Do you have issues with control rooted in your first family?

I don't hear control in this statement: Don't worry, you can stay home with the baby.

I hear - you don't have to worry about providing for us financially, I can shoulder that burden.

Just because I hear it differently doesn't mean I am right. But I am not afraid of being controlled either, so I don't wear those glasses.

I suggest you see a counselor individually if you won't go with him. Find out ways to approach your marriage differently so you don't feel cornered by what you perceive as control.

amyfiddler - did you read her entire first post? Her husband does come off as an overly-controlling person...in my opinion, anyway. Sure without some of that context, the statements you pointed out are not necessarily indicative of this by themselves.

OP - I am sorry to hear of your unexpected surprise. I have known several cases of people purposely getting pregnant while the marriage was in 'crisis'...thinking it would bring them closer. It almost always makes things worse....raising a child in the most solid of marriages is a stressful thing. Raising one in a troubled marriage....not good. Yes you have some tough decisions to make....counseling, as a couple and for yourself, is never a bad idea.

Amy thanks for replying. By "issues of control with my first family" I'm going to assume you mean growing up. Yes, I did have control issues, being a change of life baby with 4 much older siblings (the youngest of them was 14 when I was born). Of course I had no issues with parental control which I submitted to without too much rebellion. It was the four sibling also telling me what to do when I became of age that, quite frankly, got on my nerves.

But if you don't think my husband has control issues, you probably did not read my posts, which I do understand because they are all VERY long. You would also know that we don't have money issues, I don't even contribute anything to the household from my salary, so that really is a non-factor. I actually always feared he would try to get me to quit my job even before this happened. So he knows full well I don't have to worry about a sitter from a financial standpoint.

Mkroop thanks for weighing in, but I don't think you read my post entirely either. I guess I'm too long-winded! LOL! There is no way I was trying to get pregnant! I was on the pill and didn't realize that prolonged bout with vomiting, diarrhea renders the pill ineffective in some cases. Had I known this, I should/could have abstained (fat chance) or used some other method. I just don't recall that caution when I first got on the pill. The thought of having a baby on top of trying to get this marriage back on the right track is overwhelming to me. I've never been a person to be depressed, mostly just stressed, but this situation is stressing me out as well as having me depressed. My husband seems to have accepted it and moved on. He's trying to be supportive but he really thinks I should be happy since I initially wanted a baby. I never told him how when I saw how much we really get to spend so little time together, I no longer thought I wanted to raise a child that way.

Oh, hey, I finally went to a game with him. It was a good game, but I didn't enjoy it. When we were in the company suite, it just seemed like everyone he introduced me to was taken aback that I am his wife. I don't know if it is the age difference that's personified by me looking almost 10 years younger anway, but I think I can safely say I was pretty much snobbed, even though other wives were around (as well as groupies, it appears). It was very uncomfortable.

Thanks for reading if you made it this far. We have decided to wait awhile to make sure there are no complications before telling anyone about the pregnancy. That means the only person I'm talking to about it is him, and right now he is listening pretty patiently but even I am getting sick of hearing me whine!

I guess I'll end this pity party now. LOL!

Oh, Amy I apologize! I forgot I had started a separate thread from the first one, so you did not know the background. If you have trouble sleeping tonight, read it, it is two posts below. I'm sure you will be asleep in no time! LOL! I should have known when you seemed to be the only one who didn't think he is a total jerk!
Although my descriptions of things were accurate, I guess I did a poor job of bringing out his good qualities. I really do love him very much (sometimes I think too much)

Hi wifey. Gosh, what a situation. I do think you should continue with the counselling idea, if only as a way of clarifying to yourself what you want and how you might achieve that.
"I never told him how when I saw how much we really get to spend so little time together, I no longer thought I wanted to raise a child that way."
Do not delay in telling him this now. If, as it seems, he has got over the initial shock of your news and appears to be happy about it, he needs to know why you aren't as thrilled and be given a chance to fix that.
"I suppose we'll need to move to the suburbs to get a backyard (we both HATE the suburbs)"- why? Children all over the world have perfectly happy childhoods growing up in apartments. Parks are a great resource for apartment dwellers. IMO if you're planning to move anywhere it should be back to your home town so you can have help from your family. If your husband's work is so all over the place, does it matter that much where his home base is?
I don't think mkroopy was suggesting you got pregnant on purpose, merely pointing out that in so many cases where a marriage was shaky as yours is and the wife deliberately got pregnant, it wasn't the big fix they were hoping for (and generally made things harder in the aftermath). An accidental pregnancy in this situation would be even more complicated, in that it wasn't an outcome hoped or planned for.
I'm sorry the WAGs snubbed you, perhaps they see you as a threat (think positive ;-) ).

I hope you will reconsider the cancellation/postponement of counseling. You don't have to dive in full force right off the bat. Focus on establishing a relationship with the therapist and seeking clarity on a short list of specific issues.

I agree wholeheartedly with the suggestion to forget the move to the suburbs. You may need to relocate to a larger apartment/condo, but lots of people raise children in the city and love the plethora of services and amenities a city can offer from museum programs for children to the best pediatricians.

You don't have to have a back yard if your home is near a park. After all, you have acknowledged your affluence; it isn't as if you're going to be living in a third-floor walkup or cold-water flat.

Whether you stay home or not is entirely up to you. Certainly your husband's wishes matter, but ultimately you're the decider. It can be a rich experience, but also isolating, and you might consider continuing to work part-time to maintain a network and just get out a bit.

You might also examine volunteer or church activities (like the choir) because you will need a social life of some sort. You can't stay home 100% of the time and since your husband is frequently gone, it's up to you to develop those resources. Your baby will also benefit from social experiences.

Do look into reliable nanny agencies. Everyone needs a babysitter sometime. Check with your church for recommendations. Surely there's someone there whom you trust.

And finally, don't give too much weight to the wives' reactions. If they see you more often they'll probably soften. They were most likely just surprised.

Even if I read your long post describing things that others use to define him as jerk, I would not have learned a thing about him. I would only learn how you see him.

Wifey, I'm sorry that you are pregnant. You completely agreed with warnings to not have children. I know from what you've said that you didn't get pregnant intentionally, but that doesn't change what was a slam dunk before.

I'm going to state something that many will undoubtedly flame me for. There are alternatives. I'm not suggesting that you not have this child, but it's an option. Yes, IMO your marriage is unhealthy, and quite a bit more than that. As Mkroopy intimated, it's likely that adding a baby to the mix not only won't make things better but, in fact, is likely to make it worse. Do you want that for you or your child?

There; it's said. And I'm not promoting it, as I indicated. But - if you still believe everything that you've said in your other posts, this pregnancy is not good news.

As it is, try to turn it into good news and a cause for celebration by going to the counseling either by yourself or with your husband, and taking as much of the good advice you've already received.

My best to you.

"Even if I read your long post describing things that others use to define him as jerk, I would not have learned a thing about him. I would only learn how you see him."

which is what we all learn from reading any post.

duh.

& things that sound good but that really aren't are classic means of gaining control:

"You can stay home with the baby", coming from a controller, means, "you can stay home with the baby, & I'll run things, & you won't be able to do a thing because you won't have an income or any real alternatives."

Had to meet the hubby for my Dr appointment earlier today. Brought up possibility of counseling for us. He wanted to know why I think we need it. He just thinks we can work this out between the two of us. He understands about the controlling thing, it's really hard for him, because that's just how he is, but he's trying to be better about it. So I told him if he doesn't want to go, I will go alone. So, he wanted to know how I felt about going alone. He's trying to do more of what I want but "gosh, baby, isn't that counseling thing just a glorified shrink? I don't need a head doctor and neither do you."

See what I'm up against?

Anyway, thanks for responses and suggestions. Suzie, the abortion thing, not going to happen.

Staying in the city: we both really want to. But I don't know, life in the city seems so unfair to a kid. My husband grew up in the city and said he yearned for the idyllic life of the suburbs that he saw on t.v. His parents always aspired to give them better neighborhoods, better schools, etc but could never make it out. And I grew up in that type of idyllic lifestyle that he wanted. We do actually live right across the street from a park; a park that I actually love and hubby and I go there a lot just to sit and talk. It's one of our favorite things to do on those few occasions when there areno planned activites.

"gosh, baby, isn't that counseling thing just a glorified shrink? I don't need a head doctor and neither do you."
The answer to that is no, we probably don't need a head doctor, but I'm not happy. A good counsellor is more of a facilitator for both parties to express coherently (possibly for the first time, even to themselves) how they feel and what they would like out of the relationship. If you don't know what the issues are you can't fix them. Sometimes it takes someone from the outside looking in to see things differently and give you a nudge in the right direction.

I live in the inner city where there are many mothers pushing prams around, lots of children walking home from school, it is a very vibrant community.

Sure there is a not a grassy back yard with lots of trees, and space. All the school age children meet in the park, play on the swings. It is fantastic for them on a social level. My children grew up in a rural garden, with huge amounts of space, but I think they would have been better off growing up in an urban suburb.

A child needs parents who love them in a loving home.

If you do your best, that is all you have to do.

Sylvia,
"Duh" was really unnecessary and hurtful.
I didn't invite that. Why be so unkind here?
My objective is to be helpful and to be clear with the op that anecdotal evidence that her husband is controling doesn't prove that perhaps she doesnt have contributing factors that reinforce his controling actions. Often times, controling types gravitate to folks who readily give away their power. I have zero influence on him...it is she who is asking for help.

Sylvia,
"Duh" was really unnecessary and hurtful.
I didn't invite that. Why be so unkind here?
My objective is to be helpful and to be clear with the op that anecdotal evidence that her husband is controling doesn't prove that perhaps she doesnt have contributing factors that reinforce his controling actions. Often times, controling types gravitate to folks who readily give away their power. I have zero influence on him...it is she who is asking for help.

"gosh, baby, isn't that counseling thing just a glorified shrink? I don't need a head doctor and neither do you."

Really. Minimizing and deflecting. Classic control strategies.

Exactly, readinglady. But even more than your analysis, I knew he wouldn't go for it, because I figured he would see going to a counselor as a form of him NOT being in control. I actually understand why he has the controlling nature that he has (won't get into that on this forum) and I really think the thought that some of that might have to be dealt with in counseling is why he doesn't want to go. Very telling, to me, his reference to "not needing a head doctor." Because he SURELY doesn't want anybody other than me trying to get in his head.

Amy, you are absolutely right about him gravitating to me as someone who would submit to being controlled. His BIG PERSONALITY is one of the things i love about him. I guess you could say in all fairness that I was aware of his control issues, in a sense, before I married him, and this is hard to explain, but I saw it more as a him being a "take charge" type of person. So I didn't separate it from the other aspects of his personality that I was drawn to.

Popi, I'm really interested to know why you wish your children had grown up in an urban environment?

wifey, how is he acting now about the child? He made it very clear, according to you, that he didn't want children. I think it's big of him to do so up front, so that you had no false hopes. But now he's going to have one. Something that he never wanted. I expect that he will love the child. But how is he acting now about it?

So your best recourse is not to focus on his issues. Dont try to change him, you ate drawn to the take charge guy. Instead, learn how to be clear, authentic, maintain boundaries, and co exist with a strong personality without "disappearing". Learn how to remain present. Therapy can help.

So your best recourse is not to focus on his issues. Dont try to change him, you ate drawn to the take charge guy. Instead, learn how to be clear, authentic, maintain boundaries, and co exist with a strong personality without "disappearing". Learn how to remain present. Therapy can help.

So your best recourse is not to focus on his issues. Dont try to change him, you ate drawn to the take charge guy. Instead, learn how to be clear, authentic, maintain boundaries, and co exist with a strong personality without "disappearing". Learn how to remain present. Therapy can help.

Suzie, re how is he acting? It's really kind of hard to describe. Subdued? Kind of like throwing in the towel like "what are you going to do?" But that's kind of how he has been acting since I started confronting him about his control issues anyway, so I don't know ...but it's definitely not out of his usual personality, whether it be happy or angry. His usual personality if he would be happy would be sort of like "YES!" with a fist pump, I'm happy and I'm not ashamed to show it. Or if he was unhappy he would just keep repeating how much this sucks (that'I'm pregnant). He said jokingly the other day that in 2 years he'll probably have 2 kids, a house with a white picket fence, a dog and a cat and he'll look around and wonder how it all happened.

Amy, I like that advice! I really do! That will take work but its worth it.

Feels much better, doesn't it....paying attention to the things you have power to change. Counting on someone else to change, or characterizing your life partner as a 'bad guy" feels hopeless. Re focusing on areas you 'can' control is empowering. The relationship will have to change in reaction to your changes - either he will escalate, and that will be information, or he will find that he doesn't need to parent you because you are more mature than he thought.

Depending upon how your husband responds when the baby is born, it may be even more critical to have developed some of the interpersonal skills amyfiddler mentioned.

If you are drawn to a controlling ("take charge") personality, that's one thing. You are an adult. But now there is this third person in the equation.

If it should happen that your spouse's parenting style is detrimental to your child, you will need to be prepared to address those issues. That's where individual counseling prior to birth can be helpful.

Well, after a weekend of talking, talking, and talking with my husband, we find ourselves surprisingly on the same page. This may never happen again in our marriage. LOL! Please don't judge us (or DO judge us, either one might prove helpful).

1. We BOTH DON'T want a baby.

2. We BOTH don't want an abortion. In fact, not even an option. Ironically, we both feel we would hate the other if an abortion was suggested. Well, maybe hate is a strong word. I don't think I would have ever recovered had he suggested it, but probably would have tried to stay together if he changed his mind. He says it would be over if I decide to have an abortion.

3. We BOTH would not consider adoption. No strong feelings on this as with abortion, but we just can't do it.

So, there you have it. We just really don't want a baby. But we're just really going to have one. Lord help us.

I do have a counseling appointment but the only one I could get is by telephone at lunch hour, because all the evening appointments are booked until after New Year's. Actually I don't mind that, though. Husband not there yet, so I have just decided to let it go. He will be out of town anyway from tomorrow through the weekend.

Wow I feel bad for you...actually I feel worse for the child you will be having. Kids are such a life-altering event it's hard not to resent them a bit even when you both want them and they are planned, like they were with my ex and I, I cannot imagine how it would be if neither of us had wanted them.

But it seems as if the die is cast and you will be going in that direction....good luck and please remember to put the child's needs first.

OK, you've jointly decided you're going to keep this baby, now you need to work on _wanting_ him or her. I'm serious, if you don't _want_ this baby then you need to seriously consider for the baby's sake adopting him or her with parents who _do_ want a baby. Bringing up a child you don't want is cruel to the child. They know they're not wanted.

I agree with colleenoz. Think of the wonderful gift you could give the child - parents who really, really want him or her. A great gift both for the child and another couple. That is the most selfless thing to do.

I do continue to wish you well, but moreso now I wish the baby well.

Once this child is born, I urge you to have your tubes tied and your husband have a vasectomy. Do them both, so that there's no chance of you finding yourselves in this sad situation again.

Unwanted child....

You have the power to change that.

thanks for the comments everybody. I'm really looking forward to the counseling session tomorrow. I have a feeling it's going to be some tough love but I will let you know.

Then, there is:

The possibility of being stuck in a loveless relationship harboring a grudge against that child for ever. Remaining with a controlling husband who continues to live his life while you "stay home."

Living your life always trying to be. Hearing this over and over and over...

" I on the other hand wanted them badly but was willing to sacrifice having children to be with him"
"You can stay home with the baby."
" I don't even contribute anything to the household from my salary"
" I actually always feared he would try to get me to quit my job"
"husband seems to have accepted it and moved on"
"He's trying to be supportive but he really thinks I should be happy"
" I saw how much we really get to spend so little time together"
"he is listening pretty patiently but even I am getting sick of hearing me whine"

What do you see four years from now? Still playing the game of not letting his control "bother" you? Still trying to be heard? Seen? Do your feelings, your dreams, YOU really matter to him? Or is he just too busy with himself?

Do you see yourself as being happy? Happy that you are together? Where is the child?

I know relationships take work. I took on full responsibility for EVERYTHING but financial when I married my narcissistic/controlling spouse. 28 years later I have finally filed for divorce. We started out pretty much as you described. He made himself the supreme almighty poohbah and I eventually became chattel.

Good luck to you. But to me neither one of you sound happy. At all. And life is short. I also feel bad for that kid-I don't think my parents wanted me either.

There are worse things than staying home with young children. For me, that was an honor. Then again, it was entirely my choice.....and I did want my children. I was happy to be parenting and raising and influencing them.

Worried: I wouldn't call our relationship loveless. I love him very much. I believe he loves me. He says often enough and tenderly enough. Yes he has control issues and I have issues dealing with his control. But things have changed a lot since our confrontation and he does try to listen more. As for if I'm happy well at this time we're trying to deal with this situation so I wouldn't say there is a general feeling of happiness. But we're not directing the unhappiness toward each other.

When he's not working we are together a lot. Problem is he's working a lot. Lucky for me that whether he's really working is easy for me to know the reason for his trip is work. That doesn't really prove whether he could be cheating although when I've asked him if he is/has he says no. He doesn't act withdrawn but I'm aware that he still could be. I enjoy being with him and he seems to enjoy being with me. Our sex life is everything I could want and he sure seems satisfied too. But he is also very affectionate outside of sex. I pretty much can't keep my hands off him and if ever want to get him to not act angry just touching him usually does it. Doesn't change his mind much but does change his demeanor.

But he doesn't speak roughly to me often anyway. Like I said in my first post I almost wish he didn't treat me in the manner that he does because then I could easier resist him. Thanks to Mkroop for pointing that out as manipulation but Lawd! It's still hard to resist him even when armed with that knowledge. Granted in the past that has been because I just let him have his way but that has changed some too. I guess I really need to look up that word narcissistic to see what else is involved other than control. One positive I have gotten from all of your posts is speaking up for myself and not being afraid to oppose him. I don't know what my fear was with that other than not wanting to be a nag for fear it would drive us apart and our marriage wouldn't last.

I remember hearing one of my sisters say that he husband was the boss until she started having kids. Now she is definitely the queen bee so I guess there's hope for me yet.

This post was edited by wifey1281 on Wed, Dec 5, 12 at 7:32

I had a counseling session today via phone. It was very productive. I really did connect with the Minister. Of course since my husband did not agree to go, we can only work on me, but that's fine. I actually have "homework" which feels a little strange. She also wants me to tell my gyn about how we are feeling regarding the pregnancy. She seemed to imply that the way I'm feeling about the pregnancy at this point will probably change. She said that couples who didn't want children before they got pregnant don't just suddenly want them when there is an unexpected pregnancy, so don't worry about those feelings right now. She actually thinks its promising that we have made an unwavering decision to have and keep the baby.

About 10 minutes into the session, she had to offer to switch me to someone else when she discovered who my husband was, because she knows him. They worked together many years ago on implementing a sports component for an after school community program. She thinks I should get his input on how he feels about her counseling me.

The rest of the session was kind of probing into some areas that were quite uncomfortable for me but necessary. I'm actually looking forward to the next session.

Hubby is away :( but wonder of wonders, did call to see how the session went. He says he doesn't remember her from my description (I think she is married now) but he dislkes the idea of her counseling me because she knows him. But he says it really doesn't matter because he dislikes letting someone into our private lives anyway so I might as well stick with her.

Miss him already but I have a lot to do while he is gone so it will be okay.

I really would like to credit everyone here for getting me into counseling. I don't think I would have gone through with it without a consistent urging from you all. I am going to leave this thread now that I am in counseling, but I will check back in 9 months or so. :>

Thanks again and have blessed Christmas everyone.

Take care, have a safe and joyful pregnancy, and be happy :-)