I'm not sure what to think because you're all over the place without explaining any of it.

I don't know what "EVERYTHING" consisted of, and therefore have no idea if you actually know what "EVERYTHING" can be.

I don't know what "a magic wand" is.

I don't understand why you say it is hurtful and turn the whole situation into being all about you, yet you blow it off as not being your problem and too hopeless to bother with anyway.

You mention nothing of foreplay to make penetration easier and is also much better for her.

You say you both saw a sex therapist but mention nothing of the exercise(s), the therapy, the outcome, or why the sex therapy failed. You only talk about your wife's "issue" as she complained to the therapist about you, which sounds like you saw a therapist but not a sex therapist.

Have you tried oral sex? And have you tried it for long enough to bring her to orgasm or just gave up before she achieved orgasm? Do you know the goal of oral sex and exactly how to perform it, the best way to do it that will bring her to orgasm?

Are you familiar with her G spot? Do you know how to massage her G spot to bring her to orgasm? Do you know the positions that offer the optimum access to her G spot so that she can achieve "PIV" orgasm?

Seems to me you've got it more-or-less handled although "everything" is a pretty big word.

Suggest experimenting some more but be careful to AVOID "beating her over the head with it". Her orgasm is her responsibility IMHO but if you can make experimentation enjoyable as opposed to "required" you may add to your mutual satisfaction whether or not there's an orgasm in store.

I assume by "magic wand" you likely mean a vibrating dildo of some sort. They can be fun as well as useful. And there's precisely zero wrong with using lube. Some women get wet, some don't. Small deal.

Suggest encouraging her to accept additional play without expecting or appearing to require an orgasm. Be giving, not demanding. With or without the "O", she'll appreciate it. She does like that part about you. Build on it.

Thermometer has some good ideas, too.

Thermo. thanks, you're cute!

It never ceases to amaze me when I read about this subject or attempt to converse about it, how defensive women get and how quickly they get so. I would ask you to think seriously about this. What if you were NEVER able to bring your husband to climax? How would that make you feel? But to the more specific qustions,

I beleive if you did some reading you would come accross the Hitachi majic wand pretty quickly. From my reading only, this seems to be generally acknolwedged as the "gold standard" of female vibrators. It entered production in the 1960s by a major manufacturer and is still a best seller. Try ebay. it does NOT involve insersion -spelling- but clitorial stimulation ONLY.

"Have you tried oral sex" I know you are trying to help but please...we've been married 18 years. I've preformed for somewhere between 30 minutes to an hour more times than I can count. Generally she prefers indirect stinuatlion through the hood at about 10:00 on the dial, but "variety." Virtually anytime we have intamacy it involves my giving her oral until she stops me, which on average is about 10 minutes.

Gspot=spongy material on the vaginal canal wall a few inches in on the side closet to bellybutton hasn't done anything for her. Etc. Generally it's tough to summarize 21 years of sex in a few paragraphs, but I will continue to elaborate as you ask.

"....how defensive women get and how quickly they get so."

Do have to agree with you on this point. I've found it so throughout life and here, too. Interestingly, your wife seems not to be like that. You described considerable openness and cooperation, actually.

I've been with a number of non-orgasmic women. I'd say about 1/2 were well adjusted to it. The other 1/2 blamed me for being inept -- notwithstanding that they couldn't get there with anyone else either, or even by themselves. More or less blamed the entire male population. Your wife doesn't seem to be one of those types and she does seem to enjoy what she is able to -- a very good thing.

Back to your situation.....it seems to me you sound hopeful; maybe a little discouraged; but far from dissatisfied. After 21 years, I don't think you're talking about a deal-breaker, just wishing maybe. That's why I opined that you seem to have it more-or-less handled. Do I have that right?

Yes, Asolo, you are absolutely correct. He has it handled by stating he finds it hurtful and by indicating it is hopeless. And please tell me how her orgasm is her responsibility if her partner isn't there, considers it useless, or is inept? The post was about their experience together, not what she experiences alone, which is of course her responsibility.

Tennisshort, I see you posted here for the sole purpose of being able to ambush your female respondents with accusation of defensiveness that doesn't exist. You couldn't wait for someone to respond so you could slam that on them. Where you find it in my reply is a mystery to me since I'm not the one unable to please my partner and as you know, I'm not your poor wife. Sorry, never had such a problem. hmmmmm Whose the defensive one here?

I have no reason to "read" what a magic wand is, nor was I asking for direction. I am capable of searching without being prompted. My point was you made mention of a device without telling your readers what you were talking about, as you did with so much of your post. Is your fragmented nature part of the problem with your spouse? I don't doubt it is as I read your response, which was more verbose than necessary and didn't really address what I asked but did answer my question of whether you knew what you were doing. You revealed much more than you intended. Just a hint: she would not stop you if you knew what you were doing and how to do it correctly. She stops you because you are more irritating than the effort is worth enduring. I have to admit I do commend you for making the effort though and advise that you learn the proper method(s) so you don't spend another 21 years doing it wrong and calling her the hopeless one.

And yes, my response here surely was defensive because I was ambushed and attacked with falsehood. I am correct nevertheless.

"You revealed much more than you intended. Just a hint: she would not stop you if you knew what you were doing and how to do it correctly. She stops you because you are more irritating than the effort is worth enduring. I have to admit I do commend you for making the effort though and advise that you learn the proper method(s) so you don't spend another 21 years doing it wrong and calling her the hopeless one. "

Well now ouch. There is no "ambush." I am mindful that've you've been active here for many years. I'm all ears on this. again, I've asked many, many times and I am very gentle, I focus on as she describes her upper right quadrant, at her direction I never go "right at" the clitorous but through the hood, and I go until she says stop. Why do you go into concepts of "right" and "wrong"?

I perceive Asolo is more on track in that he instantly is past the right and the wrong. there is no fault. I am mindful that no man has ever been successful at, in your words, "doing it correctly" with her.
There is no right or wrong. There is a basic physiological thing that's not happening. I wish it were and I am struggling with it.

"......she said she had never had an orgasm during partnered sex, that she had never masturbated to climax, and had actually touched herself very little in her lifetime. "

Yo thermometer....that was what she said about herself. However lacking his technique may be, I would think this statement would stand on its own for most readers. From OP's description, his wife seems to know herself pretty well and seems not only adjusted to it but also cooperative on his behalf. I'd say OP's charge of defensiveness is fair enough.

There is no "right or wrong". It varies very much from woman to woman. You could learn to satisfy one woman only to irritate another doing the exact same thing. Some need more direct stimulation, some need very indirect. Without her help, I don't know how you could learn "proper methods".
The only way I know of to learn the correct way to satisfy her is to have her tell you or show you. Since she doesn't even know herself how to do this, I'm afraid you're at a loss.
If sex feels good to her and she initiates it, and she fine with that, then don't worry about it. Sex CAN be fun for women without the big "O".
And, even though you have been married for quite a while, sex can still get better as both partners learn more about each other and themselves. As long as there's no pressure to perform, she may surprise herself one day and achieve orgasm. It's been known to happen, especially in a totally relaxed, no pressure environment.
Is she open to touching herself in front of you to show you what does feel good to her?

Okay, so generally women don't masturbate and men do. Where is the sin and how does it mean she knows herself? Seems to me just the opposite. She doesn't do it so she doesn't know herself. How do you figure so backwards?

Again, I have nothing to defend, no one to protect, and no dissatisfied partner. So how was I defensive?. Please explain. Of course, you may so cleverly keep on accusing to make sure I appear more defensive with each response, but that still won't explain the initial ambush. Or is there an explanation being that you men are determined to stick together and blame women for your shortcomings and lack of understanding. I had a guy just like Tennisshort years ago. While I appreciated his effort, I found him annoying so like TS's wife, I always stopped him. Unfortunately, I was young, inexperienced, and didn't know myself well enough to properly direct him. Well actually, I didn't know the technique, so I cannot have directed him no matter how well I knew myself. If asked at that time, my answer would have been "I don't like oral sex and cannot orgasm that way." TS's wife doesn't know how to direct him, and he doesn't know the technique either. You guys are not convincing. You're just sticking together. How nice.

Is it possible that she might be happy with your sex life?

I wonder what would happen if you were to focus not on what she wasn't doing, but on your own thoughts and feelings, making efforts to adjust those and view your sex life as satisfying -

What are the things that are working for the two of you?

PS what is the meaning you place on the astroglide? (You describe this as hurtful to you). Are you interpreting any of this to be that you feel rejected by her?

My take is that you're in a bit of a Catch 22 --

Your wife has never been orgasmic except apparently, in her sleep. This tells me the issue is psychological or mental. Could be trust issues, too much on her mind, feeling pressured, feeling self-conscious -- SO MANY possibilities. But the stuff in her head that is keeping her from reaching orgasm is something only she can deal with. YOU can't 'reach in there' and fix it.

She already said that she appreciated that you didn't make a big deal our of her lack of orgasms. "Wow, a guy who is not going to beat me over the head with it". Believe that sentiment! She is comfortable with her sexual response and was appreciative that you accepted it too.

But trying to change it -- even for the best of reasons -- is not accepting, and puts her on the defensive. It makes her feel self-conscious, 'defective', not relaxed and sensual. In other words, the more you try to bring her to orgasm, the more pressure you put her under and the less likely it is to just happen.

I'd also like to step in and say it's NOT simply a matter of technique! Sure, some techniques are better than others, but for some women (all the time) or many women some of the time, NOTHING is going to work! They're just not in a frame of mind that will allow it to happen. Thinking too much, protecting themselves, worrying about something -- whatever. And for those women at those times, 30-60 minutes of even the most skillful lovemaking is just 20-50 minutes too much.

My best advice?

Tell your wife how much you love her and how appealing she is to you, even after all of these years. Tell her how you appreciate the efforts she makes to meet your sexual needs -- never turning you down, and initiating. Tell her you know that she can enjoy sex without orgasm (it IS true), but that you'd love to be able to gift her that gift -- that it would make you feel wonderful to be able to give that to her. Admit that your past efforts to do that may have felt like pressure (they probably did, to her) and apologize for that.

Then ASK HER if she'd like to work with you and/or a sex therapist to try to become orgasmic, or if she'd rather you simply drop the subject once and for all. Ask her to NOT answer you right away, but to take some time to think about it. And assure her that you will continue to love her until death do you part no matter what her answer is. And when she gives you her answer -- accept it and abide by it, even if it's not the answer you want.

Is it possible your wife has a hooded clitoris? That was an issue for me many years ago. During a pre-marriage exam by my gynecologist, he mentioned to me that mine was hooded and said that if I had trouble reaching orgasm, I should come back and he could take care of it. I had limited sexual experience before my marriage and about 8 months into the marriage I had yet to come PIV. The only way to reach an orgasm was through digital stimulation.

While DH was away on business for a few days, the doctor split the skin over the clitoris and pulled it back a bit. That made all the difference in the world.

Oh, and from the conversations I have had with other women, the consensus is that women DO masturbate.

Astroglide rocks. Tons of people use it, and not just for "dryness". It's a nice aid for better sex, what's the problem?

Ditto to vibrators. And you don't need that Hitachi state of the art thing, unless you are selling it.

And there is no "her" orgasm or "his" orgasm, it's both of your shared orgasms. I don't hear any team work here, but it sounds like each of you is waiting for the other to take the lead. But it isn't happening.

No offense, but are you an accountant or an old Republican or something? You're missing one of nature's greatest gifts to mankind. Sounds like you just ignore this problem and w-a-i-t. But what is it you are waiting for??

You know, they say the biggest sex organ is the brain. Probably especially true for women versus men, just part of the genetic make up really. Obviously I don't know how romantic a guy you are, but that is the focus I would give your DW. If she feels loved, nurtured, and attractive to her H, O's are quite secondary. Perhaps if you can appeal to her brain on a new, higher level, just maybe you can get somewhere physically as well.

May sound silly, but how about reading a romance novel or two to get a feeling for what turns a woman on? Think about it, romance novels are huge business for women- right on par with porno materials for men. This should tell you a huge difference between men and women- men like to look, women like the concept of building up to the moment and feeling nurtured.

Obviously I don't know you, but from your posts, I wonder if you are too focused on the physiology of romance and not enough on the psychology.

Hitachi? Okkkk, I'm not sure what difference brands make but my little Hello Kitty (no pun intended, but there it is) BOB works just great.
Back to subject. Maybe all this intense scrutiny on whether or not your wife orgasms puts to much pressure on her and she just wants to get it done with and get on with life.

Perhaps just have some hot sex-stictly for the fun of it with no thoughts/worries about the outcome. Not everyone orgasms everytime. Some people just do it for the giggles & good times.

-Cat

I like Sweeby's post.

If she can get off in her sleep but not while awake, seems like a big red flag to me. She could go see a shrink and try to be 'cured' - but she seems pretty content with the way things are. So that would leave you being the only one dissatisfied with the outcome of the sex between you two. My best guess is it's something that you're taking personally. Short answer? Don't.

Aside from that - I saw this somewhere up above:

"Okay, so generally women don't masturbate and men do..."

Untrue. Actually, positively FALLACIOUS.

Amen to that! Of course we do it.

Tennisshorts, some sex education may help both of you. I recommend The Joy of Sex. It's a great book and it clears up some of the misconceptions that many people have. Very tastefully done, but also specific.

People take lessons or classes to learn to drive a car or play golf, but venture into this really big area of life with no guide, sometimes. Except their assumptions.

So what's the deal, here? If she can't orgasm "like a normal woman" she's no good? I'm suspicious of this this push to some place that she's already well aware of, but that she can't reach. It may not be possible for her. If she chooses to seek it, OK, but failing to attain it doesn't reduce her, does it?

So it's like she needs to see a specialized shrink to straighten her out and if she still can't she's inferior in some way? This is something she absolutely must remedy? I disagree. She's all grown up. She knows this about herself. Why should she feel pressure about it at this late date? Seems to me she's quite well adjusted, according to OP.

Most of you are gals, so I'd be interested in your take. As a guy, like OP, and after looooong experience with her limitations as well as satisfactions, I'm a little miffed at this apparent push to insist she accomplish something she may not be able to.

OMFG....ROTFLMAO.

"Like a normal woman"... this phrase cracks me up. First of all, there is nothing "normal" about women. We are complicated, unique beings. We may change our mind at the slightest provocation. What feels good one moment is terrifically annoying the next.

This whole post comes down to one thing for me:

..." What if you were NEVER able to bring your husband to climax? How would that make you feel?"

Just so everyone knows who this is really about!

Monogamous since 1988.
Asked if ever had orgasm with him in 2000.

It took TWELVE years to ask??????????????????

One thing you might want to consider is that for men, to my understanding, sex is all about the climax, holding back the climax, succumbing to the climax. For women, sex is all about the intimacy. I don't go into it thinking "I'm gonna climax" (well, mostly!) I think, ummm....how lovely to be close to my husband. Anything else is just bonus.

If I were you I'd take the importance off of the end result and concentrate on the beginning and middle.

And why not buy some toys? Not that Oscillator 500 Turbomax. Talk about pressure! You don't need a ferrari to go to the grocery, you can ride a bike! Spend $30 or so and buy an attractive stimulator for her, and let her use it!!! IME, most men are not as adept as they think they are, and most are just as self conscious as we are. Sometimes it's easier just to not engage than deal with teaching/showing. But it's supposed to be fun! Play together!!! Stop making so many rules!

"....there is nothing "normal" about women..."

Talk about LOL!

Goes for men, too, for that matter, although we are somewhat less complicated overall.

Agreed Asolo. That's what I love about men! Somewhat less complicated, but deeper than we give them credit for.

I think people focus on sex/orgasm issue because they don't want to adress the real issue: lack of emotional intimacy, resentment or whatever else is really wrong with relationship. It is scary to address it so it is much easier to pretend that lack of orgasm destroying your marriage. whatever it is, it is not lack of climaxing.

"I think people focus on sex/orgasm issue because they don't want to adress the real issue: lack of emotional intimacy"

So true!!

..." What if you were NEVER able to bring your husband to climax? How would that make you feel?" "

I too found this hilarious! If that's all there is to it then go take care of it yourself. It would make me feel like he needs to get a grip & deal.

By the way I have NEVER asked my DH if he orgasmed. He has asked maybe once in our marriage. It's not about the orgasm it's about the closeness. I agree, why does op feel the need to pressure wife even more about it? It doesn't seem to bother her. Relax, sex is supposed to be fun!

~Cat

"By the way I have NEVER asked my DH if he orgasmed."

Excuse me? You have had to ASK your husband if he made it? Are we on the same planet? Is not the male "climax" somewhat obvious? Are you in a heterosexual marriage?

Also my two cents again;

If my DH was this focused on whether or not I attained lift off during sex, or during sleep- so much so the he seemed preoccupied with it, the mechanics of it, what was "wrong", why this, why that...sorry it would make it a huge turn off to me.

Nothing makes a woman not orgasm more than knowing the pressure is on & your mate is watching your every move, he's done this or that for this amount of time in this or that direction-Why haven't you orgasmed already!?!

Seriously!! It would make me feel more like a experiment than a sexy woman. Gawd, just let her lay back & enjoy it!

~Cat

Asolo,
I was joking, but actually, no I haven't asked him, lol...I'm usually too preoccupied to ask about that..

~Cat

"Nothing makes a woman not orgasm more than knowing the pressure is on & your mate is watching your every move, he's done this or that for this amount of time in this or that direction-Why haven't you orgasmed already!?!"

Well said Catlettuce! Nothing takes the magic out of an encounter like having performance standards imposed on us.

"What if you were NEVER able to bring your husband to climax? How would that make you feel?"

Oh -- So it IS about how you feel.
I thought it was about your wife?
Sounds like you're looking for validation -- so not exactly the 'generous offer' you're protraying it to be.
At this stage, your wife could do what millions of other women do in this situation: fake it. (Feel better?)

"Sounds like you're looking for validation -- so not exactly the 'generous offer' you're protraying it to be.
At this stage, your wife could do what millions of other women do in this situation: fake it. (Feel better?)"

Worth saying twice!

Oh, fine. Let's hear it for deception. Is that really how you gals run your sex-lives? Something you think you have to do?

I must be really out-of-touch. (no pun intended)

Well, if it's made to be a chore/test/experiment/and your partner is hung up whether or not you cum ,what causes you too, how many licks it takes to get to the center..., then uh, yes yawn...I'd fake it.

Though I don't feel sex is wasted time if I don't orgasm, I would certainly be highly irritated if my DH was this perturbed by my orgasms or lack thereof. Enough so that I probably wouldn't want to bother or would fake it to get it over with.

~Cat

No Asolo -- my 'advice' to OP's wife was total satire.

That's not what I preach, and it's certainly not what I practice. But then again, my husband has been made to understand that pressuring me to perform helps me about as much as it would help him if I applied the pressure tactics. Nothing fun or sensual about sexual performance anxiety.

Actually Asolo, I agree wholeheartedly with your post from Monday, about the OP apparently considering his wife somehow "defective".

She is what she is. She's not hiding it. She's not pretending. She's not deceiving or lying about it. If the OP accepts her for who she is, and strives for emotional intimacy rather than specific sexual goals, I suspect they'll both be a lot happier.

Exactly!

Don't know what's the matter with me...I seem to be missing a lot of humor in others' writing these days. Need to lighten up.

Do recall back the late '70's thru mid-'80's there was a big push within the feminist community that everybody was entitled to orgasms all the time. It seemed to me it was the latest "entitlement", so to speak -- which I didn't care for because it seemed to set a universal expectation that, clearly, had no basis in individual reality.

People are different. Pay attention when you're dating....and all along the way. Some women are sexually driven, some aren't. Men, too. I know it's easy enough for women to "fake it" but I wish they wouldn't. Over the decades I've been saddled with expectations and, I must admit, I've applied such expectations to some of my partners. I didn't like it and my partners didn't like it. I don't think anybody does. Duh!

The topic is interesting to me because my present SO is very nearly non-orgasmic. It doesn't matter. It's not a contest. We've made wonderful whoopee together exclusively -- including frequent mutual exhaustion -- for almost a decade.

In the OP's case, I don't think I'd get very excited about it after all the time gone by.

Don't know what's the matter with me...I seem to be missing a lot of humor in others' writing these days. Need to lighten up.

Do recall back the late '70's thru mid-'80's there was a big push within the feminist community that everybody was entitled to orgasms all the time. It seemed to me it was the latest "entitlement", so to speak -- which I didn't care for because it seemed to set a universal expectation that, clearly, had no basis in individual reality.

People are different. Pay attention when you're dating....and all along the way. Some women are sexually driven, some aren't. Men, too. I know it's easy enough for women to "fake it" but I wish they wouldn't. Over the decades I've been saddled with expectations and, I must admit, I've applied such expectations to some of my partners. I didn't like it and my partners didn't like it. I don't think anybody does. Duh!

The topic is interesting to me because my present SO is very nearly non-orgasmic. It doesn't matter. It's not a contest. We've made wonderful whoopee together exclusively -- including frequent mutual exhaustion -- for almost a decade.

In the OP's case, I don't think I'd get very excited about it after all the time gone by.

"Internal Server Error" notice, etc., and I'm not allowed to delete. Sorry.

I'm entitled to a orgasm EVERY time?!?

WTH-no one ever told me this! Thanks Asolo, going to give DH a serious talking to when he gets home.

-Cat

Doesn't everyone?

JK!

I sorta thought after SweebyÂs post this thing had run it course, just checked back on a whim. In general this seemed like a female dominated forum, and I am specifically interested in femaleÂs take on the thing, so I really do appreciate everyone thatÂs taken the time to respond, IÂve read it all very closely. A few specific thoughts

Foosacub I especially appreciated your response. Simple, to the point, blunt. Lot easier said than done but I perceive very on point. Thank you for taking the time. And I agree with you about Sweeby, and IÂd say the same about amy fiddler and Black tabby and Donna and a few others.

Others seem to bring their own baggage, their own bad experiences, and their need to feel superior, and thatÂs ok too. Whatever. IÂm a big boy.

And OF COURSE itÂs about validation, silly! What loving relationship is not? EXACTLY what IÂm saying. You give it, you get it. You need to rip me a new one on that, have at it!

Guess I just wonder why do you need so much validation after you've been together for so many years? It just seems like you are so focused on this one aspect of your sex life that it you may be unknowingly pressuring your wife.

I just couldn't deal with that kind of intense scrutiny of my sexual performance, response, whatever.

And while I can see that it really bothers you and for quite some time, after re-reading your posts I still can't understand why? It really does sounds like it's more about validation for you than pleasing your wife. Your posts are about how her lack of orgasm affects YOU.

It doesn't seem to bother her, right? I think you should just let it go, have sex because you both enjoy it and just not be so bothered by this. So what if she has it in her sleep, wish I could do that! I don't think there is any special meaning to that, beyond a nice dream.

Seriously I bet if you do not mention this to her, not for a week I mean, ever-just stop. You may be pleasantly surprised after a while. Either way you get lucky...I'm not sure you are understanding what this female dominated forum (sorry Asolo..) is trying to convey to you?

She must find you pleasing to be with to have stayed this long.

~Cat

So you noticed I'm not exactly 'sensitive,' huh?? :p

Talk about a whole other ball of wax....

Anywho, hope it was of some help. A lot of things are a whole lot easier said than done, especially when I'm waaaaay over here bangin' away on my keyboard and you're where ever you may be, trying to work on something important to you.