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seydoux

stone house

seydoux
9 years ago

Do any of you out there own a real stone house? Not veneer or facade but thick stone walls. I find that it posses challenges that few seem to understand. anyone else in the same boat?

Comments (11)

  • lazy_gardens
    9 years ago

    Would you settle for real mud?

    Adobe has many of the same advantages and problems of stone ...

  • barbcollins
    9 years ago

    We have a stone foundation/cellar and I need to do some research on how to maintain it. There are places where and a small animal/rodent has pulled some of the dirt out between the rocks.

    I am assuming i should remove and loose dirt and pack in mortar?
    There are sections where a previous owner appears to have done that.

    Is it a good or bad idea to parge over the whole thing? The old cellar is actually pretty dry, while the cement basement of the addition has moisture problems.

    We also have a large limestone boulder in one corner of the basement almost the size of a old VW bug. My guess is when they were digging the cellar in 1850 when they got to that boulder they said "heck with it" that's far enough.

    I would love to see some discussions here on saving/working with old stone walls.

  • rosefolly
    9 years ago

    No, but i have loved stone houses all my life, Living in California as I do, I cannot have a house of structural stone. Stone siding, maybe. Stone siding isn't used frequently because it can fall off the house during an earthquake, just as brick can, but you do see it once a while. Structural stone buildings are extremely dangerous in earthquake country. They shake apart into a mass of rubble, alas. No one builds with stone here. To my taste stone is by far the most beautiful material for building a house, and if I lived elsewhere, I might seriously consider it.

    There are some lovely stone houses on the eastern edge of the country, particularly in the Middle Atlantic states, built in the colonial period and the early days of the Republic. You might be able to find out how their owners have added modern conveniences. I see them profiled in decorating or old house magazines from time to time. I have also seen books on building with stone, both the slipform method and the more traditional method. You might see if your local library has any of them. Possibly the authors have discussed the issues you are seeing and might have ideas to offer.

    Rosefolly

    This post was edited by rosefolly on Mon, Dec 29, 14 at 11:15

  • Halebuilt6
    9 years ago

    I have 18 years experience designing and building historic projects. Your best option for a stone foundation is going to be re-pointing the structure. You must first determine the type of stone and find out what the ideal psi mortar should be used. If you use a mortar that has a substantially higher psi than the stone, it could crack the stone. Also depending on how thick the foundation wall is, you would need to modify your method accordingly. If the wall is thick and tightly locked together you may be able to remove all the existing mortar from the interior, which may look like dirt at this point, however this can be dangerous if the original installer used large mortar joints. If it is not safe to remove all the mortar at once, you will want to break the project into 2' x 2' sections and remove all the mortar in alternating sections at a time and then pointing those sections before moving on to the next section. If you are having moisture issues and the foundation is buried, you will need to excavate the exterior and re-point as well. Once the exterior is re-pointed you can add waterproofing and drainage systems that will surely eliminate any future issues. Can you attach some photos of the foundation walls, it is hard to say without seeing it.

  • PRO
    Christopher Nelson Wallcovering and Painting
    9 years ago

    I do, what challenges do you mean?

  • willtv
    9 years ago

    I've lived in this one for the past 27 years.
    {{gwi:2135861}}
    If you're having a problem I've most likely run accross it.
    If you need some info, I'm happy to help.

  • ahoyhere
    9 years ago

    barb, you might find more information if you search for "rubble foundation" and not just "stone foundation." Some folks say "Stone" and some say rubble. There's probably a distinction, but most people use them interchangeably.

  • Debbie Downer
    9 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Not stone but.... fake stone! Also known as "rusticated concrete," "rock face block," etc. Yep, got some unique issues here too (eg no insulation or insulation value - they did one of those infrared heat tests and told me, incredulously - your windows have more insulation value than your walls!)

  • akamainegrower
    9 years ago

    With due respect to Halebuilt6's experience, there is an important difference between fully mortared stone foundations and so-called rubble types. Rubble foundations do not employ mortar below grade. The traditional construction method was to dig a trench and dump stone into it until the exterior grade was reached. From that point upward stone slabs or blocks, with or without mortar, or brick was used to create a wall and provide a level surface above the exterior grade for the building's sills. The rubble was intended to flex with frost. It was also usually intended to allow water to enter the foundation where it was directed to a gravity drain and then out of the cellar. The interior surface of the rubble wall was often parged and frequently white washed, but this is not the same as mortaring. Rubble foundations can and do last for as much as 200+ years. Keeping any gravity drain clear and functioning is important. So is not attempting to moisture seal the wall from inside - you do not want water pressure to build up on the exterior side. Make sure grading and any gutters direct water away from the foundation. If there are obvious places where a stone has fallen out on the interior side, no harm will come from replacing it and using mortar to hold it in place. You need have no concern about mortar type for this limited use, either.


  • seydoux
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I truly appreciate all of the responses which I am receiving. As you can see from some of the comments, one of the issues which those of us who are owners of stone houses is that construction techniques were often quite different. I love my thick stone walls, but I find myself confused often between the conflicting advice I receive about repairs, i.e. whether re-mortaring needs to be the same lime mortar which was used for the construction of if a modern Portland type mortar can be used. Similarly, how to deal with changes of grade that are inevitable in a 260 year old house. This is why I opened this discussion. House built in the 18th century have many different concerns than ones built in the 19th.


  • Jack Kennedy
    9 years ago

    regarding mortar in historic structures..... you typically want the mortar to be softer than what it is holding in place (ie brick or stone). When you use a modern super hard mortar, like portland cement moisture that gets into the stone/brick has nowhere to go ( especially during freezing temperatures) and can cause the stone/brick to crack and split. Using a softer mortar allows the mortar to crack in these situations rather than the stone/brick failing.