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moon2011

Please provide feedback on kitchen design!

moon2011
12 years ago

Hi everyone,

We have been visiting this forum for a while now and have found it extremely helpful in the initial stages of planning a kitchen remodel. Now it's time to take it to the next level. We have some rough design ideas that we would appreciate feedback on.

A little background on our kitchen - it was built in the 80s and is about 20'X10'. The current layout has a range on one of the smaller dimension walls leaving no working room around the range. There is a peninsula in the middle of the room that cuts it into half. The other side of the peninsula has space for a small dining table. We want to remove the peninsula and expand the countertops/cabinets all the way along the longer dimension. This wall currently has a door that opens to a side patio. We are willing to get rid of the door and replace it with a window.

Here are a few preliminary designs we have generated for this space:

http://s1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff517/moon_2011/Kitchen%20design/

Please let us know what you guys think. Our main priorities are to increase the available counter and cabinet space and provide a seamless work environment. We are unsure at present about what to do with all empty space in the middle. The kitchen is too narrow for an island. Maybe a butcher block?

Thanks so much!

Comments (13)

  • dilly_ny
    12 years ago

    It's a little hard to tell from the picture - is the low cabinetry a window seat? It seems like your kitchen sink window is recessed more than the other window. Do you plan to put plants there and make it like a garden window? I would be tempted to put a small table by bench seating and try to make it a nook. Good luck!

  • John Liu
    12 years ago

    If you place the images in the thread, you will get more views and responses. With photobucket, it is very easy.

  • moon2011
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thanks for the responses!

    dilly_ny: Yes, the low cabinetry is a window seat. The window at that corner is low and the space is currently empty. Bench seating is the best we could come up with for that area. The kitchen sink window is recessed and we were thinking of putting plants there. The sink is in the same area but not centered in the window right now. We do want to put a table by the bench and use it as an informal eating area. Looks like you were thinking along the same lines, thanks!

    johnliu: I couldn't figure out how to embed images. Now I do, thanks for the tip :)

  • John Liu
    12 years ago

    Referring to the overhead view:
    - The short counter between refrigerator and pantry, on the bottom wall, is a bit short, it will be useful but not as much as it could be. If you extended it to the right wall - so, instead of a floor-to-ceiling pantry, have upper cab and base cabs, still fitted out like a pantry - the counter would be large enough to do quite a bit. A spacious baking center, secondary prep, room for plating, beverage station.
    - The alternative I would suggest, at least considering, is putting the washing up sink and dishwasher on that bottom wall. That leaves the entire upper wall free for prep sink and prep space and cooking and more prep - that is a lot of working space. You'd want to find another place for food storage, in the left wall cabs maybe?
    - I doubt a low bench in front of the window will be useful. Putting a table in front will eat up 3 feet of kitchen floorspace. I would consider a worktable (butcher block top, some shelves below, maybe mobile on casters) in that nook. It is perfectly okay if the table's top is higher than the windowsill. It is not a crime against nature. It will give you 6+ feet of nicely lit, out-of-the-way workspace. Or, a small, round, high cafe table with two bar stools could fit in there too. Gives guests a place to perch and chatter. Or, raise the windowsill and build in a regular base cabinet, with prep sink, and that will be a great prep spot.
    - Rather than trying to cram in a sliver of an island, I would give myself luxuriously deep counters and cabinets. A 30'' counter is a great thing to have. If you are very short or have very short arms, it may not be as great.

  • marcolo
    12 years ago

    There is almost no prep space in this layout, and what exists is over a dishwasher, which is an awkward place to work. You need more space between sink and range. The rest of the counter won't get much use.

  • John Liu
    12 years ago

    That's an idea. Can you move the range to the right, swap locations with the window?

    The most convenient place to prep is near water (wash, rinse, disposal) and not too far from the range (carry stuff to the pot) or from food storage (ideal to not walk the length of the kitchen to fetch a clove).

  • moon2011
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thanks everyone for your input!

    We were actually considering getting rid of the short counter near the fridge entirely. We currently have something similar and it is kind of awkward to use. Besides we are adding all the counter space to right of the range that we don't have currently. We were thinking of having two floor to ceiling pantries on either side of the fridge and moving the oven/microwave to the left of those. The reason being that we have a lot of large pots and pans (most of our cooking is done on the range) and they are all stored on an open shelf right now. So one floor to ceiling "pantry" would be dedicated to cookware. The only concern is that it would be one big wall of cabinets but it should be broken up well by appliances. What do you think?

    I like the ideas for replacing the low bench. The reason we went with that was we still want some seating area in the kitchen and that window has a nice view to the outside.

    Deep counters sound promising! I do have short arms but I think it would be a good look considering we have a lot of empty space in the middle of the kitchen. Anyone have experience with deep counters? How do they work? Pros? Cons?

    I like the idea of having more space between the range and sink but am reluctant to swap the range with the window. That would make it two windows side by side and a range at the end. The reason I don't like the current setup is that the range is right next to a wall making leaving only one side for prep space.

  • John Liu
    12 years ago

    The counter along the top wall is nice and long, but in the current plan I don't think it is used as well as it could be.

    You can't have one person prep by the single sink while another washes (dishsoap in the salad, you know). That lone sink looks like a bottleneck.

    Anyone prepping on the other end of the counter is 15 feet from water. Just cleaning up requires hiking the length of the kitchen with a dripping sponge and, maybe, dripping trash too.

    Thus I think you should find a place for a prep sink. That prep sink could serve two prep zones (i.e. be between them).

    On cookware, if you store some in drawers under the cooktop, you may not need an entire 36'' wide x 8 foot pantry cabinet just for cookware. Depends on how much you have - I'd do a count, that sounds like an awful lot of pot and pan storage.

    A second counter is a nice thing to have. You can plate food, all beautiful and garnished just-so, ready to be carried to the dining room. You can open and pour beverages. Arrange a dozen individual dessert plates. Assemble large platters of antipasto. It is a staging area, removed from the mess, clutter and hustle of the main prep and washup zones. Or, you can banish the worst mess and clutter to that second counter. That is always the washing-up mess, with its stacks of dirty dishes being clattered by resentful teenagers. Or, a baking zone with a lower counter, ingredient bins and stand mixer at the ready.

    I know, plenty of kitchens have only one counter, but they are usually very small ones (not yours) or they have an island (not yours).

    One interesting thing you can do with deep counters is to have a small, shallow shelf on the backsplash, below the upper cabinet. It is useful and an interesting look - there have been pictures of that detail posted before, though I can't think of the thread.

  • moon2011
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    @johnliu: I have to admit the second counter idea is growing on me. I was a bit apprehensive about having a wall of nothing but cabinets. We're also working with our KD to incorporate more drawers into the base cabinets of the top wall so that could be our cookware storage.

    Another idea we had to increase the prep space between the sink and range is to move the sink to the corner. The corner is pretty much dead inaccessible space right now. Putting the sink there would cover that area and increase the prep space. What do you guys think?

  • lavender_lass
    12 years ago

    What if you moved the pantry to the other end of that row of cabinets, and the fridge and oven/microwave slid down towards the window a bit...so from right to left, pantry, oven/microwave/fridge, then counterspace.

    You could put your prep sink under the window, where the bench is, now. This would give you a nice u-shape work/prep area, with the clean-up zone (main sink and dishwasher, as they are now) outside of the prep area.

    I don't think you need the bench, but what's on the other side of the wall of cabinets, left of the main sink? Could you make that a half wall, with maybe a counter and some stools on the other side? It would allow you to see/talk to people, while working in the kitchen and have a place for drinks/snacks :)

  • cheri127
    12 years ago

    I generally don't care for corner sinks but in this kitchen, I think I'd like it. You could also put a prep sink at the end of the run to the right of the cooktop. Your prep and clean up zones would be separate and/or you would have two great prep zones when needed.

    I like the counter next to the fridge. It's a great place for the coffee maker, toaster, bread drawer etc. I also like LL's idea to open the wall to the left of the main sink if there's living space on the other side.

  • rhome410
    12 years ago

    It sounds like you're willing to get rid of it, based on your current experience, but that counter by the fridge looks to be about 4 ft long? I have something similar and use it as my baking center...The counter where our mixer and blender live. We also have a similar short counter for our breakfast center, where our toaster oven sits. It'd be nice if that one was wider. Maybe it could fit the coffee maker if it was. If you have things like that that need to sit on the counter, but you don't want in your work area, a separate counter space can be very beneficial.

    I guess this is very related to what John Liu was saying about a 2nd counter. I also agree that the right end of the kitchen has most of the work space, but is farthest away from fridge and water, which gets problematic in every day use.

    From your description of your current setup, I can tell that this will be a vast improvement. How exciting! Can't wait to see before and after pics. :-)

  • stogniew
    12 years ago

    I would second John Liu suggestion for the prep sink right of your cooktop.

    I would move the fridge right as well to be near (across from) your prep sink, but would not be so quick to give up the counter next to your ovens. I know you can land from your ovens next to the range or to your left counter, but I would rather land "close" to range than carry hot dishes across the kitchen�s traffic. I also think your "left" counter may serve as a perfect spot for coffee, tea, toaster�s et c. tasks.