i have a roughly 3 year old samsung 520 washer that upon purchase provided a very, very low water level for both wash and rinse. After some months (more than 6 but I forget exactly how long) it got a sour smell despite always leaving the door open and wiping the boot. I ran a cleaning cycle with bleach and that resolved the odor, but right after that I adjusted the water level sensor to provide a little more water for all cycles. Following that adjustment I've never had a repeat. We have used several detergents and for over a year have been using Tide free and clear and very little FS and only on some loads. No odors whatsoever.

As far as re-mediating the smell, I think you've got a stubborn build-up between the two drums. Until and unless you can find something that will loosen that bacteria-laden material you are going to have that smell.

DO NOT think that switching to powdered is the answer, because it isn't. anyone who claims it is will be mouthing off in an "anecdotal fashion". :) Liquid detergents per se are not the root cause of smelly FL's. period.

Causes:

1. too much detergent.
2. not enough hot cycles
3. too low of a water level (that's a big one)
4. too much FS
5. leaving the door closed and/or leaving clothes in washer for a VERY long time following completion of the cycle.

After the roughly 3 years of use, the seal is still spotless on our Samsung and I FREQUENTLY clean dirty rags. When I clean dirty rags I use 2 scoops of Oxiclean powder along with the Tide and a HOT wash. For hot washes, I always purge the water line of cold water (I set up a Y connector, extra hose, a hose bib, and a drain tube to the waste fitting behind the washer. Cold water is purged in about 10 seconds or less.

This post was edited by dave1812 on Wed, Sep 3, 14 at 18:08

It is important to use enough detergent. Using too little detergent can also lead to moldy smells.

Did you wash in hot water on a regular basis?

Did you use liquid chlorine bleach in your loads on a regular basis?

The above are the most important factors in reducing mold. The below may help too though:

Raising water level should help with buildups and mold but it is by no means required for a mold free washer. You also need to be careful when using this method not to raise the level too high.

Using liquid detergent doesn't necessarily lead to mold, but powder detergent tends to be more forgiving than liquid when it comes to buildups and mold.

It is a good idea to leave the dispenser open as well as the door and let it dry too. If it has a removable tray for liquid detergent, take that out while it dries.

A good strategy is to switch things up. Give a different detergent a try, liquid or powder!

This post was edited by hvtech42 on Wed, Sep 3, 14 at 18:42

Go to Technofresh.net and read some of the things there. They have an "at home shock" that you make from things at home to help get the smell and scum out. It's worth a look.

Not enough detergent...too much detergent...how do you know?
How do you raise the water level?
Technofresh - cannot find any solid reviews on its effectiveness.
Will start leaving the detergent drawer open as well as the door, will try powdered detergent instead of liquid. Am doing everything else suggested.

Buy the Washer Fan and it will keep it dry and smell free and I do not have any connections at all with them. Just seems to work plus you could always move it from one washer to the next.(when you buy new)

spark823 - what is a Washer Fan? Where does it go? Who installs it?

Go to WasherFan.com

It will explain everything. They have a model for LG. It fits onto the back vent of your washer with magnets. All you have to do is stick it to the back vent and plug it in. Fan runs all time to keep washer dry, smell and mold free. Even runs while clothes are washing etc. Check out his website.
You can also look him up on You Tube. He has some interesting videos on there about mold in the hoses and detergent build up etc.
He has videos too that show you how to install the washer fan which couldn't be easier! Hope this helps!!

> Not enough detergent...too much detergent...how do you know?

Depends on soil level, detergent concentration, load size, and water hardness. A tablespoon could work as a starting point in soft water, lightly soiled smaller load, assuming 1x concentration HE detergent, but other than that you'd want more. Cooler water needs more detergent.

How often do you wash in hot and use bleach? How hot do you wash? Does your washer have an internal heater?

>How do you raise the water level?

You need to give your model number for specific advice on your machine.

Oh yeah and I would not buy one of those washer fans for these reasons:

1. They have false information on their website (a fan is the ONLY permanent solution for washer odor, only use liquid as powered detergent will damage your washer, never use more than 1-2 tablespoons of detergent)

2. They have spammed this forum in the past.

3. You are paying $80 for a little computer case fan, USB cable, and wall wart. You could do it yourself for cheap.

This post was edited by hvtech42 on Thu, Sep 4, 14 at 21:51

From my experience and those of friends and relatives I know who have front loaders that I compared experiences with, we solved our problems by switching to powdered detergents. When I switched from liquid to powder with my first FL, moldy smelling clothes and odor in the drum disappeared. It is still essential to air out the machine after finishing laundry for the day, using frequent hot washes as has been suggested and routinely running a cleaning cycle. I use Downey with every load, so that means I have to clean the detergent drawer more frequently and leave it open to air out. This is what worked for me.

When I looked for a new washer a few months ago, I mentioned the smell thing on front loaders to a clerk. He said stuff builds up under rubber seal around the door. He put his finger tips under it and said to wash inside the seal. He also advised users to leave the door open a bit when not in use. It sounded like the rubber in the garbage disposal and the gunk I get out of it is very nasty. I opted for a top loader.

This post was edited by EmmaR on Sat, Sep 6, 14 at 15:20

I had the exact same problem with mold thing shortly after getting my front loaders, particularly with smelly, sour towels. I was then using liquid detergent and I truly believe that was the culprit. Since I switched to powder Tide HE , they were immediately fresher and felt fluffier. I think I read on this site that liquids can sometimes contain animal fats (gross). I still use liquid on occasion on my permanent press/cold wash items, but everything else... use powder and a warm wash.

Also... don't listen to those who jump on the "it doesn't dissolve" or I find clumps all over my laundry when finished" That is complete and utter nonsense, as long as you aren't packing your machines super tight with clothes and using the right temperature, you'll be just fine. Some people just don't know how to wash!

Think about it like this.... we ALL grew up on powder detergents and they cleaned great with no clumping and our laundry was just fine.... now all of the sudden they're "evil" and no good.

This post was edited by kgdallas on Sun, Sep 28, 14 at 2:04

I have a front loader and got the smell. Found technofresh, used it and was happy. didn't like the high price. Tried TIDE washing machine cleaner and it works just great and cheaper. I use once a month.

It is a fine line between too much vs too little detergent. I still know think I have it down pat but I keep trying....

Bleach is very effective against mold:
Dilute bleach in water(1:20) and use a rag/sponge to wipe down the washer and seals. Do a wash cycle(with nothing in it) and 1/2 cup of bleach, do that once a month to keep it from coming back.

If you don't like the smell of bleach:
3% hydrogen peroxide can also be used but dilute with water(1:1) and wipe down, add a 1/2 cup of hydrogen peroxide and do a wash cycle once a month to keep it from coming back.

Never mix bleach and hydrogen peroxide!

They make tablets that are designed to be run through the front loaders that will dissolve biofilm and mold stuck deep in the plumbing system.

USE THEM. They work.

The other thing to do is find the water pump in your unit and take apart the pre filter. I found all kinds of stuff in mine including a small baby sock, a penny, and several pins and paper clips. A lot of nasty stuff in there. Clean it out.

Run the cleaning tablets 3 in a row, it will make a huge difference (i used affresh)

Mesh wash bags are 3 for $1 at Dollar Tree. Good for the baby socks.

armjim: "From my experience and those of friends and relatives I know who have front loaders that I compared experiences with, we solved our problems by switching to powdered detergents."

Apparently, you and your friends are not using any water in your washing machines; because, when you put powdered detergent into the washing machine and the drum fills with water, the powdered detergent dissolves in the water and then you are washing with ... TA DAH! ... liquid detergent! So either you and your friends are washing dry, or you and your friends are comparing the results of washing with liquid laundry detergent with the results of washing with liquid laundry detergent, and thinking that you discern a difference. I thnk that psychologists call that "cognitive dissonance" or somesuch term.

"When I switched from liquid to powder with my first FL, moldy smelling clothes and odor in the drum disappeared. It is still essential to air out the machine after finishing laundry for the day, using frequent hot washes as has been suggested and routinely running a cleaning cycle."

We have been using front-loading automatic washing machines in our family since the 1930s; we never have taken any specific measures to air out the washer after finishing laundry for the day; we only occasionally use hot washes; and we never have run a cleaning cycle; and we never have experienced a mold smell. So far as I recall, however, we have not made a practice of closing the washer door until it latches with a click when we remove the wet laundry after a cycle; we simply let the door rest ajar against the latch, and that provides sufficient air circulation to keep the drum fresh.

"I use Downey with every load, so that means I have to clean the detergent drawer more frequently and leave it open to air out."

And that statement is the key. Downey, a wax, is a receptive host to mold; moreover, the wax coats not only the laundry, but all of the inside of the washing machine. If you did not wax your laundry, very probably, you never would need to undertake the other remedies.

when you put powdered detergent into the washing machine and the drum fills with water, the powdered detergent dissolves in the water and then you are washing with ... TA DAH! ... liquid detergent!

Herring Maven, you've said this before, but I don't agree. There are ingredients in liquid detergents that keep all of the components in suspension, and ingredients in powdered detergents that keep it from clumping. I'm sure there are other differences as well, and they're significant. it's actually not exactly the same as mixing a powdered detergent with water.

That said, while washing habits do play a part, I think that some of it also has to do with the brand of washer, because design and water levels can be a factor. Water hardness is also a big factor, and it takes some trial and error to find the right level of detergent to use for the particular washer you have--whether it's powder or liquid. Getting the right balance between getting your clothing clean and using too much takes a little time, but once you have it figured out, it's easy.

Best of luck to the OP in getting the problem sorted, and to keeping it from returning!

Herring, I related my experiences. I made it very clear that I said it is what works for me. I have had FL washers since 2001. I enjoy seeing what others have to say about various aspects of their machines in this forum. That being said, I am not obsessed with my washing machine nor would I ever take a reproachful tone towards someone who has an experience or anecdote to relate that differs from my own.

@herring maven,

You must be lucky or live in an arid environment not to experience mold, I do agree with wax(in fabric softeners) being bad for your washing machine.

Chlorine in the tap water also kills mold, some municipalities use a lot and some use very little.

If you live in a humid area then you will likely experience mold, mold(as well as bacteria) loves warm and humid environments.

There are many variables but the best advice is leave the door open for a few hours after washing.

I personally use liquid detergent in my FL with no issue, but I hear from customers a lot that switching to powder helps. Powdered seems to be a lot more forgiving in general. Switching laundry products is always a good idea to fight mold, no matter what you're using. As said above, liquid detergent is more than simply powdered detergent dissolved in water.

cj47 -- first paragraph is quoting me: "[when you put powdered detergent into the washing machine and the drum fills with water, the powdered detergent dissolves in the water and then you are washing with ... TA DAH! ... liquid detergent!]
Herring Maven, you've said this before, but I don't agree."

While I wish you did agree, the reason I have written that before is that it is a fact, and whether you agree or not does not alter that fact. I could write that spiders have eight legs, and you could disagree that spiders have eight legs, but spiders would have eight legs regardless.

"There are ingredients in liquid detergents that keep all of the components in suspension, and ingredients in powdered detergents that keep it from clumping."

Now that is a very different statement from saying that a powdered detergent in an aqueous solution is not in that solution transformed to a liquid detergent. And you and I have no disagreement that there are differences between detergents that are packaged as liquids and detergents that are packaged as powders. We differ only in whether any presently distributed laundry detergent can perform its detergent function without being converted (if necessary) to a liquid form. During the wash cycle, all current technology detergents are in liquid form.

Most modern powdered detergents are processed by a method called prilling to reduce clumping, and that process is neither applicable nor necessary for a liquid detergent; and undoubtedly liquid detergents must undergo processing to keep the ingredients from separating in the manner of cream rising to the top of unhomogenized milk; and some of that processing may include the addition of nondetergent chemicals. But there is no reason to believe that any such processing or chemicals -- if, indeed, the processing did involve chemical additives -- would have any effect on the promotion (or inhibition, for that matter) of mold in the washing machine.

armjim: ". . . nor would I ever take a reproachful tone towards someone who has an experience or anecdote to relate that differs from my own."

Perhaps your understanding of the meaning of reproachful differs from mine, but I think that I have not reproached any other person in this thread or in this forum. While not being judgmental as to what any person chooses to do with or to his or her own laundry, I have pointed out -- more than once, yes -- that one should not be surprised, after consciously adding to one's laundry a medium in which mold is known to be able to thrive (wax), that mold has begun to propagate in that host.

moviegeek: "@herring maven, You must be lucky or live in an arid environment not to experience mold,..."

Most people would not regard Portland, Oregon, where we have about 180 days a year with st least some precipitation (albeit many days with but trace amounts), as an arid environment. And within our climate, our unfinished, officially/* unheated basement, where our washing machine and dryer are located, and which the temperature hovers in the 40's (F.) all winter, and never gets above the low 50s even in midsummer, is an excellent environment for the growth of mold. We do have mold growing on the concrete walls of the basement, and have to scrub the walls down with bleach from time to time to keep it in check. /* We used to have an inefficient old converted sawdust burning "octopus" furnace down there -- it had been converted to an oil burner before we bought the house -- that leaked sufficient heat from the combustion housing that our basement stayed in the 50s throughout the winter. Since replacing that furnace with a 98%+ efficiency modern natural gas furnace, we have had to be more concerned about mold growth on the walls than we were formerly.

But, yes, I am very lucky; I regard myself as the luckiest person in the world, unrelated to any laundry matters.

But, getting back to laundry, we abet our luck by using a scoop of borax in every laundry load (which we have been washing with liquid detergents for years) in our automatic washing machine. But I hesitate to emphasize the borax, as some may regards such comments as reproachful.

>During the wash cycle, all current technology detergents are in liquid form.

Nobody disagreed with you on that. Everyone knows powder detergent will eventually end up in liquid form. That is not the topic being discussed. The question is, if I pour liquid detergent into one cup, then pour water into another cup and add powdered detergent, will the solutions in the cups be the same. The answer is no.

>Perhaps your understanding of the meaning of reproachful differs from mine, but I think that I have not reproached any other person in this thread or in this forum. While not being judgmental as to what any person chooses to do with or to his or her own laundry, I have pointed out -- more than once, yes -- that one should not be surprised, after consciously adding to one's laundry a medium in which mold is known to be able to thrive (wax), that mold has begun to propagate in that host.

I don't think your comment about fabric softener is what was found reproachful. You may not have meant it, but your response to armjim's experience switching from liquid to powder detergent seemed quite condescending. It also did nothing to address the fact that the mold problem was apparently solved upon switching detergents, even with continued use of fabric softener.

I don't get mold in my machine. I have been using it for a year now. It is a front loader. I use both liquid and powdered detergents. I add STPP to each load, about 2 tsp. I never use fabric softener. I always use warm water (104degrees) or sometimes hot or very hot. I use a sanitary wash (158degrees) about every 2-3 weeks. Without fail I wipe out the water in the gasket at the door. I use a white microfiber bar towel from Williams and Sonoma and hang it over the door to dry. I always leave the door cracked. I've never left the detergent draw open until recently when I thought it might be a good idea (not because there was any odor) as sometimes it is damp inside. But never any mold. My laundry is always fresh.

I always use vinegar instead of fabric softener - just a few tablespoons - and leave the door ajar between washes. I've never had any moldy smells in about 12 years. I run a bleach load every couple of weeks; use oxyclean on other white loads. We live in foggy San Francisco.

@Herring_Maven, We differ only in whether any presently distributed laundry detergent can perform its detergent function without being converted (if necessary) to a liquid form. During the wash cycle, all current technology detergents are in liquid form.

LOL, really?

Done here. Enjoy your wonderful life.

Cj

hvtech42: "Everyone knows powder detergent will eventually end up in liquid form."

Apparently, there is one member of this forum who disagrees.

"That is not the topic being discussed. The question is, if I pour liquid detergent into one cup, then pour water into another cup and add powdered detergent, will the solutions in the cups be the same."

But if you pour , e.g., Vaska liquid detergent in one cup and Tide liquid detergent in another cup, will those two solutions be the same? No. And if you pour , e.g., Tide powder detergent in one cup and add water and Biokleen powder detergent in another and add water, will those two solutions be the same? No. Different detergent manufacturers use different formulations in their detergents, and individual manufacturers use different formulations among the various detergents in their lines. Your premise seems to be that the differences in packaging (powder in a box vs. liquid in a bottle) are important but that the differences between formulations are not, and you have not presented any evidence that that is the case.

And then there is the matter that most if not all modern front loading washing machines have a detergent drawer for dispensing liquid laundry detergent, but one is supposed to put powder detergent straight into the washer drum. Inasmuch as one could put liquid detergent into the drum, does the prevalence of liquid detergent dispensing drawers not suggest that the machine manufacturers regard the use of liquid detergent as the default method for their washing machines? If liquid detergent causes mold problems. wouldn't the washing machine manufacturers discourage the use of liquid detergent and promote the use of powder detergent?

"It also did nothing to address the fact that the mold problem was apparently solved upon switching detergents, even with continued use of fabric softener."

In medicine, there is a well known and proven phenomenon called the placebo effect, and I strongly suspect that that phenomenon may be in play. If you spend money to have a mechanic install a different brand of spark plugs in your car, e.g., from NGK to Denso or Autolite, or vice versa, you may well think that you perceive differences in acceleration and fuel economy -- and there may be some very minor differences; but every competent auto mechanic will tell you that the performance and mileage differences between brands of spark plugs that meet the vehicle manufacturer's specification are so subtle you never could discern the performance differences in the seat of your pants and, given differences in temperature, humidity, and traffic, you would need many tanks of gas to establish any difference in gas mileage attributable to the spark plugs.

But there is also the possibility that the washing machine mold issue may have been with a specific brand of detergent, and that switching brands within the liquid detergent category (or within the powder detergent category) would have yielded the same result as switching from liquid to powder (or from powder to liquid) detergent.

And then there is the matter that most if not all modern front loading washing machines have a detergent drawer for dispensing liquid laundry detergent, but one is supposed to put powder detergent straight into the washer drum. That is not correct. Frontloader detergent dispensers are designed for *both* powdered and liquid detergent. An insert "dam" is set in place for liquids to prevent them from immediately draining. It's removed or set into a different position for powders so they can flush under instead of over.

There have been several people on this board find that switching to powdered detergent had a large effect in eliminating or reducing mold/smutz residue on *both* toploaders and frontloaders ... so clearly there is a significant difference between powders and liquids in some combinations of environmental factors.

dadoes: "There have been several people on this board find ..."

On the basis of controlled testing? No: none that I have seen; if I have missed any controlled test results, please point me to the findings that I have missed. Did those people "find" on the basis of placebo effect or cognitative dissonance? I think that it is a distinct possibility. A couple of decades back, a lot of audiophiles became convinced that painting the edges of compact discs with a green magic marker improved the sound reproduction through their speaker systems. As the quotable Casey Stengel (may have) said, "you could look it up."

I am open to persuasion, but I do remain highly skeptical. Note: I am not accusing anyone of falsifying data; do not misapprehend my skepticism.

"... a large effect in eliminating or reducing mold/smutz residue on *both* toploaders and frontloaders ... so clearly there is a significant difference between powders and liquids ..." (The underlining is mine, not in original.)

My professional career required me to analyze statements made under penalty of perjury, and I learned that a shortcut to finding the weakest part of an argument is to hone in on the places where the person uses "clearly" or "obviously." It shows that the speaker/writer is unsure, and that he or she feels a need to buttress the argument with intensifiers like "obviously" or "clearly."

"in some combinations of environmental factors"

We are in complete and total agreement that environmental factors can play a major role in observed results.

Here is a link that might be useful: You could look it up.

Several years ago I assisted someone here with a toploader having a chronic mold/slime problem. This is the historical incident I remember most clearly since I was directly involved in it. He disassembled the machine to clean the residue. Did not change from liquid detergent but did make some changes on washing habits (less cold washes). Twice more, as I recall, the machine was disassembled for cleaning/inspection over a course of several months to find mold/slime accumulating each time. Quit using liquid detergent and the next disassembly found the machine to be clear.

You aren't the be-all-end-all of knowledge and experience either in the world or on this board.

dadoes: "You aren't the be-all-end-all of knowledge and experience either in the world or on this board."

You are correct. I am not. And I do not claim to be so. And also I do not make snarky statements about other posters here.

So. Let us get this straight.

Ecover ZERO Laundry Powder, http://us.ecover.com/products/zero-laundry-powder/, is composed primarily of plant sugar based surfactants. Ecover ZERO 2x (liquid) Laundry Detergent, http://us.ecover.com/products/ecover-zero-2x-laundry-detergent/, also is composed primarily of plant sugar based surfactants.

Ultra Tide HE powder detergent, http://www.tide.com/en-US/product/ultra-tide-he-powder.jspx, is composed of surfactants that appear primarily to be petroleum based/*; Tide Original HE (liquid) detergent, http://www.tide.com/en-US/product/tide-he.jspx, is composed of surfactants that appear primarily to be petroleum based. /*

I take it that your position is that Ecover liquid is more like Tide liquid than it is like Ecover powder, and that Tide powder is more like Ecover powder than it is like Tide liquid? That is, do you think that all liquid laundry detergents share qualities that all powder detergents lack, and that all powder laundry detergents share qualities that all liquid detergents lack?

/* Procter & Gamble lists the ingredients of its Ultra Tide HE Powder Detergent as:
Sodium Carbonate
Sodium Aluminosilicate
Sodium Sulfate
Linear Alkylbenzene Sulfonate
Water processing aid
Nonanoyloxybenzenesulfonate
Alkyl Sulfate
Sodium Polyacrylate
Silicate processing aid
Sodium Percarbonate
Ethoxylate
Polyethylene Glycol 4000
Fragrance
DTPA
Palmitic Acid
Disodium Diaminostilbene Disulfonate
Protease enzyme
Silicone
Cellulase
http://www.pgproductsafety.com/productsafety/search_results.php?submit=Search&searchtext=Tide&category=ingredients&start=31&num=10

/* Procter & Gamble lists the ingredients of its (liquid non-HE) Tide Original laundry detergent as:

water
alcoholethoxy sulfate
linear alkylbenzene sulfonate
propylene glycol
citric acid
sodium hydroxide
borax
ethanolamine
ethanol
alcohol sulfate
polyethyleneimine ethoxylate
sodium fatty acids
diquaternium ethoxysulfate
protease
diethylene glycol
laureth-9
alkyldimethylamine oxide
fragrance
amylase
disodium diaminostilbene disulfonate
DTPA
sodium formate
calcium formate
polyethylene glycol 4000
mannanase
Liquitint™ Blue
dimethicone
www.pgproductsafety.com/.../ingredients/.../Tide_Liquid_Original.pdf

Herring_Maven, I'm not seeing any links to controlled studies supporting your opinion in any of your posts. Since you're asking for them from others, perhaps you've got a few of your own? And if you don't--then your opinions remain your opinions, to which you are entitled and welcome. But they don't magically become fact through repetition and pontification.

Personally, I don't care enough about this subject to comb the internet for studies. I'm happy to accept Dadoes opinion, which appears to be "it depends on the environment, but sometimes powders seem less likely to encourage the growth of mold". You, however, seem passionate and appear to have lots of time to ponder it and expound. Care to share your findings?

While you don't make overtly snarky statements to other posters, you are usually able to work in an artfully worded insult aimed at whomever you were replying to. Perhaps you think we're not intelligent enought to 'get it'. You might be surprised.

Here is a link that might be useful: Or, you could look it up.

This post was edited by cj47 on Mon, Sep 29, 14 at 10:42

"While you don't make overtly snarky statements to other posters, you are usually able to work in an artfully worded insult aimed at whomever you were replying to. Perhaps you think we're not intelligent enought to 'get it'. You might be surprised."

Now THAT'S funny ....... I don't care who you are

cj47: "I'm not seeing any links to controlled studies supporting your opinion in any of your posts. Since you're asking for them from others, perhaps you've got a few of your own?"

There are two things wrong with your suggestion. First, I was not the one making the assertion that liquid detergents cause mold in washing machines (specifically that they selectively cause mold only in front-loading washing machines). It is the burden of the presenter of a novel proposition to offer proof. Second -- and more importantly -- it is never possible to prove the negative of any general proposition.

The assertion is that liquid laundry detergents as a class cause mold while powdered laundry detergents as a class do not. The advice given is, "if you are using a liquid, any liquid, then switch to a powder, any powder." With the hundreds of brands of liquid laundry detergent, and the many possible concentrations in use of each of those brands of liquid detergent, in the marketplace; and with the hundreds of brands of powder laundry detergent, and possible concentrations in use of each of those brands of powdered detergent, in the marketplace, how could one construct any possible controlled test of the negative that you ask to be done?

We live in a part of the country where Sasquatch legends have abounded among Native Americans for centuries, and where occasional Sasquatch sightings have been reported among European descendent settlers for the better part of 200 years. A quarter of a century ago, somebody in Northern California made a movie clip of a man dressed up as a Sasquatch shot from a distance that got cumulatively hundreds of hours of air play on television stations over the years (TV news shows love visuals), until the maker of the movie clip came forward a few years back and admitted it was a hoax, a joke that got out of control. Since then, I have heard that it has been "proven" that the Sasquatch does not exist. The proof of nonexistence has not been made. No Sasquatch advocate I, I nevertheless object to the idea that showing that one movie clip was a fake proves anything other than that the movie clip was a fake. I do not know how one ever could prove definitively that Sasquatches never existed.

"You, however, seem passionate and appear to have lots of time to ponder it and expound. Care to share your findings?"

I am not especially passionate about liquid laundry detergent per se, but do get my stem wound by repeated assertions of Urban Legends generally. You still find a cohort of people who passionately assert that the old Procter & Gamble crescent moon logo, first adopted in 1851, proves that P&G is a corporate follower of Satan. (P&G finally abandoned the logo in 1995.) Or that P&G's Dawn hand dishwashing detergent, uniquely among dishwashing detergents, is a risk to children's corneas.

Frankly, I think the assertions that use of liquid laundry detergents causes mold to grow in front loading automatic washing machines is an Urban Legend. Like dadoes, I have anecdotal support for my belief: we have used a variety of liquid laundry detergents (liquid Tide, Arm & Hammer, Biokleen, Ecover Delicate Wash, Vaska, and others) exclusively in our front-loading washing machines here in mold-friendly Portland, Oregon, for at least 35 years since switching from powder detergents sometime in the late 1970s, and in all that time we: (1) have not used any powder detergents in our washing machines, and (2) never have experienced any growth of mold in our laundry or in our washing machines. Our experience is anecdotal; it is no more proof than the "proof" that Sasquatch does not exist is proof; but it is a broad experiential base with a variety of products that supports my theory that liquid=mold, powder≠mold is an Urban Legend.

Here is a link that might be useful: Procter & Gamble and Satanism

Good lord!

>First, I was not the one making the assertion that liquid detergents cause mold in washing machines (specifically that they selectively cause mold only in front-loading washing machines).

Nobody made this assertion! Nobody said liquid detergent causes mold! The only point people are trying to make is that in some cases, trying out powdered detergent might help with mold. If you are having mold issues and have already tried the obvious, there's no harm in giving this a try too. I said back in my post that I myself use liquid detergent in front loaders for years (mainly as a matter of habit), and do not have mold issues. However if I did experience issues I would not hesitate to switch to powdered in a heartbeat. That's great that you don't have issues with liquid either, keep it up. But I'm not going to try and pretend that both types of detergent are going to behave exactly the same in all cases!

Nobody here knows enough about the science behind this stuff to fully explain the differences between the detergents and why one may or may not be less forgiving than the other when it comes to residue and mold.

I have the washer fan and it does work. you can also replace the drain pipe that is located inside the machine.

My mom, the neatest cleanest housewife ever, always warned me to leave the door open on the washing machine when it was not in use. I never knew why--but I guess now it was to make sure the machine doesn't develop mold.

Just think -- you could have been watching some stupid television show today instead of reading this post.