why did they pay for him to go oversees? and why do they allow him to bring girlfriend to stay overnight, every night? why do they feed the girlfriend? why do they allow rude girlfriends in their house? how 19-year-old has that much money in the bank? where did he get over 10K?

if your parents choose to allow all this, then there is nothing you could do. it doesn't matter if you intervene or not. your parents allowed this. so now they see the consequences.

I wrote a really long response earlier and then deleted. It comes down to this...until your parents decide to stop being doormats and start actually parenting this will continue. If they don't do something he will end up like my mooch of an uncle who did it until the day his mother died at 89 (and then he robbed from her estate). That is the way users are - they use unless someone doesn't let them, and then they look for the next mark. Should your parents tell your brother it's time to find a place of his own? Of course, especially in light of his finances, his girlfriend (and all of that). But will they? YOU can't make him do it. THEY have to.

This seems complicated but it's not. If your parents allow themselves to be treated this way then there is nothing you can do about it. Kick him out, and don't give him anything. It's as easy as that. THEY are creating the problem, not your brother. He is going to keep taking whatever they are giving, and he is going to keep treating them how they are allowing him to treat them. THEY continue to give him money and trips. THEY are allowing his girlfriend to spend the night and treat them like garbage. THEY are allowing him to live there without paying anything or following rules. THEY are trying to make him finish a degree that he doesn't want to finish. THEY got him a job instead of making him stand on his own feet and get his own job. THEY have created this monster.

I'm sure they are nice people who are trying to be good parents, but if they don't stop NOW, they are going to have a 40 year old son, still living at home and treating them like crap. They are actually hurting their son and themselves instead of helping. They are doing him no favors. He sounds like he has become a real jerk, because your parents have given him all the power and control.

What exactly do they expect you to do? The only thing you can do is to tell them they have to stop. No more money, no more trips, no more tuition, no more living at home, no more finding him jobs and trying to force him to finish his degree. Give him a month to find a place to live (which should be no problem with all that savings). Maybe he'll freak out and not talk to them for awhile, but he'll get over it.

People will only treat you poorly because you allow them to. They have taught him it's okay to take advantage of them and treat them this way. They are the only ones that can fix it.

"They have taught him it's okay to take advantage of them and treat them this way. They are the only ones that can fix it. "

Agreed!

"I really feel I should speak to my dad, but like I said earlier, don't know if it's within my rights to do this."

It's not a matter of "rights". This is family. Of course you can talk to them. I strongly recommend that you do. You may be just the reinforcement they need to act. Some people avoid confrontation regardless of consequence. Appears your parents are like that. What you described NEEDS confrontation.

From your description, it looks like somebody has to grow a spine. Of course your brother will be offended. He earned it. Do what needs to be done and let time take care of the rest. He'll either grow up or he won't. Neither you nor your parents are in charge of that. He needs to be cut off and kicked out.

It's not only a right, it is the only healthy option, to talk about your experience of being part of this family.

"When I see brother successfully manipulating you, and taking advantage of you, and hurting you, and when I see that you continue to put yourselves in that situation, it leaves me thinking this will not stop and I am afraid the damage will never end. I'm afraid of what it is doing to you and to him, and I'm angry about that."

That is healthy. What is not healthy is to think that you have any power or responsibility to change your brother or your parents. Your job is to express, and to establish healthy boundaries of your own - if that means that you no longer want your parents to complain to you without also being willing to DO something, then they may no longer complain to you. IF you cannot tolerate our SIL's mouth, then if she is disrespectful you will go home.

This will not change them, but it's a lot closer to healthy than 1. not speaking up and 2. thinking grandiosly that you have the power to change them.

Thank you so much for your replies! I agree with you all COMPLETELY! My parents are enablers.

The main enabler is my father as he has control over all the finances and whenever my mum tries to enforce any rules or discipline or even just DEFEND HERSELF against verbal attacks, he gets angry at her. She feels she is standing alone with no support in that house.

Latest development... and you won't believe this! I rang my father to tell him something needs to be done and that for once he needs to stand up, be a parent and enforce some rules and discipline, or if not at least support what my mother enforces, he said he would talk to my brother that night. Normally he is home by 5pm, but instead of talking to him he snuck in the house late that night (8 or 9pm) so he didn't have to speak to my brother.

It's like he is fine with yelling abuse at my mother cause he knows she is stuck with him financially (she is in the process of making plans to become more independent so she can leave him), but he is scared of a 19 year old boy and a 17 year old girl! It's crossed over the line into pathetic now... He has stood by and said nothing while my brother has said to my mother that he 'wished she was dead' because she told his girlfriend off for being rude. I got so angry when I heard this from my mother.

I've decided I will say my piece to my brother, his girlfriend and my father. A disagreement has recently occurred between my brother and I regarding unrelated matters, and his 'lovely' girlfriend tried to manipulate my mother to 'get on their side' so to speak even though they are clearly in the wrong and both my parents agree and have told me to stand my ground on the matter.

My partner and I have done things for my brother before and from now on we are cutting them off completely and leading the example for my parents to follow.

I've thought long and hard about it and am willing to cut my father and brother from my life until they are both willing to act their age and all treat each other with respect, because at this point I have none for them.....

I agree though that if this doesn't work (talking to them) there is nothing more I can do because I am not the one enabling him, but at least I can sleep at night knowing I made an effort.....

Thanks again...

Kristy

Kristy you sound like such a sensible, considerate person. You have such a good understanding of what is going on in your family.

I have noticed in my family that my son says things that he should not say to his father, and I know if I spoke like that (and I would not)then his father would surely get annoyed with me. I think sometimes parents just love their kids so much, they are a bit frightened of reprimanding them in case they don't like us any more. I know this sounds silly but I am sure it goes on.

My son is 17 so nearly the age that your brother is.

I have recognised this in my own family and I am going to put a stop to it, because it can get out of hand.

Perhaps your father is in the same situation with your son and it has gotten out of hand - big time.

I wish you well in your pursuit of family contentment and I hope your father wakes up to himself and sets things straight.

Popi

Trust me on this--this is a 'bat your head against the wall' situation.

You CANNOT change your parents. You CANNOT change your brother. All you can do right now is step back, see the situation for what it is and realize that your parents are going to give this deadbeat whatever he wants, for the rest of his life, and there will be nothing for you, ever. If you speak to professionals in the field, they'll tell you it's common for parents to over and over again put the 'needs' of a deadbeat child over the good of their other children and even ahead of what's good for them (the parents). Parents will often let one child bleed them dry.

And oh yes, they will from time to time go to one of their other children, complaining about the drain on their finances--BUT they rarely really want any help. And if you do attmept to push them to do the right thing--guess who will be wrong and will be on the outs with the family? You.

Not only have I seen many other families go through this same scenario, but let me tell you about DH's family. His one sister has always been a taker. She's got all sorts of explanations as to why she needs money--mind you, her husband has a very high position with the government and has made 6 figures for years. Anyway, this deadbeat, over the years, has gotten her parents to pay for: her kids' braces, her cars, her appliances, new roof for her house, and dozens of other stuff. FIL and MIL used to go to DH, complaining about the drain on their finances. DH would get all upset, worried for them, and make good suggestions. They didn't want to hear anything reasonable. Eventually, that SIL finagled and got control over their finances. the stress she put FIL under killed him way too early. Then she STOLE over a quarter of a million $$$ from MIL (who by that time had Alzheimer's). Cost us $20,000 so far in forensic accounting and legal fees to stop the hemmorage of $$$$. It's been 7 years, and the case still hasn't been completely resolved. And honestly? There's no money left in the estate for the rest of the children to inherit. I don't care if I NEVER get any money from someone else's death--that's not really how I choose to make $$$, but darn it, it's grossly unfair for one child to steal the estate from the others.

If I knew in my eary 20's what I understand now about these family relationships, we would NOT have allowed ourselves to be victimized the way we were. We would have walked away years ago. I know that sounds cold, but we batted our heads against the wall for 35 years, always doing the right thing, never taking a penny from anyone that wasn't ours, and none of it was appreciated. ever.

I know this isn't the advice you want to hear, but truly, the best thing you can do for yourself, is to handle your own fiances responsibly. To protect them from others, and to make up your mind that if your parents choose to give away their money now, to a child who should be able to pay his own way, they ARE NOT your responsibility in the future, when they are down and out because of it. Do not feel guilty if they come to you for help later in life and you feel you need to turn them down. They made their choices, it's not up to you to pay the consequences for others mistakes, truly.

"......none of it was appreciated. ever."

Lots of meat in those few words! It has always/everywhere been pretty much like that.

I notice no one has mentioned counseling...does your dad even WANT to change? Could be is all he needs is the tools and clarity to do so - in that case, maybe some assertion training (and a wise trainer could work in some counseling). Best of luck to you.

I imagine the reason no one suggested counselling IS because the decision to do that would have to come from the father. It would be virtually impossible for a daughter to convince an unwilling father to give counselling a try--IMO.

"He has stood by and said nothing while my brother has said to my mother that he 'wished she was dead' because she told his girlfriend off for being rude. I got so angry when I heard this from my mother."

If my brother EVER said something like this to my mother, he would be picking himself up off the floor. The girlfriend as well.

Your mother needs your support more than ever. If this were me, I'd be tapping dad for MY share of his generosity and banking it for my mother. Especially if Dad keeps letting the son (and skag girlfriend) treat her like this.

Like azzalea said "You CANNOT change your parents. You CANNOT change your brother. All you can do right now is step back, see the situation for what it is and realize that your parents are going to give this deadbeat whatever he wants, for the rest of his life..."

In the meantime, I'd help mom figure out what assets dad has so she will get a fair deal should they choose to part. If he isn't forthcoming, she can always ask the IRS for copies of their tax returns from prior years in order to come up with a fair settlement of what dad will have to pay if he decides the deadbeat freeloaders are more important than his loyal wife.

Your mother needs your support more than ever. If this were me, I'd be tapping dad for MY share of his generosity and banking it for my mother. Especially if Dad keeps letting the son (and skag girlfriend) treat her like this.

I agree!!

I wouldn't hold my tongue either regarding my brother or his girlfriend. If they can dish it out, they can take it!

I'd also tell my father that he needs to grow some balls and be a man for once... not a mouse!

Your mother so needs your help and support in this situation. I'm glad you're there for her.

If my brother ever disrespected my mother in front of me (and my father said nothing), I would stand up for my mother and ask my father what kind of man he was for letting his son talk to his mother/his wife that way and not say a word!! I would make them feel ashamed of their actions.

Also explain to your mother that she needs to stop accommodating her son and his girlfriend. No more special vegetarian meals, no more laundry, etc. Maybe they'll get fed up and move out! Support her by helping her stand her ground... stop being an enabler. If girlfriend doesn't eat meat, too bad! Eat somewhere else.

Good luck!

If the girl is 17, under 18--legal problems

Why would there be legal problems? It's not her daughter! You don't HAVE to allow someone else's kid to live in your home. You have the right to kick her out. You can call the police to have her escorted out of your home if she doesn't leave on her own.

Total smoke-screen. Boot both of their sorry asses out....today!

I know it won't happen. Mommy and daddy are both invertebrates. Sad plus obnoxious.