integrate it into the shallow end of the pool. Would this in fact be a cost saving for him?

Thank you,

shellip

Orig. plans w/splash deck

{{gwi:2039944}}

Comments (13)

  • banana_fanna
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Oy.

    It's a good thing that the PB took responsibility and is doing the right thing by starting over.

    Whenever we hit a glitch in our construction, I would keep in mind the very wise words of someone on this site: when all is said and done and the last landscaper leaves the premises and you're floating in your pool with a cold, frosty one, you'll forget all about the build problems.

    Granted, yours is more than a mere glitch but I hope a few months from now this will seem like a distant memory.

    Good luck. Looking forward to watching the process.

  • nylsor107
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Hi Shellip,

    Just wondering how things are going with your pool re-do.

  • shellip
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Just an update on our progress to date. New crew started Wed. and oh boy the problems they have found! I think we are finally moving in the right direction.HOPE!

    Only question now is the size of the pump and if two pumps are needed. PB says only one pump, new crew says need two pumps. That will be the discussion for the weekend. Have to have a decision by Mon. Also reading the thread on the auto fill so may have to add that too.

    Condition of pool when new crew arrived.

    {{gwi:2046578}}

    Concrete and dirt that needed removal.

    {{gwi:2046579}}

    Old dirt shows the elevation error! Wow!

    {{gwi:2046580}}

    Removing the 5 loads of dirt which I just bought and had hauled in a few months ago.

    {{gwi:2046581}}

    New dig.

    {{gwi:2046582}}

    Steel and plumbing going in.

    Almost done with steel in gutter pool.

  • poolguynj
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    That long a catch basin/edge will need its own pump.

    Scott

  • golfgeek
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Shellip,
    It appears that you are already committed to the two pump system. I noticed a skimmer in the pool wall. Vanishing edge pools don't normally have skimmers because the catch basin IS the skimmer. You are kind of working at cross purposes here with both.

  • shellip
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Golfgeek,

    As a new pool owner, I had no idea what I did or did not need re: equipment for this type of pool. I tried to join the Genesis 3 and to find some type of instruction guide for what is customary. Genesis 3 does not allow non PB's to join, so I have been gathering all my information from this site and one other forum.
    There have been so many mistakes on this build that I have started to double check everything! PB did the dig and the plumbing himself the first time, but has called in a crew for the re-do. PB wants the crew to tie into his old lines and go with a 1hp pump for the entire syst. New crew said NO WAY, too many feet of head to pick up. Right now there is a 3 way spirited discussion on which is the most efficient method. I just want to be sure I have everything in the walls that need to be there prior to the gunite! BTW, this is PB's first infinity edge.
    THANK YOU!!!
    shelli

    FULL VIEW OF PLUMBING 110'5" FROM SHALLOW INLET TO PUMP

    POOL SIDE VIEW WITH SKIMMER SHOWING.FROM SHALLOW INLET TO DEEP END WHERE PIPES MAKE TURN IS 37'

    PIPES TURNING FROM SKIMMER SIDE AT THE BACK OF THE DEEP END TO RUN LENGTH OF THE DEEP END

    PIPES RUNNING ALONG DEEP END OF POOL TOTAL OF 18'7"

    GUTTER PLUMBING

    PIPE RUNS ALONG THE DEEP END AND MAKES A RIGHT TURN TO GO TOWARD THE PUMP. APPROX. 55' FROM THE RIGHT TURN TO THE PUMP.

    CLOSE UP OF THE RIGHT TURN FROM THE BACK OF THE DEEP END TOWARD THE PUMP

    PIPE LEADING TO STUBS FOR PUMP

    The distance from the inlet in the shallow end to the skimmer is 28'. from the skimmer to the back of the deep end is another 9'. Where the pipe turns at the back of the pool skimmer side to run along back of the deep end of the pool is 18'7". From the deep end of the pool where the pipes turn to the Pump is approx 55'. So from the furthest inlet in the shallow end of the pool to the pump is 110'.5".

    From the main drain up and out the back of the pool to the pump is 77'5".

    This is why the new crew said a single 1hp pump will not work.

    Thanks for any thoughts.
    s

  • golfgeek
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Shellip,
    Anytime projects(plumbing) get redone and tied into existing lines, it won't look as clean and neat as the first time around. All the plumbing needs to be under pressure(35psi min.) and holding until all gunite and deck work is complete. Competent plumbers will also track and label the lines at the equipment to make the equipment set a little easier.
    Every PB has a first for a lot of projects. There are a lot of different ways to do things. Your project is no different. Most PB's will research and have some method to their madness.
    It appears that little thought has been made as to how your system will actually function. A skimmer and main drains are installed just to make sure that everything a normal pool has is there just in case.
    I would encourage you to look at a couple things:

    1) Make sure an automatic water filler is installed! Most times it is installed in the basin, but because you are using two pumps and treating the catch basin and pool as separate bodies of water, it won't matter where it is installed. Just make sure you put one in. Justification for this is twofold: water that runs over the edge is aireated and more prone to evaporation. And, if the water level in the pool drops, you may not have enough water in the basin to operate it properly.
    2)You will absolutely have to run the pump for the catch basin EVERY day. If the catch basin doesn't run for a week, you will have a couple more problems: water evaporates and again you may not have enough water in the catch basin to operate it properly and since you are not filtering this water you will have problems with unfiltered stagnate water in the basin that grows algae rapidly.
    3) I suggest you install some type of remote control system. There are plenty to choose from, Pentair, Jandy, etc. This will enable you to operate the pumps and lights from your home or patio. I suggest this because it will be advantageous to be able to turn on the basin pump while the pool is being used. This will help ensure that splash over into the basin is being pumped back into the pool and it does not overflow. I don't think you want to walk to the equipment and manually turn on the pump each time you use the pool. I haven't made my customers do that since the 70's.

    One other item that you might want to look into, though it is a little late to address fully. This is the elevation of the basin. Catch basins should not be visable when you are standing on the opposite side of the pool. Perhaps a detail of the site lines were provided by your architect when he drew the original plan. With all the changes you have had to endure it would be good to check this to make sure. Nothing ruins a good vanishing edge more than being able to see the edge of the catch basin when you stand at the opposite side of the pool.

    The pool pump size can be 3/4 or 1 hp with an appropriately sized filter. The basin pump will need to be large enough to produce a minimum of 108 gpm thru the plumbing. Brand and hp may vary. It just needs to produce at least that much water based on the length of your wall. Good luck.

  • shellip
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Update on pool progress. New pool is now plumbed, shot, and coping complete. Waiting on a few more tiles for back of weir wall. New crew working on the drainage and patio. Not the same as PB. These are the guys that noticed the elevation issue in the first place. Waiting until all the excavation complete for the patio to do the final steps of the pool, the auto fill, the pool light and the plaster.
    Still issues with PB's attention to detail, but luckily we are on top of it and catching things as they happen.
    A few photos of the progress.

    Through and through hole in the gunite that drainage guys fixed. Could stick steel through to the form and water was coming out the hole like a faucet.
    {{gwi:2046593}}

    Drainage and Concrete guys at work.
    {{gwi:2046594}}

    {{gwi:2046595}}

    Shellip

  • golfgeek
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Shellip,
    Glad to see that the PB is making things right.
    Have you had any additional discussions regarding the way the pool will be plumbed regarding number of pumps and location of auto-fill line?

  • shellip
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Golfgeek,

    Have not had much discussion w/PB. The current crew is one we hired. Just too unsure of the PB to allow him to do the drainage and deck. No new discussions on the pump/plumbing in the past few weeks. He wants to put in a 1HP to run everything, and I have requested a variable speed that goes between 1.5 to 3HP. Asked him to credit me for the 1 HP and I would pay the difference, but so far not taking my offer. Will let you know when we discuss again.
    The auto fill is in the gutter pool and is 16" below the coping, or about 10" below the drip line tile.
    shellip

  • poolguynj
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Intelliflow's exceed your desire on the low end in that they can run slower and meet your high end requirement.

    Scott

  • golfgeek
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Shellip,
    VS pump is a good choice.
    Auto fill height will need to be adjusted to proper depth when pool is running after start-up. Setting(dimensions) doesn't mean anything at this point.
    Good luck.

  • shellip
    Original Author
    12 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    poolguy & golfgeek,
    Thanks for the input. Had rain here last week, so all is at a standstill again. Will update when we get moving!
    shellip