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It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Posted by deutsch100 (My Page) on
Wed, Oct 28, 09 at 14:56

I've been waiting almost 2 weeks for my Charlie's Powder Laundry Detergent to arrive...and I HATE it.

I followed the instructions (and member's advice) very closely. First load I did was with some small clean towels and rags, 2 scoops of Charlie's and I used very warm water. I was surprised to see TONS of suds. I did this 3x, and by the 3rd wash, there were very little suds during the wash and rinse cycles.

I've done 2 loads of laundry, and while my clothes feel clean (although have NO smell at all...I did know in advance though that Charlie's was zero scent), they do not feel soft, and some gym clothes do not smell fresh and laundered.

The MAIN REASON I HATE CHARLIE'S is that the beautiful Honeycomb, Stainless Steel drum of my NEW ($2000.00) Miele washing machine is dull, streaked and looks awful. I'm running a 2nd rinse and spin with distilled white vinegar, and I really hope this helps. I know it's purely aesthetics, but the Miele Honeycomb Stainless drum is actually beautiful & now it looks terrible! I haven't had my washer 2 months now, and I'm going to be so mad & sad if Charlie's "wonder, miracle" soap changed the finish of my Miele Stainless drum!!

Sorry for the rant, I'm just really upset!!


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

So sorry to hear about your drum of your new washer. I would be upset as well. If the vinegar does not do it I would call Miele or Charlie's to see if they can help. I also have a stainless drum but the Charlie's hasn't been an issue.
As for the softness it does take a month or so to fully remove the residue from other detergents on your clothes. Then the softness is wonderful!! Like you I'm trying to find a boost for the gym clothes. It seems to me that the new stay-dry materials out there are harder to clean.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Thanks ammo0810. Even after washing the same towels 3x in a row with Charlie's and nothing else...they did not feel soft, and I know it's just what I am used to...but they did not smell clean!

After 2 rinses with vinegar and hot water...the stainless is looking better. Not 100% yet, but I'm going to do a few more loads of laundry with German Persil Liquid or Arm & Hammer he Liquid and fabric softener and then another rinse with vinegar! Frustrating, and I feel I flushed $ down the drain with ordering Charlie's :(

Everytime I try a expensive or fancy detergent...I am disappointed. Yes, Persil is very $$ in the USA, but it lasts long and I like the almost all of Europe swears by it, as well as my beloved Germany!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Charlie's Soap does have a money-back guarantee, and they'd probably want to know about this problem.

I've copied the following from their website. Let us know how things turn out for you.

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"If you're not completely satisfied, Sutherland Products will, but not gladly, refund the buyer's purchase price."

send an email to taylor@charliesoap.com
or call Taylor at 800-854-3541.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Thanks cryptandrus. Nice...really like the we will, BUT NOT GLADLY, refund the buyer's purchase price. I think that sounds very arroagant and rude! I guess also, I am annoyed at anything Charlie's though. All companies hate refunding money, but at least they lie and say "gladly refund purchase price.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi Deutsch100
we seem to have a lot in common... I had Charlie's soap shipped to Italy from the US (crazy, I know, but...) and I was REALLY disappointed with it (actually stopped using it). The European P&G top quality detergent is Ariel (called Dash in Italy), and it usually gets the highest ratings in Which? magazine tests.
Have you tried the Miele Care Collection detergents yet?


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I quit using Charlie's after my washer had a white fuzzy coating that was never there before. Persil is still the best. I use Sears for some things. But would not go back to Charlies. I wouldn't even donate it to the animal shelter.
Just ordered my yearly Persil supply.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Chlorine and some other chemicals can attack stainless steel, and it doesn't have to be from bleach. Other cleaning agents release chlorine and similar chemicals when they work. Perhaps Charlie's "soap" is one of them.

BTW, there are many different types of stainless steel. Some are more stain-less than others. None are stain-free.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Deutsch100

Have the same complaint with Charlies.

The stainless looked great for a while, but after several
bags of Charles the shine was gone and a white dulling film appeared on the finish. After several loads with vinegar in the wash and rinse the stainless steel was restored to a nice shine.

I found the product aged clothing in appearance -especially cotton polo shirts and did not remove
staining from anti-perspirants.

I think the product is over priced and praised for the
results.

I also, find the Persil product line superior - at least
color Megaperls doesn't deteriorate/age garments in my opinion


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

*Thanks cryptandrus. Nice...really like the we will, BUT NOT GLADLY, refund the buyer's purchase price. I think that sounds very arroagant and rude! I guess also, I am annoyed at anything Charlie's though. All companies hate refunding money, but at least they lie and say "gladly refund purchase price.*

Sorry you didn't like the product, but the people from Charlie's Soap are anything BUT arrogant and rude. They are very friendly, helpful, and willing to look into any problem you are having with your laundry. The refund policy is meant to be tongue in cheek, meaning they will refund your money, but not gladly because obviously that means you were unhappy with their product. They have a great sense of humor that I guess is lost on some people.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

It's easy to descale the washer drum and door, if it gets buildup for whatever reason (I get it on mine, even though my clothes come out fine. This is with Sears detergent, not CS. I do plan to try CS in combination with STPP though). Miele's very expensive washer descaler just contains citric acid crystals, so after I tried that, I bought a 5 pound jar of food-grade citric acid from Amazon for a reasonable price. I've descaled it once with the stuff from Amazon, using 1/2 cup IIRC. Ran a Custom cycle on Sanitize temperature, with Extended option, and the machine came out shining.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Thanks everyone for all the input, and I am SO glad that I am not the only one who think Charlie's is overpriced nonsense...rudin1969, bonny doon, wayne98).

My several loads with Charlies made my clothes look dull, fuzzy and dry (we do not have hard water, had it tested when our Miele Dishwasher was installed 2 years ago).

Rudin1969, yes I have tried the entire line of Miele Care (for washers and dishwashers). While it is not bad, Persil is much, much better. Smelled better, removed stains and odors better and my clothes looked better with Persil. I'd take Miele care any day over Charlies though!!

My Stainless finally looks almost back to normal. 2 loads with Persil and Fabric softener and 2 cycles with white distilled vinegar.

Yes, in a perfect world we'd all use some "natural" product like Charlie's with no bad chemicals or fragrance. With all the chemicals we breathe from Diesel, Gas, jet fuel, the chemical sunscreens we slather ourselves with daily, the hairsprays and colognes we all use....I think using a nicely scented laundry soap and fabric softener is totally ok. I do not want my clothes smelling blah and feeling crispy...and I don't want my Miele washer all white and dull on the inside!!

Persil Color Gel for darks and colours and Persil Universal Gel for whites. Downy, Snuggle or Purex fabric Softener. Btw, Purex is made by Henkel...the makers of Persil. Purex FS is SO cheap in the USA, and smells great, and it's not as thick and coating as Downy!!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Did you read the last post on the A&H thread? I told you when you did the "cleaning" with the CS you will (or I did) have TONS of suds. I couldn't believe it. My tub dulled also but it later came back after using some Tide and also some bleach. You might run some Oxi with a load and that might help. It does take a while to get the clothes(and yourself) used to CS. BUT for myself, Tide powder cleans better than CS and I am sure the Persil does.
Give the CS to a neighbor or donate it to an animal clinic, etc.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hey sparky823...yes, I read your post about the high suds the first time doing the "cleaning" with Charlie's. It was insane how much suds there was. I think some of it was due to the fact that they want you to use 2 scoops and some rags. Normally you use 1 scoop of Charlie's and a full load of laundry. So while some detergents may leave some soap residue, I think part of this "pony show" that Charlie's has new users do is rubbish.

While Tide he Powder is not one of my favourites (although I love and hate the smell at the same time:), I'd use Tide he Powder any day over Charlies.

Honestly, I feel Charlie's is a "down home goodness" version of the super expensive NYC The Laundress. Great website, shining testimonials, and hook, line and sinker.

For now at least, I will stick with my ever faitful Persil liquid and nice, scented Fabric softener (and sometimes even dryer sheets too). I'm sure that made the people at Charlie's just squirm in their seats :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Although you experience with Charlie's was not what you expected it still is a great detergent for some and does work. I believe that more natural detergents may take a little more time or pre-treating to stack up against the mainstream chemical laden detergents. But for me it's worth it.
I don't think they are putting on a "pony show" as you called it. Detergent success has a lot to do with your water quality and machine and as we know that can vary a lot by where you live and how the water is treated by your local water quality facility. I'm sorry you had a poor experience with Charlie's and am glad you have a detergent you are happy with but Charlie's is not the devil. Just a detergent that didn't work like you hoped it would.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I too am not impressed with Charlies. I have soft water, the water company confirmed it and I also tested it myself. It left my clothes dingy, dirty, and the underarms still smelled. I find the Sears detergent much better.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I use Charlies because it DOESN'T have a scent - not because I don't like it, but because as I walk around in the world I don't want to send the allergic people running for cover. I know a teenager who can't go to school because of so much scent from clothes, deoderant, hair spray, shampoo, tobacco etc. She can only come to church if we set aside an area for those people willing to meet her needs. Scent is nothing but scent. It doesn't indicate that something is clean. You do miss out on that "pull the warm towels out of the dryer and sniff them" thing, but I think that is a small price to pay for making the world a safer place. We put so much crap into our water system that will eventually come back to as drinking water - why add fragrance that essentially does nothing?


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Devorah...it's not just that I didn't like that Charlie's did not have a scent, it's that it jacked the finish of my new Miele washer, and that (like elbits said) my clothes were dingy, not clean and underarms in shirts did NOT smell that they were even laundered.

Unscented is fine, but Charlie's does NOT work. Overhyped rubbish. But, just my opinion :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hey again devorah! Me again :) In regards to the teenager that cannot go to school due to scents, that is tragic and sad....but we must admit, this is very, very rare. I have an amazingly keen sense of smell, but I do not ever remember being able to smell someone's laundry detergent. Perfume, hairspray and deodorant for sure though! Scented laundry detergent (which many manufacturers have naturally scented) is honestly the very least of our water supplies.

I'm honestly happy that Charlie's works for some, but I am also happy to see it is just not me, that really dislikes it. Actually I hate it!

Oh, the Stainless Honeycomb drum in my new Miele W4840 washer is now 100% back to normal. Many loads with persil and then vinegar rinses, has removed whatever coating and discolouring Charlie's did to the drum. I am very relieved and happy. Love, love, love Persil!!!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I have smelled people's detergents in their clothes before. I have a friend/neighbor that uses Gain det. and Gain dryer sheets and HONESTLY it is like a fog around her the smell is so strong.

I also worked with a guy that his wife used April scent Downy and that was all you could smell when you were around him. They must be immune to the smell??


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Deutsch100,

do you have hard water? Hard water and soap usually form a white, sticky residue. I don't know what it is called in English, but if I translate it would be something like lime-soap. It's a natural by-product of soap dissolved in hard water. I see this very often when I'm at my girlfriend's house: they have hard water and when I use a bar of soap to wash my hands, there is always a white residue left behind in the sink. Like powder. It does not happen when I use liquid soap, though. It because, I think, liquid soap does not contain soap as such but mainly surfactants - like regular laundry detergent. If you do speak German: I have linked the explanation of this "lime-soap" at the bottom of the post.

Mechanical scrubbing and/or acid get rid of the white/dull residue.

It's so crazy how expensive Persil is in the U.S.! It's almost cheaper to have it send by mail from Germany. A regular box of Persil sells for around $8 over here.

Greetings from Deutschland!

Here is a link that might be useful: Kalkseife on German Wikipedia


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Danke whirpool trainee! Nein, wir haben kein hartes Wasser hier. Vor 2 Jahren wurde unser Wasser getestet, weil wir eine neue Miele Geschirrsplmaschine kauften (Mieles brauchen Salz, und der Techniker mte die Wasserhrte wissen).

Der Rckstand ist jetzt schon weg. 2-3x mit Essig, und Persil. Wieder danke!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

deutsch100, how can you be so sure that you've never smelled someone's laundry detergent? I trust you don't have a mental catalog of every detergent scent on the market :-) You might have smelled detergent, and thought it was perfume or hairspray or deodorant.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I think using fabric softener is half the cleaning and stinking problem. That stuff is hard to rinse out and clogs my machine. I believe it takes many washings to get out all the fab softener. I don't understand why everyone doesn't use white vinegar instead. A good powder detergent will leave you cloths soft enough.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

$8 for Persil. When you say $8, is that for the huge box? Please don't tell me that, I may have to relocate. LOL Tell me where I can buy it online from Germany, please? I love the Persil. I don't think of it as expensive because I don't have to use any other cleaning agent or even chlorine bleach. Just some vinegar in the rinse, which I've always done.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Ha ha, CS did not work for us either.
Now 8 dollar Persil? Can we all pitch in and get a truckload ?
I want some cheap Persil too!!!!!!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

On the stainless tub in the F&P Aquasmart, the Biokleen premium left a thick, white coating (as well as building up in the clothes). A cleaning cycle with Lemishine fixed that. I used mexican Ariel for a while and it was ok, but still left a slight dull film. I did another cleaning cycle with part Ariel part Lemishine and it brought back the original shine.

Since then, I've been using the Arm & Hammer powder and whatever they've put in that stuff leaves absolutely no film. Pretty impressive for 20 grains hardness water.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi Deutsch 100
are you familiar with Le Blanc detergents?

Here is a link that might be useful: Le Blanc


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi rudin1969. I have not tried LeBlanc detergents. It looks somewhat like The Laundress, which honestly kind of scares me. Pretty packaging, great website, organic ingredients and the idea of being exclusive...and that's it. After trying SO many detergents, I have not tried anything that cleans better than Persil Color Gel & Persil Universal Gel. I do like Tide he Powder, but the residue left in the wash drum is horrible...so I will never use again :(

I do like Ariel in Germany. The Ariel that's available in the USA, is the Mexican version...and I do not like it. Too strongly scented, and way, way too much sudsing. I found out that Mexicans love suds in their wash (Foca, Roma, Viva and Mexican Ariel).


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

thanks Deutsch 100. Let me know if you'd like to use European Ariel again. I'd be more than happy to send you a couple of boxes from Italy :). And yes, I've ordered some Le Blanc detergent -- will keep you posted :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Wow, Thanks a lot rudin1969!!! As much as I would love, love to have some European Ariel, it's been my past experience that the shipping charges from Europe are like 3-4x more than the product I'm receiving :( :(

I am curious to see how you like LeBlanc. Maybe you've found a treasure. In the meantime I will continue paying crazy amounts for Persil, and dreaming of the Ariel and cheap Persil you Euros get to enjoy!!

Not fair, the stuff we get in the USA is so inferior. Tide vs. Persil. Mercedes vs. Chevrolet. Miele vs. Whirpool. :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

deutsch100,

I don't think Charlie's is the be all and end all but I do use it for certain types of loads and like the way it cleans and smells. What you may have been experiencing with all the suds on the first 3 initial washes was the locked in suds in the towels from the detergent you were using before. It is amazing how much suds can get locked into fabric after repeated washings. The dullness of you interior finish could have been caused from all the residue the Charlie's got out of your towels. It would have probably went away with repeated Charlie's washings. You mentioned using fabric softener. FS is notorious for causing excessive build up not only in clothes but on the insides of washers. It's possible that the Charlie's brought out the hidden residue in the nooks and crannies of your washer. There is no ingredient in Charlie'S that will harm stainless steel. Call Charlie's and talk to Taylor, despite their blurb on their bag, they are very friendly and very helpful. They have sent me replacement bags for seeming minor problems. Also, the liquid works better for many people.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

With regards to the smell or non smell of Charlie's, It doesn't have no smell. Cheer Free and Tide Free have no smell. I find that Charlie's has the smell of clothes that have been hung out in the sun to dry. I has a very fresh, clean smell that is very subtle. I like Charlie's the best for sheets, t-shirts and towels.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi sshrivastava
if I recall correctly, you've mentioned using Le Blanc detergents. Did you like them?
Sorry to hijack this thread :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi sshrivastava
if I recall correctly, you've mentioned using Le Blanc detergents. Did you like them? Sorry to hijack this thread :)

Hi Rudin1969,

My friend sent me a small bottle of Le Blanc Linen Wash as a gift and I loved it. Based on that experience, I purchased several other Le Blanc products - Towel Wash, Laundry Wash, and Silk Wash. I am disappointed in the other products. While the Towel Wash does leave towels clean and soft, it also leaves them with an extremely strong perfume smell even after 7 rinses in my Asko on high water level. This is using only 1 TBS of the Towel wash when the recommended dose on the bottle is 1/4 cup! The products seem to clean well enough, but I would only recommend them to someone who doesn't mind their clothes smelling of perfume. It's not even a clean, lightly scented smell like Persil. Your clothes come out smelling like you sprayed perfume on them. I walked into my bathroom the other day and was wondering what that smell was when I realized it was the towels acting as air fresheners. Too heavy for me.

I am with Deutsch100 regarding Charlie's Soap and most detergents that I've tried. I was a happy CS user for a while but noticed a funky, musty odor creeping into all of my clothes especially sweatpants, sweatshirts, etc. It doesn't clean as well as most claim. What's funny is that folks say you need to use CS for a month or so, or go through your first bag before you start noticing improvements. Is that because it takes you that long to form a new habit and also for your brain to con itself into thinking that what it's looking at is "clean"? Seriously, it happened to me. After a while I thought this is how clean clothes look until I pulled out my old box of Persil and did a load just for kicks after reading this thread. Funky musty smell is gone, clothes appear cleaner and are soft coming out of the dryer without any mysterious "residue".

Everyone has different experiences and if a specific product works for you then I think that's great. I'm of the opinion that a laundry detergent should remove a stain on the first wash, not take several washes. CS would fade stains, but not remove them entirely, and it would take several washes to achieve this result. I used Bi-O-Kleen Premium Powder for a while and was happy with that, but I also experienced the "funky" clothes smell and thought I had a mold problem. The Bi-O-KLEEN without a doubt does clean better than CS. I live in Arizona where the air is very dry, I leave the door ajar, and I never had odor issues when using Persil or Tide. I put my Asko through regular cleaning cycles at 205F using dishwasher detergent. I have a whole house water softener as well, so the CS dysfunction is not due to hard water. I believe CS was originally designed to clean fabrics for textile companies, and that is the same formula we are buying but in smaller packages. When you think about it, there are no stains on fabrics before they are made into clothes. You need very gentle cleaning for those types of fabrics. Home laundering has different needs and requirements than textile companies. While this is just speculation on my part, it makes sense.

Several years ago I posted in this forum about how Tide cleans just as well as Persil for far less cost. I even did a cleaning comparison and posted photos. I had a lot of time on my hands back then! :) I'm much picker about my detergents today, and having gone through so many I'm much more aware of my likes and dislikes. I was also a regular FS user back then, but not today. Contradicting what I said three years ago, I believe Persil is probably the best option for people who want a product that cleans well, doesn't leave an objectionable scent or leave your clothes smelling "funky", and rinses cleanly so you get soft and fluffy clothes out of the dryer without the need for FS. One of the more ludicrous claims made by CS, I must admit, is that it takes several washings - up to a month's worth - before all of the "residue" from your previous detergents is removed. This claim is so illogical. If there was so much buildup in your clothing that it would take multiple washings to remove this buildup, your clothes would be stiff as a board and unwearable. I'm still trying to understand this one. I admit that I don't completely understand the chemistry and processes involved, but it's counter intuitive.

I ordered two 54 load boxes of Persil last night - Megaperls and Megaperls Color. I still have some leftover Persil from (believe it or not) 6 years ago which I will use up before my new shipment arrives. It was the box that came with my Asko. I suppose that's proof for how much experimenting I've been doing with laundry products. I can't wait to once again have clean, fresh smelling clothes.

Cheers!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi Sshrivastava
many many thanks for your most informative reply!!
I've never been a Persil (called Dixan in Italy) user, as in Italy people are either pro- 'Ariel' (called Dash in Italy) camp or pro- Persil :), and my family has traditionally been faithful to Ariel....


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Yay Sshrivastava...back to Persil!!!

The Megaperls are pretty great. I've tried Megaperls Color, and it is very, very gently. So great for color retention...not very good at underarm odors (especially from gym, or sport clothing). The Persil Color Gel is amazing at odors, even underarm funk. The old, original Persil Universal Powder, I find is equally good for whites, but I always buy Persil Universal Gel. My family in Germany, also does not like Megaperls Color, but loves the color gel/liquid. If I can find it, there was a comparison against the Megaperls and the Gel...and the Gel won hands down (for the color, that is). Report ist auf Deutsch, Kannst du Deutsch? :)

I am EXACTLY like you...I have tried almost every laundry detergent I can get my hands on, and I ALWAYS return to Persil (although I really love the Gel/Liquid opposed to the powder).

Fabric Softener is not as evil as so many believe. Try mixing you favourite FS with equal amounts of white, distilled vinegar (my alltime fav is April Fresh Downy). You get the benefits of both, and there is NO buildup in the machine or clothes. It's been a win-win for me.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I'll report back when I've had a chance to use both Megaperls products. I'm going to write a letter to Le Blanc to let them know how disappointed I am with their products. I will do the same with Charlie's Soap, although I'm more upset with Le Blanc for putting so much perfume into their product. You would faint if you smelled my towels, which are being washed in Persil right now to bring them back to normal! :)


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$$$ Persil $$$

Okay, so I just did some online research on Persil.

Best offer USA: Amazon.com sells a Jumbo-Pack Persil Universal Powder for $62.99 / 80 wash loads. That's 78 Cents per load. The smaller boxes/sizes seemed to be more expensive.

German offer from a regular drugstore: A pouch of Persil Megapearls for $6 / 18 wash loads. That's 32 Cents per load. Interestingly, the bigger boxes were more expensive. *?!*

That being said, I actually use German Ariel detergent all the time and Lenor softener, both of which are P&G products. I also stopped using liquid detergent - not because I think it clogs up my washer, no - but because they never did well on "Stiftung Warentest" (our consumer magazine).

Deutsch100, I can send you a copy of the detergent test if you like. Just send me an e-mail via my profile (can't upload it here because of copyright etc.).

Alex

Here is a link that might be useful: Persil Jumbo Pack Laundry Detergent


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Deutsch100, I agree with you almost 100%. It didn't clean well and remove odors well. and who wants to wear stinky clothes long enough to wash them for several washings?


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

As someone who now owns a Meile washer and uses Charlie's Soap, I have been reading this thread with great interest. I have been using CS in my Meile since I first got it last year and I have never had the problems that the OP (deutsch100) had. If anything, it has kept the inside of my drum sparkling clean. I don't understand why the OP refuses to call CS over the problem. If I had that problem with a detergent, I would have been on the phone with the manufacturer as soon as possible to find out what went wrong.

Deutsch100, don't get mad at me but I think you have been a little over sensitive to Eligan's response to your comments. You should have expected such responses from people on here that use and like CS especially when you use such a strong term as "Hate"! I didn't see Eligan's posts as an "Attack" against you.

lola3816


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I am so sorry you have had probs with the Charlie's. I normally use Charlie's, but I too have had occasional problems using it and have had to use other detergents in my laundry.

People at Charlie's have tried to help me and have been very nice, but there are just some issues that can not be over come. It's not their fault. It's not the detergents fault. It just is what it is. I still love Charlie's and it still does great for many things here, but if it didn't work for you I'm not gonna beat ya up over it even if it worked perfect for me or someone else.

I have always been of a mind that people should use what makes them happy, what works for them is what they should use. If the Persil works for you babe then by all means you should use it.

It does make you realize though that we, here in the US, are getting screwed a little bit. You look at detergents in the UK and across Europe and they have all these low suds choices for high efficiency washers to chose from and we hardly have any. Maybe it's time for a little detergent revolt here in the US. LOL!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hey Lola3816... Deutsch100 was responding to another poster on here who insulted her -- basically told her to move if she doesn't like America. That's the post she is referring to regarding being "attacked." That post has since been removed by the moderators, which may be causing confusion as to whom she was referring to. I just wanted to clear that up!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

In posts here and in a whole thread about Arm & Hammer detergent that have since been removed for some reason, deutsch did name Eligan as one of the poster's attacking her/him.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Sorry you have had problems with Charlie's. I have used it exclusively in my Kenmore Elite HE5t with a stainless drum since we purchased it in November 2008. It is as beautiful as the day we bought it.

In fact, we just had a drain problem. (I washed fuzzy dog toys that fell apart in the washer.) The drain was also spotless, except for the fuzz. But all the plastic parts were super clean.

Have you contacted Charlie's Soap? Even if you don't keep the product, they have excellent customer service.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

My 2 cents on all of this...

I purchased Charlie's Soap in the past and I am still using it but not on all of my clothes. It works fine for some of my more lightly worn clothing and for the darks, towels and bed linens. I do not like it for my whites or my gym/hiking clothes. It just does not do the job on them with removing ground in dirt. I figure that is the trade off with a more "natural" style detergent. I have had the same issues when I tried homemade laundry soap and others like Planet and Seventh Generation. It is what it is.....

Will I buy Charlie's again? I don't know, maybe? But I am not too picky about my detergents. I usually buy what is on sale and I use bleach in my white loads to keep my clothes from going dingy. I hang my laundry year round and in the summer I am sure to hang those whites in the sunshine to keep them as bright as can be. I pre treat stains and I do what I can. I just think that these days detergents don't work as well as they used to since they were reformulated.

After even being somewhat disappointed by Tide and all the name brands as they are not as effective as they once were, I have resolved to use whatever I find on sale. Some brands do a little better than others but not enough to pay extreme costs to ship detergent from Europe (I lived in France for a decade and remember Skip, Ariel and others). The main issue I have with Charlie's is that it doesn't remove odors from gym clothing or even perfume that was sprayed on the clothes. This is in addition to using vinegar. However, your mileage may vary. I live in a very soft water area.

So I alternate with what is on sale. Right now in my laundry cupboard there are 12 boxes/bottles of detergent ranging from Sun, Costco brand, Arm & Hammer, Gain, Tide & Charlies. I have plenty stockpiled from mixing coupons with sales. I don't find Charlie's any better or much worse than anything else.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

THANK YOU PERSIL!

After washing only a few loads, I'm noticing my clothes coming out cleaner, brighter, softer, and fresh smelling - not perfumy or musty. I am getting very good results from both Persil Megaperls and Persil Color Megaperls. Washing my colors w/ Color Megaperls at 120F gets out faded stains that Charlie's Soap (CS) wouldn't touch. My whites came out blindingly white after using regular Megaperls at 160F. I thought my whites were coming out just fine with CS, but it's like I found a whole new brighter shade of white this week!

One of the reasons why Persil is better at stains than CS may be the presence of enzymes in both Megaperls products. There are no enzymes in CS. My understanding is that enzymes are necessary for removal of protein-based stains, are active up to 140F, and are an important part of "profile washing". I don't know if Miele washers work this way, but my Asko spends the majority of its wash cycle in the temperature zone where enzymes can do their best work. I also have a whole house water softener.

The other interesting item worth mentioning is that my clothes feel soft and fluffy coming out of the dryer - more so than with Charlie's. This part may be in my head, but I'm not noticing any of that elusive and mysterious "buildup" that is mentioned by Charlie's Soap and even my Asko manual. I think the whole detergent buildup issue has its roots in the poor rinsing ability of top loaders. I noticed a lot of suds from the detergent buildup in my clothes after switching to a front loader after using a top loader in my apartment complex for a few years. However, since then, I haven't had any detergent buildup issues in my front loader.

Find what works for you and stick with it. A few years ago I was denouncing Persil for being an expensive "bourgeois" detergent, but now it's the only one that gives me the perfect cleaning, rinsing, and scent. I've tried HE versions of Tide, Tide Coldwater, Cheer,, Wisk, All, Charlie's Soap, Bi-O-Kleen Premium Powder, Country Save, Le Blanc/L'Amour, Ecover, and possibly more. I've settled on Persil as my perfect, albeit expensive product.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I think the detergent build up comes from just using too much detergent. The traditional detergent companies have been instructing customers to use way more detergent than is necessary. The soap never gets fully rinced out and then it is put through another wash cycle without getting completely rinsed out and bam, you have build up. I first noticed this when I got a hot tub and was told to double rinse any swim suits before using them in the hot tube so they don't transfer excess soap into the water. I added an extra rinse to the suits and there was still tons of suds. I was on the 6th rinse and there was still suds. After I finally got all the suds out, I cut my detergent use down and 2 rinses in my then top loader got all the suds out. A washer repairman told me to cut the detergent recommendations in half from what they tell you to use.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

lola3816 I agree! I have a top loading machine but I even cut down the amount of detergent on my wash loads and it makes a huge difference, especially since I hang dry my laundry. Any residue left in my clothing and they would be stiff as a board. I only do full loads of clothing and I never use the amount they recommend in my wash. I typically cut it in half (which brings it down to the amount for a medium load) and all of my clothing comes out clean. I only have one rinse cycle on my washing machine and so cutting it in half I only need just one rinse on my machine. Of course I am sure this is different when you have a front loading machine (which I hope to have one day, but will not replace our washer until it NEEDS replacing)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

But CS claims you have buildup on clothes washed in your front loader using other detergents, and that it takes up to a month of washing in CS - or an entire bag - before that mysterious residue comes out. That seems suspect to me, since most folks using front loaders use less detergent. If residue can be removed with a few extra rinses, why does CS claim it takes multiple washings?

It's funny how detergent manufacturers always make a claim that forces you to use a lot of detergent just to see if that claim is true. It always seems to work to their advantage. What I CAN say is that Persil rinses cleanly and does not appear to cause any buildup. I use 1 TBS for most loads, but have used up to 4 TBS as an experiment and had no rinsing issues. I have an ASKO with five standard rinses, though, so those of you with only two rinses may have issues with higher doses.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

See that's another excellent point you all have brought up. It's not just a sudsing factor with detergents that a person has to worry about, the rinsability factor plays a huge role too. I have noticed some brands hardly suds at all but are a complete pain in the buttoot to rinse out anyway.

It still leads me to the conclusion that we in the US have gotten at least slightly forgotten about in the detergent market. I think I am going to write a letter to Dial/Henkel today and beg them to bring Persil to the US too where the cost would come down. Maybe some of you here could do the same. Usually if there is a demand they will make a supply. Just a thought. Couldn't hurt.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Does CS say it takes a month to get rid of build up in the washer? I thought they just say to run the first load with 2 tbs and some old rags. They don't say to do that for a month. I do think that detergents like Tide and Cheer are harder to rinse out no matter how much you use. If Charlie's was saying to use a half a cup with each load to get rid of build up, then it would be suspect but they are only saying to use a TBS and even only a half TBS for front loaders no matter what size the load. So I don't see that as trying to get people to use more. It's not like the shampoo companies that say "lather, rinse repeat" or the laundry detergent companies like Tide that have you use way too much according to their scoops and lids. I guess CS is say it "may" take up to a month to remove build up from clothes depending on how much build up you have. So they are saying don't judge your results on only one or 2 washes.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I had to pound my eyeballs back into my head after reading the Nov 1 post by sshrivastava! I remember well the Tide experiment and post. Oh well prodical child, welcome back to Persil.

Unfortunately I switched to Sears detergent for the past year and found that it may save you money but leaves me much disappointed in the final result and I will be going back to Persil and STPP very soon. It was so much better and I soon regretted buying two huge buckets of the Sears detergent. Glad its almost all gone.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Lola3816,

You are correct. You are only suppose to use 2 tbsp to clean out the machine before you start laundering clothes in Charlie's. The only time they recommend using 2 tbsp washing clothes is if you have really hard water. The average person can use anywhere from 1 tbsp to 1/2 tbsp per load.

They do recommend for the first few washes of all your clothes that you use 1 tbsp per load to remove old detergents and fab softeners. After that if you still see a lot of suds then they tell you to cut back.

The month thing came into play as some of us found out it can take a month to remove the build up from our laundry. I was one of those people. I have hard water ranging between 8 and 10 grains. Not super hard but enough to cause a prob. Combinging that with old detergent and fab softener residues, it took a month before my clothes softened up and began to smell better.

The only reason why I am not exclusively using Charlie's now is I am caring for my mom. She has had two strokes, and heart attack and now has cancer. Her skin is real sensitive to touch and if her clothes are not super soft it actually causes her a great deal of discomfort. Due to this I have had to go back to using conventional detergent which will still clean when you use fab softener. Also, I do not have time to soak a lot of garments if they get really bad like I use to. So having something that blasts the dirt off right away kinda helps too, but I do miss using my Charlie's on everything.

Heidi


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

hi fordtech,
I have to say, all this Persil love has made me reconsider trying it. Does anybody know if they offer any kind of money-back guarantee? My husband has had allergic reactions to some scented laundry detergents, and I'd really hate to get stuck with a (very expensive) box of something I can't use.

ps Since Persil already has phosphate in it, there's really no reason to add STPP, it's just another phosphate.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

fordtech, are you using Sears alone, or with STPP? Persil plus STPP vs. Sears alone wouldn't be a fair comparison.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

No I dont consider it to be a fair comparison one on one, but I shouldnt have to feel like my towels are sand paper either. I was only using a tablespoon of STPP per load so wasnt a major boost I would think, just a little helper. My main reason to want to go back to persil is the scent. I just miss it over the bland scent of the sears brand. If you are ultra sensitive to scented detergent I wouldnt recommed Persil anyway.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Cryptandrus, I dont want to leave with the impression that I feel there is no other good detergents than Persil. Im sure you will find other satisfactory brands. It is VERY expensive compared to most other brands and if you are on a tight budget I would use anything that gets the job done to your satisfaction withing your budget. Im just spoiled to the Persil aroma... LOL And I get good results with my 2 to 1 blend with STPP. We dont do that many loads of laundry here anymore to be so confined to budget on the detergent. If the economy turns bad I might be using grannys lie soap one day... HEH!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

cryptandrus, Persil does not have phosphates. Phosphates are not listed as part of any ingredient, and the ingredients are disclosed right on the package. Persil does contain zeolytes, however, which take the place of phosphates.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

sshrivastava, my last box of Persil Megaperls had Phosphanates listed on box. Isn't that Phosphates?


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Everone here who likes Persil talks about the great smell. When I tried Persil, I liked the smell but when the clothes came out of the dryer, there was no smell to them at all. All that Persil smell, that you smell when opening the box and pouring in the machine is gone by the time the clothes come out of the dryer. I actually prefer the smell of Chariles/Sport Wash clothes when they come out of the dryer then the way Persil clothes smell out of the dryer.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

fordtech, would you be willing to try a load of towels with Sears and STPP, and tell us how the results compare? Say, half a Sears scoop of STPP?


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Persil does have phosphates

here's the ingredients list, downloaded from the Henkel website:

Persil Universal-Megaperls
Ingredients declaration according to Detergent Regulation ((EC) No 648/2004)
ZEOLITE
SODIUM CARBONATE PEROXIDE
SODIUM DODECYLBENZENESULFONATE
TAED
AQUA (WATER)
SODIUM LAURYL SULFATE
SODIUM CARBONATE
SODIUM SULFATE
SODIUM CITRATE
2-PROPYLHEPTAN-1-OL, 7EO
SODIUM ACRYLIC ACID/MA COPOLYMER
SULFONATED POLYETHYLENE TEREPHTHALATE
CELLULOSE GUM
PEG-80
ZEA MAYS (CORN) STARCH
ALCOHOLS, C16-18, 7EO
TETRASODIUM ETIDRONATE
SODIUM SOAP C16-18
SODIUM BICARBONATE
PERFUME
CORN FLOUR
HEPTASODIUM DTPMP
PARAFFIN
SODIUM CHLORIDE
C12-18 FATTY ALCOHOL 5 EO
SODIUM HYDROXIDE
OPTICAL BRIGHTNER
SODIUM GLYCOLATE
PEG-14M
COLORANT
HYDRATED SILICA
PROTEASE
HEXYL CINNAMAL
LINALOOL
BENZYL SALICYLATE
LIPASE
AMYLASE
MANNANASE
CELLULASE

You're absolutely right that Persil does, in fact, contain Zeolites, but it also has phosphate ingredients too, including:
--
TETRASODIUM ETIDRONATE Synonyms: Tetrasodium (1-hydroxyethylidene) bisphosphonate

Description
Tetrasodium etidronate and the related disodium etidronate are chelating agents and sequestering agents that attach to metal ions to keep them from reacting with other compounds in a mixture, and to prevent them from precipitating out of solution as insoluble scums.

Uses
Tetrasodium etidronate is used as a water softener in soaps to prevent soap scums and bathtub rings by locking up the calcium and magnesium in the water.

Compounds with similar functions are sodium carbonate, sodium edta, sodium citrate, phosphoric acid, and tetrasodium pyrophosphate.

---
HEPTASODIUM DTPMP is also a phosphonate
Hepta sodium salt of DTMP = Diethylene Triamine Penta (Methylene Phosphonic Acid)

used as stabilizer for peroxide bleaching and detergent additive

---


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

The link below is the first hit from a Google search for "phosphate vs phosphate", without the quotes. See the section "Phosphonates as fertilizers". Basically, they don't make good fertilizers for grass. So they probably also don't fertilize algae in waterways, and thus aren't a threat to the ecosystem.

Here is a link that might be useful: Understanding the Phosphonate Products


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

hi, suburnanmd, Your article states that phosphonates don't make good fertilizers for grass because

"Over time, phosphonate fertilizer can be converted by bacteria to phosphate in soil, where it can be taken up and metabolized by plants. This conversion can take several weeks and is not thought to be a very efficient means of phosphorus delivery to plants when compared with phosphate fertilizers."

I think your article means to say that phosphonates aren't as *efficient* or cost-effective as phosphates when they're used as crop fertilizers.
---
excerpt from an article titled "Researchers Study Roundup as Possible Cause of Harmful Algal Blooms":

"It turns out that many cyanobacteria present in Lake Erie have the genes allowing the uptake of phosphonates, and these cyanobacteria can grow using glyphosate and other phosphonates as a sole source of phosphorus," Bullerjahn says.

April 27, 2009 article listed by Stacy Brannan
Associate Editor, Ohio Sea Grant and Stone Laboratory 1314 Kinnear Road Columbus, OH 43212
614.292.8949 brannan.16@osu.edu

cyanobacteria is another name for blue-green algae

---
anyway, I was just responding to a comment made about adding STPP to Persil. I think that would be unnecessary since Persil already contains a phosphate ingredient that does the same thing as STPP, which is a phosphate additive

Here is a link that might be useful: the Great Lakes Information Network (GLIN)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

It doesn't contain phosphates, it contains phosphonates :-)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

suburbanmd, I would but I dont have any STPP. That was actually the reason I quit using Persil to begin with was that I couldnt get any reasonably priced STPP. So I purchased two huge buckets of the Sears detergent because it was on clearance so I figured I would give it a shot. Soon afterward I located a reasonably priced source of the STPP but never got any because I wanted to see how Sears held on its own and I wanted to keep it dirt cheap rather than blend with much more expensive STPP. (much more expensive than the detergent was)

I seriously doubt one or even a few loads would fix this stiff towel problem though. Even when I switch back to Persil and STPP it will be likely over a month before it gets back to normal.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Well supposedly Charlie's is suppose to be coming out with their own water softener to go with their detergent next year. I'm gonna get some and try it out. I found a brief snipit of it on their feedback pages. I think it's on page 3 or 4, but I know they mention it somewhere in the beginning.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

My bad, it says "phosphonates" right on the box! That's what happens when I try to multitask. I just did a quick google search on phosphate vs. phosphonate and discovered that phosphates have an extra oxygen molecule lacking in phosphonates. This tiny difference means that phosphonates do not contribute to ATP production in plants, therefore will not have any impact on algal blooms or plant metabolism. Phosphonates are also used as fungicides, which could have a beneficial effect on limiting mold and mildew in washing machines.

It would appear that phosphonates are tolerated much better by the environment than phosphates.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Wow! What a thread. I just now got around to finding it. I actually tried to send a few of you emails, but Gardenweb is being a pain. Bottom line. We do have a money back guarantee. Yes, we say "will, but not gladly", but that's basically because we hate lying. When companies say they will gladly refund, they're not being truthful, and if they start there, where's the end. We just chose not to start.

Anyway, in some situations, people can have a bit of transition problems as other detergents come out of their clothes. I've not seen dulling of any metals other than aluminum. That's why it's sold to metal shops for punching metals and to auto shops for tool and part cleaning to keep them shiny. Sounds like something else might have been at play with the dulling of the drum, but it's hard to say for certain.

Deutch100, if you're out there, give us a call. I promise not to berate you, but actually help either you, your machine, or your wallet. :)


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi Taylor,

I think it's great that you offer a non-toxic, environmentally friendly alternative to the big box detergent manufacturers. Your product should be great for people with chemical sensitivities, allergies to scents and dyes, etc. However, I think perhaps people are taking your 1 tablespoon dosing recommendation too literally. This is something I'm hoping you can clear up for us, or in the other Charlie's thread. How can you recommend that 1 tablespoon is enough when people have differing water conditions, load sizes, water amounts, etc.? I think people should use their own common sense, obviously.

For instance, using 1 TBS of CS in my Asko got me funky smelling clothes if washed at 120F or less. I have a whole house water softener, so there would be no hardness to inhibit the detergent's effectiveness. Using 1 TBS of Persil in my Asko helped a little, but it wasn't until I switched to the Miele XL front loader and tripled my detergent dose that the odor issues disappeared and my clothes started coming out brighter and cleaner.

Can you clear up any confusions about your product? I'm sure we would all appreciate it.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I too have to agree with Deutsch...I have tried Charlie's numerous times in my Miele, and I basically hate it as well. Even after religiously using Charlie's and nothing else, my clothes, towels and sheets never had that "Nirvana softness" that Charlie users gush about. All my washed and dried items while on Charlie's soap were dry, rough, and not fresh smelling!

Underarm smells (exercise clothes) were still there, basic stains and spots were not removed and I know that some people like or must not have fragrance, but Charlie's made my clothes never smell or feel clean after using it. I too trashed my Charlie's. I think it's great that someone from the company is trying to contact unhappy users though. Uhhh, please don't email me though. Sorry, Charlie's will never please me!! :) You will have to pull my Persil out of my cold, dead hands before I tried Charlie's again!!!


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

For those who do not like their current choice of detergents, please consider donating your detergent to a local charity - animal shelters, battered women's shelters, homeless shelters, etc. They will gladly take your detergent, although maybe if you give them a bucket of CS they might give it back if they get too many complaints! Ha, I'm just kidding.

If clothes are coming out rough and stinky, they are obviously not getting clean.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Good question sshrivastava. The one tablespoon was based on original tests done with our Liquid Laundry, in Mayodan, NC water on a Maytag extra capacity TL. We came out with the Laundry Liquid back in the 80s. Without knowing better, we suggested 1/4 cup per load. We watched the market, and after a few years (we were really slow back then) we found that people were having really good experiences with 1/8 cup (1 oz). Ah! Okay. So in 2002, we launched the Powder version. The formula is the same, but since it has a higher amount of washing soda that theoretically allows the same amount of detergent to perform better, you can back down the dosage. The first batches went out with a typo on them saying "1/4 cup" per load. That's WAY too much detergent (suds galore for the poor test market). That's when we applied the logic above and came up with the 1 tablespoon.

That is a median. For those with larger washers, consistently heavier soils, or harder water, you might need two or 1 + a water conditioner. For those individuals who have smaller washers, only run tiny loads, or have really really soft water, they can get by with .5 to .75 tablespoon. The dosage graph is a curve rather than a straight line.

In Mayodan, NC a tablespoon is a very popular dose. In Raleigh, NC (w/o a water softener) 2 tablespoons works better. If you got one of our unfortunate "bricks", the detergent probably didn't work nearly as well as it should have and 2 would have been a better choice. But if you have a brick, we offer to replace it with a fresh one.

I won't purport that we can please every one. But given the history of the product, if easy stains are lingering or if odors aren't coming out with one wash, or if clothes are stiff, something is very wrong. Deutch, larsi, seriously...sorry it didn't work for you...it's very perplexing. We have solved this problem in the past (and as recently as last week) for some individuals.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi Taylor,

Thanks for the thoughtful response. You emailed me a PDF file - can you post a link to this PDF file for others to view? I think those who have had an unsatisfactory experience with CS may be using a 4.0+ cuft machine that needs 1.5-2 TBS of CS, especially in harder water conditions. For those who have hard water, a non-precipitating softening agent will make a big difference.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I don't have these series of files online (yet...redesigning some things). Anyone who asks can get a copy, though. We'll either e-mail individual files or provide a comprehensive CD ROM for them.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

i got two soaps as replacement for my bricks . surprise, they are bricks again


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

organic_mary1, your post is confusing. What, exactly, is your issue and how does this relate to Charlie's Soap?


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I hate to revive this thread, but to throw more fuel onto the fire...

I RAN OUT OF PERSIL!!! Before ordering more, and to check my sanity, I pulled the Charlie's out of the cupboard and washed a load of dark colors. What if the whole "Persil is better than Charlie's" thing was all imagined and just in my head? I was hoping it was, actually, because I sure would save a lot of money not having to buy Persil anymore. Using the dosage suggested by Taylor in an email to me some months ago, I used 2 TBSP in my MIele 4.0 cuft machine that was filled up nicely with dark clothing. I had three deep rinses enabled and washed in Warm (105°F) water. All rinses were clean as a whistle - no bubbles, clear water.

As I started removing the clothing from the dryer I could quickly see that I was not pleased with the results. The white piping on one pair of gym shorts turned dingy and overall the fabrics felt harsh. One of my dog's bellybands/diapers came out stiff as if it had been starched. I have washed most of these items together in the past and never had these issues with Persil. Clothes always felt soft, fluffy, and the white piping was always bright white.

Not at all satisfied with the results, I re-washed the load using my other favorite - BI-O-KLEEN Premium Powder. I used the same 2 TBSP dose. The white piping was restored and all of the fabrics (including the bellyband) came out soft and fluffy. This experience has basically forced me to permanently shelve Charlie's Soap except for things like silk and woolens where it does a decent job. This experience has validated my love of Persil but also reminded me of how wonderful Bi-O-Kleen Premium is. The Bi-O-Kleen is a close 2nd behind Persil in my opinion. Read all the positive and rave reviews about it on Amazon. It's unusual for any product to have so many positive reviews.

If you want a well performing natural product, check out Bi-O-Kleen Premium. I can't recommend Charlie's Soap after today's validation.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I quit using my Charlie's soap in my laundry. It just wasn't working out for my needs. Although... I can honestly say that it works great in my carpet cleaner for cleaning my carpets.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I have also stopped using Charlie's Soap, but still have a bucket of it in the garage - anyone interested? On those occasions when I want something more green or natural, I use Vaska or Bi-O-Kleen Premium. I'm using Vaska more regularly to better judge the impact on my fabrics. So far so good. Clothes are coming out soft, although it doesn't appear to be particularly good at cleaning greasy stains. This I find interesting in light of the fact that one of the ingredients in the product is a plant-based degreaser.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

sshrivastava said I have also stopped using Charlie's Soap, but still have a bucket of it in the garage - anyone interested?

LOL You bet I'm interested! I'd gladly take that off your hands. Are you in the US? North, south, east or west?

I actually get great results with Charlie's Soap. I do add about a teaspoon of STTP with it and have a Miele FL with a "real" heater... so that probably has a lot to do with why Charlie's works so well for me.

I do also use other detergents at different times, including Persil, depending on what I'm washing. Persil's enzymes are pretty amazing.

But, YES I would take that bucket of CS for sure!

If it's just sitting in your garage turning to stone you really should think about donating it. I know animal shelters, for instance will often be glad to have a donation of laundry detergent.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

Hi everybody!

I guess I'm resurrecting this thread because I have been using Vaska for a few months and find it far superior to Charlie's Soap. It cleans better using natural botanicals, leaves clothes soft after just one wash, and is concentrated. I find Vaska superior to Charlie's Soap in every area except cost per load.

I have found Charlie's Soap works much better as a laundry booster than as a primary detergent. If you look at the ingredients list of Charlie's Soap - Washing soda, Sodium Silicate, Coconut Oil Based Detergents - the primary ingredient is washing soda. Well, washing soda is recommended all over the internet as a laundry booster to add along with your regular detergent. Using CS on its own, for me anyway, is like washing with plain water. And I have totally soft water, so hardness doesn't play a role.

Washing soda is a good degreaser, which is why CS worked as such a great degreaser on industrial machinery before it was marketed as a laundry detergent. The degreasing qualities of washing soda make it an excellent product to strip your machine of build-up, which is why you find sodium carbonate (washing soda) in many of the washer cleaning products.

Unfortunately, it's not very good at cleaning clothes.


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RE: It's official...I HATE Charlie's Soap Powder Detergent

I'm certainly glad to know I'm not the only one who hates Charlie's soap. I've been using it for over 5 months, and it's ruined all my dark clothes, leaving a dull, grayish residue, that will not wash out...regardless. They all look like they'e had clorox smilled on them, but in a less obvious manner, more like spots that look faded and streaked. I called the company, leaving a msg. describing my problem. They responded via email with this:

"You must have inferior brands of clothing and/or material to have had this happen, we don't ever hear of this happening unless the fabric is inferior."

So, their conclusion, all my dark clothes, every piece, every color, whether it be gray, purple, black, brown, etc. etc. are ALL inferior brands or ALL of inferior material?????
I hardly think so!!!!!

I'd been using Charlies soap powder for over 6 mos. following all the recommendations on the label. Precleaning machine, etc. etc.
Over these 6 mos. it has literally ruined all my dark clothes.
Their answer was *NOT* an acceptable answer at all, since I've never, ever experienced this problem over the many, many years doing laundry, with all types of materials of dark clothes, either new or older items, many different fabrics and brands, with all types of laundery soap;EXCEPT with Charlie's Soap.
I'm 67 years old and know what I'm doing when using laundry soap products.
In the 47 years I been doing laundry, NEVER haveI ever had this problem, until the last 6 months of using Charlies soap. This is not a coincidence, this is the outcome of using Charlie's soap.
**Needless to say, I'm very upset about this and the loss of many items of dark clothing**
The email I sent using the email in their website bounced back...several times and now, they won't even acknowledge my phone calls.
This is how I responded:
I might be able to eschew this comment of your cust. service rep. if it were on just a few items, BUT NOT on ALL of them. You cannot tell me that all my dark clothes are inferior or has inferior material. I need to know how to get this off all my dark clothes, but it appears they are permently ruined, almost as if bleach got on them, exept not as white if it were bleach stains. This makes me sick, I have had so many articles of dark clothes completely ruined and no longer able to wear.

Charlie's Soap is the worst...without a doubt L/Soap I've ever used. I wouldn'tg even give it away for fear it would cause someone else the same problems. Plus my clothes are not at all soft, but stiff and coarse.
Please respond,
Anne P Murray
402-201-2094
Omaha, Ne.
CHARLIE'S SOAP YUK, YUK, YUK!!
IT WILL RUIN ALL YOUR DARK CLOTHES
CERTAINLY, NOT WORTH THE BUCKS,
CHARLIE'S SOAP
REALLY SUCKS, SUCKS, SUCKS!


 o
oh, no, the problems of the bourgeoisie

In my beloved Germany, where everything is better, and where they make laundry machines that cost three times a Maytag, you can also buy German Laundry Magical Powder, manufactured by the Smurfs--just tiptoe out before dawn and collect it as it accumulates under the cute German toadstools. It's a lot of work, but in Germany, the standard of living is so high you have *time* for these sorts of pursuits! Then bring it back, and wash your high-quality German clothes, and they will be proto-Angelically clean afterwards . . . and your good, solid German laundry machines will not have spots on their gleaming German steel insides.

For Lord's sake, Lady. You're worried about a little residue on the inside of your *washing machine*? If you have that much time to worry, worry about children being sold into slavery, or not being taught math, or about why this country (which you have chosen to live in rather than your beloved Germany) is in such bad economic trouble. I am disabled, and live below the poverty line--and I am thrilled because I just was given a cheap little vacuum cleaner by the State of Massachusetts. (After about 12 months of begging and saying a vacuum cleaner would really help my asthma.) It's not a Miele, but I can't be choosy. I would *happily* change problems with you.

Hint: Focus on things that matter. That way you will build a life worth living.


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