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lilsarsf

Cabinet Doors in Kitchen: Cherry wood vs. Cherry plywood?

LSSF
9 years ago

Hi!

I am getting cherry cabinet doors in the kitchen. The person making them asked me:
Do you want cherry plywood or cherry (solid) wood?

Which, like every single step of this remodeling adventure, has highlighted how very little I know - and probably caused the cabinet maker to sigh.

My gut reaction was to want to say: just a piece of wood with no toxic resins/other toxins/glues please! Also, I hope to live with and love this kitchen for the rest of my life in this apartment, and I am guessing solid wood is better in the long run? But I have no idea if that is really true.

My current understanding:
Cherry plywood = the door would be one solid piece vs. Cherry wood the doors would be a couple pieces stuck together (they would have a seam) because a piece of wood doesn't come that wide. This idea (1-2 seams per door) might bother me visually, but I don't know.

Cherry plywood = the grain/color would be much more uniform vs. Cherry wood the doors would have a potentially large color and grain pattern range. (This idea (variation in color/grain) doesn't bother me visually - although I hear cherry's color shifts a lot time and the variations might take a clear stain pretty differently).

Plywood = less expensive than wood.

Is that correct? Are there other differences to consider - in a kitchen or in general - that I should know to help me decide better? Do either of these have more potential for warping, etc?

I welcome your experiences/thoughts. I have learned so much from reading your posts -- and I look forward to the day I know enough to contribute to someone else's process! I hope you all can help me understand this.

Thank you!

Comments (16)

  • jakuvall
    9 years ago

    If you are getting a slab (flat) door then get veneer on MDF with solid wood edge banding

    If you are getting a rail and stile door (like shaker) you can get either. If getting a natural or very light finish you may want solid wood so that as it ages the colors match. But there will be noticeable differences in the color of the sticks glued together over time unless they are sequence matched or at least very carefully selected. Note that many better brands that control the veneering process manage to avoid color discrepancy between center panels and frames.

    With mid to deeper tones, or with better quality cabinets, there is no noticeable difference with age.

    My own mid tone cherry from an upper middle brand looks great after ten years. I keep as many aged samples of both as possible to show clients and so I know how each makers product will behave. Ask to see something.

  • LSSF
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Can anyone recommend a website so I could get a better sense of the color options and what solid vs. plywood might look like? I keep doing searches, but I cannot tell which are accurate - I just know what I want the color to more or less end up being. Thanks so much.

    @jakuvall Thank you for your thoughts. I want the doors to settle into a honey-cherry⦠not so dark. So right now the maker is recommending an "oil based" "natural," mostly because I cannot tell what it will look like in a year.

  • HomeChef59
    9 years ago

    Solid wood can warp. I learned this the hard way. It made me a convert to MDF and painted cabinets.

    You want cherry, consider veneer. Veneer has been a time honored tradition. Veneering done well is lovely. I would want a solid base that won't warp. Solid wood sounds good, but in practice it can be a problem.

  • jakuvall
    9 years ago

    Here is a pic of a 4 yo mini base, cherry with a very light stain (Sienna from Showplace) it is barely dark enough to even out grain variation when new.

    In a photo natural cherry of the same age would appear almost identical.
    Raised panel on door shows variation in boards using solid wood. The variation has increased with age. Side of box is veneer which matches well at this point thanks to the light stain.
    You really need to see samples in hand. A couple of weeks in the sun darkens cherry enough to get a rough idea.

  • texaspenny
    9 years ago

    It would help if you told us what style of door you are choosing. If a flat slab, MDF w/ veneer is what you should go with. Here is a pic if my cabinets in natural cherry. They have deepened now just a bit, 18 months later. The grain is horizontal which gives it a different look than vertical.

  • aptosca
    9 years ago

    I'm getting joined solid wood, to the point of trying to not have veneer on any side panels either, though it remains to be seen if I can get that to work.

    In any case, I like the look. That's what my Stickley stuff is made of.

    Personally I notice veneers now and don't like them. They look artificial to me ... but I'm an arts & crafts type, so I'm into "honesty". I notice the repeating patterns and I particularly don't like book-matched stuff. But lots of people do.

    As jakuvall mentioned, there's concern that veneer won't color the same as solid wood over time. I've seen cases where it was obvious and others where it wasn't noticeable. I could never figure out why they were different. People mentioned changes to the wood fiber when cut for veneer, glue, etc., but seemed like the degree of change was unpredictable.

    But if you're slab front or anything where there's little/no solid wood showing, presumably it'll all color relatively the same.

  • LSSF
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Wow - thanks everyone! I think I understand this better now. I like the idea of putting the stains in the sun a couple weeks and going from there! And the photos of the sideways grain? Sooooo cool! I never thought of that!

    I was originally thinking slab - at least for the bottom cabinetry, but I am toying with the idea that the top cabinetry might include two glass corner doors. So that makes me think I should go with a shaker style, since it is a lot going on (and a verrrry small kitchen). I am not sure yet. Like @aptos_ca, I am drawn to solid wood, but I am worried like @homechef59 warned about with the warping.
    But it sounds like:
    For slab, prob go for the cherry plywood, but for the shaker, solid wood = a fine choice.

    Does that sound about right?

  • Texas_Gem
    9 years ago

    I'm no pro but I will pass on what my custom cabinet guy told me.

    "So many people want solid wood because they think it is superior to layered (plywood). They don't understand and I can't seem to make them understand that a solid piece of wood is going to warp a LOT more than plywood."

    Initially, when I started my reno I wanted "all wood" b/c I perceived it to be of a higher quality. After months of research and GW I discovered that, on fact, you should probably NOT use a solid wood in the kitchen unless it is just for rails and styles.

  • susanlynn2012
    9 years ago

    What a good post! It would be great if we could see a kitchen with the plywood using a shaker door and one with just solid cherry using a shaker door to see if we can notice the difference. But solid wood can warp so maybe plywood would be the way to go.

  • aptosca
    9 years ago

    I don't believe warping is really an issue, just based on existing practice:

    In most cabinetry, stiles and rails are solid wood.

    (Fairly?) high end furniture (Stickley) is solid wood.

    So solid wood isn't rare. Based on that, I have a hard time believing warping is an issue. I'm not a wood expert, though.

    While I've not heard about warping, I have heard about movement, particularly when painted. The discussion is usually relative to MDF.

    Thickness is an issue. With raised/reverse raised solid wood you can create a panel that's thicker than the groove in the door frame.

  • GreenDesigns
    9 years ago

    "Plywood" is a misnomer. What you really mean is veneer. A veneered door can give you interesting grain patterns.

    Quarter sawn veneer.

    Rift sawn veneer.

    Plain sawn veneer, horizontally placed.

    Mixed veneers.

    Shaker with solid stiles and rails and veneer center panels.



    Solid cherry pieced center panels with solid cherry stiles and rails. Notice the "striping" effect from using separate pieces of solid wood.
    (CloudSwift's kitchen)

    Badgergal's kitchen.

    Solid woods move and expand much more than do veneers. That's why the center panel on a paneled door needs to float. A slab door composed of solid wood pieces will have a batten on the rear to stabilize it and keep it from cupping and warping. That can interfere with the internal storage capacity of the cabinet.




    Used as a feature on the outside!

  • rwiegand
    9 years ago

    It shouldn't necessarily be possible from a couple feet away to tell whether a given board is veneered or solid. Edge banding is typically a disaster waiting to happen and should be avoided at all costs. MDF panels, if you go that way, can be edged with solid wood, a much more robust solution.

    With solid wood every board is different, and care and attention has to be paid to color and grain matching. (With factory-made cherry cabinets this is frequently, and glaringly not done, then the differences are badly disguised with stain). Plywood will typically be more uniform and free from sapwood.

    The style of door is the primary consideration. Frame and panel doors with raised panel have to be made from solid wood, Slab doors can be done either way. Frame and panel doors, if properly made from well seasoned wood almost never warp. Slab doors will be more prone to change shape with changes in humidity. Some pieces of plywood move more than solid in my experience, other less, and sadly I don't know how to predict which is which in advance.

    Veneer comes in a myriad of forms, either rotary cut or sliced, The sliced veneer can be laid up in random, repeating, or bookmatched patterns to achieve the look you want. A specialty plywood supplier will have all of these options available for a common veneer like cherry. A cabinet maker can also make shop-made veneer to exactly match solid wood parts, assuming he has the sequential boards cut from the same log to permit precise matching. There's no end to how crazy you can get if you're really fussy about color and grain in cherry!

  • boystown
    9 years ago

    badgergal, love your kitchen. What paint color did you choose for your walls? It is very nice and works so well in your kitchen. I have cherry cabinets and black counters and just cannot decide on a wall color. I cannot do green which would be lovely so am inclined to do a nice neutral. Thanks

  • badgergal
    9 years ago

    Gageasgranny, the paint color in my kitchen is Benjamin Moore Hillcrest Tan. It is difficult to show the color accurately in photos. In the picture I posted above it seems to be a little lighter than it is in real life.
    I think the picture below shows the color more accurately. I am not afraid of color and I think darker paint colors can often make the cabinets and whole room look richer.
    In the picture below, the little bumped out area with the windows is painted a lighter color but it's not as light as it appears in the photo.The color for that area is BM's Capilano Bridge.

  • LSSF
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Wow! @badgergal - your kitchen looks awesome, btw. Love the curved doors. And so many people's kitchen - wood vs. veneer - look fantastic. I already feel better! I appreciate everyone for sending in photos and your time in explaining the nuances and your experiences and all. I feel so much better - and like there isn't really a terrible decision⦠just a divergent path to decide about and some warnings on both sides to consider. THANK YOU!