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Need help with shelving

Posted by debrak_2008 (My Page) on
Fri, Nov 9, 12 at 11:55

Need to fiqure out what to do with this area for shelving.

kitchen9-5027

Original plan was for two floating shelves. The bottom one would be just above the tile and hold the microwave (ge spacesaver). A 2nd shelf somewhere above to hold cookbooks, etc.

A true floating shelf seems to be an issue as we did not plan for this before the dry wall. So I'm looking of ideas and options. Not just for the function of the shelves but the style.

At this point I really don't care if the support is seen, just that it looks good. It can't however be drilled into the tile. The shelf could be slightly above the tile line. Also want to be budget friendly.

Attached is a thread I had regarding support.

Here is one support idea I found.

http://www.containerstore.com/shop/shelving/wallMountedShelving/brackets?productId=10001032

Dh has suggested L brackets flipped so that one part of the L goes up instead of down. He also said we could take one or more of our old cabinets and retrofit them. It would then be easy to attach to the wall. Basically door less cabinets.

Here are some of the elements of my kitchen.

Photobucket

Also the color the the shelves..what should they be? Would 2 black shelves take away from the black pencil line? White as the window trim etc. is white? I thought of stainless but very pricy. Stainless contact paper is costly too but if it works better.

Really need some inspiration and new eyes to look at this. So please tell/show me what you would do and why.

Thank you!

Here is a link that might be useful: microwave on floating shelf


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Need help with shelving

You can still do the floating shelves. Just notch the drywall where the studs are(use a stud finder). Install the L brackets on the studs, then plaster over them. The bottom of the shelf can be routed? with a groove to hid the bracket on the bottom of the shelf from the front view.
Somebody on GW has done this, I think PPS7?


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RE: Need help with shelving

Sorry for bumping this up just hoping to get more ideas.
Even if you just let me know what color you think you would do for the shelves. Try to match the cabinets? black, white? SS look?

localeater, DH will not cut any more drywall. Maybe never again in his life. He requests I find an alternative.


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RE: Need help with shelving

you know where the wall studs are,correct? check out mockett.com and allcabinet parts.com-----supports/brackets of all types for heavy applications or lighter...various depths and suitable for a variety of materials. By default you could have a 27 in wide cabinet installed and suspend the ge spacemaker from screws and a plate down thru the bottom floor of cabinet-no shelf,and with this cab,still have open area nearer window for open shelves-it looks like you have 4-5feet width-you should be able to get this just the way you want.


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RE: Need help with shelving

I can't be of much help on how to do the shelves, except to say that I like the idea of shelves more than using the old cabinet without doors. The shelves will look much more open than the doorless cabinet. I've seen some very cool shelves hung from wires on the ceiling -- check out Houzz to see if you can see those.

I love the gorgeous cabinets and countertop you have. Stainless shelves would be great, but picking up the white of the trim would be nice too, I think. Black might be too heavy-looking.


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RE: Need help with shelving

I think I am the boring not creative person - I would match the shelves to your cabinets - otherwise my right and left brain might go into hyperspace.

Do we need to create a ABS - all but shelf club - I might be part of it as I haven't done our pantry yet.


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RE: Need help with shelving

Showplace Wood prodcuts offers floating shelves- 12" deep, up to 96" wide, and either 2-1/4" or 3" deep, in any wood/finish combo that they offer (which is huge) They list the load rating at 15 lbs per lineal foot. When they first brought these out I was dubious. I'd tried some others from Lowes and no matter what I did to "correct" the problems they would sag and ended up with brackets on em.

So I tried em on my favorite guinea pig- me. I have two in the office at 68" which are mounted to a very bad wall. We were able to toe in one end to increase the load ability since I wanted to put catalogs on them. Solid as a rock. I've installed these into tile in a kitchen for pots and pans on each side of a range, been there 6 mos and I'm not worried.

You will only have to find the studs that you have- for the micro I'd want to toe into the corner.
NOTE- you must follow the mounting instructions exactly!!! I added a piece of wood, perpendiclular to the mounting strip, at each end- just to make it easier to mount them plumb to the wall, would highly recommend doint that.


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RE: Need help with shelving

herbflavor, Thank you for those web sites. Mocketts has a lot of cool brackets. The issue seems to be the load capacity. Interesting idea about the cabinet.

The shelf needs to be 12" deep and 36" long. There is another 8" to the window frame but I'd like to balance it with the other side.

The microwave weighs 35lbs, add another 5 lb for meat in a casserole, thats 40 lbs.

jakuval, Thanks for the suggestion. Looks like I would need at least 20lb per linear foot capacity. Should have calculated this before.

justmakeit and a2gemini, thanks for the color suggestions. Will rule out black. White could be a safe choice. My concern about matching the cabinets is not getting the color right. Buying from the company is too pricy. SS/metal shelving is also costly. Would have to come up with an idea to do a SS look a like. The microwave is black as you may have guessed. I prefer black appliances but I do really like SS in other things. Have a SS sink and range hood TBI, so I thought SS shelves would tie in.

Attached are some brackets I found that can hold 75 - 80 lb could also add a middle bracket for more strength.

Any other suggestions are appreciated.

Here is a link that might be useful: shelf brackets


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RE: Need help with shelving

don't forget-the shelf itself adds to the load capacity.


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RE: Need help with shelving

Excellent point!


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RE: Need help with shelving

debrak,
I recently went through the same mental exercise for my shelves that will hold my microwave, and my husband also is not up for any more drywall cutting -LOL.
I ended up with wooden shelf brackets that are chunky and square and hopefully look contemporary, not country(since I am going for a more contemporary look). I get the feeling that you don't want wooden shelf brackets, I did find lots of metal brackets in my search and I will share them. But also, in response to your point about not wanting shelves from the cabinet company it is possible to just buy matching stain from them and then you can stain your own wooden shelves perfectly. If you want wooden brackets I can give you sources of those as well and you can stain them too.
Bluestone Shelves
From GW Photos
From GW Photos

Mockett
From GW Photos
From GW Photos


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RE: Need help with shelving

Couldn't you do the floating shelf hardware and add an L bracket to the shelf, on the top, BEHIND the microwave for added support there? You'd never see it if you put it back there and then you'd maintain the clean, floating look for the rest of the shelves.


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RE: Need help with shelving

Localeaster, I don't mind wood. The support though can't be onto the tile. I did a quick look at those bluestone shelves and will look more in detail later. Are your supports under the shelf, if so by how much? A little under is fine

Yes a L bracket as you descibe Deedles would work. I can hide one behind the microwave. I would also need to hide the other on that shelf and the 2 on the shelf above. It can be done. I just wish the L brackets I've been seeing are a little nicer looking. Some are clearly not meant to be seen with sharp corners and such. Also some are at a right angle on the outside of the L but slanted on the inside. Hope that make sense. Because they are designed to be used under the shelf.

In the four photos localeaster posted the 1st 2 would work if the size and load capacity are ok. But the 2nd two would not as the brackets are currently positioned. The 3rd does not appear to be able to be flipped. The 4th I think I there is an issue with the size shelf it can handle.

If you are still reading this you are a saint.

Any photos of reversed L brackets that actually look ok? off to google...


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RE: Need help with shelving

I was thinking something purely functional like this that would be hidden from view by the micro and whatever else.

You could notch out the back edge of the shelf, attach the bracket(s) to the wall, slide the shelf on, screw or bolt on from underneath. Even paint the bracket to match the wall color.

Photobucket


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RE: Need help with shelving

I'd really need to see a pic that included more of that area - the window and cabs on the other side.

from what I can now see tho I think black would work - and pick up the black line tile and that in your granite.

there are some really nice looking metal brackets pictured above also.


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RE: Need help with shelving

I think I have really lost my mind....

Deedles you are right you could notch is out. The one you posted looks better than what I've been seeing.

Ok, could the shelf be attached under the bracket??? So the L or whatever bracket would be attached to the wall and to the top of the shelf. Would this work?

I'm on Ikea and so this simple bracket that made me think that I'm thinking about this the wrong way.

Here is a link that might be useful: ikea bracket


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RE: Need help with shelving

I think for the sake of strength you'd want to attach it under the shelf. I guess you could really bolt it through but then you'd have a hump where the bracket sat on the shelf. Probably just the place you want to set something that tips over, lol. And I don't know how long the legs of the L bracket would have to be to hold the weight, either. Microwaves are heavy and so are dishes.

Some of the ikea ones look nice, but it seems you were wanting a 'cleaner' look with the floating idea? That's why I threw the L bracket idea out there.


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RE: Need help with shelving

I would try just sitting a micro there, on its cardboard box and see what you think. It reads open and airy now, but I'm pretty sure it will become "micro in your face", particularly when the door opens. Lots of those pests are 15" deep plus the plug.

Retrofitting a cabinet is ok but the micro will still need at least an extended shelf.

The problem with the Ikea brackets (using valter as an example and I do have them) is that it's tricky to calculate what will happen when you put a deeper shelf on. And it's tricky to estimate how much to allow for people using it because its elevated. As an example, if my popcorn is burning, I'm going to be smacking that door open button with a fair amount of force and may tug the door downwards a little from panic. 5-20 pounds of force? 35 pounds? I have no idea!

Back to the Valter, it's current limit per shelf is 33 lbs. Altho they DON'T EXPLAIN, it's likely they were thinking 2 foot spacing of brackets and an 11 1/4" shelf for ikea. You'll need to use a deeper shelf between 15" and 20". This means that the front edge is a cantilever for 5-10" past the edge of the bracket.

The brackets are taller than the space you seem to have to the outlet from the tile, so you'd need to mount them through the tile to actual studs. That means extra long screws that can't have a wider diameter to compensate for the fact that the screws themselves are more brittle with length as well as harder to install.

I don't know what to think about using those in that situation. Because the valter brackets themselves are junk white wood, my guess is they would fall apart about 3 months later. You'd know when the micro crashed onto the counter and then the floor.

I think what I would choose to to is cut out some drywall below the outlet face plate and strongly screw a nice board (like a 1x3) to the exposed studs - adjusting to make it even to the face of the tile. Then I could install brackets anywhere I wanted plus possibly a french cleat for the shelf. By adding something like 1x2" strips on edge to the front and the back, I would get some weight re-inforcement and add to the stiffness of the shelf. So sorta-kinda like the drawing showing the edge of the arrangement.

I'd also ask casey (user name ci_lantro I believe) and/or other competent woodworkers (which I am surely not).


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RE: Need help with shelving

There is alot to think about here. While I'm working on the technical stuff. Actually will have DH to do that. Dh thinks a 12" deep shelf is fine but I will take the microwave into the master bath. Put it on the counter and plug it in. From this I should be able to get a real measurement as for depth needed. Please keep giving me your thoughts on the color/material of the shelves. I will post another photo in a few minitues.

bmorepanic, your popcorn story made me think about if DH should fasten it down somehow or put a lip on the front of the shelf so it doesn't come forward.


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RE: Need help with shelving

kitchen9-5030


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RE: Need help with shelving

Ooo, is your kitchen turning out nice! I think I like the muffins...er, shelves in black like the pencil tile. Or, matching the cabs would be nice, too. I'd probably stay to darker rather than lighter if it's to be wood.

Purty, purty!

How big is your sink?


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RE: Need help with shelving

Deedles, if you were here I would offer you a muffin. I must confess that my DSIL made them. She has recently retired and keeps baking, much to our delight.

So you would go dark or black? I was afraid it would take away from the pencil line but maybe it would draw more attach to it?

I kept thinking light as in stainless but when I look at this photo maybe it needs to be dark to balance out the cabinets on the other side?

The sink is a blanco super single. Interior width is 26 1/4" wide. Willtv has the same sink. I wanted the biggest single that would fit in a 30" cabinet without cutting the cabinet. She fits perfect and the granite has a very slight postive reveal.


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RE: Need help with shelving

Thought I would post some photos of the somewhat finished product. I'm still decorating.

Thank you for all your help!

 photo kitchen9-5024_zpsb67586c3.jpg

 photo kitchen9-5023_zps8a833bb9.jpg

 photo kitchen9-5022_zps6a028f29.jpg

 photo kitchen9-5021_zps3bd7002b.jpg


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RE: Need help with shelving

http://www.bobvila.com/blogs/how-to-install-floating-shelves/

This is how we installed floating shelves, I think in your kitchen I'd try to go bracketless. And I think I'd do the same color as your cabs for continuity. Anything else might stick out.


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