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jhzr2

Removing an original 1925 cabinet

JHZR2
9 years ago

Hi,

Were renovating our 1950s kitchen in our 1925 home to make it both a bit more modern/useful workflow-wise, but also a bit more like original.

We love the 1925 inset door cabinet in our butler's pantry. I'm not sure if it is in its original location, some things point to it having moved, but were not sure.

Anyway, to be more of a focal point, were interested in trying to move it to the other wall in our butler's pantry. But this thing is nailed in really tight.

Nailed in as in toe nailed to the floor, shelves to the frame, and shelves to the wall through the lath.

If we damage the plaster and lath, that's an easy fix. Damaging the cabinet would be heartbreaking. We think moving it to another wall would make it more obvious and more of a focal point, but I don't want to take any chances.

Everything is put together with 2 or 2.5" nails. What to do?

Sorry for the lousy pics.

Comments (12)

  • Jillius
    9 years ago

    I have torn out a bunch of cabinets nailed in very similarly to that. Removing it is going to chip it where you have to take a crowbar or whatever tool to the nailed areas, and the cabinet itself will never be as square as it is again now. That is particularly important for inset doors because then they won't close.

    All in all, I think you shouldn't risk it. What you might consider is having a matching cabinet made to go in the more visible place you wanted this one. A repeat element like that makes you notice both more, and you'd still have the look you want while keeping the history intact.

  • ajc71
    9 years ago

    Can you post a couple pics of the cabinet with the doors open?

  • rococogurl
    9 years ago

    If you are asking this question, you likely don't have the skills/experience to do the job. Why not find, and bring in, a veteran carpenter to help with this task?

  • PRO
    Joseph Corlett, LLC
    9 years ago

    Drive two joint knives between the wall and cabinet and drive a pry bar between them. Insert a shim or shims, pull the knives, and repeat as you work your way around the floor and wall. The cabinet will not be seriously harmed.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Knife

  • sombreuil_mongrel
    9 years ago

    It will either emerge unscathed or be reduced to splinters.
    It was built in place, board upon board, starting with the base (if any), back and sides, shelves, then the faceframe was added, finally the countertop and any small moldings. Removal will be the reverse order.
    Casey

  • GreenDesigns
    9 years ago

    It's built in place, not a separate "cabinet" as is done today. Not really removable without destroying it.

  • missymoo12
    9 years ago

    Are you handy with power tools? Do what trebruchet said then utilize a multimas saw or a reciprocating saw in the gap. Must have a steady hand for this.
    Take the doors off first - duh. That is what makes the cabinet anyway. With a multimax you could remove the face frame from the rest of the cab from the inside.
    If it were mine I would go after that wall to the left first and see what you have going on.
    Don't be upset if you have to take it apart in pieces and re assemble elsewhere. Not really that bad, will be time consuming but absolutely doable.

  • PRO
    Joseph Corlett, LLC
    9 years ago

    "It's built in place, not a separate "cabinet" as is done today. Not really removable without destroying it."

    Nonsense.

    I've removed granite backsplashes successfully with this method and they are much more delicate than wood.

    If you have access to any of the finish nails, use a nail set to drive them all the way through before beginning. You'll have a few holes to fill. They'll add charm.

    This post was edited by Trebruchet on Sat, Sep 13, 14 at 17:22

  • desertsteph
    9 years ago

    "Why not find, and bring in, a veteran carpenter to help with this task?"

    Trebruchet surely knows what he's talking about.

    if you're not sure about doing it, talk with someone who restores old pieces.

  • rmtdoug
    9 years ago

    As with all things wood and fasteners, it depends, but this is how I would approach it first. I'll try to be as comprehensive as possible, but I have to assume you have some basic carpentry skills:

    Work slowly. Remove the doors and all trim. Try and identify as many nails as you can before starting. Try and find all the studs in the wall and look for filled holes on the face of the wood and then look inside the cabinet were you would logically drive a nail. Get a Sawzall and a long flexible metal cutting blade (one with hacksaw teeth). Do not use a "super-duper wood/nail-eater" blade.

    Use Trebuchet's method to pry a gap. Slide the blade into the gap and find the nails. Cut only when you hit a nail and stop when you get through it. Go to the next nail and repeat. You only need a gap wide enough to slide the blade in. Don't worry about damaging the wall. Pry the wood the absolute minimum and try not to cut into the cabinet. Cut as many nails as you can this way.

    If you can't reach all the nails with the saw, use a good hacksaw blade clamped to visegrips and slide it in and hand cut the rest of the nails (this takes real effort, take your time). If you don't have a Sawzall or do not feel comfortable using one, you can cut all the nails with visegrips and a hacksaw blade but be prepared to work at it.

    Once you have the cabinet out, do not drive the nails back out through their holes unless they are box nails (big round heads) because that is the only way to remove those. Even then, drive them out only 1/8" or so and then grasp them with pliers and pull them out the rest of the way while spinning the nail. Always pull them straight out. Do no bend them over as you pull or you will chip the wood. If they are finish nails, you will chip the wood if you drive them out from the front. Rather, pull them all the way through the wood and out the side you cut with the blade. You may have to dig a little hole around the nail stub to get some pliers on them (big lineman pliers work best for this). You can also use a nail set and drive the nails in deep enough to grip the cut end with pliers, but then you have an even larger hole to fill on the face of your wood.

    Having said all that, there are no guarantees any method will work. I've seen stuff like this that had so many nails that it was impossible to save.

  • _sophiewheeler
    9 years ago

    A built in place cabinet won't have any sides. Or back. It's a faceframe between the walls, usually with some cleats nailed to the walls to support the shelving inside. Sure, you can probably pry the faceframe off, but you won't get the shelving with it, and when you're done, you won't have a cabinet to put somewhere else. You'll have a faceframe that needs a cabinet maker to construct a cabinet box and join it to it to be placed anywhere else.

  • JHZR2
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I owe this thread an update.

    The cabinet has one side, I guess to close it off on the exposed end. Otherwise the shelves are affixed to the walls.

    I took the advice of trebuchet.

    "Drive two joint knives between the wall and cabinet and drive a pry bar between them. Insert a shim or shims, pull the knives, and repeat as you work your way around the floor and wall. The cabinet will not be seriously harmed."

    I did this with the exception that I used my fein oscillating saw and cut the nails at wall/floor level (enough of a shaft to pull the nails). There were a TON. Excessive is the word that comes to mind.

    Where we are going to re-install, the side without a wood "side" will go against a wall of plaster and lathe, so I can just re-nail (or likely screw for the sake of the plaster) the supporting wood piece that goes under the shelf that came off when we removed the cabinet. Some of the other spots to affix the cabinet may be a bit trickier, but I think we will figure something out.

    Not sure if tow nailing the bottom edge back down is the best/smartest way. Would I be better off taking a small wood strip, screwing it horizontally into the cabinet and then vertically into the floor? Ditto but turned for the other cabinet structures?

    Thanks!