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jessie21or2

dark wood cabs, drawer front dilemma, down to the wire

jessie21
16 years ago

since march, i have been struggling with how to change my kitchen, trying so hard to find a way to keep most of my high quality cabinets (wood mode, custom from former owners, but with hideous doors that i've lived with for 12-13 years)... and have a new area built to replace desk and microwave cabinet. the cabs were the most important decision for me...the scariest, most expensive, etc. after many trials and rethinkings and such, i gave up on trying to do this myself and finally found a local cabinet guy who will build the new area for me, make and replace all the rest of my doors/drawer fronts, and reface the old cab boxes so all will match. i'm scared beyond belief.

i need to make a couple of decisions in the next couple of days, when i have to put down a deposit and was hoping you could all help.

i know that most wood lovers love natural wood...but for my kitchen cabinets, i want stained wood. really really dark stained wood. i don't want paint...i want to start with wood and then maybe paint in the next kitchen update in 10 or so years :) seriously. so, my first question is, what wood should i choose? i was going to go with cherry but then thought maybe there would be something that would work better but that would not be much more expensive.

i love celticmoon's dark refurbished oak, but does it make sense for me to choose oak when, like celtic, the busy grain kinda bugs me? it would save a little money...not sure how much, maybe 6 or 700. what wood works best with a dark dark stain? the stain color will be another agonizing one when the time comes...soon!...and i am open to all suggestions. should i get cherry?

can anyone show me pics of their really dark cabinets? i did search the finished kitchen blog some, but kept finding ones that look a little medium or medium dark to me.

my other immediate dilemma is that my cab guy was going to make drawer fronts that are similar to the center panel of what will be my new raised panel doors. but i kind of want plain drawer fronts (there would be a teeny groove or eased edge shape on the edges.) my question: is it ok to have plain drawer fronts and raised panel doors? does anyone do this and does anyone have pictures to show me?

sorry this is long. i will have more questions sometime soon.....sure hope you all can help.

Comments (35)

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    We have Kraftmaid Cherry with the Ginger Glaze and I love them but I am a dark wood person - ours aren't dark/dark, but very pretty in person. Here is an older picture:

  • fromflorida
    16 years ago

    There are many wonderful woods that will take a dark stain well -- cherry, of course, but cherry also darkens over time. A less expensive alternative that won't darken as much as cherry is red birch, which has some of the grain qualities of cherry. I would stay away from maple because stain does not always absorb evenly with maple.

    I don't have photos to show, but I have seen many kitchens with raised panel doors and plain drawer fronts. If you look under traditional kitchens in the finished kitchen site I'm sure you will find some examples.

  • dallgower
    16 years ago

    I don't have a picture yet, but my new cabinets will be Alder with a Truffle stain. They are very dark chocolate brown. I stayed away from Cherry because I did not want any red tones in my cabinets

  • Buehl
    16 years ago

    If you like cherry, you might like alder, which is less expensive but has a similar look (a little less red, more brown). It will not darken over time as cherry will but it's quite somewhat softer. If you don't have children or don't care if you get a few dings in the doors or cabinet boxes, it may work for you. It's not so soft that it'll look terrible in a short time, but you may get a few dings more dings over the years than you would get w/a harder wood. We were originally going to get alder b/c of the cost difference, but ultimately decided that:
    ..(1) since we're spending so much on our kitchen (gutting & redoing everything),
    ..(2) I've always loved and wanted cherry, and
    ..(3) I'm kind of a klutz and bump dishes on edges, etc.
    that cherry is really the best for us. I suggest you go through a similar process of questioning yourself and family b/f committing to a wood.

    As to drawer fronts...yes, slab or plain front drawers will look fine w/raised panel doors, even if you have a very detailed door style.

    Omega, a custom & semi-custom cabinet maker, actually offers two drawer front options for their cabinets...detailed look matching doors and slab style. Both look fine and which looks better is strictly a matter of taste.

    I will say, though, that if you have mostly drawers that you might want to think carefully b/f getting slab drawer fronts. Think about what a cabinet run of all slab drawers would look like. Some people like the look, others do not...again, all a matter of taste!

    Good luck & HTH!

  • 3katz4me
    16 years ago

    Mine are quartersawn white oak - dark espresso stain - I don't think this is one of the more economical choices but it's nice (IMHO).

    {{!gwi}}

  • saskatchewan_girl
    16 years ago

    I'm in love with the dark cabinets too. I have about 50+ pics (ummm......maybe more: ) I have been to many cabinet stores and here is a bit of info they gave me. From what I've looked at alder and maple have nice wood grain but not too wide, and they show up really nice with dark stain. Also if you have a raised panel the edges take on a glazed look without the extra cost. The maple is harder wood than the alder but alder is a bit less cost. There is a lot more wider grain in Oak and LOTS of varient grain color in Hickory. Cherry, I was told, takes the dark stain easier and doesn't show as much wood grain and is very smooth and a hard wood (unfortunately out of my budget). Here is a link at one site I look through that shows different woods, stains and styles. http://canada.thomasvillecabinetry.com
    {{!gwi}}


    {{!gwi}}
    If I posted a pic of anyone other kitchen forum person please forgive me, I only have them stored for ideas for the cabinet maker because I really admire them : )

    We will be ordering our cabinets in the next couple days and we decided on a dark mocha/coffee stain on maple, here is a pic of the door style, kinda shaker with an edge in the inside for easier cleaning. Would like the raised panel but it's 20% more (glaze is another 15% too) and our remodel wasn't a planned one, so shaker type it is.
    {{!gwi}}
    If you get lucky susan4664 will post a pic of hers....'to die for' gorgeous!!!
    Hope this helps.

  • lindybarts
    16 years ago

    I have a few pictures in my idea files from the Street of Dreams.

    Dark Cabinets (I think they were Alder but not sure)

    Another shot from the same kitchen

    Maple cabinets (with a Glaze)and slab front drawers with raised panel doors

  • rhome410
    16 years ago

    re: staining oak dark, look at Robin_D's kitchen. I would never have thought 'regular' oak (as opposed to quarter-sawn) could look so wonderful.

    Drawers: Take a look at Sharb's island drawers and doors. Raised panel on the doors, but flat panel with simplified edge on the drawer. Not exactly what you're talking about, but different than mimicking the door on the drawer fronts.
    http://share.shutterfly.com/action/slideshow?a=67b0de21b32c7e5fa4b9&auto=0amp;idx=11&m=1&d=1194839184894

    Frenchkitty also did her top drawers differently than her deeper drawers and her doors.
    http://s122.photobucket.com/albums/o269/frenchkitty_photos/?action=view&current=finishedkitchen001.jpg

    Here is a link that might be useful: robin_d's dark stain on oak

  • nutellasandwiches
    16 years ago

    Here's my favourite dark cabinet inspiration

    Here is a link that might be useful: bosches kitchen

  • jessie21
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    oh my gosh.....i just spent an hour answering each of you individually and then accidentally took a link and my long message is GONE! dang it! i should have opened a new window...just hate it when i do that.

    sorry i can't do it again now..... :(

    anyway, thank you ALL for your tips, suggestions, and especially the pics.

    i do want to say to gibby, i remember your kitchen, thanks for reminding me. it's gorgeous.

    buehl, thanks to your post, it won't be alder. it's pretty, but i know we would ding it up!

    and to nutellasandwiches, i think that might be my favorite dark cab inspiration now too...so rich and dark! thanks for sharing it. and i love your name,...not many people know about nutella, lol.

    saskatchewan girl, now you have me dying to see susan4664's cabs.

    again, thanks to all of you......i think, due to your pics and input, i will go ahead with the slab drawer fronts. i'd love to see even more dark dark cabs!

  • chiefneil
    16 years ago

    Here's a couple photos of my kitchen with dark cabs. The wood is alder.

    Here's a closeup of how the slab drawers look against the raised-panel doors. I'm still dithering about pulls for the wide drawers, so they look kinda plain in this photo. In the photo above you can see some of the drawers with pulls in the lower left corner.

  • saskatchewan_girl
    16 years ago

    Well here are a few more ideas. I'll post a couple with doors/drawers I think you're interested in.......
    {{!gwi}} {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    these are light but show the different drawer fronts
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}

    Hope this helps

  • raehelen
    16 years ago

    We were originally going to go with very dark (almost black) expresso stain on Maple cabinets. It looked gorgeous. We have birch shelves in our den stained very dark green. So, I think both of those woods would be an option for you.

    I would ask your cabinet maker to show you a good sized sample of his staining once you make a decision, before you commit. So that you are clear on what both of you are envisioning. The quality of the staining job and the finishing are going to be as important as the type of wood you go with.

  • jessie21
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    cheifneil, omg, now THAT's what i'm talkin' about! absolutely gorgeous. by any chance, can you tell me what brand and color of stain it is? the whole kitchen is just exquisite...love your floor too.

    saskatchewan girl, you are going above and beyond with your idea pics...thank you! i just love the 2nd and last kitchens.

    raehelen, thanks for the suggestion. i am a little worried about what his staining will be like...he's an older guy who has made cabinets for about 40 years, but has no showroom....just a giant workshop... and i've seen nothing in his shop like the stain i want. but he assured me he'll do a sample and get my approval before staining everything so we may be tweaking when the time comes.

    thanks again, everyone!

  • chiefneil
    16 years ago

    Jessie, my cabinet maker said the finish is from akzo nobel, a color called merlot. I was never able to buy any independently, but presumably professional cabinet shops have access to it.

  • saskatchewan_girl
    16 years ago

    Chiefneil.........absolutely gorgeous!!!! Are you happy with your light countertops? I'm still stuck between light or medium, I guess contrast vs monotone. Your backsplash is so beautiful..did u DIY? Very nice.

  • User
    16 years ago

    Darn all you posters. Now I have total regrets about my painted cabinets. If I had seen some of those kitchens a year ago....

  • jessie21
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    thanks again, chief...

    saskatchewan, i'm having the same dilemma (one of my many), deciding on light or medium counters. i've seen lots of both....love them all! can't wait to see what you come up with.

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    saskatchewan_girl - those are our cabinets you are getting. We love them but don't think they are easier to clean. Ours don't get that dirty, but the dust gets in the groove but I'm too lazy to clean it as we are DIY and still at it.

  • jessie21
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    and i found susan4664's cabs on another thread and you were right. also beautiful.

    Here is a link that might be useful: thread with susan4664's cabs

  • saskatchewan_girl
    16 years ago

    pcjs....hmmm I live in a small town so dust is always an issue. Do you have a glaze on yours? I'm hoping to have the grooves darker without the extra cost of glazing LOL. Because of the cost of raised panel I pretty much have to stick to a shaker style but I DON'T want them flat on the inside edge. Do you have any suggestions?
    Last doors cabinetmaker showed me were like this
    {{!gwi}}

    BTW......susan's cabinets......enjoy : ) If I lived anywhere near her I'b become a cabinet stalker and invite myself for coffee daily just to admire LMAO
    {{!gwi}}
    {{!gwi}}
    saskatchewan girl

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    Ours are Kraftmaid with Cherry with Ginger Glaze. I ordered a tiny size drawer door to make sure it was what I wanted.

    They really aren't that bad with dust but I can see a little. Of course, trying to clean it might help. :) We are DIY redoing our entire house, so I gave up with all but the worst of the dust a long time ago. I absolutely LOVE the cabinets and can't imagine having anything else. Any cabinets are going to get dusty so I would picked based on that. I like them as we have a 1950's house and they go great with well, anything. I would get the glaze or otherwise they'd be boring. It was 10% more for us with Kraftmaid.

    They are made by both Kraftmaid and Premier who is sold by Homeless Depot. The Premier line is cheaper and some of the inserts aren't as nice and they don't have the higher end woods/stains. But the one you were showing looked like their Mocha Glaze Maple. http://www.premiercabinetry.com/gallery/ds_oxford.htm

    We didn't price out the Premier line as I didn't know about them prior to ordering/Gardenweb. But, we wanted Cherry so it wouldn't have mattered. Several others on here ordered the Premier line and were very happy. We will consider them for our basement (these were too $$$) although now I am leaning toward Ikea as they are on metal legs for flooding but I flip back and forth as I don't like Ikea and husband wants to custom build cabinets.

  • chiefneil
    16 years ago

    Saskatchewan_girl, I'm really happy with the white granite in combination with the dark cabinets. I really like the contrast. But it's personal preference - I've seen more complimentary color combinations that look great too.

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    Here is a picture this morning I finally took for the kids of the original owners :) It's a better view of the cabinets - the glazing is the best part and I would think these cabinets would be dull without it.

    We'll paint, finish the bottom of the top cabinet molding and put the double doors between those cabinets in sometime in the next 10 years.

  • saskatchewan_girl
    16 years ago

    Thanks so much for showing me your cabs pcjs, I'm still looking at the other style too.
    Cheifneil, great another dilema for me down the road!!!! LOL.
    sk girl

  • pcjs
    16 years ago

    Our lighting is bad (at some point we will put in a few more recessed lights) so it's hard to see our coloring. Pick your cabinets first, get a sample (i.e. tiny size drawer door) and then countertop shop. We picked Silesstone and I ran to the Silesstone installer (they don't sell directly) who gave me the 12x12 tile and when I got home I hated it. So, that began our great granite search. Ours has whites, off whites, and lots of other browns and some black (not in the original plan to have black). In the initial stages, my husband wanted granite and I wanted Silesstone so I won but in the end, he did as I hated my first choice (which would have looked nice too). And, I never would have guessed I'd pick an granite with movement, but we have a small kitchen so we figured we'd go for it. In person it looks really nice - it would look nicer if we ever finished it.

    Oh, we still haven't cleaned the grooves well so you can see it doesn't show that much but if you look up close you can see some dust. I tease my husband with that and the windows - I only design, buy and install, I don't clean.

  • whenzuc
    16 years ago

    For those of you who stained your alder wood cherry---Are you happy that you chose alder over the cherry? Was it purely for the pricepoint or for the grain? How soft is it compared to cherry? Opinions please- I am stuck between going for cherry, saving $3700 and going for the alder, and saving an add'l $2500 by not glazing. Help please

  • Buehl
    16 years ago

    Whenzuc: Rather than switch to alder or eliminate the glaze, we changed our door style (i.e., stayed w/cherry wood + mandarin stain + coffee glaze). The cabinet "boxes" remained the same and, luckily, the drawer fronts were identical. The change from a high-end door style to lower-end + eliminating 2 pullouts, a breadbox, a 24" x 12" upper & lower cab (Message Center), & eliminating decorative doors on the peninsula seating side, we saved $7,000.

    One big advantage to going that route is that as we save more money, I can purchase doors in the original style (which I love!) and add back most of the things I eliminated. If I had changed the wood and/or glaze, I would not be able to slowly get the kitchen I wanted.

    Something to think about....HTH!

  • lindybarts
    16 years ago

    We opted for the Alder to A) Save Money and B) avoid the red colors of Cherry

    We also opted to eliminate the glaze because we have mitered doors anyway and the stain kind of looks like a glaze in the creases anyway.

    I love how they turned out.

  • whenzuc
    16 years ago

    lindybarts- and others- do you feel that the alder is any softer? Any dings? Do you feel that the alder wood stands on its own and not as a cheap alternative to looking like cherry? Your way saves me over $6500, so that is interesting.Do you feel now that you did not compromise at all?
    Anyone sorry that they changed to alder?

  • scwren
    16 years ago

    I am in the middle of the exact same dilemma...I want dark cabs, but what wood??

    I met with our local cabinet guy last week. He told me that alder prices have sky rocketed lately b/c of increased demand, while cherry prices are falling. He said at this point he could do cherry cheaper then alder. I had him quote the kitchen with both woods...haven't got the info yet...

    Interesting.

  • whenzuc
    16 years ago

    my kitchen designer has quoted me either a 15% or 17% premium for cherry over alder. This equates to $3700. Pretty hefty premium. I Wish that my cabinet guy quoted cherry costs coming down.

  • napagirl
    16 years ago

    A local showroom has a distressed character-grade alder display kitchen that is absolutely beautiful in a nutmeg stain, I believe. Nice thing is, it won't show any dents and dings. Character grade should be a lot cheaper than premium grade. Of course, the green marble counters, with copper apron sink and copper wire door inserts also enhance the Country French look.

  • jessie21
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    bump because i don't want to lose the resourse of this thread....such great photos of dark stained cabinets.....thank you everyone!!!

    update, i did pick my wood and finally my stain. i'm getting cherry wood and the cab guy really worked with me to find a dark stain color i really like....it's a mix of a couple other colors. and my drawer fronts and the new cabinet section are almost done...waiting on new glides for the drawers. i did pick the plain drawer fronts.

    now i have to pick counters and floor and pulls and paint. oh my.........
    too much to even think about right now.

  • mackswim
    16 years ago

    Another option to make a really dark wood cabinet is to use aniline dyes. I am experimenting with wd lockwoods and love the colors I am getting on my white oak. Haven't settled on one yet but pretty sure I am going with Ebony. I am doing slab fronts as well. Looking forward to seeing your pictures!