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chipster_2007

Which Is The Best Paint ?

chipster_2007
16 years ago

I am planning to paint the interior of my home and am trying to decide which is the best paint between Benjamin Moore, Behr, C2, Valspar, Pittsburgh paint? I want the paint that covers the best so I do the least amount of painting necessary to get a great job? Also, some of the colors I like do not seem to be as vibrant with some paints? I thought that C2 and Benjamin Moore were the best but recently saw that ?consumer reports gave Behr a great rating? Any assist is greatly appreciated. Also, i will be removing wallpaper, the walls have not been painted before. Will they need a finished coat of plaster before painting? Thanks

Comments (29)

  • Faron79
    16 years ago

    Hey Chipster,
    Well said PG!
    The world of 'paint' is kinda funny...what someone else hates, someone else loves!
    * Shop mainly by color first. That's what you have to live with every day.
    * As PG said, stay in the top-tier of your chosen 'brand'.
    * The ONLY plus to 'contractor-grades' is the price.
    * Prep & priming are more important than you think!
    * Deep, jewel-toned colors often require grayed or tinted primers.

    I personally can vouch for ACE-Royal, Ralph-Lauren, & C2.
    * Our store has all 3; and is in the ACE 'Top-50' retailers in the U.S.
    * I've used all 3 at home, and I like them.
    * We used to have Behr, but dropped it when we found out we could become a C2 retailer.

    Bottom-line...there's lotsa good brands out there!
    Faron

    Here is a link that might be useful: C2's Website

  • Michael
    16 years ago

    If you're looking for vibrant colors, take a good look at full spectrum paints by Ellen Kennon. She specifies ICI Dulux paints as the base for her various full spectrum colors. I have 4 colors in my own house and they are beautiful.

    I want the paint that covers the best so I do the least amount of painting necessary to get a great job?

    Even the highest quality paint recommends two "full" coats of paint over primer. Don't be tempted to spread the paint thin to cover more area quickly. If the label suggests 400 sf per gallon, it will take two gallons to paint 400 sf twice. ( 2 coats )

    Michael

  • Michael
    16 years ago

    Another quality paint in vibrant colors is Citron. C2 is a fine paint, but Ellen Kennon and Citron have been doing for years what others are now copying. Most genuine full spectrum paints range from 8 to 16 pigments.

    I have a question for Faron.

    Please explain the need for 16 colorants and then explain how many of those 16 may be used to create fusion 8413.

    Thanks,

    Michael

    Here is a link that might be useful: C J

  • Kimberlyinva
    16 years ago

    I agree with Ellen Kennon's quality. A good neutral in her color line that I like is Mushroom. I'm considering it for most of the downstairs in our new build. You can order samples on line.

    I am in love with Farrow & Ball (another full spectrum paint). Expensive but sooo worth it. I just did our living room in Light Blue (it's a gray blue, real pretty) with white silk drapes, stunning (just hope other's like it so I can sell this thing!!). Samples can also be ordered on line. You can get some good paint ideas by just doing a Google search for Farrow & Ball paint.

    I'm an oil based primer girl myself. Works for me so I just keep using it. Hubby hates it but oh well, he's NOT allowed to paint, period!!! Or caulk either...hehehe

    Hey, after all, it's just a little paint. You can always do it over if it annoys you...been there, done that.

    :)

    KAT

  • Faron79
    16 years ago

    Hi Guys!
    Michael-
    I'm replying to the 2nd part of your question with the 3 hardest words for most people to say..."I don't know". That answer relates to creating what I presume to be a full-spectrum color!

    * F/S colors are a new "I've gotta learn about that" item for me!
    * I've been trying to learn from Funcolors, etc., how & what colorants are used in the F/S theory when they "craft" a color.
    * I'm assuming, but don't know, that basic ICI colorants are used. I AM familiar with these colorants. We used to tint our RL paints with that line.

    >>> To the 1st part of your question:
    * The 16-colorants enable more complex hues to be made.
    * Some light whites have 6 colorants added.
    * Color-matching with 16 colors available to build a color is much easier. Subtle nuances of whites are easier to capture.
    * THIS ISN'T A F/S LINE OBVIOUSLY!! One of C2's objectives is simply building real complex colors.
    * Another benefit is that not so much colorant has to be added for real deep tones. Of the 16, there's 4 High-Strength colorants: High-Black, High-Blue, High-Red, & High-Yellow. There's also a bright Orange that not many colorant lines have.

    Well...lemme know if I answered what you needed!
    Faron

  • steve-va
    16 years ago

    I don't pay attention to consumer reports reviews of paints. I think you are better off talking to the people that use a paint line & those that live with it. It seems that lines like Behr get great reviews from consumer reports cause they win in some scrubbing experiments. I would really see how great a wall painted with flat Behr paint looks after you scrub it with some light shining down the wall. Its gonna show period! The biggest problem I have with hardware store paints is that you have a much higher chance of mis-tints & screw ups. I get the best service & accuracy from a locally owned paint store. A few dollars more for a gallon of paint can translate into a thousand dollars of hassle if its wrong.

  • gail_ish
    16 years ago

    I picked out the colours I wanted from Behr & brought it to Betonel (a high-end Canadian paint store) & he mixed them for me - by eye!! It was perfect. I agree that if you go to a company that just does paint, you get people who really know what they're doing. The big difference I noticed was pretty much no splatter!!

  • rococogurl
    16 years ago

    Let me just give a slightly different opinion and experience here.

    My whole house was painted with BM about 3 years ago. The colors are light and bright -- what I needed. Looked great.

    But over the 3 years the paint is starting to poop out. I can't explain it but that's the effect. It's looking a bit dull. Doors are holding up not so well.

    On the advice of amysrq and Pirula, who's a championship painter, I tried Farrow & Ball. The colors are more limited than many of the US brands. But I did find one four our guest room that was just right.

    The difference -- as Amy suggested -- is astounding. First of all, the surface quality of the paint is amazing. The walls are like velvet.

    While F&B does not tout the paint as "full spectrum" the effect is the same. It changes color with the light.

    My painter also commented on how easy it went on -- he had not used it before.

    Based on that experience, I got sample pots of additional colors and I'm working with them. Eventually, the whole house will be repainted using F&B colors.

    I'm about to do the laundry room where the woodwork is pale gray and pooping out colorwise. F&B has a slightly darker gray that looks great. I've got sample wall colors up.

    I've seen a house painted in C-2. I wasn't impressed by the surface quality although I was prepared to be.

    Everyone has their favorites and the truth is that even with full spectrum paints, colors change with the light in someone's house.

    I was at a friend's house whose rooms were painted with a F&B color that's up on my wall. In her house it looked pale/yellow/ivory in my house it looks Dijon mustard.

    We're both on the East Coast' she's further south. Our lots are wooded in the same way.

    So it's all relative to the colors you like, the type of surface you want and how much time, energy energy and cost is worthwhile.

    Was at the hardware store yesterday speaking with the paint guys about their new Aura paints. They claim they are absolutely 2 coats (first self-priming then second) and scrubbable. He said that the VOCs are low and the Regal line will eventually be changed over to a similar formulation.

    I haven't used the Aura yet.

    But apart from color, if surface quality is important then F&B would be a brand to consider, without doubt.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Farrow & Ball

  • chipster_2007
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Thanks everyone for all the great info. Very helpful. One question still concerns me: Since the walls have never been painted, they are porous and rough. Is a good primer and great paint going to give them that velvet look I want or will I need to have a finished coat of plaster put on to achieve this look? I don't want to go to that level if I don't have to?

  • paintguy22
    16 years ago

    It depends on what the walls look like after you remove the wallpaper.

  • sanborn5
    16 years ago

    We are building our 8th house and have used everything from Sherwin Williams, Benjamin Moore, Martha Stewart, and Behr. On this house we decided to use the Behr and my husband said it goes on very smoothly and we are VERY happy with the results. He has also built many spec house and used Sherwin Williams for those and the results were OK. He really likes the Bher. Now if someone would just make a paint that REALLY matches its paint chart!!! I find no matter what color I choose it always differs and seems to be darker. And these color matach computers are not even close if you have threads of colors in the fabric.

  • kerryokie
    16 years ago

    I love Ellen Kennon colors in the ICI line. I like the lifemaster low VOC paint but I have also used the velvet matte. I have not tried Bm Aura but have heard good things about it. Farrow and Ball is used often in my home country (Scotland) and is used in high end homes almost exclusively. My father painted professionally as a side job and he always used the Dulux ICI line. I agree that two full coats are necessary for optimum color and wearability. The first coat covers, the second coat is the one that brings everything to life. I used Behr in one of my bathrooms and decided to repaint the trim. I taped off my walls and when I pulled the tape off, it took parts of the paint with it. Now, this is paint that had been on the walls for over a year, so it should have been well cured. Neadless to say, I am not impressed with Behr.

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    A champion? Moi?? Paint nutcase is more like it. : )

    Farrow & Ball is fantastic paint. Period. I did a lot of research as I was planning the whole house and tried many different brands. In a previous house I'd had the same experience with BM. Looked nice enough when it went on, but when we sold the house four and a half years later, the house needed to be repainted already. It looked dull, it's hard to explain. This was not a sunny house, and we're not hard on things. So I don't know what that was about, but I didn't want to use BM again in this house.

    I ended up using C2 in one room. Very nice paint, but my least favorite of the bunch. The finish is nothing special. Not bad or anything, but compared to the velvet hand of the F&B walls, there is no comparison. Even the finish on the Donald Kauffman paint (which is a Pratt & Lambert base) is slightly better. However, C2 made my absolutel favorite primer, hands down. And the C2 color is rich and beautiful.

    With F&B you get both, beautiful, rich color and an exquisite finish. I've also used the F&B eggshell on woodwork and some bookshelves. Very happy with it on those low handling wood pieces.

    However, for the kitchen cabinets I used FPE's ECO and I'd never use anything else. Strong, beautiful, rich, completely scrubable (ask me how I know). Delighted.

    Reeeeeeeeeeeally expensive though, so I've decided to go with F&B again in the basement library when I have to paint all those bookshelves.

    In the end, the house will be about 85 percent F&B, 5 percent FPE, 4 percent Donald Kauffman, and 1 percent C2.

    One of the major issues with paint, to my mind, is not just how beautiful it is or how well it cleans. All very important, obviously. But I don't want to have to repaint in five years. That's just nuts. It's only been about a year so far, but all the walls look like they were painted yesterday and I've had to clean a few of them several times (I now have a dog, and a six year old boy. 'nuff said.) I remember having to touch up the BM in the previous house within the first two years. I'll keep reporting back on how the paint is doing, but F&B is my absolute favorite and I'm sticking with it for the next painting olympics (omg, I'm not quite ready to think about that yet!).

    Ivette

  • hvackennyd
    16 years ago

    I would like to add my .02... IMO, Farrow and Ball is indeed wonderful paint and is light years better than the other paints I have used. The finish, at least in the Modern Emulsion I've used, is exquisite... Really is "velvety smooth"!!

    I originally started painting our new(3 years old)house with paint I was familiar with from years of prior use... This meant BM Aqua Pearl and P&L Accolade. I was relatively happy with these and probably would have lived happily ever after . Then I discovered this forum and became interested in "other" paints... I fell hook,line, and sinker for the Ellen Kennon paints and ultimately ordered 16 gallons of the stuff in "Velvet Sheen" for our house... Well, I can state that this paint has not lived up to my expectations and is already looking tired and in need of replacement... With three little boys in the house, I expected the "washable" and "scrubbable" finish to be just that!

    However, this hasn't been the case and I have started exploring other products... Since then, I have used F&B, C2,and new BM Aura. I literally just finished with the Aura last night and will report on my findings later. I did notice that it really has some wonderful application qualities... A joy to cut-in with and rolled out beautifully... But we'll see :)

    In closing, I will say that quality tools DO make a HUGE difference: Corona brushes and Wooster lambswool sleeves make even me look like a professional!!

    Ken

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    Ken:

    I totally echo you on the Corona brushes and the pure lambswool roller (forget what brand I used). I discovered Corona relatively early and made the Purdy brushes I thought were okay suddenly feel like I'd been painting with a steam roller vs a surgical tool like the Coronas. They also cleaned up better and were like new afterward. The lambswool rollers I unfortunately discovered after halftime, so only the hallway/foyer and living room/dining room are painted with them. But really beautiful how the paint goes on and the coverage is unreal. It didn't really make me use less coats or anything, but each coat went on so much better.

    If you're going to kill yourself working like this to paint your house, get the best tools you can. It makes all the difference in the world.

    Ivette

  • hvackennyd
    16 years ago

    Ivette,

    I had to laugh when I read your reply... I "discovered" the benefits of a lambswool sleeve after I had already painted 3/4 of my house!! I had been using some Wooster Superfab sleeves, but was tired of finding lint left behind so I began looking into alternatives. Thanks to you, brushworks, paintguy and others, I decided to give the lambswool a "spin" :)... Holy smokes, talk about coverage... I was stunned at how much less time I was spending loading up at the bucket.

    Also, I echo your sentiments concerning Farrow and Ball. I am truly happy with this paint and am now in the process of re-doing most of the house with it... Not cheap, but as you said, if I'm going to kill myself painting, I might as well enjoy it :)

    Ken

  • rococogurl
    16 years ago

    I went with the FPE on my front porch which needed repainting after 2 years with BM. The paint supported mildew. I've had the window trim repainted with FPE as well.

    Next year I'll do all the windows and doors in back.

    I'm told it will last 8 years. If I calculate the difference in the cost of the paint, given the fact I'd need to repaint every 2 years, I'm still ahead dollar wise having gone with FPE.

  • mahatmacat1
    16 years ago

    A late question re the lambswool rollers: do they leave a nap look at all? I was steered toward the high-density foam rollers, rather than lambswool, for doors especially, but you know I trust the folks here more than anyone IRL :) Is there a low-nap lambswool roller sleeve somewhere that leaves no texture? TIA and sorry for the ignorant question.

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    Flyleft, I was using the napless rollers for the first half, and they left no nap at all, which I really love. When I switched to the lambswool roller, I got the minimal nap ones. Nevertheless, there is an ever so slight "texture" to the walls I did with the lambswool. But it's barely noticeable, I mean really, I think I'm being neurotic. Certainly no one else would ever notice, and there's virtually no texture. With the flat you have to get your eyes two inches from the wall, and with the eggshell you have to stand just so with the light just so, to see that "hey! Is that nap?"

    In short, don't worry.

    Ivette

  • mahatmacat1
    16 years ago

    Ah, thanks, Ivette. I won't worry about the appearance, then. When you say napless rollers, you mean the high-density foam? Why did you switch? Was it because of the lambswool carrying capacity? Thanks again if you can take a second to reply. Such silly tiny issues we deal with here :)

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    Jeez, can you believe I can't remember the details?? They wére not foam, no. They were just the shortest nap ones. I switched because the paint store guy (who by this time knew my name and bust size practically) told me I should try them because they're the best. So I did. And they are! They come in different naps too. Just be sure and ask and get the one with the shortest.

    Ivette

  • Faron79
    16 years ago

    LOL Ivette!!
    "...knew my name & bust size practically..."
    THAT opened my eyes this morning! Wow...I DO make paint frequently for some rather attractive clients, but...hmmm...keeping track of "sizes"...;-)
    (You know ME, it's a hairstyle thing!!)

    Seriously, quality low-knap rollers leave the least "texture", but more frequent re-loading is sometimes a bother.

    Faron

  • mahatmacat1
    16 years ago

    I know of a guy at Rockler who probably knows my bust size. Which is why I don't go in there anymore. He spoke to my (not all that special, even) chest *consistently*. Even my daughter noticed it. Guess I was a shocking change from all the retired white guys in mini pickups...

    Back on topic: I'll get the shortest nap lambswool, then--looking forward to a painting jag again :)

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    LOL! I only meant that dude and I were "like this" after buying paint and supplies for and painting every wall, trim, kitchen cabinet, and ceiling in the 1600 sq foot mail level of our house! Ha ha..

    OMG Flyleft. The entire basement awaits me, another roughly 1400 sq feet, most of which will be built in bookcases. But that's all still a ways away, thank goodness.

    Ivette

  • Faron79
    16 years ago

    Ladies,
    I'm apologizing...I MAY have sounded a little "unseemly" in my comment above! I was only making light of Ivette's "unexpected" comment above...it struck me as so funny!
    But, after my post, I realized I may have sounded just like the creeps' you guys were referring to! I NEVER do the "look-down" when helping a client...even though it IS sometimes tough...;-) !!
    (In the summer though...there's not much to some of those tops...)

    Faron

  • mahatmacat1
    16 years ago

    Oh I didn't think you were one of those creeps, faron, don't worry. And believe me, I don't dress in strap-tops or anything revealing like that--haven't since --hm, since I got married :) ...that was part of what was confusing--this guy must have been *rather* desperate or rather pathological to give this treatment to a normal jeans-and-t-shirted middle aged woman with her daughter. I didn't even want him around my daughter. DH wanted to tell the manager but I just let it be; probably shouldn't because I'm sure I'm not the only one.

    ANYway, that's a lot of wood to paint, Ivette. But you're such a master--will you spray them or paint them "by hand"?

  • pirula
    16 years ago

    Faron, not to worry. I don't think you're a creep either!

    Flyleft: you are telling me. I will BRUSH, lord help me. I like brushmarks on woodwork, idiot that I am.

    Ivette

  • radiorara
    16 years ago

    Yes I agree with all or most of what people are saying in here. Remember to always go overboard on prepping and cleaning as this will determine the best end result. No amount of paint will hide a bad drywall hanging and or refinishing job. If you want quality results you must spend the time smoothing out your walls and celings. That said I personally like Sherwin Williams Paint. Color Accents/Promar 200 and 400 are excellent choices and good bang for the buck. I also recommend Lowes Signature paint (Made by Valspar) The 100% Acrylic line only and the one that says on the can lifetime warranty. This is decently thick paint with 1-2 coat coverage and has a decent amount of solids in it. I have used it several times and have had nothing but great results but everyone has thier preferences. I would concur that Behr stinks and American Traditions should be avoided as well. Glidden Paint is a no go. Duron is owned by Sherwin Williams and there paint is decent and will give satisfactory results. Dont be swayed by Ralph Lauren or other fancy names instead look at what the chemical and solids content of the base that they are using to mix it up with as this is a good indicator of quality and Consumer Reports is not the best reference to go by as well as they are not painters and we all know that painting is an art. Good Luck!

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