mmm I don't know how much work can be done.. but right now I don't like how far are the sink from the cooktop etc..
i will like to see the fridge and the oven or double oven at the same wall where is now the cook-top.
move the cooktop where is now the fridge. .. I will square off the sink 45" angle.
I will have also double pocket door to give a bigger opening trough the dining room.
but again I design modern kitchen all the time, little bit different from standard american traditional design kitchen.

Just off the top of my head, I would absolutely change the way the door on the pantry opens. That's an accident waiting to happen. My pantry door swings into the pantry and will be on a swing hinge (that will stay open until I push it lightly). I'm planning to store less-often used items behind the door.

Is there a DW in this design? I'm not crazy about the sink on an angle as it makes it tricky to have the DW handy.

Patti

Just to clarify...where is the oven? Is that a cooktop with oven underneath, or a range? After reading giacomo_it's response, I assumed the oven was near the sink, but after looking at it more closely, I think the DW is near the sink and the oven must be under the cooktop?

Patti

I would question if there is enough swing space for refrig/freezer door against the wall.

To answer the questions...

The dishwasher is currently placed just to the left of the sink.

The oven is in the bottom left corner, on the same wall as the cooktop.

In general, I like a lot about the layout, but here are some of my concerns...

The island cuts off access between the refrigerator and cooktop and between the sink and cooktop. It's also a long way to fill or empty pots, and a long way from the sink for prepping purposes.

I agree that the pantry door poses a problem. Also, the refrigerator is difficult to access from the breakfast room and great room.

Any thoughts about any of these issues?

I would love to see giacomo's recommendations for the layout. I don't think those layout changes are necessarily "modern" rather than more traditional in style, but they make a lot of sense to me.

I'm with you Holly -
I immediately saw a Barrier Island and a Destination Fridge, plus the pantry door smacker.

I'd start from scratch...

I also like giacomo's suggestions as long as there will be space between the cooktop and the wall.

This is one of those kitchen spaces that is too wide not to have an island, but too narrow to really fit one. With this layout, the owner will get her exercise running laps around that island, and doubling back on her own steps. If the fridge is relocated next to the pantry, and the cooktop is to the left of the sink (about 18" from the bottom wall), I could see keeping the island if it was shortened (to maybe 42"), so not blocking the fridge too much...A butcherblock surface could be nice.

In a 2-person house, I doubt the pantry door will cause much trouble, but there are ways to address it, if the owner is concerned. That is a nice pantry space.

For fun. Not exactly this, but something running around there somewhere. Maybe a big fat "L" stuck up against the pantry wall with cooktop, ovs and prep sink. Maybe one of those nice curved italian jobs with flowing lines where prep, cook, pans and trash are placed in about 6 feet. Jeese, Lousie, right?

I want to be looking at the view and the people and not a wall. Dishwashing doesn't take the time and effort it used to, so I put it in the no natural light space, facing the wall position between the kitchen and dining room. There may also be some way to make cleanup into a walk thru butlers pantry.

Depends on if she likes open or protected and the preferred orientation for cooking/prep (I really like facing out).

{{!gwi}}

holligator if can give me some dimension on a plan I will do a quick design.

Comment on original design: If a prep sink is added to the island on the cooktop side (SE corner), I don't think the island is truly a "barrier island." The refrigerator is on the "side" so you don't have to go all the way around the island to get to it plus w/a sink right there you actually have a work area that, yes is on the DR end, but I suspect it gets less traffic than the Breakfast Nook end.

I actually kind of like the basic design...but I do agree about the DW location and pantry door.

I would move the DW south about 15" - 18". Not sure what to do about the door though!

It is my kitchen that you all have been discussing. It is neat to read what people think. I appreciate the input. There will be a prep sink in the island. The dishwasher is to the left of the sink. Double wall ovens are to the right of the cooktop (at the end of the wall).

I didn't read the entire thread, so if this has been mentioned forgive me.

Never never put a refridgerator in a corner. It will always cause a problem opening the door IF it is hinged on the wall side.

I also agree with the issue of the refrig opening into the wall. That's my major issue with our current house (we are in the process of building a new house now) - here, the builder put our refrigerator right in the corner and I can't open my freezer all the way. It drives me absolutely insane!

I have a recipe for a dessert that is made in a 9x13 and needs to go in the freezer that I haven't been able to make in the 11 years we've lived here because I can't get the freezer door open far enough to get the pan inside.

I didn't mention it before, but I do really like the original design in that the angle of the penisula repeats the angle of the built-in bench - very appealing visually.

The pantry door problem should be easily solved by having it open into the pantry. It will lay flat against the wall and not be in the way of the shelves at all.

Good luck with your kitchen, farmergator!

Patti

You make a very good point about the fridge opening into the wall. I am going to see what we can do about that. Hmmm...a door that opens inward. I will have to check on that too.

Glad you made it on here yourself, farmergator! :)

My latest variation on your plan is below. Maybe we can get some GWers' comments on this.

I extended the kitchen into the breakfast room just a bit (about two feet?). Since you'll have that bench seating, your table can be closer to the wall and still leave plenty of room for passage. I did change the configuration of the bench a bit to accommodate the table, but that change isn't essential.

I moved the refrigerator to a spot that would be more accessible to others without getting in your way while you're in the cooking. I put a counter next to the refrigerator for the microwave. I like having the microwave close to the fridge and close to the table, so that seemed like the best spot. It would be even better in a cabinet above the counter. You'd have four potential landing spots for the fridge--the counters on either side, the island, and the counter to the right of the sink.

Moving the refrigerator took up some of that great pantry, but you could still have a decent sized closet opening into the hallway that could be used as pantry space or other storage (broom closet? coat closet near the garage entrance?). I added a corner pantry, as well. Together, those two spaces would give you a lot more shelf space than the single one. The corner pantry also mimics the angle of your sink.

I moved the cooktop to the opposite wall to make what I think is a better flow. Food would move from fridge to counter to sink to prep counter to cooktop. The island would provide additional prep space, with or without a prep sink.

I put some space between the sink and DW, to allow some room for you to stand without knocking your knees. I'd suggest putting a pull-out trash in that space. That would be useful for both prep and clean-up.

I would put drawers for storage or your every day dishes to the right of the sink. That would be convenient for both unloading the dishwasher and setting the table. Fancy dishes could be stored in the cabinets closer to the dining room. Pots and pans could be stored in drawers beneath the cooktop and/or in the island. I'd also put narrow tray cabinets in the island at each end. The one near the sink would be to store cutting boards, and the one at the end near the oven would store cookie sheets. Drawers between them could store other baking supplies.

Thoughts?

Much better Holly!
A corner pantry is a great use of space, and having that closet right behind the fridge would allow you to use a full-sized fridge and still get a counter-depth appearance, which can save money and give more fridge space.

In fact, with that layout, I'd be tempted to do away with the island altogether. The island isn't really large enough to be hugely useful, and the appliances are very nicely arranged without it. The countertop between the sink and cooktop is the natural prep zone, so actually using the island would mean turning away from the open view. (A second cook could use it though - Do you often have a second cook?)

If you lose the island, I'd be tempted to increase the countertop depth to 30" -- you'd really be surprised what an extra 6" of countertop depth does for functionality. Basically, it means you have ample work space in front of a coffee maker, toaster oven or utensil bin.

If growing the kitchen or shrinking the breakfast room is a problem, the ovens could also go on the other side of the kitchen next to the pantry.

I love the last layout. My only concern is I would hate to have my dishwasher to the left of my sink. I'm right handed and it would seem ackward to load it with my left.
The fridge is better to have on the same side of the pantry to make it easier to put up groceries.

I really like the last design. I agree the island now could go, stay, become smaller mobile one.
As for DW to the left of the sink, it must be what you get used to. I am right handed and have always had mine to the left.

Don't think you can do a normal depth ref and that island. Both aisles are max 3 feet wide with a two foot wide island. Regular depth ref (without countersinking into the hall closet) would take about 10 inches off the aisle before its doors open.

you say that these folks love their fresh produce....we do as well! thats why we added a subzero to the plan. it's nice to keep that resh spinich fresh for a month after its picked! i;d make that a priority for this kitchen. it also solves the issue with the island. a 36" french door...even a 48" french dooe (which i kick myself for not having done) would be fine with the island if theres 36 to 39" clearance.

you'll never use that pocket door....i'd just do a 36" opening. we have that....perfect for flow but still does not give a full view of any kitchen mess.

i would still put a sink in the island as well. this with the fridge placement makes it a two cook kitchen (use the island for salad prep, hand washing, etc. we have one in our small 33x43 island for just that reason.

this is what I will do... but of course I just spend a couple seconds :-)
probably need more works..
{{!gwi}}

my solution I like if we switch the sink with the cooktop.

I really like Holly's second post. I spoke with my designer, and she says we all have great ideas, and wants to join the forum :) However, she expressed concern about the closet under the stairs being useful. Based on the dimensions, I could get very little in there. Although I love where Holly has placed the pantry, I wonder if it would be worth it to give up one big space for two smaller spaces (and one not being worth much). The designer recommended leaving the pantry in the same location, but using a door that swings inward. So, the cooktop and ovens would be on the same side as the sink, the island would still have a prep sink, the fridge would be down from the pantry, and the dishwasher would be moved over a bit so I won't bump my legs. What do you all think of that?

I like Holligator's plan...I really like corner pantries (I put one in our kitchen as well!). But, I would definitely move the ovens to the other side. To me, the west side seems crowded. It does make an excellent work area, but a little close--especially if you have someone cleaning up while you're prepping/cooking. If the ovens are moved then the cooktop could move south a foot or two to add some workspace/distance b/w the sink/DW and cooktop. The refrigerator side will still have plenty of landing space.

I would still put a prep sink in the island, though, to increase the functional work area to include working on both sides of the island if needed or even on the refrigerator/oven side.

One advantage of the island remaining is that it will help direct traffic away from the cooking side. W/the corner pantry & no island, people would probably cut diagonally across the kitchen and possibly infringe on the cooking zone--which could be a safety issue (in addition to an annoyance!). The combination of the end of peninsula opening and island will direct traffic to the east side of the kitchen b/w the DR and Breakfast area.

I really like the shape of that peninsula!

Cross posted!

Your KD has the pantry in the same space where she says a closet wouldn't fit? Why would a pantry fit/be useful there but not a closet? Is the pantry going to be smaller than it shows or only have one or two shelves? If so, I think the corner pantry will give you more usable space. The closet doesn't have to be as deep as Holly shows, it could be shallower allowing it to be more useful as a closet or even a place for large/bulk items.

I still like Holly's plan better. Your KD's plan to put everything on the west wall has a crowded wall...is she planning to add the couple of feet Holly did? If not, my comment about being crowded is doubled w/your KD's plan.

Well, I'm glad the designer likes the ideas, but I disagree with her about that closet not being a useful size. By my judgment, it's approximately 3'x4'. I have several closets in my house that are that size and they are very useful. I'd add that the larger pantry is mostly floor space, and in two smaller pantries, you would almost double the amount of shelf space. That, to me, is more useful.

Holligator or Giacomo, I'm trying to design a kitchen. Do you have special software you use to create a layout?

I really like Giacomo's plan. Holly's corner pantry looks like a tight squeeze.

onerae,
I use different programs, plan and elevation Autocad on PC, rendering and 3D models on Mac.

I prefer Holligator's plan. It is a much better use of your space. I really like the corner pantry.

Thanks. Any other thoughts about this version?

My only other ideas would be to scoot the fridge down a hair to allow it to recess into that closet a bit. That would make it possible to go with a full-size fridge rather than a counter-depth model.

That change would necessitate moving the MW to either the other side of the fridge or to an under-counter location. A MW drawer either in the island or next to the sink would be nice, but there would be plenty of room next to the fridge, too.

Also, taking the MW away from that spot would allow for that to become a message center, as bmorepanic suggested. I think that would be a nice touch.

Any other ideas?

The DW is awfully close to the range. What about moving it to the other side of the sink on the peninsula?

does the homeowner mind the 45 degree angles?... there are now two: the island and the pantry closet. they wouldn't be to my liking, in my kitchen I chose dead space over 45 degree angles, but this is a clearly a personal design vs. function decision... just wanted to raise the point in case the homeowner cares to consider this.