Larsi, I was on the fence over the $1,000 rebate (in Canada) on the Miele W4840. I was thinking Samsung or Electrolux?? After reading this, I'm heading to the Miele showroom today to check them out in person. The "deal" is on until May 21st ... maybe I'll do it :)

Wow... I sure was surprised to see this! I've been following the saga even if I never posted. Well hopefully third time's the charm with the W4842 and that this new one works well for you.

(BTW -- I have often wondered why you didn't get one of the discontinued 220v Miele models instead?)

hcj1440,

Over the years I had 3 sets of the older 220V Miele Washers. While they are amazing and little work horses...they are little. With my now larger family, and I like to wash king size and queen size blankets & sheet sets weekly, the "standard capacity" 220V machines are too little!

While I am the first to admit, that NO MIELE can compare with the quietness of the newer Samsungs or Electrolux during a high/max spin cycle....the Miele uses build materials that are honestly unlike any residential wash machine in the world. I will miss the sheer size and spin speed quietness, but the Miele design and build quality is top notch!!

Larsi,
I can't get rid of my great doubt : I guess many Americans underload their frontloaders.
Also here in Europe we wash sheets weekly (in summer even twice a week).... but we don't run a load for each sheet ;-). My "standard" Novotronic washes 3 single bed sheet sets in a load or a vintage heavy linen twin bed set plus 5/6 towels. It fits also king size bedspreads and throws with no problem ...
The very only case I admit bigger drums are handy is when it comes to wash king size duvets

Hidroman, I was just at the Miele Gallery today inpsecting all the models. Your post confuses me! I was sure the Novotronic looked SO tiny. Even the W4840 didn't look huge to me ... now what?? They told me the Novotronic could wash a queen size duvet but not a king and that the W4840/42 could handle a king.

I was convinced I need the W4840/42 but you think the Novotronic handles a pretty large load? My regulard loads are not huge (clothes). I do have a king size bed so do have king size bedding to wash.

Larsi, thanks for your positive energy, i really need it. I wanted to see a Miele when i first started looking for a washer, but there are not any around here. The store might could have ordered one if they do that brand, but i wanted to "see it" first. The only way i have seen any is on You Tube, so that is helpful but not the same as in person. In reguards to the Electrolux dryer, yes the high pitch whine can get to me, whereas the IQ touch i tried did not have it. I have had some of my sheets try to go into a roll, but have always adjusted them here and there during drying, even did it with my old Roper dryer. The Samsungs i tried rolled them into the tightest roll, and the washer rolled them too. I am afraid anymore when they call to deliver a set since i have had such a horrible time with them, that i almost went back to an old top loader. Everything is made cheaply anymore. So i am nail biting waiting for the replacement set and then won't be able to breathe freely until i have used it about a week and find that everything works. I don't think that a lot of these companies have all the bugs worked out in these front loaders. If the next set has any trouble then my hubby WILL make me go to a top loader and then the dryer door will again hit me in the knees when i open it as we have to have them jammed together whereas with the stackable units i can have room. So cross BOTH fingers for me.

Livebetter,
tye told you right @ the Gallery
I'll try to give you some clues

- my Novotronic is 10 y.o. and has a smaller drum than current ones. Mine is 49 cubic decimetres (rated 5 Kg) while smallest current ones have a 54 cu. dec. drum rated 6 Kg.(e.g. the W1612)

- The smallest commercial Miele washers have the same drum size as the Novotronic W1612. These machines are used in small hotels, bed & breakfast, restaurants .... You'll agree with me that a B&B or a small hotel have to cope with larger amounts of king size sheets than a household made of 4-6 persons, yet a same sized washer fits their needs. Of course these commercial machines have a stronger heating element and run a 140°F full load within 45 minutes

Full 140°F colorfast cotton load in a old 10 Kg commercial Miele

this "highlander" ;-) is a mid seventies residential Miele running a full load on cottons 140°F + short . The machine is round 35 y.o. yet there is no evidence of any mold on the rubber boot

Here is a link that might be useful: have you looked for a good deal here ?

hidroman,

Yes, our past "small", standard Novotronic wash machines would take a complete set of CA King sized sheets (fitted sheet with elastic, flat top sheet, 2 king sized pillow cases). The machine was packed full (not tight) , but it was full. The machines would wash and dry actually pretty great. The problem with the smaller/standard sized Miele units (or Bosch or Asko) is that large blankets, comforters and large clothing items...the wash drum is too small in both the washer and the dryer to allow enough movement and tumbling.

This being said, I would gladly take a small Novotronic over almost any American or Korean front loader. Miele units are built like a tank!

Livebetter - you could always take a sample load to the Miele Gallery and see how the Novatronic works for you.

I wanted to see how my saddle pads fitted into the Little Giant washer and the people there had no problems running a test load for me. I was trying to decide between the Miele LG and another Asko (a 240V heater and the ability to modify the programs were non-negotiable requirements for DH and me). The drum in the Miele was just that little bit bigger, plus the manager at Ferguson's couldn't, and wouldn't, arrange for us to see the Asko model we were interested in.

Roseark - I sympathize. We refused to purchase without seeing the machine also. Maybe we would have gone with the Asko if we had been able to see it in person, I don't know, but I don't think that is an unreasonable expectation when spending this sort of money for an item that we will, hopefully, be using for a good ten years or more.

I have been using FL's for most of my life and the European companies have a ton of experience with them. I can't recall any bugs in any of the European machines I have used over the years and you certainly can't go wrong with the Miele build quality.

Larsi -- aha... thanks for satisfying my curiosity on why not the older Miele units.

everyone else -- FWIW, I have a 6kg unit and husband managed to wash our king size down comforter in it. I guess he just crammed it in there. The wash was successful -- there wasn't a pocket with detergent stuck in it, the whole comforter got uniformly wet, etc. And more importantly, when we put it back on the bed it wasn't itchy anymore (must have had some dust mites or something).

I had an AEG 88840 which I always crammed full and everything came out great. And whites were *white*. I'll be getting an Asko 6903 in July which I'm hoping will be at least as good as my AEG.

The $1000 rebate definitely was giving me second thoughts about buying the Miele but we'll see how the Asko works out.

Larsi,

I only wish you had shared your negatives about the Electrolux before today. Some people may have made a purchase decision based on your 100% positive reviews earlier. Knowing about the negatives may have kept them from making the same mistake you made. But eh, that's life.

I'm still loving my W4842. After reading chefwong's experience in another thread, I peeked behind my rubber boot to make sure I wasn't harboring any alien lifeforms. Clean as a whistle! After being accustomed to my Asko's default five rinses, I didn't think the MIele could do it justice with only two. However, the interim spins after the main wash and again between rinses seems to go a long way toward getting my clothes rinsed as well as the Asko.

The W4842 is good for someone who wants an intelligent, no-nonsense washing machine built to last for many years to come. It's not good for someone who wants to watch cute animations, check email or surf the internet on their washing machine display screens. Sorry, I had to say it. Sometimes less really is more.

Another reason i hate living in this city, i called around to the appliance repair people we have here and not one of them worked on Miele. They said they seldom see them here in this town. Plus if they did the machine is still out of my income range. I don't have credit at these stores or any others. It is strictly a what can you afford thing. Lowes had some pictures in one of their books, but only a page. It's a shame. I had never heard the word Miele until i came to this forum and now i feel a complete outcast due to having an inferior washer.

I like the idea of the smaller Novotronic units. I like the Youtube videos of the clothes filling the tub and turning in the water and detergent. In my current Frigidaire Gallery the loads seem small in there. They fill about half the drum and tumble a lot.

Of course for the odd time I want to wash a larger blanket or duvet the larger drum is a plus.

I wonder if for 90% of my laundry needs the Novotronic is a better choice. Would I be under filling a W4842? Is it possible to under fill them?

From what IÂve read, Europeans do smaller loads more often than we do here.

Ahhhhh Â. so hard to decide. I havenÂt even considered an Asko or Bosch.

What about the smaller dryers? There doesn't seem like enough room for the clothes to move and be wrinkle free. I also have a gas dryer and don't think those come in a gas option.

I ruled out the Novotronic while at the Gallery but now feel I should go back and look at them closer. Maybe I should take a load with me.

Hydroman, I am familiar with Miele Unboxed but thank you for thinking of me. I want to narrow down which unit IÂm interested in and then IÂll check there for availability. They have some great deals.

Larsi

The appliance stores in your area have to hate you hahahahÂÂ. However I think itÂs great. Many things these days cost way too much money for defective performance , I am the first to return things if they donÂt work well. With that said I do love my W4842 & T9822 and my Hondas, lol. I thought the comparison to BMW was funny, but I get it. IÂm just the biggest Honda fanatic in the world. IÂm going to suggest you test drive an Acura some day :) Hope the new Miele set works out for ya.

s...tava, I posted such glowing reviews about the Electrolux, because I was SO happy to not have a machine that was knocking pictures off the wall when spinning! I said for day ONE that the build materials on the Electrolux were inferior to Miele (see my original couple of Electrolux posts)! I do not think the Electrolux units are bad, and I would never tell anyone to avoid them, but they did not suit my needs as well as I thought they did. It took me a few weeks of heavy use, to really miss my Miele units. I think you know, I did not try and 'dupe" someone in to buying an Electrolux. The Miele just proved to be better for me. Being German, I really like that "over-built" feel of German appliances and cars. Just my preference! Sorry!

Speaking about cars...Mieleforme!!! :) I've actually owned a Honda for 3 years back in 1993-1996. It was flawless for about 2.5 years...seriously perfect. Then it just died electrically. The dealership could not figure out why the battery was always dead, power windows would go in and out, radio and CD player would not work, etc... On a positive note though...I paid $14k for the car, and they gave me almost $12k for it THREEE years later!!

Since then, my spouse and I have had probably 20 Mercedes and BMWs. Some have been near flawless, and some have been an absolute nightmare. That being said, the feel, build materials, safety innovations and Patents and ride quality of a high-end German car cannot be compared!

I will drive an Acura to feel them..I think some of their models look awesome. I've driven a few Lexus and Infiniti models, and they were pretty great (not as heavy and tank like feeling as a BMW though). Where you are a Honda addict, I am a HUGE BMW addict! I love them!!! We currently have 2 new BMW models and a BMW motorcycle. Love them!!!

I hear you on the Bimmers ;-). My husband is pleading with me to give up my 11 year old 528iT but the thing is bulletproof. Plus it's a *cool* soccermom car, lol. I said when it hits 350K I'll think about it.

So do you think the smaller 6kg machines like the current W3033 could handle a Full-bed sized quilt?

So do you think the smaller 6kg machines like the current W3033 could handle a Full-bed sized quilt?

I would think so... my 6kg Miele (w1215) did fine with a king size down comforter.

Mysteryclock,

Yes, I have a Miele W3033, and, for example I'll frequently wash 7 pairs of adult-sized denim jeans in it at a time.

I think it could handle a full-sized bed quilt, no problem.

The W3033 is a great machine. I love it.

cryptandrus,

Thanks for the info. Do you have the matching dryer? If so, does it have the (occasional?) auto-reversing tumble that the big machines have?

mysteryclock, No, sorry, I don't have the matching dryer.

I have a 15-year old Kenmore dryer that's still going strong! :-)

I prefer to line-dry as much as I can.

mysteryclock,

Yes, the smaller Miele dryers have reverse tumble. They do it on and off the entire drying cycle. This feature is A MUST for me. Without it, sheets and larger items will "ball" up...hot and dry on the outside, moist and wrinkled on the inside.

This reverse tumble feature also makes up a lot in terms of performance, smooth clothes and fluffiness, since Miele tumble dryers are smaller than most other units. Even the Super Capacity T98XX series are only about 6.3 cu feet. With the reverse tumble feature, my clothes, sheets, blankets and towels come out 100% fluffy and wrinkle free in the Miele. I do not even iron cotton button down shirts! Would NEVER own a dryer without reverse tumble!!!

Hi Larsi - hope you can get used to the loud spin cycle. I was just telling my wife (based on your reviews of the Electrolux) that we would get out of our Miele W4842 and dryer next week. I know the build quality is high quality, but the shaking when in spin cycle is really unacceptable. Also, still not impressed with the Miele gas dryer.

I would caution anyone buying a Miele to really think about the loud spin cycles and also their gas dryers. We still may give the Miele tech one last try, as I hate thinking of the process of returning them.

Greg

gfish,

Last week when our Miele Technician (supervisor and field area specialist actually) came to program the W4842 to water + and to set the T9802 to extended cool down, he said that besides mine, he has only seen maybe 2-3 T9800/T9802 Electric Dryers in homes. He said it surprises him, since the Electric dryers are SO, SO much better than the T9820/T9822 Gas dryers. About 95% of all dryers in California are gas, where a lot of the rest of the USA and Canada use Electric. Almost all of Europe, if not all of Europe has Electric Dryers.

The Miele tech said Miele Electric Dryers are more even, more consistent, quieter, more reliable and just better in every way, compared to Miele gas dryers. His words, not mine!!!

Yeah, the W48xx washers are NOT whisper quiet during the spin cycles. Acutally if I sit there, and constantly tweak one of the rubber feet that touch the floor with the special Miele tool/wrench...I can get the MAX Spin to be very, very quiet and smooth. But, depending on the load size and contents..the next load might be loud (rattling and vibrating). Usually the Max Spin is ok enough, to not be bothered. Would I run my W4842 next to a sleeping baby's room? Probably not! NO where near as quiet and smooth as a Samsung with VRT or an Electrolux, new Bosch or even the new Kenmore Elites...but the Miele build quality, Miele Service and Miele commitment to longevity and reliability is a big plus!

Consider having Miele trouble shoot the washer spin problem, and have them trade your gas dryer for a T9802 Electric dryer. I really like my new W4842 washer, but I LOVE the T9802 Electric Dryer!!!

Larsi, does the W4842 vibrate worse than the W4840 you had before, or is it installed in a different place so you can't directly compare?

I've never found the spin on my W4840 to be loud. It might vibrate some, but the noise level isn't very high. I think most of the noise is from the pump.

suburbanmd,

The 2 W4840s I had never vibrated, rattled or shook. The first W4842 did not either. The last 2 W4842 units (current one included) was/is kinda loud during the high and max spin cycles. It is more of a rattle/shake, is "something loose kind of noise"! My current W4842 is much better than the one I got about a month ago, but the spin cycles are not quiet by any means!

Honestly, compared to the plastic junk on the market for sale, I will accept a little noise for a few minutes during the spin cycles. Since I have tried other brands, I know that Miele is best suited to my demands and expecatations. The wash cycles and rinse cycles are very quiet in my new W4842!

According to the Miele service manuals, the W48XX drum has an 80 L capacity and the T98XX dryers have a drum capacity of 180 L. Isn't the rule of thumb that the dryer should have double the volume of the washer? Here the dryer has 2.25x.

Meant to say an outcast with a washer dryer set that is considered inferior by some if it is not a miele. Have never had a service tech for the model he is there to see about ever dog that brand, of course they are going to say all kinds of good stuff about it because they want you to keep buying the same brand.

roseark,

No one on this forum thinks you have an inferior machine, or at least I do not. The materials used on the Miele units, just met my high demands better than the Electrolux. I think Electrolux is leaps and bounds better than most crap on the market today!

While I LOVE my Miele units...trust me, your Wave Touch washer is SO much quieter, and more balanced that any Miele. The Miele, in my opinion, out performs anything else in sheer terms of cleaning...but the Miele does not have any advanced vibration reduction technology like your Electrolux does.

I like to compare Miele and Electrolux to say BMW/Mercedes and Lexus/Infiniti. The Miele units are German, bank vault solid and quite conservative. Electrolux units have more advanced technology and more "goodies". To each his own!

It's all relative, isn't it?

Larsi, you illuminated the Electrolux for a lot of people who knew very little about the machine. Indeed, most of us probably thought the big selling point of the Electrolux was the slow wash times when in reality it has all the flexibility anyone could need. I think that's great. This forum is so much more helpful than any other web site or magazine with "reviews". Today most "reviews" are simply a regurgitation of the manufacturer's marketing baloney and very little, if any, hands-on usage.

I happen to like the Miele party right now - the food tastes good, the music is classical, the host is attentive, and I'm having a good time. The Electrolux party down the hall looks like fun, too - a younger, cooler bunch that bring their own booze and dance the night away. Okay that sounds silly, but both parties are fun! :)

I know this comment is so old- but I just found it doing research on washers..thought I wanted miele, but larsi_gw's comments about them being like BMW/mercedes gave me second thoughts. Let's be honest they're expensive pieces of junk. Sorry. Fun to drive and cheap while leasing, but not so cheap after the first 3 years- no durability and expensive to fix.

If miele is anything like that, man that's an expensive piece of junk.

Those of you who come across this thread, I found Speed Queen to be solid.. the gears are metal not cheap plastic.. Though I am trying to figure out how I can get the larger commercial one in the house, if possible.

I always thought electorlux were junk too?? That's what I've been reading and forget the cheap plastic american ones ( GE, Maytag, etc etc)

Aaargh! this is not easy especially when investing thousands of dollars into a washer!

Electrolux is not junk, honestly! The Kenmore Elite 5.2 cu. ft (LG too) are great machines. The metals, glass and plastics feel top notch! Nothing feels as robust at the Miele units, but they have now been discontinued for some time, so there is no new stock left. All Miele offers is "small" Euro sized units. Even their Little Giants are quite small!

But I love my Euro sized Miele:) it's just the two of us now. I have plenty of room for laundry. I do wool and grubby chore clothes with ease.

Do you realize this thread is about FIVE YEARS OLD??