I like the open look created by moving the fridge to the opposite wall and adding a peninsula. The stove might be better in it's original location, to get it out of the sink area. A few other things I would change:

1 - Replace proposed wall corner cabinets with Wall Diagonal Corner Cabinet
2 - Remove open shelves to the left and right of window and use larger wall cabinets
3 - Swap out Base and Wall cabinet to the right of the fridge for a pantry

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen Cabinet Kings

I like moving the fridge. It's going to give you the counter space you need around the main prep and clean up areas. But, I agree that the breakfast bar is a bit "iffy"--some of what you gain by moving the fridge, you're losing by adding the breakfast bar.

If you keep the L shape kitchen, you would have more options on stove/sink placement. How do you feel about moving the sink away from the window? That would give you more options on sink placement (but add to possible plumbing expenses).

KabinetKing's idea of putting in a tall pantry would give you more storage.

Are you keeping the half-wall (assuming so since you don't want to mess with flooring)? Where is that wall in the cabinet drawings? Next to the cabinet next to the fridge? Are you going to reserve some floor space for a dog feeding area?

You're also using that floor space for a trash can--does your cabinet plan include a trash pull-out? It's nice to hide the trash if you can.

Can you draw your existing layout with measurements and door/window locations? It makes it a lot easier for folks here to mentally rearrange things.

I'd change the bottom cabinets on the right wall to drawers as well as the cab next to the frig.

I really like your hutch/china cabinet in the DR! Once you get the curtains up (I'm assuming you're putting up curtains b/c you have curtain rods above the windows), that space will be very warm and inviting!

A few things about the kitchen...

How deep is your DR? Can you afford to lose space to the counter seating? Since you have a floor height difference, the safest configuration would be to have the cabinets "end" at the height transition and have the stools on the DR side of the floor. But, then the stools start encroaching on the DR space.

I think your kitchen has very good potential. If you could post a measured layout of the space (it can be a blank space with measurements, don't worry about adding appliances & cabinets), it would really help us help you! See the "Layout Help" topic of the "Read Me" thread (linked below) for more information. It has some questions that will help us as well. Include a rough drawing of the entire first floor so we can see how the kitchen relates to the rest of your home...including traffic patterns.

Can the window over the sink be changed/moved? Does the sink have to be under the window? Today, far more time is spent prepping (70%) than cleaning up (20%), so the "sink under a window" isn't really as necessary today as it used to be (pre-DWs).

Corner cabinets...keep them 90-degree cuts...it opens up the space much better. Diagonal upper cabinets are often "in your face" and when in a tight space, like in your kitchen, they make the space look even more cluttered. What I would do in that corner is use an upper corner cabinet that has the 90-degree cut, not a blind corner cabinet (I can't tell from the pics which you have...) My MIL has blind corner upper and base cabinets...and they're awful! The worst are the upper cabinets, it's almost impossible to get into the blind corner. She doesn't store anything in the "blind corner" and tries very hard not to let anything fall into it. That makes that space a waste of space. A full corner cabinet would allow you to use the entire space, even if some of it is for seldom used items. Similarly for the base cabinet. In your tight corner, don't put in a diagonal b/c it takes away quite a bit from the floor space. (The bit of added counter in the deep corner with a diagonal cabinet isn't useful.)

I agree about the shelves, though. Unless you need them (for plants), I would eliminate them to open up that space.

As to the refrigerator/pantry suggestion, only put in a pantry cabinet if you will have landing space for the refrigerator within 48". If you don't, then I would leave that space as a base + upper. Do you have a separate pantry elsewhere (not a pantry cabinet, I mean a step-in/reach-in/walk-in pantry)? Those pantries, if configured properly, are the best use of space and the best pantries...you have access to the entire space...wall-to-wall and floor-to-ceiling w/o cabinet walls & ceilings limiting you. Plus,...

First thing that jumped out at me is that 26" or so between sink and range is too small, as Buehl notes. I hated that in my kitchen -- also a primary driver of my remodel.

My solution was same as Janet's -- keep the L instead of adding the peninsula/breakfast bar. Then you can scoot the range a bit to the left.

Then I had a crazy (?) idea. Do all that, but then add the peninsula back in, putting it where you have your half wall now, to the right of the new fridge. There are certainly disadvantages (like directing traffic potentially too close to the range), but they may be manageable. It will be easier to tell with an overhead sketch.

Thanks for the input so far.
Here's a little more about "us". Right now there are 4 of us - me, my husband, 4.5 yr old son and 3-month old son. We might add child #3 in the future. I do all of the cooking, my husband does the dishes. We don't entertain a ton, but do host Christmas for the extended family.

Here are the dimensions of the kitchen:

Here's the floorplan of the first level (including additional measurements for the dining room area)

We do plan on this being our "forever" home, so we want to make sure we do this right!

Should there be a second window on that 92.5 inch wall? One over the sink, and one where the slider is on your proposal drawing?

The window (slider) is in the DR...on the other side of the 38" "Full Wall" in the drawing above.

Is this it?

Is the refrigerator a "counter depth" model? (I.e., refrigerator box = 24" deep and with the doors + handles, around 31" deep)?

Or is it a "standard depth" refrigerator (33" or more deep, usually)?

Are you replacing this refrigerator with the remodel?

If so, do you have room for this refrigerator in the basement?

+++

Is the range a 30" range?

+++

Is the sink base 30"?

Here are some ideas to continue discussions...

I have to be honest, I think your DR is too narrow to take any more space from it to accommodate seating at a peninsula. If you had nothing but a table & chairs (i.e., no china cabinet), you might be able to fit seating...especially if you went to a banquette, but not as it stands.

I've done some with/some without the peninsula as well as peninsulas with & without seating. I did not do one w/o the china cabinet & with banquette...

Layout #1

Layout #2

Layout #3

I really dislike the DW in the Prep Zone like this (and in #4), but you are very limited on kitchen depth, especially with the Garage/Basement jutting out into the space. If you had more length and/or the flexibility to move the kitchen window, I'd do something like my kitchen, but you don't have the length or the window location. Hmmm...I don't think you mentioned whether you could move the window...could you?

Layout #4

Layout #5

If I had to choose, I'd probably pick either #5 or #2 without the seating.

I didn't even get a chance to answer the original questions :)
Fridge - were planning a 36" counter-depth, side-by-side.
Stove - 30", electric
Sink Base - 30" is what we'd go with.

Your missing dimensions are correct.

I'm on the fence about moving the window. I feared it would cost a lot of money, but I'm concerned about how much it limits our flexibility.
The more I've thought about it, the more I think the breakfast bar seating has to go.

chiefy76,
The house I grew up in had a breatfast bar that jutted into dining. The DR was too narrow/small to accomodate the bar with seating adequately. My parents got some stools and put them there anyrae... It made it so that neither the bar nor the table were comfortable.

I think having a counterspace is what you need. Since the DR is so close, you can have people sit at the table.

I would probably move the tall pantry next to the frig and put the MW under counter. I prefer the counter space versus having MW above. I don't use MW often enough to lose the counter space for it.

#5 seems to tight between sink and range with only 15 inches...

I like the corner sink idea if you don't move the window.

One thing your existing kitchen has that none of Buehl's layouts have is a pet feeding area. Do you have another place in the house to move that, or should there be space in the kitchen?

You can fit only so much in a limited space. Yes, there are all kinds of things to add to a kitchen, but with limited space, you have to start weeding out the "wants" from the "needs". Typical "needs": storage, workspace, functional layout.

Take the example of the cat feeding area...there are some places you could place it with or without taking up valuable storage space:

• On the DR side of the MW/Snack center

• Eliminate the bottom drawer of the 24" cabinet next to the refrigerator, finish it, and put the cat dish inside the alcove that creates. I recommend making the middle drawer a bit shallower so you create an alcove the cat can be standing under w/o hitting the top of the alcove.

• Is there a place in the hallway? (That's where we feed our dogs)

• You have a large LR/Playroom & a large FR...perhaps there's a place for them there

That last item brings up an idea...albeit it will probably not be cheap...

Have you considered doing the following?

(1) Move the Kitchen to the DR and take up all the space b/w the DR far wall (where the china cabinet is) to the Hallway doorway.

(2) On the outside wall, b/w the new side wall of the kitchen (flush with the beginning of the Hallway doorway) and the Powder Room, put in a pantry.

(3) Turn part of the FR into the DR

(4) Turn the rest of the FR into a Formal LR, including putting up a wall b/w the new DR & LR

(5) Turn the LR/Playroom into the everyday FR (perhaps with cubbies for toys & books)

Something like this:

It's just a thought!

I do like the corner sink - it definitely opens up a lot of options.

We do need to figure out somewhere for the pet food/litter box. I think I can squeeze it into the "dining room" area by the fridge, if the wall is gone.

I've been sitting with these layouts for a couple of days. I really like layout #2 - but the 45" upper at the end of the stove wall is really bothering me. I think it'll be impossible to open the left-hand door (reaching over the counter) and the right hand door has to open into your face - making that whole cabinet pretty un-usable.

Are there any other ways to address ending the upper cabs effectively since there not turning the corner like the lower cabs?

Just make that cabinet space shorter... You could shorten it to 36" and it will still be a factor of 9 (to match the 9" cabinet on the other side.) (I'm taller than average and have very long arms and the cabinets that go that far in my kitchen are fine...all the way up to the top shelf of 36" tall cabs, but if you're average height or have short arms, I can see that it might be an issue.)

BTW...that's not a 45" cabinet...that's just showing you that you have 45" to play with for configuring cabinets however you like. Other than "specialty cabinets" (trash pullouts, appliance cabinets, sink bases, pantry/utility cabs), I don't specify specific cab sizes...I just show the total amount of space you have to work with. It's up to you to find a configuration you like. I do try to create spaces that can be configured similarly (like on either side of a window or vent hood), but it's not always possible given the space. For example, in my kitchen I have 3 cabs on each side of my hood...18" + 21" + 18". They add up to 57". If I were drawing it up, I would have just shown the 57" on each side of my hood, not each individual cabinet. Aesthetic configurations of cabinets are very personal, so I don't usually go into that much detail.

If the "abrupt" ending is bothering you, you might consider angled open shelves on the ends. Just put decorative items on the shelves that you don't have to use/move very often.

There are probably other ways to end the cabinet...anyone else???

We do need to figure out somewhere for the pet food/litter box. I think I can squeeze it into the "dining room" area by the fridge, if the wall is gone.

Maybe a cabinet opening into the dining room like options 4 and 5 would be a place to store cat food and kitty litter close by?

I've been sitting with these layouts for a couple of days. I really like layout #2 - but the 45" upper at the end of the stove wall is really bothering me. I think it'll be impossible to open the left-hand door (reaching over the counter) and the right hand door has to open into your face - making that whole cabinet pretty un-usable.

The right hand door might not be too bad: double check by opening doors of various sizes in a showroom. The left-hand door looks like a stretch, especially if you are not tall.

A 21 inch wide cabinet which does not go over the peninsula at all would probably look OK, but may not give you enough storage?

I just realized that since I"m not doing the breakfast overhang, I can easily turn that last cabinet around so it opens from the dining room.

I think I'd also extend the counter next to the fridge and angle it into the wall so I can sneak the cat food under there and gain some extra counter space next to the fridge.

DH is NOT convinced there's enough space between the sink and the dishwasher. We might have to go back to the drawing board.

12" is considered the minimum in this situation. 18" would be better, but you have limited space.