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timss_gw

lifetime sealer

timss
15 years ago

HI,has anyone had GRANITE SHIELD put on countertops,stainless or shower doors? I've been to their website they have demos looks like it works really well

and it's gauranteed,I am so sick of sealing granite,

thats what I had the pleasure of doing for the holiday

Comments (65)

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    yes,I,have used a few different sealers (impregnators)
    they all are pretty much the same,
    but all of them are temporary,
    that's why I was asking about that specific product.
    There are granite shops around that will give you a warranty but they tell you to wipe up spills right
    away and use coasters and all kinds of things that
    any of my kids will ever do. So far only 1 I found
    has a realistic no questions asked warranty I'm hoping
    to get some feedback from someone who has tried it
    Thanks
    Tim

  • peggross1
    15 years ago

    It is my understanding that sealers protect against staining only, and NOT etching.

    (right, Bill?)

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Correct.

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Posted by bill_vincent (billvincent@hotmail.com) on Wed, Jul 9, 08 at 22:40

    If the sponge leaves a dark spot, it needs to be sealed.

    Posted by bill_vincent (billvincent@hotmail.com) on Sun, Jul 13, 08 at 17:50
    timss-- Just because the stone shows a wet spot doesn't mean the sealer's not working!

    Bill, O.K ?????? which one ?????

  • Babka NorCal 9b
    15 years ago

    timss-

    He listed three sealers in a post above. You get to pick one.

    -Babka

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Babka

    I am not asking which sealer. I have used 2 of those and
    they did not do the job, I am asking which of the two posts
    that I quoted him on is the correct statement as they are
    conflicting
    THANKS

  • vrjames
    15 years ago

    tim,

    there are several directions to this thread, I will try to pull a few together.

    1.) granite Shield, which has been well advertised here on the GW is really an unknown to me. When I linked a few months ago to their U Tube advertisement about how great it is, they plainly stated that it is a topical "shield" that dries on top of the stone. IMHO topical treatments are absolutely undesirable because they have a long history of discoloring over time and there is nothing to be done to repair the damage. Maybe Graniteshield has overcome the hurdle, but I think if they had they would be advertising in the Major trade mags and the large stone supply companies would be pushing it hard. All of us would like to make the stone impervious to staining.

    2.) The wet towel test is not entirely accurate as previously stated here. some water will get through the sealer, but it will disappear. This brings me to defining a "stain" and moisture in a stone. Water "moisture" will wick out fairly quickly. A stain needs to be removed via a poultice.

    3.) Since you began this thread on one track, and then divulged the fact your stone has been in 8 yrs and you did nothing for 4 years. You may very well have stained your granite. Before you put any more sealer on your stone, you need to have it cleaned. If you put Granite shield on top of the stained granite, you will still have stained granite under the "shield".

    I would recommend having a restoration professional look at your stone and advise you on what to do.

    Blessings

  • remodelqueen
    15 years ago

    Sorry, timss. I forgot to call and find out what was used until just now. It was Granite Shield. They offered to apply it to my BBQ, and other stainless steel items ($50 per appliance) but I didn't have the extra money at the time. Wish I would have.

    The company informed me that they don't use GS anymore (new owners), but I am glad I was able to get it. Hope that helps a little.

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    If the sponge leaves a dark spot, it needs to be sealed.

    Posted by bill_vincent (billvincent@hotmail.com) on Sun, Jul 13, 08 at 17:50
    timss-- Just because the stone shows a wet spot doesn't mean the sealer's not working!

    Bill, O.K ?????? which one ?????

    Timss, those two statements are NOT in conflict. If the sponge test leaves a dark spot, it shows that the stone is absorbant enough that it needs to be sealed against staining. NO WHERE did I say that the sealing should STOP the absorbsion of liquids!

    James-- it was not inaccurate. The test is meant to be done on UNSEALED stone. The whole point of the test is to see if sealer is necessary AT ALL or not. Not to see if the old sealer has worn off. As you're aware, it won't mean anything with breatheable sealers, as I tried to explain to Timss above.

  • vrjames
    15 years ago

    Bill, sorry, I was speaking with regards to here on the GW. Many posters are confusing wet spots with stains.

    The wet cloth test has a variable to the absorbancy rate depending upon type of stone, sealed or resined and amount of time the wetting agent is allowed to sit.

    I have dealt with this issue twice in the last few weeks. consumers think the stone should be impervious after sealing.

    Blessings

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Hi everyone,
    Really confused now, granite company says my stone doesn't
    need to be sealed at all, so why do I have stains ?
    I get a different story everywhere I turn for help.
    I know why, because nobody really knows for sure,
    Too many procedures Too many opinions too many experts
    Not enough straight answers.

    Thanks remodelqueen,
    That helps allot, A real answer from a real person. I'm definitely calling GRANITE SHEILD. Their warranty seems to be the best one out there. I haven't heard or read anything bad about it from someone who has had it done.

    James, their warranty does say it is warranted against adverse change so I guess they got it covered,
    I was sceptical too but I just can't find anything bad about it.
    Thanks
    Tim

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    I got to this site by luck, but it is great to see how all of you give some inputs from experience. I personally have some knowledge on stones that might help some of you.

    First.
    MAINTENANCE: Leaving a sponge overnight on a natural stone is not recommended, even with the better of sealers. Cleanliness is the first and most important item on the list. You have a several thousand $ counter, treat it that way.
    Second.
    Sealers will work differently on different natural stones. Even the brands that are mentioned above have several types, ie. for marble, granite, acid proof, polished surfaces, exterior applications, Color enhancing sealers, etc. vrjames mentioned "I would recommend having a restoration professional look at your stone and advise you on what to do" One of the better suggestions so far.

    If you must do the application yourself, please make sure that if there is any sealer that was applied before, it must be cleansed, usually you can get a stripper (it's a chemical, don't get any funny ideas) to basically strip the old sealer off. Then clean it off, with something like acetone, if there is moisture trapped in the stone it is better to let the moisture out. HOW? I've used a blowtorch (small torch at home, professional torch at work) I don't recommend anyone to do this unless they are qualified. Then you can apply the new sealer.

    I'll do some research on Granite Shield, personally I haven't used it, but please there are many types of sealers in the market, one of them will be right for you. Check with the MIA (Marble Institute of America) for Literature and advices so you don't get false promises.

    Hope this helps,

    Vic

    Here is a link that might be useful: MIA

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    Just a note, the lifetime warranty is for the sealer to be reapplied as many times as needed, if there is any stain on the stone already, they will not replace or reimburse any money. Don't get desperate Tim, read the link for the MIA-Sealing Stones on this post. Contact them, if necessary, because you have a great investment and they are there to help you.

    Thanks,

    Vic

    Here is a link that might be useful: MIA Sealing Stones

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Vic-- Nice to see another pro come on board!! Welcome to the fray!!

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Vic,
    where do I get my blowtorch qualification papers ?
    just kidding
    the links are helpful, they talk about low quality
    topical sealers but from what I understand GRANITE SHIELD
    is high quality and has been highly recommended by it's consumers. They also are members of MIA and the BBB and are
    in good standing,
    please let me know what you turn up.
    Thank you
    Tim

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    Thanks Bill, believe me I am not a pro, I just happen to love natural stone, if I was a kid I would say that I want to grow up to be a geologist :)

    I'll be happy to give some advices but please let's do our homework because an investment from $3K to $15K or above is not something to take lightly.

    Thanks

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    Tim,

    Are you a salesperson for this sealer? Some friends in the industry tell me that someone with the username "Tims" has been posting similar topics such as your's on different forums, I see you keep writing the sealer's name in capital letters (maybe you want us to pay attention to something?)

    In October we will have the StoneExpo @ vegas, I see that last time GS was at the show was on 2005, plus I don't know about the MIA certification for them, the rest (BBB, NKBA,etc) is not that they're not important but almost any company can get them.

    I've been in working with natural stones for sometime, and work close to where this sealer's headquarters are, and it amazes me that if it is such a great product, all the 'PROS'(right, Bill?) should be using it, and it shouldn't be advertised to the customers direct, whom because of lack of knowledge or false promises can be made to buy a product that CAN damage (not will, CAN) their stones. Before we advice anyone to use any product we should experiment it.

    With so many different products in the market and so many minerals in natural stone,one sealer will not be the answer for everything. Lifetime warranty, I doubt it, reapplying a sealer for a lifetime is something that would be more credible.

  • vrjames
    15 years ago

    Vic, I would like to welcome you as well into the fray.

    I have noticed from Tims responses as well that he is yet another of Granite Shield's customers? (sales people) that have occupied this forum for about a year now and as I posted earlier almost the same thoughts as yours.

    This Tim has been more tenacious then the others though.

    I have no axe against GS except for the companies attempts at free advertising here through deceptive means.

    Blessings

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    WRONG,
    I stopped using their name because I was accused of being
    connected . meanwhile names of products are being used
    all over this site but that's o.k
    I say it and I'M a salesman.
    Can you tell me how I can find out about something
    without mentioning it,

    Oh, by the way vic you mentioned their name in your first
    post tell the truth your their sales manager aren't you

    THANKS FOR THE HELP
    WHAT THE

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    Thanks James,

    As you know it is hard to give advice on which products to use. We pay thousands of dollars on our kitchen and bathroom remodels. It is unethical to advertise in such a deceiving manner.

    Check the link below, is it me or was it a coincidence that on Jul-03-08 someone with the Username 'Tims' started a thread with the same header as this. Hmmm... interesting. He claims that he is a Fabricator?

    Customers should read this and see the problems that this company is causing.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Fabricator's Forum

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    YEA, YOUR RIGHT, I ASKED THE SAME QUESTION ON ANOTHER FORUM
    AND GOT THE SAME RESPONSE TO MY QUESTION, YES QUESTION,
    I NEVER SAID HEY, EVERYBODY, TRY GRANITE SHIELD, OR YOU
    NEED GRANITE SHIELD, BUT SOMEHOW, I END UP GETTING THE SAME
    KIND OF FEEDBACK FROM PEOPLE WHO JUST HAPPEN TO BE FRIENDS
    AND SEEM TO BE VERY THREATEND BY THE VERY MENTION OF A NAME, THAT TELLS ME THERES SOMETHING TO THIS.
    I'M LOOKING FOR FEEDBACK ON SOMETHING I'M VERY INTRESTED IN
    LIKE A HOME OWNER THAT HAS SOMETHING BAD TO SAY ABOUT IT
    LIKE I SAID BEFORE IT'S SOMETHING I CANT'T FIND
    I CAN ONLY FIND PEOPLE WHO HAVE NEVER USED IT, YET DON'T WANT TO DISCUSS IT WITHOUT GETTING DEFENSIVE AND ABRASSIVE.

    SO MAKE SOUND ANY WAY YOU WAN'T

    THANKS AGAIN

  • remodelqueen
    15 years ago

    This thread is irritating. Let's let it drop off of the forum.

    I'm sorry I even spoke up about my positive (yes, positive) experience with GS.

    Posting on one forum acting like a concerned homeowner, and saying you are a fabricator on another is a huge red flag as to what you are trying to accomplish here. We actually have a friendly forum here, we'd like to keep it that way.

    On a petty note, writing in all CAPS is super irritating. And it implies that you are really angry.

  • vrjames
    15 years ago

    tim, you have been called out.

    If this is the way Granite Shield wants to sell its product they are seriously in trouble.

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Your kidding right, I am a fabricator and I do have granite stains in my own house.
    because the sealers out there aren't working for me or my
    customers that's how I became interested in this product
    but somehow asking around before investing my money is
    a bad thing.
    so I really don't understand what you think your calling
    me out on because I never pushed any products and I did not
    post anything that wasn't true
    sorry I wasn't invited into your click but that's not what I
    was trying to do anyway
    I was trying to hear from someone like remodelqueen who you
    have convinced I am the Antichrist

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Just another lowlife

    I wasn't going to say anything, but I had a feeling. Every single time, now, without fail, that Granite Shield has been mentioned in this forum (and I've been here for about 4 years now), it's been a Granite Shield salesman who's brought it up, trying to play the part of a homeowner.

    I don't care HOW good the product is, I'm already suspicious of it because of their shady marketing practices.

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    its hard writing in all lower case

  • vic.s
    15 years ago

    Tim

    Don't get mad, if your product is as good as you claim, we will all use it, but before we can suggest it to any homeowner, we must experiment it. I'm willing to try it on several natural stones and see the results, if it's as good as you claim then I, am sure all of us, will ask for an apology. Unfortunately to see if it will be good for a lifetime, then you would never get an answer from any of us, maybe from our daughters, sons or grandkids. Don't get the industry to be against you, because as Bill stated that no matter how 'good' your product might be, you're sending everything down the drain.

    Hope to see you guys @ StoneExpo in October, and show the industry what you got, you guys are going to be @ StoneExpo right?

  • remodelqueen
    15 years ago

    If I thought you were the anti- Christ, I'd cross myself 3 times and run like the wind!!

    I just think you are sneaky and possibly benefiting yourself (monetarily) by discussing GS.

    The product has worked for me, as I have already stated. But, I don't like sneaky business tactics. If you are affiliated with GS in any way, it would deter me from using the product. I don't do business (hand over the money that my husband works damn hard for) with sneaky companies. I'd rather you come to this forum and say "Hey, I work for GS and it is a great product, if anyone has any questions please don't hesitate to ask."

    Anyhow, hopefully I'll get the soapstone counters I have been dreaming of. Then I won't have to worry about sealing it. I'll just oil away!!!

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    your all nuts I tell ya

  • defusco
    15 years ago

    Hi...I see Timms made it here to! He has been advertising the heck out of this product on granitehelp.info and I would like to shed some light here:
    Timms is a fabricator. He is also a granite shield dealer. If you want to see he is making the same todo at that site here is the thread:
    http://granitehelp.info/index.php/topic,828.0.html

    Properly sealed granite should last years unless acted upon by an outside source like an alkaline solution (a poultice IS an alkaline solution, so are Drano, Easy off, Lye soap, etc). A stain may be lifted with an alkaline solution as well as a sealer.

    Smarge, you mention MB Stone Care and Maurizio has a great reputation. I like him already and we have never met.

    Bill, you mention Aquamix Sealers Choice Gold, Miracle's 511 Impregnator, or Stone Tech's Impregnator Pro. Have you guys ever tried products By Tenax like Hydrex, Protex or Ager? They are top quality and work well. The last is a color enhancer that gives the wet look as well as being an impregnating sealer.

    Granite shield is topical and impregnating? If that's true what's the point? Might as well bury your counter under 1/4" of acrylic.

    That's just my $0.02

    Mark DeFusco
    DeFusco Industrial Supply

    p.s - if any of you contractrs would like a catalog let me know.

    Here is a link that might be useful: DeFusco Industrial Supply

  • hotgranitekills
    15 years ago

    Ha! Par for the course. Only in the granite industry, from top to bottom.

    I think timss is Al!

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Have you guys ever tried products By Tenax like Hydrex, Protex or Ager?

    Hey Mark-- There are MANY good sealers on the market. Someone, either in this thread or another one, brought up Maurizio's sealers, too, which are also top quality sealers. I've also heard alot of good things specifically about the Ager sealers. The reason I hawk the three that I do, is that they're the quality sealers that are most easily accessible to most people. The others, many times, you really have to go searching for.

    Ha! Par for the course. Only in the granite industry, from top to bottom.

    I think timss is Al!

    Atleast we're not going around trying to convince people about how the toxic waste from solid surface fabrication could kill ya.

  • remodelqueen
    15 years ago

    We don't call ourselves "nuts" around here. The correct term is TKO!

  • monicakm_gw
    15 years ago

    Whew! Lots to read and I'm not having a granite problem so I skipped the last half of these replies :o
    When we installed our kitchen granite in '02, my research showed that Aquamix Sealers Choice Gold 15 was the best. That's what we used. Solvent based...darkened the stone. It DID keep stains at bay but it (granite) DID show darkened areas that got wet. The granite DID lighten when the water dried. BUT, I read over and over again that it shouldn't darken when wet if sealed with a good sealer. After a couple of years I stopped worrying about it. Water evaporated nothing ever stained it. Last summer we added a bar (same granite) to the kitchen and added granite (a lighter color) to the master bathroom. I wanted the kitchen granite enhanced (like the older part) and the bathroom NOT enhanced. The product they used for sealing was Tenax Ager (for the kitchen). Tenax for the bathroom as well but not the Ager (enhancer). I also put the Ager on the existing granite kitchen counter. My kitchen granite does NOT darken,when wet,since applying the Tenax Ager. My (lightish) Giallo Ornamentale bathroom granite does NOT darken when wet. This will be the only sealer I'll ever use! Just so I won't be accused of spamming (even tho I've been here for over 6 years) I'll not link the product. If interested you can google it :)
    Monica

  • gneegirl
    15 years ago

    I really don't want to give more life to this thread because of the GS guy, but I have a question about the GS product. I thought that it was the same sealer that HD uses(d). I have that on my granite but didn't use HD. My "warranty" is lifetime but being that I never trust lifetime, I'm a little suspicious about how good a job it is doing. I don't have problems with the water spots. I'm just seeing a LOT of pits. I know that when I use the cleaner it doesn't seem to be as bad. Is the pitting a sealer problem or is it just the stone. I have crema bordeau which I love. Not sure if the stone is prone to the pitting, but would like to know if it is because of the sealer going bad or from something else. Also, is there any way to prevent that?

    Bill or other pros - please; and not the imposter.

  • vrjames
    15 years ago

    gneegirl,
    Granite Shield and the Stnemark sealer from HD are not the same.

    Stonemark is an impregnating sealer that is absorbed into the stone and is put on all slabs sold in that Stonemark line. It is a good product and HD has been selling it for a few years now. As for their "lifetime" guarantee, you need to read the fine print, the guarantee itself is not worth much.

    The GS product is fairly new, I have only seen it here so far with links to a u-tube video talking about how great it is. The people pushing it here have all opened with the same lines as this thread opened.
    I have watched the video and the only problem I have is they say the product isa topical "shield" that creates a barrier to stains. Fine by itself, but that is the problem, with topical products, they all have without fail the problem of discoloring, scratching and dulling over time.

    So if anyone wants to trust that GS has found a "lifetime" way around this issue then give it a try. But my gut is telling me that is why they are not pushing this product to the fabricators and stone supply companies.

    Only my opinion.

    James

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    gneegirl-- the pitting is just the stone. It has nothing to do with the sealers. How old are your countertops?

  • mmme
    15 years ago

    Monica, I'm getting giallo ornamental too, so I'm going to try your Tenax recommendation. I'll stay away from Tenax Ager (because that darkens the stone? I think that's what you were saying).

    I know that my fabricator plans to put on something called Porous Plus. Is it okay to switch sealers? or is it best to stick with what was originally put on for subsequent applications?

    Also, someone here questioned how good the lifetime warranty is with these lifetime sealers. I read the fine print for the one they sell at HD. There were a lot of conditions, including that you must wipe up spills right away, that they only cover food-based stains, etc. Basically I decided that if I followed all the conditions, I probably wouldn't get any stains. I think a lifetime sealer will eliminate the need to seal every year, but I don't get the impression that it will necessarily make the stone impervious to staining. At least that is not what the warranty was claiming.

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Porous Plus is a good sealer, but it's overkill for your stone, with no added benefits. It's part of the Miracle 511 line. it's made specifically for extremely porous stones, such as the softer limestones, or even terracotta ceramic. In the 511 series, you'll also find a sealer called Impregnator, which for your stone, is every bit as good as the Porous Plus, and costs less than half the money.

    If you already know you want to use the Tenax sealers, you might ask your fabricator if he'd be willing to use it right off, so long as you purchase it, and if he says no, then tell him to leave it unsealed.

    Personally, though, I'd be fine with the Miracle Sealers.

  • mmme
    15 years ago

    Bill, I wish it was overkill.

    I asked the fabricator to seal a sample of my stone for me. I brought it home, waited 24 hrs for it to set, then did a stain test on it. Even with this Porous Plus sealant, wine stained after being left on for just a couple of hours. I got it out by using a poultice, but it's clear to me that this stone is very porous.

    Will multiple coats of the sealant help?

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Let me ask you-- how long did you let the wine sit on the stone?

  • mmme
    15 years ago

    Um, maybe 2 hrs?

    I know that ideally one would wipe a drip up right away, but I was trying to think of realistic scenarios. I don't think it's crazy to imagine picking up a stray glass after a dinner party and discovering that there was wine on the bottom.

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Keep in mind-- NO penetrating sealer will catch all stains. The only way you can be guaranteed of that is with a topical sealer, and then you ruin the look of the stone. I had a feeling you might've let it sit for a good while. The Impregnator won't do any worse, and it'll cost less.

  • monicakm_gw
    15 years ago

    mmme, yes, the Ager darkens (as if it were wet) the stone. I wanted that look in my kitchen but not in the bath with the Giallo Ornamentale. As long as the sealers are same "base" (for lack of a better word) you can use different brands. IOW, you can use different water based sealers OR different solvent based sealer brands but it's inadvisable to mix the two types. We don't drink wine so I can't give any first hand experiences with that and the Tenax sealer.
    Monica

  • mmme
    15 years ago

    Thanks for the helpful advice, Bill and Monica.

    I do wish the granite people would just give people like me a little info sheet upon purchasing! I'm sure this stuff seems obvious to them, but it's all new to me.

  • timss
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    mmme, I can say I have tested GRANITE SHEILD with red wine
    and left it on overnight the next morning the wine left a
    sticky red spot that washed off with a wet paper towel
    and the sample was not stained. as far as the finish being
    ruined, my samples, and kitchens I have sealed look fantastic (also coke, grape juice, tomato sauce, catsup mustard and all kinds of stuff I could find around the house)they all washed off and no stain. I have asked around and you won't find a customer who says their granite is ruined

  • gneegirl
    15 years ago

    Thanks James and Bill, for clearing up the difference. In answer to your question, the stone was installed in mid January, this year. When it was installed, the guys kept mentioning how surprised at how strong the stone appeared to be. It cleaned up so nicely and generally, it still does. I have a good number of pits - some very small; some much more noticeable. But almost all of them seem to "go away" when I apply a couple of coats of cleaner. I have never had any staining - from anything. I think I'm just a little nervous becasue I'm seeing all of these changes in the stone and if you remember, I did have a crack. I've just become more dilligent about using the cleaner. Is there such a thing as using too much cleaner?

    Thank you!!

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    Is there such a thing as using too much cleaner?

    Nope. :-)

  • gam51
    15 years ago

    Bill or Vic, Which sealer do you recommend for Juperana Crema Bordeaux on a kitchen island?

  • bill_vincent
    15 years ago

    The normal three--

    Aquamix Sealers Choice Gold
    Miracle 511 Impregnator
    Stone Tech Impregnator Pro