I'm checking out Antique Lace in their historic collection. It is a lightly golden beige color. I wouldn't think it would go yellow (unless you include golden in that description). I haven't tried it yet but check out the swatch.

It is impossible to judge the colors in the store. They look completely different once you pick them off the rack into your hand and different again at home in your own lighting.

When I'm there, I check them against a bright crisp white swatch so I can see the undertones clearly and compare samples.

Dakota Trail, Light Raffia, Cincinnati Hotel Briggs Beige, Cliveden Sandstone, Lyndhurst Stone. That's a range of chips to start with, good for comparing to each other which will help you zero in on which beige fits what you think beige should look like.

Beige - the idea of beige - comes from three hue families. Red, yellow-red (orange), and yellow. So the typical interpretation of what beige means is going to have a hue bias that is pink, orange or yellow. Nature of the beige beast.

I'm gonna have to disagree about use a white swatch for color comparisons. White provides too much contrast in the visual assessment. What it ends up doing is visually stripping chroma. So you are not able to see and evaluate a color's chroma - in other words you can't tell how colorful it is set against white because white makes it look more washed out/dull/muted than it really is.

A true neutral gray is best, black isn't much better than white but it's still better than white.

You should never try to judge color against a white wall nor should you ever leave a white border on painted samples. White's not the good guy when it comes to trying to see color accurately.

If you are going for a neutral color, you could try something other than beige. There are shades of gray that look good with oak cabinets. Or sage-y greens can be surprisingly neutral.

I know most people say don't judge relative to white. I just use it to see the undertones clearly. That white border on a sample piece is not good!

I have been amazed at the color transitions depending on what is around the sample, or the lighting, of course! It seems a near impossible task. I know my light bulbs will not always be the same year after year and some need to be replaced with who knows what with the incandescent ban. Something can look green in one room and tan in another (no trees involved).

I will try gray and see how that works. But I only use the white to check or compare undertones. I can clearly see if a white has any red in it, for example, compared to another chip that is more yellow. I was ending up with whites that looked too much of a pale yellow tone rather than warm and needed a little red or ochre in the mix.

Peke, could you be looking for a taupe? Maybe they're just another form of beige, people usually complain that they can be pink.

snooks you're a thinker - thinkers are a good thing!

Instead of comparing to white to see hue bias, try comparing to saturated color chips. Like a full on pure hue, primary red. It's a 'that which is like unto itself is drawn' kinda thing. White truly has no value relative to color acuity and accuracy. (pun intended) #colorhumor :)

So put the yellow next to red to see if there's red in it?

I don't quite get the white thing but will continue to analyze as I educate myself! : )

Thanks!

Yup. You got it.

When it comes to acuity and visual ergonomics white is avoided at all costs because it pollutes the visual field with harsh contrast and drastically influences other colors.

Any color you use for comparison, to evaluate is going to influence the color you're looking at. The question is which background (color) influences in the best way to highlight the part of the target color you want to see. i.e. if you want to identify hue bias, then you compare to hues.

Undertones are not a characteristic of architectural paint. It's a term and factor that is misused and misplaced in the architectural coatings realm. Instead of undertone, it's hue bias.

I will give it a go! Thanks for the demonstration :)

I will try it too. We have since tried 6 new sample colors. I will look at your suggested colors next time I go to Lowes.

I would go blues or greens but husband does not like blue or green with the medium oak. Looks good to me though. He wants a darker tan/taupe and I think it is too much brown.

Oak crown moldings, oak cabinet, oak stairs, oak floor... too much brown.

We also have brown leather furniture and oak tables.

Can someone suggest a Valspar blue or blue green that would work? I painted our bathroom a blue-gray-green and he hates it. Says it is too dark. I think it looks almost "minty" blue-green. Don't know much about colors to fix that.

Love seafoam, aqua, teals, blues and greens...we live on lakefront property so blues and greens would fit. We do not have counter top colors yet. One giant room...dining, living, kitchen so the paint must go with everything.

Thanks for your color expertise! Peke

How about a simple warm white? Artwork and furnishings stand out beautifully against it.

Would warm white be yellow/golden? Should I go with a cool tone? Like a little blue in a white paint.

Thanks,
Peke

I can't point to specific paint colors but I did check out SW Moderate White which looked like a white that had some brown (dark chocolate) rather than yellow to me, if that makes any sense. You can get a warm or cool white. I was thinking warm because it looks pretty with warm trim.

What color is your oak?

I am not sure of the color. It is a medium color is all I know. The cabinet guy is matching the current crown molding, but I don't know the name of it.

Going to Lowes tomorrow to look for a white with brown in it.

Thanks,
Peke

I just meant a golden or orange or darker brown.

Forgot you want Valspar. Only color I know there was the Antique Lace which looks like a soft gold to me but maybe it's a tan.

Thanks. We picked up more sample cards today. Will live with them for a day or so, then get a paint sample to try on the wall.

Peke

I don't have any information to add but wanted to tell you that you're not alone in your experiences! I'm also looking for paint and everything turns crazy on me. I decided to try two grayish colors one warm and one cool. The first turned khaki and the second lavender! Neither look like the sample. Painting a sample on the wall is a necessity but it's so depressing when they look nothing like the chip. So, I guess I'm just commiserating! Good luck and let us know how it goes!

I understand...same here. We have 4 that look pink and 2 that look lavender. Rest look yellow or gold. Gray turns green. The only color that doesn't seem to change is green or blue. But...they look pastel....too much like a baby's room.

For the people who understand hue, color, value, etc. What is in the green or blue that doesn't change colors? Do they have more cooler colors?

Thanks
Peke

I don't think you will like the V Antique Lace. Just did a sample board yesterday and it does have a good bit of yellow. I think it will be golden for me but if you don't want yellow...

P.S. Well, so, it doesn't match the chip. The Aura is lighter and more yellow than Valspar's chip.

This post was edited by snookums2 on Wed, Feb 6, 13 at 0:18

For the people who understand hue, color, value, etc. What is in the green or blue that doesn't change colors? Do they have more cooler colors?

There's nothing *in* the green and blue. Rather it's a matter of their being less toned. They likely have a very simple mix of colorants - just one or two - in the can. Which is why they look pastel. Which is also why they seem to not change much from the chip -- they are simple colors and it is easy to see what hue family they belong to, blue and green.

Near neutral paint colors are colors that have been toned down so far they look "gray". These colors are not so simple. They are complex and it is not easy to see what hue family they come from.

Every color comes from a hue family. And that is where the hue bias, like green, purple, and blue comes from. For example, the gray you think *turned purple* has always been purple you just didn't see it. Probably because you didn't know to look for the hue bias.

It is also the hue family that gives direction as far as color temperature. Near neutral paint colors from the yellow-red hue family will be warmer than the paint colors from the blue hue family.

Paint chips are arranged by hue family at every paint store. Paying attention to what hue family section of the display you are pulling chips can help; even with those super toned down colors that look gray.

Sometimes the store will pull the near neutral colors out into a separate side display. Which makes it harder for people to identify hue bias and temperature in paint chips.

This post was edited by funcolors on Mon, Feb 4, 13 at 18:24

I knew someone could explain it! Hue was the word I was searching for but couldn't remember. Thanks!