perhaps inviting a local dr to make speech on the downsides of smoking? if s/he promised to stay and talk after?
i know my mother (a reformed smoker) hated her downstairs neighbors...they were heavy smokers and the smell came up thru the kitchen pipes...so that could be considered second hand smoke in some cases...
i'd also bring up the cleaning of the grounds...you know people toss butts and matches in the nicest of places...

You mentioned that there are already "non smoking complexes" in your vicinity. I would make an appointment to speak to their committee and ask how they presented the bylaw to their owners, maybe there's another way to 'skin the cat', so-to-speak, that might prove beneficial to your cause. Perhaps suggesting that the committee might impose a "smoking levy" to be absorped by all tenants might bring them out to vote, reason, to keep the grounds and ashtrays clean from butts, etc.

One can do all the talking one wants to do about the hazards of smoking. That's not the problem in getting out the vote. It's rampant apathy which is a common malaise [and growing more so each year] of condo developments no matter what their size.

Here are some suggestions:

1. Send ballots and proxies to every owner with a stamped return envelope.

2. Follow that up with direct phone calls [someone must have a list of contact #s] to those who do not respond.

3. Throw a social on a day or evening when you know people are likely to attend and solicit their vote then. Do it by each division or building. Recognizing whatever your structural configuration might be. Keep it localized and small.

Start early in the vote seeking process and be prepared to work a long while to get results. I hope you have an active, interested property management firm who will assist you in this project.

Been there...done that...and the above suggestions have worked although knocking on doors has also been necessary. Fortunately...for me/us...the number of townhouses here is relatively small by comparison to your Maui territory...and State condo laws have changed here to facilitate this type of voting need. Otherwise...nothing would ever get done. [sign] Where the apathy is as high as the population...a majority of attendees at any meeting can now pass or reject this type of vote. It's no longer based on the total population number.

I truly wish you much luck.

Anne

The 2/3rds rule became popular at the dawn of time to make it difficult to make changes. That was especially useful for new developments, where the "developer" has the majority of votes until near completion of the build-out.

In your case, chisue, I can image the obstacles will be be owners who are smokers and won't be supportive, those who think such a restriction could limit their rental income, and others who don't care or don't respond to communications. Those in the first two groups will unlikely be sympathetic to any outreach. If they number as much as a quarter of the owner group, you face a difficult and maybe impossible challenge.

I live in a Retirement Community. The lease for any of the units has a clause that indoor smoking is prohibited. But I doubt that in your case you would ever get a smoker who is all ready there to agree to a no smoking rule.

I recently learned that any one who has a house to rent, can put that in the rental agreement. I assume it is a state law but I don't really know.

Good luck.

Sue

Just an idea, and not sure of the exact wording of your by-laws requiring the 2/3 vote, but consider this possible loop hole: Barring any language to the contrary, you/the Board could interpret the 2/3 vote as 2/3 of those who participated in the election, rather than 2/3 of all homeowners. This follows traditional interpretation of similar rules: legislation is passed on a simple majority of those VOTING; those who abstain are not counted either way. Same for Roberts Rules of Order: votes are decided on the basis of those members who are present, and not on the total membership.

Another idea - use proxies. If you think you won't get these people out to vote, you could offer to have them sign a form giving you the authority to vote in their stead.

Can I pry a bit?
How much is the owner's maintenance fee, and how often is it levied?
(Or maybe it's called the HOA fee where you are.)

To lure people to vote, my subdivision (not in a vacation area) puts the names of those who cast ballots in a drawing for 1 free HOA payment, plus they offer the proxy option.

Check with the property insurer. Cigarettes can cause fires, if a no smoking property would decrease the insurance cost and thereby decrease the monthly assessment by even a little bit, that may be an incentive you could publicize.
I agree that the challenge here is not a health appeal, but rather an overcoming apathy getting the vote out challenge.

This post was edited by lucille on Fri, Jan 23, 15 at 6:06

Appeal to their pocketbook.....
Possible insurance discount
Check to see if property values increase when no smoking is applied
What is the replacement frequency or cost on HVAC systems in condos with smoking units vs. non-smoking
What is the increased likelihood of a fire and thus liability risk/cost
Let them know that having too few voters may result in another future vote which may incur additional election costs. Get out the message vote once - vote healthy!
I like pammyfays idea of the proxy option (if allowed) or a drawing from among those who vote--but only if enough votes are cast to meet the 2/3 minimum

In my HOA we have a hard time getting people to vote. One helpful way is to offer a $10 discount on the next months dues for voting and then the drawing for 1 free month. It helps, but we still never get 2/3 of the community to vote on anything.

Thats a tough one. So many people feel there has been so much rights tampering in general. Property rights groups have gotten very strong in some areas. Non smoking facilities are the top of my list for vacationing and I don't allow anyone to smoke in our home, cars rv or boat. Some people accept no smoking rules better than others. I think you have a real uphill battle, but at least allowing in on the grounds might help. Since the economy has rebounded some, and the units probably have high occupancy rates will be helpful, Some owners may remember the tough times when the vacancy rate was so bad, and will frown on making it more difficult to manage their investments.

I'd go with proxies, if your bylaws allow them. This way anyone who would vote to ban smoking but doesn't want to attend the meeting can give you their proxy to vote for the ban. If you go door to door, you can explain the advantages of the ban (and the disadvantages of being the only place left to allow smoking), encourage people to come vote for themselves, and offer to vote for them as their proxy as a convenience. You can make the same offer by email and paper mail, but you may need to follow up in person to get all the responses you need.

Thanks, all! You have interesting ideas, which I will take to the board. We're in the 'education' phase, but hope to take this to a vote a year from now.

Ownership here is a mixed bag. Very few owners *live* here full time. For most, their condo (or condos) are investments -- with some use as a second home, but intended to earn by generating revenue from vacationers to Maui, and, eventually from appreciation. Some owners never occupy their units -- strictly a business proposition. A few owners do not rent their units at all -- exclusive use as second homes.

I would like to get a count of which owners fall into which group(s). We may need multiple 'pitches'.

As you can see, the usual general apathy is compounded by 'out of sight; out of mind'. Most owners are not present to BE lobbied, but at home in different states and provinces.

The board has 'poked the bear' by bringing this up. Response has been from the most impassioned on each side of the issue. I think there's a whole unknown quantity in the 'middle ground'. I'd like to have some idea that those people are in favor of the ban before we have a big surprise. If only the impassioned vote, that could backfire.

Maybe I need ideas on how to get a reading of owners thus far NOT engaged. Straw vote? Telephone survey to put the points and get opinions?

The complex was completed in 2001. It is on 23 heavily landscaped acres, with clusters of three-story buildings, each with an average of twenty-some units, each with one or two bedrooms and two baths. There are two pools, tennis courts, parking lots, BBQ's, miles of paths, a front desk, etc.

We own one of the smallest units. Our monthly maintenance fee is $545 including water and simple cable TV -- and all the expenses of running the complex including maintenance, general insurance, landscaping, a resident manager, attorneys, management oversight, on and on. It's the tropics; there's LOTS of maintenance!

We all pay RE taxes (triple that of resident homeowners). If we rent, we collect and pay state and county taxes (13.42%). If we don't live on island, we must have a legal representative here to aid guests with any problems at our units. (Many employ one of two main rental agents to do this.) We have utility bills to pay; Maui's electrical rates are huge.

Does that improve your 'picture' of the ownership -- generate further ideas?

Is it the twenty or so units that are the issue here?

How about having an informal visit with a fair number of the folks, either at their place or inviting them for coffee, dessert, etc. to sound them out?

ole joyfoul

OJ -- There are thirteen 'clusters', each having an average of twenty-some units. The total number of units is 316. Few owners are ever on property at the same time. Very few *live* here. About forty do not rent out their units.

Most owners vacation here and rent their units to vacationers when they are not using them. Some never occupy their units and rent them year round.

Some owners who rent do their own bookings. Some have contracts with rental agents on the island to manage their rentals.

Owners reside in several states and provinces on the mainland. A few live overseas.

I appreciate everyone's ideas. Yesterday I discovered that we have only THREE units where owners and their guests smoke.

This may refine the issue to try to only to be sure that when those units turn over, they become non-smoking units -- AND to vigorously go after anyone observed to be smoking anywhere other than the designated benches.

We do enforce Quiet Hours. Issuing warnings about that is part of the job for our night security man. Fines can be imposed -- collected from an owner whose guest is rowdy; the owner reimbursed out of his guest's damage deposit. Last ditch, renters are subject to being evicted if their activities annoy neighbors past 10 p.m. It's in the rental contract that the guest must obey property regulations, which already include smoking regulations.

Thanks for your thoughts!