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ljsandler

$3,000,000 Home-- Should Have Used This Site!

ljsandler
16 years ago

I went to a party last night at a $3,000,000, 8300 square foot home. The family built the house in 2005, with the assistance of an interior designer. The house is gorgeous! The kitchen was about 30 by 30, not including the eating area. Here's some observations about the kitchen:

white plastic outlet covers on cream colored island cabinets and backsplash

common granite--I've seen it many, many times

work triangle from one side of the kitchen to another--sink on one wall, refrig on the opposite wall, 30 feet away and stoves in the middle

If only they had used this site to plan and design this kitchen!!!

Comments (84)

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    Not all onxy is that expensive - I saw some as an accent tile and given how much we'd need it wasn't too bad. I've seen it for far less, but it depends on the quality and the color - of course, I pick the most expensive stuff.

  • ljsandler
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    I'm speechless--I want that onyx!!!

    I have talked to many folks remodeling kitchens and baths who have done little to no research. They have no idea there is an endless world of possiblities, in all price ranges, for their project. I taught my own contractor about the following items, which he had no idea about:

    angled plugmold
    Kichler undercounter lights
    induction cooktop
    Gaggenau steam oven
    5 different kinds of cabinet hardware in one kitchen
    caulk and not grout between the backsplash and the granite
    cabinets that look like furniture instead of cabinets
    recessed light chandeliers

    I scrupulously researched for over a year before I started on my kitchen remodel. It has little to do with price and everything to do with knowing what is available.

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    That's not my bathroom, I chose limestone. I was at that stoneyard shopping for my tiles and saw the beautiful exotic slabs they had in their showroom. I knew I wanted to capture the beauty so I took photos.
    Pharoh, that is Lapis, look at the link I included in the post below it.
    Do any of you like green? This is one huge slab. I think red onyx is the most beautiful but I don't have any photos of red onyx.

    {{!gwi}}

    {{!gwi}}

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    P.S.
    Ask pharaoh to show you his kitchen. If I recall he has backlit onyx. He designed it all himself. One of the most gorgeous kitchens I've ever seen.

    Donna

  • igloochic
    16 years ago

    I was going to point out Pharaoh's kitchen for a great onyx sample :) It's beyond gorgeous.

    I did consider using onyx on the floor of our powder room (we have an onyx sink in there) but I was told it's a better accent tile than full use tile. It's pretty soft. Even at the high cost it wouldn't have been much because we have such a small powder room (7'x3'). You know...I should rethink that...they have to rip up the floor again because the contractors broke a couple of tiles...maybe I should change....Pharaoh...is it really that soft?

  • plllog
    16 years ago

    ODonna, Like green? Oh, man!!! I have two rainforest green marble sink tops, and one verde bahia :) The previous onyx is gorgeous, but the green is OOOOOOOH!

    Please tell me onyx makes a really bad cabinet door. Please? I'm getting really wild ideas....

    Pcjs, I know what you mean. But a lot of people got into flipping when the market was hot without having a clue what they were doing. Rule 1 is know the market. Rule 2 is get in and get out fast because a) your first offer is probably the best you'll get and b) paying mortgage interest is where you lose money. Rule 3 is do it generic and inexpensive, but never, ever, short the details. It's not for the unschooled or faint of heart :) But while I share your opinion that they get what they deserve, I hope for your sake the houses aren't sitting empty devaluing your neighborhood!

    My dream kitchen? In my dream kitchen ODonna's Lapis and green onyx don't clash and I can have both. In my dream kitchen I have a breakfast room and a butler's pantry and a wine cellar. And a butler to get the wine from the cellar, decant it in the pantry and serve it, for casual home dinners, in the breakfast room. In my real kitchen, I may get a small bank of cupboards with a sink to call a "butler's pantry" (even though it's just a furnished passage, and a day help to assist in the kitchen at really big parties.

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    They aren't devaluing the neighborhood and we bought our house undervalue as it was an estate sale and needed updating and lots of repairs (great bones and an easy DIY house as the original owners kept it up well till they could no longer DIY). We're not planning to sell, so even if they do, good, then maybe our property taxes will go down. There are about 5 houses we know of - most are asking over $1 million whereas most of the houses are going for $350-700,000 - the $350,000's are just coming down in price now as they were going for $425,000+ and it was just crazy for a tiny 800-900 square foot house with no basement and not very nice.

    Some of the flip houses are ok, but none of the kitchens except one or two had anything special to them and the few I liked were gross as they didn't have appliances and you could see where they cheated with costs (i.e. granite, etc). Between this board, being our own GC, and being DIY, we probably notice way more than most people, but if you are asking $300,000+ more than your cost of the land and building costs for the new house, make it worth it to the buyer. One house has probably been on the market 3 years - we've been in our house 2 1/2 and it was on the market before we bought ours. The other one I think of I just giggle as that house I desperately wanted after 2 years of looking and only 2 people bid on it, and they took a builder over us for less money (tells me the house had huge problems as they refused a house inspection).... it did sell and went to a weird auction thing.

    Onyx in a cabinet door... humm... now that is something I could go for. I have two doors open for glass as one of these years I'll make glass panels.... humm...

  • plllog
    16 years ago

    Pcjs, I'm glad to hear you're not suffering from the unsold overpriced places. Isn't it amazing how a bad kitchen will look as bad in a $300K house as in a $3M one? But why would someone price at 25% above top of market?

    The first house I offered on when I bought the current had great original details and an iffy redone kitchen and bath which weren't true to the classic Spanish style of the house. I underbid 10% because they were above market, had a few drawbacks, and had that ugly kitchen (nice granite counters though). They didn't sell for over a year, and finally took $6K less than I offered. People are nuts.

    But back to Islander's OPost: I just thought--I have a houseful of awful almond plastic outlet and switch plates. The library has ones that match the shelves. The dining room has an artist made patina'd metal one. Other than that, they're bad. Many of the walls are white! But I haven't gotten around to 'em. It may be that the ones in the $3K house were the ones that the electrician had free for the price and the homeowners just haven't gotten to replacing them. But my kitchen is half the size, and I'm going to gut it to reduce the hike :) Never let someone who doesn't cook design a kitchen!!

  • pharaoh
    16 years ago

    Donna, igloochic,
    Always happy to show photos of the kitchen. it has been a year and we still haven't put in the finishing touches such as molding, a few paint touch ups etc.

    but the onyx is still glowing :)

    I am planning a bathroom remodel now. perhaps thassos white, glass tile, glass countertop, white marble vessel sink, chrome faucetry, modern crystal chandelier...

  • patser
    16 years ago

    This is what makes the world go round....different people, different opinions, different tastes. Differences aren't slams in my books. Differences do not imply right/wrong. Differences are just that - differences.

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    igloochick,
    Actually my favorie is red onyx. I just deleted my pictures of a shower in red onyx. The green comes in a dark and light color. It also comes in white. The wear depends if the floor will be walked on constanly. I think a small powder room would be fine for onyx. It is a rather delicate stone and can sometimes look busy so keep that in mind. The tiles are beautiful though. Go to a reputable stoneyard and ask to see a sample from the boxes that you would be purchasing. The color varies from lot to lot. The price was less than my limestone, But I pushed for a contractor's discount.
    Donna

    pharoah, you should be a designer!

  • mindstorm
    16 years ago

    IMO, antss made a very good observation that has gotten lost in the yen to show over-the-top stone choices in the guise of attention to detail. Antss point is that the large kitchen's too-large work triangle may not be meant for the owners or any single soul to walk between, anyway. It may actually be meant for an entire catering party or service staff to be able to efficiently work at. Not an unlikely conjecture in a $3M house. So, given that very fair assumption, does the house's layout still seem ill conceived, ill-designed, lacking in detail etc.?

    As far as "common granite" goes, I wouldn't have for a counter any of the slabs shown here for love or money. I'd have to assume that the owners had more money than taste! Pharoah's space works and it works beautifully because he's used the richness of the few pieces of onyx to catch the eye in a controlled way in a space that will catch the eye anyway - it could be a black-hole without care or it could be entertaining like pharoah's execution. He's not trying to impress with his acreage of onyx or writhing granite all over the floor or the counters.
    So, if the "common granite" is a tasteful granite, well, taste is a very important component of wealth. :-)

    In essence, I agree with patser. Differences are good, they are hygenic ... c'est la vie and all that. These wild granites may be what you would do with your money, but be assured that there are those who do care about the details who would find this just as revolting as you find a "common granite". :-)

  • ljsandler
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    pharaoh--o la la!!!

    A clarification about what stood out regarding the white plastic outlets in the kitchen. It really wasn't the fact that they were plastic but that the cabinets were cream and the walls were green. The contrast of the colors drew my eye to them first and then to the grandeur of the kitchen second. If the outlets were painted, the color of the island and the wall color, they would not have been noticeable. I even think the almond color would have blended better than the white.

    Second, there are a vast array of granite possiblities between common and "wild" granite. Common granite is not bad, ugly or not to be coveted, just used by alot of folks.

    The family in question does not have catering staff and or service staff in the kitchen. The most they have is a couple of times a year they have one person in to help keep the food stocked during parties. They have a cleaning lady who comes in once a week to clean. Therefore, I stand by my original observation that 30 feet one way is too far to go, especially if you have to go to the refrigerator multiple times.

  • livinwell
    16 years ago

    Pharoah that is one beautiful kitchen. I don't cook much of anything that doesn't go into my microwave, but I would just sit at the dining table, with a nice cup of tea, hot water from the arrowhead water dispenser, and look at that island.

    As many have said "to each his own". My dream kitchen would be, heck, non-existent. There's plenty I could do with an extra room.

  • metaphysician
    16 years ago

    We used golden onyx for our backsplash in 12" tiles. I think it cost about $300 in materials. I love the stuff!

  • plllog
    16 years ago

    I think staff appreciate a well designed kitchen too, even if they're being paid for the hike! :D Whether it's two maids, three catering assistants, or Mom, Dad, Grandma, and Junior doing the cooking, a well designed kitchen is just easier to use. When the owners never set foot in the kitchen, as in the case I mentioned, but not Islander's, they sometimes just don't care :)

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    mindstorm,
    I'm not suggesting that anyone would actually use any of the rare granites I posted. I am just having fun with this post and showing some beautiful,(IMO), and different stone.
    Donna

  • plllog
    16 years ago

    Donna,

    I could be tempted to use one of those gorgeous stones you showed us (though I still think I'll use mostly tile). The trick to using something that wild is that it has to be the star. A lot of people want their countertops to look very plain, either because they keep a lot of stuff on them, or because they put a lot of detailing into other elements, such as panels in the doors and drawers, bead edges (ogees, ropes, etc.), moldings, fancy pulls/knobs and faucets, mosaic or accented backsplashes, etc. With a really wild stone, especially one which incorporates many colors, one is best off with very plain cabinets, no moldings, simple hardware, etc. Just as with anything else, it can be done tastefully, or it can be just hideous. It all depends on context.

  • fnzzy
    16 years ago

    well I have a similar story with a twist - we have friends with a brandy new house. This girl was totally HOUSE obsessed and went over and over and over every detail to the point where it was a bit too much. So we go visit and she's telling me about her granite which was some supposed rare stuff. I personally thought it was kind of ugly but that was my opinion, I could see how much she liked it, she was oohing and ahhhing over everything pointing out all the little swirls to me. But instead of focusing on her granite all I could do was stare at her obviously cheap cheap cheap cheap cabinets. If walmart made cabinets, that's where these came from. They were so horrible. I think she blew her budget on this granite and thought "everyone will focus on my granite so it doesn't matter if i put in cheap cabinets with a crappy install"

    Don't even get me going on the floor.

    My point is, it's all about balance. I think all the things you choose should be balanced appropriately.

  • claudesw
    16 years ago

    Hi--Each to her or his own. I am a rockhound by birth-always looking at the ground to see if there is a treasure there--so I was delighted to choose a granite that had some movement and character-almost like a landscape in a rock--it is not that unusual but I love to work on it. I am more of a rockhound than a cook, but I do love the chance to express myself in my remodeled kitchen--and also pay attention to function.

    Here is a link that might be useful: kitchen remodel

  • jekormanslp_yahoo_com
    16 years ago

    Islander: I have heard of everything you mentioned in your list above. But what in the world are recessed light chandeliers? Do you have pictures or can you refer me to a website where I can see these? Thanks in advance!

  • ljsandler
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Recessed light chandeliers are decorative rims with hanging crystals for recessed lighting. I have 3 over my island as I didn't want pendants. I haven't learned how to post pics yet but here is the website http://www.beaux-artes.com/products/recessed_chandelier_medallionstyles.html
    They are a delight to work with and have the best customer service!

    Here is a link that might be useful: Recessed Light Chandeliers

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    claudesw,
    Your kitchen is gorgeous. I couldn't see your granite very well in the pictures. Do you have a close up?

    The first granite I posted and the onyx are very "busy" and would need to be with a very simple cabinet. The Lapis in person is not really "wild", it's predominately blue. In a all white kitchen, maybe white lacquer cabinets, it would be breathtaking.
    I couldn't afford any of these stones myself, but in a expensive home, if I were the designer, I would have chosen something exotic. Everyone is entitled to their tastes and opinions. Mine has always been a little more "out there".
    Donna

  • fnzzy
    16 years ago

    my thinking though is that there is "simple" cabinetry and then there is cheap cabinetry. Yes, the granite my friend had called for toned down cabinets, without a doubt. But it looked like she understood toned down to mean hang a cardboard box on the wall and call it a day.

  • claudesw
    16 years ago

    Hi organic donna: I thought that I had successfully posted earlier but I guess my post never made it here. I love the blues too and coveted them for a guest bathroom that I am planning to remodel next. When I was at the stoneyard I was just struck dumb by all the fabulous stones. So much eye candy there that I could not pull myself away--I really thought that I was going to have to camp there. I will try posting better pics of the granite when I experiment with my new camera later this week. Thanks for your kind comment.

  • deke
    16 years ago

    lsandler, that's it. I will never invite you to another party if you and your online friends are going to go on and critique my kitchen! :-)

  • oruboris
    16 years ago

    I've noticed at a certain price point [usually well past $3m] kitchens become less important and special, not more: only 'the help' spends time there, so why bother?

  • stovegirl
    16 years ago

    Just goes to show you, money can't buy taste.

  • mindstorm
    16 years ago

    Donna, Ok, I'll share my faves ... :-)

    Here's one of my favorite stones:


    Common as dirt as entire continents of people have it, but I think it is lovely.

    Here's another I love that I did use in my remodel:


    It is big and black and therefore fairly common but only fans of black stones will know that Blues Night or whatever name it goes by now is a subtly different than another black granite.

    Ultimately, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder regardless how many have beheld 'er. (I know, I know, *groan*! but this was my first chance to use this cheesy rejoinder *grin*).

  • sue_ct
    16 years ago

    Donna, is that first slab a marble or one of the white granites?

    Sue

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    mindstorm,
    I love the white stone, is that marble? The second one looks almost like blue eyes, is it? It's beautiful. I don't feel that any stone that was produced by nature is at all "common". I think your granite and your kitchen are both gorgeous. You know how I love modern.
    I took pictures of the stones in the previous post because they were so unusual, something that none of us will ever use in a kitchen.
    Donna

  • antss
    16 years ago

    I think stone in general is so COMMON these days so most everyone around here must be really rich and have no taste.

    "Just goes to show you, money can't buy taste" .............if you choose to believe stovegirl.

    You guys need to rip out those marble and granite and get glass counters,or one of the new clear composites with embeded elements, or zinc tops if you really want to be cool,stylish, and tasteful.

    p.s thanx storm!

  • sue_ct
    16 years ago

    Sorry, I should have addressed the question about the slabs to Mindstorm. Marble or white granite? Looks like marble, but if it is white granite, I would love to know the name.

    Sue

  • mindstorm
    16 years ago

    Sue, Donna, the first one is honed carrara marble.

    Donna, the black one is called "Blues in the Night" and "Blue Night" and also "Blue Polare" granite depending on which fabricator I've seen it at. My vendor called it Blues in the Night when I purchased it.

  • mindstorm
    16 years ago

    Ah, forgot to complete my thought. O_Donna, regarding the black granite, I've read on this board many many times over the years that the only reason to buy a granite would be for its movement and that in particular, it was a waste to buy a black granite 'coz you may as well buy an engineered stone. Well, I couldn't for the life of me find an E-stone I liked nearly as much as this blue-night-polare business. So, I guess I shouldn't have said back there that black granites are maligned as "common" so much as a waste of money and gumption because they are so uniform but I love that black stone of mine with its little blue winking points and the odd white/clear quartz nugget - even if it is the ugly step-child to others. :-)

  • Mick Mick
    16 years ago

    Some of those granites make my skin crawl....*skeeved*

    I am interested in seeing how they look in a "real life" kitchen.

  • igloochic
    16 years ago

    That's a bizzare reaction to a rock...you take your stone more seriously than most I guess. Personally, even if a stone dosen't ring my bells, I've yet to be "skeeved" by a granite or onyx. They're all pretty rocks, just different. :o) It's not like they have bugs crawling over them....oh wait, I did see a fossil embeded granite I loved....

  • Mick Mick
    16 years ago

    "Taking stones seriously"...Come on Igloo...I'm taking stones seriously? lol I wasn't smacking on anyone's taste and if you took it that way, I apologize. The fact is that I have a high sensitivity to certain images and some things make my skin crawl - The Body Wars exhibit, jellyfish, raw chicken, open wounds, etc. And unfortunately deeply veined granites is one of those things.

    Bizarre? Not necessarily. Individual to me? I doubt it.

    Carry on! :)

  • igloochic
    16 years ago

    LOL diva it made me giggle, forgive me if I offended. Your reaction just struck a funny bone I guess (It's been a bad day, I have very few left, I did mean to tease, not to hurt, and if I did so I'm sorry! Now carry on...I'm gonna go stroke my stone :oP (Ok i'm in a hotel and the granite here is really ugly...so maybe not) :oP ....carrying on!

  • reno_fan
    16 years ago

    lsandler, I'm intrigued by the recessed light chandeliers. I'd love to see them in an actual room setting. Is there any chance you could email me photos?

    I'm of the firm opinion that "bling" is good, and those lights have bling!!

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    I have to say that some of your responses to the granites I've posted are not what I expected. I have never said anything negative about anyone's choice of countertop, yet many of you don't mind judging my taste.
    Donna

  • chiefneil
    16 years ago

    "I have to say that some of your responses to the granites I've posted are not what I expected. I have never said anything negative about anyone's choice of countertop, yet many of you don't mind judging my taste."

    I was thinking the same thing Donna.

    BTW, I think the blue in Azul Bahia is lapis lazuli, so your granite does share some of the same ingredients as that beautiful lapis slab you posted.

  • ljsandler
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    reno fan--my kitchen is still in disarray but I will email you some pics when you can see them in a normal setting--maybe in a couple of weeks. They are really beautiful.

    I think that all the granites posted here are lovely. I don't think there is ugly or bad granite--just granite you see often and granite you do not see often.

    Donna--you have impeccable taste! You can come decorate for me anytime!

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

    Thanks for your kind words cheifneil and 1sandler.
    I try and be positive and respectful with my advice and appreciate being treated the same. I understand that we all have very different tastes. I'm not asking any of you to approve my choices, I am just displaying some of the stones that I admired.
    I don't think nature has produced too many ugly things. Even a bullfrog has beauty.
    Donna

  • fnzzy
    16 years ago

    "I don't think nature has produced too many ugly things"

    you've never seen my DH's feet!

  • ljsandler
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    ROTFLMAO!!! Too funny, buffettgirl. Come to think of it, my DH feet aren't that hot either!

  • plllog
    16 years ago

    ROTFL!!

    BTW, lsandler, I'm sorry I got your screenname wrong above :) I kept reading it as "Islander"...must be wishful thinking.

  • fnzzy
    16 years ago

    those stones, however, are a work of nature and are beautiful. Now, granted, they'd look silly in my house, but somewhere they'd look gorgeous.

  • lezard
    16 years ago

    I want see picture of LAPIS LAZULI countertop????

    I can't see it.

  • organic_donna
    16 years ago

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