kawcjp--I was there too today!! I had to drop off a drawer and a pullout that I didn't like the finish on inside. They would have come for them but I didn't want them to make a special trip to pick them up.

I was there around 8:45. Were you inside? I didn't even go in, dropped and ran.

Glad you had a nice visit.

Will they mix econoline on the bottom and regular for the walls?

I believe that they will not mix econoline and regular. I think I asked about that for my dog room and they said they couldn't do it.

kawcjp glad you had a good experience at DW! Did you tell them you were from Gardenweb?

beekeeperswife--We didn't get there until 1030 (we're a 2hr drive). I didn't ask about mixing the two lines...we have three exposed ends so I would want the wall and base ends to look the same. It's a great idea though! BTW, I love your kitchen and seeing the progress...I showed DH your photos (and Beagles') when I first told him about DW - they helped convince us to contact DW. My fingers are crossed for the vent hood install - I would be beside myself...

Beagles--Ha! Yes, I mentioned it to Lorna on the way out...she mentioned that other gardenwebers have also had very clear ideas of what they wanted too! I take it as a compliment. :) Poor thing had some very nice drawings but I insisted on working from the ones I originally sent(with her help we did tweak them a bit). Thanks for posting all of the inspirational photos. Your house is beautiful!

Thanks kawcjp. DW must be used to all the TKO people by now- Bee and I broke them in well I think :) I never met Lorna, I wonder if she was there when I was doing my kitchen and they just didn't want to subject her to me!

Thanks for the update and clarification on the econoline. I am excited to make my visit. Hopefully next week before the kiddies get out of school.

My dh used to say when Jason would go look for something and be gone for a few minutes that he was actually out back screaming out of frustration....I told him that and he just smiled and said "I see" and laughed.

Hopefully Beagles & I have broken him in for all of you.

I need to get him some of that white-out tape as a present. I think he used a lot on my order!

"no, wait. Let's do these handles." white tape "Well, maybe not, what about these?" white tape "hi jason, it's me, can we change the color choice for the closet?" more white tape.......

Yeah, better stop by Staples today.

Bee, I think I'm odoing a number on him as well! haha

FWIW, I got a quote from Dutchwood and Shiloh for painted inset and Shiloh was a little cheaper for the same thing. Dutchwood sounds great, and if I lived a little closer (2 hrs away) maybe I would have used them. But Im perfectly happy with my cabinets.
So for those of you that are reading this post and live too far from DW, you can still get reasonably priced painted inset.

designnov--oh, absolutely you are right. Like Beagles said though it's when you start customizing that you really see the difference in price. I personally don't know anything about Shiloh's quality (I'm sure if a GW member is picking it, it must be good!) , but I can attest that the quality from DW is excellent.

Glad you found Shiloh to work out for you.

You are right - we did not add decorative pieces other than moulding, so that may make the difference.
Reading this thread almost make me wish I had pursued them a little more, but Im happy with my cabs, and we stayed within our budget.

I tried to find a Shiloh dealer in our area but the closest was going to be over two hours away. I hear that they were recently having free upgrade to inset doors which would be a huge savings considering what the Brookhaven rep told me the upgrade to inset was going to cost per door.

Wow we really LOVE Dutch Wood.... lol

I will add to the list of another happy customer. We did the kitchen, 2 bathrooms and a laundry room. We used the 1/2" line for the laundry room and bathrooms and the 3/4" line for the kitchen. We NEVER heard NO from them. From design, to installation it was a great experience, we had ZERO problems.

I would do business with them again.

Tom

p.ball2...Inset is going to be all over the board price wise.

Even thou inset with Shiloh is free at this time, there regular price I don't think is that bad.Their regular price for flush inset is listed at $20 per door and $8 per drawer, while beaded inset is listed at $30 per door and $14 per drawer.In comparison to do full overlay is $26 per door and $12 per drawer with Shiloh.

When I priced out cabinets with Riegsecker, it was only $134 more then full overlay.

Did you check with Crystal cabinets? They're currently offering free inset with their cabinets. They have a semi-custom line call Keyline which I'm currently getting quoted on.

I was going to check with Dutchwood, but I'm in Chicago and think that I'm to far from them.

Good luck with you're kitchen. Hopefully, you won't take as long as me. I started looking back in January 2011 and still have not made a decision.

I just sent off my cabinets specs to DW for a quote after several frustrating weeks with the original custom shop my GC recommended. I really liked the quality of the first place, but he wants to communicate via my GC and it's dragging down the process. Does Jason have an email address? I couldn't find one online, sent it via fax. I am also going beaded inset, will update once I get price back.
Very timely thread for me, thanks for all the info everyone!

jason@dutchwood.net

(you should include "Gardenweb" in the subject line)

Although, after dealing with the masses of TKOers, he might not open it!!! lol

kidding. I think that he really appreciates knowing when a customer finds out about them on GW.

I'd have to imagine they are pleased with GW referrals. They must know by now it's a very, um, unique (demanding doesn't seem right, maybe very educated?) audience and it is all word of mouth referrals. If you're getting multiple referrals from here, you're doing it right!

Having a little difficulty finding frameless cabinets. I have one, maybe two (waiting to hear back) places I will get quotes from when i'm ready in a few weeks.

I'm crazy enough to drive the 5 hours to pick them up if the price is reasonable, next one to visit needs to plant that frameless bug in their ear again! Please!

I think they like doing the challenging stuff that GWers come up with. A lot of things in my house were things they had never done before (not that you could ever tell it was their first time, they look amazing!) and Jason seemed to indicate that it was fun to do the unique stuff.

I think we are going up there some time next week to drop off some fabric for our window seats and hope to see the bedroom cabinets they are making for us. Maybe I'll run into GWers there, LOL!

I think it's great they were willing to try new stuff. I hope they keep a list with some pics, those finishing touches are great little extras that set DW apart. You and Bee might need to be put on a retainer with all these ideas and referrals!

aries61: interesting that Crystal is offering free inset right now. A kitchen designer I went to, who reps Crystal but is phasing them out and now offering Omega, said that Crystal is sooo expensive that we are going to stop carrying them. Even when I said that I had seen their cabinets and liked them he did not seem to want to give me a quote or entertain my desire to explore using Crystal. I have to say this is a guy that I was not very impressed with but it goes to show that having some knowledge before you go to see a kitchen designer is quite helpful.

I saw his design proposal on Frida.... YAWN not very exciting. I don't have any training and I could see problems with his design. Safe to say I won't be using him even though the price he gave me for Omega dynasty shaker inset was lower than I had expected (but still higher than Dutchwood).

p.ball2...I'm suppose to be getting a quote from two different places hopefully this week on Crystal. When I get them, I'll post the prices and let you know.

Also, I was looking at some other quotes that I received from other places and they sent me some door pictures of something interesting. They had a mortise and tenon door with a bead near the edge of the door. I've only seen that on mitered doors before. I'll try to post pictures later tonight when I get back.

I'm attaching a link to a kitchen on here done with Crystal Keyline. According to the poster, she looked at 100% custom cabinets, Medallion Cabinets and Shiloh Cabinetry and said Crystal had the best price of all of them.

Here is a link that might be useful: Crystal Keyline Inset

p.ball2... Here's the first picture. I'll post the other picture in another response.

p.ball2... Here's the second picture. The same door as a beaded inset in the door not the frame.

Aries: Thanks! I will be interested to know what your crystal keyline quote is. I think I may investigate getting a crystal quote from another place in the area who also carries crystal.
I think I have seen or heard of the door you posted. The bead is a detail on the door rather than on the door frame. It looks nice. Does that cost less to create or is it less likely to chip or dent if it is on the door? What is the difference between putting the bead on the door versus on the frame which is more traditional?

p.ball2..The first quote came in at $6710 compared to about $5500 for Shiloh. Not a large kitchen at all. The sink wall is 134" and the range wall is 136". It was based on a raised panel door with 5 piece drawer fronts either in maple or premium(clear)alder. Cherry was a 6% up charge. Currently Crystal is either offering free upgrade to cherry or free inset(both plain and beaded).

The only thing I can say is weigh all your options. You have to like what your getting. I've looked at many cabinet manufacturers and I found that I'm not impressed with a lot of the finishes or construction that I've seen.

Funny story that happened a few weeks ago. I walked into a kitchen design center and went over somethings with the designer. I had my current layout with changes that I wanted. We looked at several cabinet manufacturers and narrowed it down. She showed be what price categories the door styles were in the manufacturers book which had prices which weren't outrageous. Then she asked by budget which I told her was around $10,000 for cabinets only. She looked at me and said no no no, probably around $15,000. I thought to myself, for less then $15,000 I can get some really nice high end Amish cabinets which was a much better quality then what she showed me. I thanked her for her time and walked out. I refrained from telling her what I thought. I felt sorry for anyone who walked in and dealt with her.

Aries61: thanks for posting the quote. I agree with you about finishes completely! I am going with a white painted cabinet and some maufacturers finishes looks plasticky or too shiny.

I had read on GW that Shiloh has beautiful painted finishes but the closest dealer is hours away for me. I think if you go with Shiloh.

As for the Crystal cabs- I had also read and heard good things about Crystal. I am a bit disillusioned by the one kitchen designer who presented me with a preliminary but quite boring design and never even mentioned the free upgrade to inset when I questioned him about Crystal. I think since there is no benefit for him to sell the crystal viersus Omega he would rather push the Omega and forget telling me about the free upgrade.I have heard Omega cabs are nice - but they don't even have them on display in the showroom yet. I have made the decision not to go with him.

The second designer I met with seemed really great and she reps Plato and Woodmode/Brookhaven. I have a gut feeling though that the Plato price may come out too high for me and that Brookhaven may fall into the high end of our budget. We will see. I am excited to see what she comes up with as a preliminary design since she asked alot of great questions and seemed to "get" the look and function I was aiming for.

$15,000 for a kitchen the size you describe? You were right to walk out. What cabinet line was she rep for?

You do have to be a savvy shopper and realize that there are good, conscientious designers out there and some that are no so good. Best of luck with everything!

I will post updates when I get the pricing back on the Plato and Brookhaven.

p.ball2..The two lines that we looked at were Executive Cabinetry and Cabico Espresso. She had a bunch more then these, but she said that these were the two least expensive.

They also had Decora, which I received a quote a while ago for about $9,000 from another company.I've looked at a lot of cabinets and received many quotes. The quotes ranged between $5,000 to $15,000 with most of them under $10,000.

I've linked to one of my postings back from May which you can see the my kitchen layout with a bunch of different layouts. It's not a large kitchen.

Here is a link that might be useful: Link to my kitchen layout

Does DW have a website? I can't seem to find one.

gldngrl61 they do not. They have a brochure. http://web.me.com/illustra_graphics/Illustra_Graphics_%26_I._G._Publishers_Graphic_Design_And_Audiobook_Publisher/Brochure_Design_Page_Layout_files/Dutch%20Wood%20Brochure%20MedRes.pdf

Their contact info is:
1317 Hilltop Road
Myerstown, PA 17067-1760
Phone: 717-933-5133.
Fax: 717-933-1191

They also did all of the cabinets in my entire house, so if you haven't seen them, there are pics here (kitchen, all bathrooms, gathering room, great room, dog room, laundry rooms, conservatory, dining room, closets, pantry, bedroom fireplace). http://stonepondhouse.blogspot.com/

Dutchwood does have a website but it is really just their brochure online as beagles stated above.
If you google dutchwood LLC it should come up but if not try this website address: http://web.me.com/illustra_graphics/Illustra_Graphics_%26_I._G._Publishers_Graphic_Design_And_Audiobook_Publisher/Brochure_Design_Page_Layout_files/Dutch%20Wood%20Brochure%20MedRes.pdf

It is a crazy long one.

I got the quote back from Jason 2 days after submitting my plans...amazing! Also turned out $6k cheaper than the original custom shop we were working with.

I'm torn, because the original shop calls beaded inset their "bread and butter" and I really love the style I picked out with them. And we took an entire day to drive there and see their operation. But $6k delta! I am trying to bargain the original shop down, but suspect I will be another GWer who uses Dutch Wood.

For comparison's sake, the original shop (LancasterMaid) provided a quote of $29,653. Dutch Wood was $22,972.50 . Kitchen is 13' on sink run, 12' on range wall, 8.5' island. Deeper bases and uppers and taller island. While I've done minor tweaking, pretty close layout at the following link:

Here is a link that might be useful: Scroll down for layout

Beaglesdoitbetter,

Where in FL is you vacation home, if you don't mind me asking? Are you serious about having DW build your FL cabs? I am in FL & have been drooling over your kitchen & Bee's. You are both my GW gurus (bowing down). Shiloh is an option where I live, too but my parents had an Amish kitchen in IL & the quality could not be beat. If you've broached the subject w/Jason re. the FL build & it was well recepted, do you think I should keep an open mind as this for an option? FWIW I would use them for a whole house (4.5 baths, kitchen, 2 laundry rooms). Would the price be worth the extra cost of freight? Then does the GC then install them? Or could I pay the extra to fly down DW to install? Do you see any issues with inset in FL w/the humidity & having the wood cured in PA vs. FL? Due to allergies, our home is almost always closed w/AC running, so I am thinking that wouldn't be an issue.

Thank you for any insight!

wishiwasinoz I haven't worked out logistics yet, but I think that is my plan and I told Jason I wanted him to do the FL cabinets and he said OK - but we aren't ready to actually do the FL kitchen yet so we haven't gotten too far into planning (we're replacing doors, windows, floors in the house first, removing popcorn, adding moldings and generally de-1970ing the house!)

Tentatively, I believe what we were going to do is fly someone from DW down to measure because our house is way-out-of-level (guess there were no tape measures in 1972) and then have them make the cabinets. We were thinking of renting a truck and driving them down ourselves although not 100 percent sure on that yet, and then I have a handyman down in FL who can install (I think it might be hard for DW to come down and install them b/c they won't have tools or anything, but again, not sure).

Our house is in Clearwater. B/c of the humidity, I would probably have MDF-centers w/ solid wood elsewhere on the cabs.

My handyman down in FL said he could make our cabinets from scratch though, so that is another possible option, although I suspect we'll end up w/ DW b/c I trust their quality and because I think it will be cheaper if we can find a way to get the cabinets down there in a cost-effective manner.

Beagles let's get on the same timeline! :-). FIL owns a moving co. so I will sweet talk him into moving the cabs at cost. Knowing DW might be an option is making things quite interesting!

How would I plan this out for a new build? Are the builders ever slightly off in kitchen dimensions? That could totally screw up the custom cabinetry fitting into place.

wishiwasinoz, we were a new build too. We had the basic kitchen measurements and did drawings and quotes that way. Then, once the drywall was up, DW came to measure to get exact measurements down to the inch. You would need to do the same I think.

If we could coordinate a timeline, that would be awesome :) Are you near the Clearwater area?

I would love to be a fly on the wall when this discussion comes up at DW....

:)

beekeeperswife I think DW has been well-and-truly broken in by GW by now. I mentioned to Jason that he'd be doing my Florida house and he just nodded his had and said "OK."

They are coming over here on Thursday to install my study window seat and pantry cabinet! I can't wait. We did an all-glass to the floor cabinet in the pantry for dishes and it should be pretty neat looking I think.

thanks all for the info. i have just started looking at a kitchen re-do. i'm already stressing out after looking at appliance costs. i'm not too far away from dw, so i must go up there.

did you say they only do inset doors? i really wanted white inset cabs, but already changing my mind to settle for full overlay to save on some costs. what typically is the price difference between full overlap and inset with popular manufacturers? thanks

Dutchwood does inset and full overlay. They only do framed cabinetry at this point not frameless from the conversations I have read. I found the upcharge forinset with some of the big manufacturers to be all over the board. For some it is offered free as a promotion for others it can nearly double the price of the cabinet. I believe the upcharge at dutchwood was $17 per door. the big difference is that the little extras do not cost a fortune. I asked him to make a custom paper towel holder that was above the pull out trash below counter and the charge was $55. I think it was several hundred for the one manufacturer that I priced and the other did not do that at all.

mags, mine are full overlay "with very little faceframe showing"....that is the description in the quote.

The only thing I would have done differently was to have the end panels be recessed, or more built into the actual cabinet frame. Mine are door panels that are applied ON TOP of the frame. It is not a big deal, I think on the cabinets that are next to the hood though, it would have been a cleaner look to have done it the other way. If you look at the photo below, see the cabinet to the right of the hood? See that little vertical strip to the left of the left door? That is the side of the panel they attached to the end of the cabinet. The door comes to the end of the cabinet frame, and if the panel was recessed, you wouldn't see that vertical line.

Not that big a deal, I'm nit picking, but I just didn't even think about that.

P.ball,
I'm revamping a 24" trash pull out.
I have been trying to figure out how to incorporate paper towels into something so I didn't have to have them on the counter or wall somewhere. Could you post some pics?

Thanks!
Christine

Omgoodness bee, that is the kitchen I want! So close to what I have envisioned...on a much smaller scale! Thank u for sharing and I must save a pic for kd. I love the way the cabs go up to ceiling. We definitely couldn't have as much glass since we're slobs. :-). Btw, for any glass inserts, u can go to a stained glass supplier that sells glass and get ur pick of any type of glass. Instead of paying upcharge on fancy glass inserts from dealer, after install I just took a door to glass shop and picked out a glass. They cut it to fit perfectly.

Does dw do appliance fronts/panels?

Bees ur kitchen is to die for. Did dw install?

When I see a kitchen like urs, it shows me that overlay fronts can work and look just as nice. I'm going for timeless look since I'm tackling the 'one and done' projects.

Oh my what decisions to make.

mags, yes dw does the install. They do the panels for appliances too. I have a "thing" about faux drawers and doors. Jason at DW totally understood my issue. If you look at the sets of drawers on each side of the sink by the window, you will see 3 drawer fronts on each side. The top two on each side are dish drawers, I wanted them to completely blend in with the other drawers and not look like one big drawer. Some integrated fronts are only one panel from some companies, but having them made custom you can ask them to do this.

DW's glass fronts are not upcharges. If you want anything but clear glass, ie Antique German, or wavy, etc., then yes, there is an upcharge. But mine cost the same as having wood fronts.

Thanks for the compliments. DW does have a ckd that is available to you.

bee

in process right now!

Mags438 we have a full overlay Dutchwood Kitchen too, not sure if you have seen mine, but just in case you have not, here it is (prior to move-in, there's stuff in the cabinets now!):

I do not have a picture of the paper towel holder worked into the trash pull out but Jason showed me a picture of a similar one that he did. I am still in the early stages of design with them. Presently waiting for his drawings. If you search for built in paper towel holder on the Kitchen forum you will get a few pictures.

Wow, beagles, kitchen is gorgeous! And huge! I'm suffering from space/size envy.

Did Finestra ever post pictures of her finished kitchen? I can't seem to find pictures.

I would also love to see how michelle16's kitchen is turning out. Michelle, I know you are not posting on GW anymore. I wanted to send you an email but that option is not open on your page. If you read this post and are willing, please send me an email. Would love to see how your dutchwood kitchen is progressing!

Bee-
Those dishwashers are so cool! Can I ask where your trash is?
Thanks!