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Kidney problems - help needed with diet. Anyone? Meghane??

weed30 St. Louis
17 years ago

Taco's blood tests show high BUN levels and high creatinine. The vet said her BUN is 48 and should be 25, and the creatinine is 3.2 and should be 1.6. She wants me to start Taco on Hills KD, but I really don't want to feed commercial.

I guess I am willing to try the canned Hills KD, (She hates Kibble), but my goal is to make a KD diet for her myself, so at least I know there is fresh wholesome food in it.

I am just starting to look around on the internet, and have found some things, but I know it will take awhile to decipher. One article I found, in part:

A diet suitable for dogs and cats with failing kidneys can be prepared at home by adding one-half cup of cooked ground chicken breast or two crushed large hard-boiled eggs (no shells) to four cups of mashed potatoes or four cups of boiled brown rice. 30ml (Two tablespoons) of Canola oil, one-quarter Centrum tablet, 100iu of vitamin E, and 500mg of absorbable Calcium from any human calcium supplement, which is free of phosphorus on the label. Vitamin E (alpha-tocopherol acetate is known to slow the aging process by scavenging free-radicals). Garlic or onion powder can be used in moderation if the diet is fed to dogs. It must never be fed to cats. The amount prepared should feed a ten pound cat for two to three days, or a 25 pound dog for a day or two, depending on its activity level and metabolic rate.***

A second recipe, originally published by Hills Pet Foods, for renal failure in dogs but somewhat modified by me, consisted of ¼ pound ground regular beef (not chuck or round), 1 large hard-boiled egg, two cups of cooked white rice, three slices of white bread, and a teaspoon full of calcium carbonate. I would add a multivitamin with vitamin E to this recipe.

In any of the renal diets, the addition of fermentable fiber may be helpful in controlling uremia. The theory is that the bacteria that ferment this fiber in the intestines utilize some of the excess urea in the petÂs blood stream.

Comments (17)

  • mazer415
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I am questioning two things. One why so against a commercial brand of food, and second did the vet not recommend some meds to take...
    On a more personal note, I am sorry to hear your critter is having such dramatic medical issues. You are in my thoughts.

  • sammycat
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Weed30 -- there are other kidney control diets. I feed my kitty Sally Royal Canin Modified (I get from the vets) with some Royal Canin Mature 27 (I get from the pet store). This is dry. I also try to feed her some lower protein/lower phosphorus canned foods -- Nutro Senior, PetGuard turkey and rice, and Science Diet senior.
    You might want to join one of the email groups for CRF -- sorry I don't know if Taco is a dog or a kitty, but I belong to the Yahoo group for CRF cats and its an amazing, incredible source of information.

  • weed30 St. Louis
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    mazer, I just don't believe that commercial foods are healthy for pets. Just as I wouldn't eat a sole diet of overprocessed and questionable foodstuffs sprayed with vitamins and expect to be healthy.

    With Kidney disease, there aren't really any magical meds, unfortunately. Just diet modification as far as I can tell.

    And thanks for your thoughts. She is 14 years old, so it's not like a medical problem like this is a shock, but it's still tough. She's definitely my baby, as is her 'sister', Maggie.

    sammycat, thanks for the ideas. I have already found info about CRF and cats. There is a lot of crossover on recommendations for treatment and diet with cats and dogs.

    I found a lot of info that a low protien diet isn't really proven to be effective, but low phosphorus and some other things I haven't had the time to get into are beneficial.

  • annzgw
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I just went thru this with my 14 yr old gal, but her levels were triple the levels your dog is showing.
    I'll try to find the name, and Meghane may know what I'm thinking of, but my vet suggested a type of antacid that is suppose to bond with, and help remove, the excess phospate in the system.
    We didn't have enough time to try it with my dog since she was already in kidney failure.

    Like your dog, one of her symptoms was stumbling and losing her balance. I believe the buildup of uremic toxins causes it, but that's a guess.
    My thoughts are with you............

  • weed30 St. Louis
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    annz, Thanks so much for responding with that information. I am sorry about your dog. It is so hard when they can't tell us what is wrong. I did read some things about caltrate to help with the phosphorus issue. There is also mention of fish oils being helpful for kidney disease. For now I am going to try the commercial diet just to get started while I study.

    I was interested to find out that your dog stumbled too. The vet wants to start Taco on a low dose of phenobarbital in case it is siezures.

  • dobesrule
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I had a similar situation with my Chow over the last few months. Smokey's results actually came back higher than your pups. The vet wanted to monitor and recheck levels for a while. There are other things that can cause the results to come back high. Does a urinalyisis show that your dog is actually concentrating it's urine? Anyway it turns out they are now thinking hers was caused by a severe dental problem that was allowing bacteria to get into her bloodstream.


    Lisa

  • weed30 St. Louis
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks, Lisa. I will look into that. I am sure a urinalysis was not done.

    How did you get your dog to pee in a cup? ;)

  • clt3
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Weed - Unfortunately, I've just been through this. My dear, sweet 10 year old welsh terrier, Maggie, lost her battle last week. I miss her terribly.

    She would not eat the K/D, canned or kibble. She did eat that hamburger, rice diet you mentioned. Keep in mind it is kind of dry, you can add a little sodium free chicken broth. I was also told to use a phosphorus binder, amphogel (sp?), which she hated.

    I have another recipe I found in a book at the vet's office. She really liked this one a lot.
    Healthy Chicken
    3/4 c. cooked chicken meat (wht./dark)
    2 1/2 cups baked potato w/ skin
    1/2 c. chopped broccoli
    1/4 c. chopped parsley
    2 T. chicken fat
    pinch of minced garlic
    600 mg. calcium carbonate.
    Bake potatoes in micro until soft, cut into bite-sized pieces before measuring (I found a large potato yielded about 2 cups of potato). In a nonstick skillet, heat the chicken fat and garlic over medium heat until hot and then add the chicken meat and parsley. Add the broccoli and continue heating until it is soft. While stirring, add the potatoes and heat until all is mixed. Allow to cool before folding in in the supplements.

    I found the powdered calcium carbonate (Tums) in a health food store. I believe their website has a store locator - www.nowfoods.com. If you can't find it let me know, you can have my 3/4 full bottle.

    I multiplied both the hamburger and chicken recipes and froze them in freezer bags. I also found it was easier to buy a roasted chicken. It yielded about 7 cups of chicken meat.

    There is also a yahoo group with some very knowledgable people - K9kidneydiet.

    I have 2 other recipes that we didn't get a chance to try, one for a stir fried rice, and one for eggs and potatoes. If you would like them, just let me know.

    Let me know if I can be of any more help. It's a very painful diagnosis and even though we had 9 months, it's still very hard for me.

  • eandhl
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Weed, I am sorry about Taco but I will say we had a PRT that crashed i.e. couldn't stand at all with kidney failure. We did do the hills mix canned/dry. After keeping her at the Vet's to hydrate her IV for a few days. They didn't give us lots of hope at the time. Well she was a really easy feeder so she accepted the diet and added liqs really well. She surprised everyone and lived 3 plus yrs.

  • sillymesillyne
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Sorry about your doggie, Weed. I hope Taco gets better.
    My Toby is 13 and 1/2 and I constantly worry about him.

    Hugs to you, Taco and Maggie,

    Silly

  • annzgw
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Weed,
    Like you, I fed a homemade diet and my dog was already getting one when she developed the KD. She had other health issues and after discovering the the kidney problem she became VERY picky about what she would eat. Near the end she would only accept raw meat.
    Anyway, I talked to the vet and the name I was trying to think of was Alternagel. It was recommended because of my dog's picky eating. It's OTC and binds with the phospates in the stomach, not the system, and is good for dogs in early stages and on non-prescriptive diets.
    It may be worth talking to your vet about it.

    My dog also had a horrible urinary infection..........I'm still having guilt feelings here since she had shown us no symptoms.........and I know her teeth were in poor condition but other health problems overruled having them cleaned. So, as Lisa mentioned, do have a complete checkup, including checking the teeth and a urinalysis.
    BTW, a good vet can draw urine out of the bladder.......so it's not necessary to do the catch method.

  • sillymesillyne
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I don't think you're going to find the Alternagel. Even though it is OTC, I was once prescribed by a doctor to use Alternagel, daily. I had just come home from the hospital, perforated ulcer, and the doc wanted me on liquid antacids in addition to Zantac. I was to alternate the Alternagel with Mylanta.. reasoning being, Mylanta will constipate you, badly. Alternagel will give diarrhea, by taking both you stay "regular". Anyway, I haven't seen Alternagel in a long time.
    Maybe you'll have better luck than I did, finding it.

    Silly

  • merry_ann
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Mehgan,

    I got this recipe out of my Dr. Pitcairn's Natural Health for Dogs and Cats. A book written by a vetrinarian.
    Anyway- this recipe is especially for cats with kidney problems.

    Feline Diet For Kidney Problems

    3/4 pound (1 1/2 cups) ground chicken (with skin)or turkey
    4 cups cooked white rice, enriched
    4 eggs
    2 tablespoons cold-pressed safflower,soy,or corn oil
    3 teaspoons Animal Essentials Calcium (or a scant 2 teaspoons eggshell powder)
    1/4 teaspoon iodized salt
    1 teaspoon parsely (a natural diuretic, optional)
    5,000 IU vitamin A
    2,000 milligrams vitamin C (1/2 teaspoon sodium ascorbate)
    taurine and other cat vitamins (about 5 days worth-we want to add at least 250 mg taurine to this recipe amount)
    50 milligram level B-complex (or 5-10 milligrams per day)

    Note : you may have check around to get vitamins- they are almost always avail from your vet, but I wouldn't switch around suppliments, or types or forms of say calcium, in the case of a kidney freindly diet...

    Mix everything together in a large bowl. Serve raw if the cat will accept it. otherwise, mix all but the vitamins together, bake about twenty minutes in a moderate oven, and then wait until it cools to mix in the vitamins. Your cat may have a poor appetite, so to some extent you will need to cater to him to keep him alive. Occasionally, substitute 1 to 3 teaspoons of liver for part of the meat. Be sure to provide plenty of fresh, pure (bottled or filtered) at all times. Also encourage drinking by prividing meat or fish broth warm once or twice a day.
    Feed as much as your cat will eat-this makes 5-6 days worth of food for the average cat.

    Hope this helps. Good luck.

  • merry_ann
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Darn,

    WATER. Provide plenty of fresh pure WATER. When will I ever learn to read what I've written before I hit send? :)

  • dobesrule
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I'm not sure I could catch a sample with Smokey, she sqwats pretty low. With the Dobe tho it was pretty easy. Most vets now tho, at least where I work, like to get a sample by csysto- that way they can get a contaminant free sample.

    clt3, I'm very sorry about your Maggie girl. I lost my Dobe to cancer on Sept 23. She was the light of my life and I miss her like mad.

    Lisa

  • Meghane
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Here's another canine renal diet from my clinical nutrition textbook, based on an 18 kg dog:
    237g cooked white rice
    78g cooked regular beef (not lowfat)
    20g boiled egg
    50g white bread
    3g vegetable oil
    1.5g calcium carbonate
    0.5g iodized salt
    1 adult vitamin per day

    This is a reduced protein (21%), phosphorus restricted (0.22%) diet, appropriate for early renal failure. Sounds a lot like the one you already found.

    Dr. Pitcarin's for dogs is:
    1/4# hamburger (not lowfat)
    2 3/4# cooked white enriched rice
    2 large beaten whole raw eggs
    1/4 cup cooked carrots
    2 tablespoons cold-pressed safflower, soy, or corn oil
    1 slightly rounded teaspoon eggshell powder
    1/8 teaspoon iodized salt
    20 milligrams vitamin B complex
    1000 milligrams vitamin C
    optional- 1/2-1 clove minced garlic

    Mix and serve raw if accepted. Or mix everything except the vitamins together and bake 20 minutes in a moderate oven and wait until it cools to mix in the vitamins. Occasionally substitute 1-3 teaspoons liver for part of the meat. Will feed a 40# dog for 1 day.

    Provides slightly less protein (17%) 25% fat, and 55% carbs, low phosphorus.

    If you can calculate recipe nutrients or have a program that can do that, here are the recommendations from my clinical nutrition book for dogs with early renal disease:

    Phosphorus: 0.15-0.3% dry matter
    Protein:Sodium: Potassium recommendations vary based on individual- some animals especially cats become hypokalemic, whereas dog may become hyperkalemic. If Taco has normal potassium levels now, try to feed the same amount but make sure you monitor her renal profile including potassium on a regular basis so adjustments can be made.
    omega 6: omega 3 fatty acid ration There has been considerable debate on when to restrict dietary protein in dogs with renal disease, and by how much. I would definately have the urinalysis done on Taco to determine if she has proteinuria. If so, she needs more restricted protein than if not. However, the protein in either case should be high quality and easily digestible, like the eggs and hamburger meat, not plant-based which is harder to digest. My personal belief is that you should restrict the protein as little as necessary and monitor the pet to see how the diet is working. If you switch diets and the BUN (especially sensitive to dietary changes) goes up, may have to reduce the protein a little bit and recheck. The appropriate protein level will vary among individuals and by the stage of renal disease. You have to adjust as needed.

    It is not 100% true that there are no meds to help with kidney disease. Any medications are based upon the symptoms of each individual pet, and applied on an as-needed basis. For example, if Taco is protienuric, an ACE inhibitor such as Enalapril may be beneficial. Secondary hyperparathyroidism may require more restricted phosphorus or phosphorus binders. Anemia may require erythropoietin. If she is dehydrated and cannot drink enough water to compensate, she may need subcutaneous fluid maintenance. If she has GI signs such as vomiting or nausea, then histamine blockers (cimetidine) or proton-pump inhibitors (omeprazole) may help. If she develops hypertension, the ACE inhibitor may help but if that is not enough then can add calcium channel blockers. Proteinuria is managed through the diet. Keep in mind that you can only safely restrict the protien by so much, since protein is required for a healthy immune system. Also at some point, restricting the protein more can contribute to worsening protein-losing nephropathy, which is definately not wanted.

    Chronic renal disease affects pretty much the entire body. But quality of life and survival can be enhanced by careful frequent monitoring (I'd do blood pressure, CBC, renal chemistries every 3-6 months depending on progression of signs) and appropriate treatment of signs as they occur. It is not easy nor inexpensive, but I think it's worth it to keep on top of things.

    The single most important thing to be careful about, as others have alluded to, is water. Even a short episode of dehydration in a pet with kidney disease can be devestating and send the animal over the edge and into failure. Second most important thing is to make sure she eats well. Eating doggie junk food is preferred over anorexia, even in animals with kidney disease.

    The best thing though, as always, is the easiest- provide lots of love and attention as you already do. Good luck.

  • weed30 St. Louis
    Original Author
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks everyone, for the valuable input. I'm working a lot this week and next, so can't post as thoroughly as I want. I have Piticairn's book, as well as Schultze and Goldstein. Between those, posts here, and my vet, I think I have a good chance of doing right by Taco. You are all great :)