Do you have the entire first floor plan view? It's hard to know exactly what to say without knowing where the assorted walkways go.

Also, a bit about (or do buehl's entire checklist-questionaire) what y'all cook, how you entertain and family would be nice.

Will you have a 48" full range with two ovens and then an extra wall oven/micro? That looks like a 42" Side by Side refrigerator plus one dishwasher. There might also be a trash compactor?

The room on the lower edge is a bar? the 7 x 6ish ft room to the right side of the lower edge is a laundry? A wine room? Is the only path (without going outside) to the dining room through the kitchen? What's up with the fat hallway on the lower left?

Since I posted yesterday, we decided against the wall oven and wall microwave. We are going to have a 60" full range, 48" side by side refrigerator, warming drawer in the island, 24" drawer microwave In the island, dishwasher next to the sink. The 7x6ish room was going to be a wine room but we are going to change that to extend the bar that is to the left of it.pantry. That outside wall will be even with the wall to the left of it. In it will be a tall wine storage unit, an icemaker, and under counter beverage center, small sink. We put the dining room in between the kitchen and screened outdoor area because when we entertain we are more casual.

I'm not sure what's what in the full floor plan. The screened area has the 3 skylights and runs on the side of the living room? Or the area at the very top that has another kitchen?

I think about flows, views and pathways. I try to walk around the house in my head and think about "What does somebody see when they walk in the front door" or "How far do I have to carry groceries, laundry or cleaning supplies." In your case, there might be whole house patterns to think about too.

Picture shows some traffic ways. There is a pretty bad pile-up in front of the range and a lesser one at the dining room door. The other interesting thing is there's not really a convenient spot for sitting down grocery bags for unpacking/ sorting. Most of the groceries are put away within 6 feet, but its without much counter.

So, I would think over a couple of things. You could move the bar area between the kitchen and the dining room - or - move it between the kitchen and living room. Aside from a shorter walk to the wine (always a good thing), it can be a staging area for stuff - if you will, a guest usable butler's pantry turned into a bar that could also store dishes or be a coffee service/dessert area. There are also hallway issues that would need to be worked out.

Another option is to move a lotta doorways so the paths change.

The house doesn't seem

This is two alternate positions of the bar plus a movearound of the main kitchen elements. I'm NOT saying you should do this, it's more an illustration of trying to have nicer traffic paths through the kitchen.

The very top of the floor plan is the screened in patio with an outdoor kitchen. The area behind the great room is an open area loggia. I am liking some of your ideas. I like the range on that other wall with maybe a window beside it or maybe one window on each side. Not sure about the location of the sink. Was thinking about putting it on the island. The pantry is a little confusing to me. I can't picture how it would look. Could you explain it to me? I like the Alt Bar/butlers pantry beside it. By the way, our upstairs consists of 2 guest bedrooms over the master area and a home theater over the garage.

If you can, try to isolate the "working area" from the traffic - like not co-locating two major work areas together or making setting the table include having to walk through where prep is occurring.

Sometimes tasks are split so a person is doing dishes or putting away or taking them out to set the table doesn't disturb the working chef(s). It would be easier to ferry things from/to the dining room and to/from the outside kitchen from the upper wall location of clean up.

Its really convenient not to have dishes pile up in the main work area. When clean-up is on the island, your work space can disappear under a pile of used pots, bowls, lunch dishes or whatever. I have a smaller sink that I use to fill pots, drain pots, wash the occasional veg and the occasional pot close to the range. I don't have to ask anyone to get out of the way, no child can run through it, I don't have to carry hot pots anywhere so its a lot safer for me. The sink is always empty and usable.

Think about splitting task areas. So nice not to have to dodge around open oven doors when doing the dishes or open dw doors when taking stuff out of the oven or have to step out of the way of someone coming through (most of the time).

I drew two different bar locations. One site is between the kitchen and living room and I'm thinking storage and a sink accessible from both sides. The other alternate is in part of where you had it, but moves its entrance - so people doing a beeline from the dining room don't walk through the business end of the kitchen.

The pantry I drew is a placeholder showing two walls, one the traditional 24" deep and the other more narrow. The link below is a pantry I admire (except the ladder). Smaller than that, but something like that.

I somewhat lean towards making the bar site between the living room and kitchen and making the whole lower edge a "walk through" pantry. But I'd really kinda lean on the house designer or architect to help out on how to change the long, fat, hall intersection with the kitchen cause it doesn't look easy.

The only BIG thought I had about the hall thing is perhaps trading the dining/kitchen spaces and perhaps having all the cooking together would help. Just talking personally, I'd combine the kitchen and screen porch and outdoor kitchen somehow - like use them fancy window walls that fold up if it's someplace with a warm to moderate climate. - to open the kitchen up to the screen porch.

Here is a link that might be useful: Pioneer Woman pantry

Thanks for your help. Your ideas make a lot of sense. In the original plan, the dining room/living room were combined and the breakfast room was where the dining room is now. I will upload a photo. We are thinking of going back to the dining room/living room combo idea and not have a breakfast room and putting the screened patio right off of the kitchen. Still studying the other ideas you gave us.

Here is a photo of the original

Here is what we are thinking about doing.

If I could suggest the building a home forum? They talk about these kind of issues there too. I'd hope for more responses about the house layout - it's a little beyond my "feature set".

Ok. Thanks!