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canyonhome_gw

New member kitchen redesign/remodel plans

canyonhome
14 years ago

Hi. First, we started our remodel about two months ago (planning & research), when we found and purchased our home, and have been lurking since and I want to send a thank you out to all those who have posted in the various Kitchen and Appliances threads.

I should have joined and started posting earlier, but well...

We begun work (using a contractor - I have no skills for this type of stuff) two weeks ago, and are now in the middle of demolition (removing some walls, completely ripping out the existing kitchen, and doing some minor restructural support work).

It's too late for me to change the plans (I hope my obsessive reading/lurking here over the past months which led to numerous revisions/updates), but I would love to see some comments on if I did OK, or what I might do (other than revising construction plans) to make it work best.

Here's the plan:

There are a couple of final changes not represented in this plan (contractor said he didn't need an updated plan, so I saved the cost of having my KD do another set of plans):

1. The DW and sink in outer island are swapped.

2. The outer island is extended an additional eight inches into the living room to allow for a 42 inch sink cabinet.

3. With the outer island extension, the inner island extension is now five foot eight inches.

4. The inner island is actually 30 inches wide, not 36 as noted.

5. The tile represented by the checkerboard patter is only in the mudroom/pantry and kitchen, ending at the outer island; wood floor extends all the way to the front door and into the guest bed/bath entry.

Last, let me offer some comments as I suspect I can guess what some comments might be posted:

We started with 42 inches around the inner island. But, this left the outer island placed too far into the traffic flow, IMO. So, as a compromise, we cut down to 36 and 38 inches where noted, cut the raised counter depth from 18 to 15 inches, and narrowed the inner island from 36 to 30 inches. I also incorporated that 45 degree angle cut in the closet wall to physically and visibly improve the flow.

I hope that the less than perfect 42 inch pass spaces are sufficient. I have friends that only some island passes of only 34 inches and while not as nice as 42, it still works fine.

I hope that the outer island doesn't interrupt flow (especially with bar stools used, although not placed all the way to the counter end closest to entry). I think it will because of the 45 degree cuts, the fact that the living room wall at the deck is a 20+ foot ceiling with ski mountain trail views which will draw the visitors eyes upwards, and that the wood flooring will be laid so the planks run from entry to back wall, also drawing eyes to the view and up and over the island.

As some advised us, we considered a plan with no innner island, and a larger outer island which while larger did not extend into the entry lines extended, but I wanted two sinks - with neither facing a back wall - and separate prepping and cleaning areas.

I'm looking forward to any comments and tips that you might post. Thanks!

PS - I can see that the plans jpg might be too small to read, so I'll upload the cabinets plans (overhead and elevation) in a second post.

Comments (11)

  • canyonhome
    Original Author
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Here's the plans for the cabinets, which also provide a better ability to read the dimensions of the final kitchen layout. Again, I'd love to get any comments or tips on the plans, noting I'm past the point of being able to make changes (I did revise the plans numerous times after lurking and reading many posts here!).

    I do have a question on color. We really like darker colors, and I fear our choices are too dark (but my wife doesn't want to change any items). We are going for a rustic meets industrial kind of look (we don't want a modern or contemporary look) - I hope I'm using the correct terms.

    The areas open, adjacent rooms (living room, dining room, etc.) will have dark rustic walnut five inch planks. The kitchen cabients are a medium dark stained knotty alder. The backsplash is a darker red with black stains brick, in a subway patter of standard 2x8 (actually I 2-1/4, but that's standard so six bricks high fit in the 18 inch space between counter and uppers). All appliances are stainless steel with a commerical/industrial look), including a 20 inch stainless backsplah rise, for functional not necessarily asthetic purpose, behind the BS AG 36 inch range. The backspash will extend up behind the Wolf wall chimney hood (blower located outside) and cover all of the wall above the 8 foot cabinet height to the 11 foot ceiling, to give the look of an old rustic brick wall that was left in place. We'll also use the bricks to line the outer wall of the outer island. My wife loves a black granite (won't do other options like quartz, etc.), and the tile that she likes is also dark, with red and black tones/colors. Oh, forgot to mention, with the porcelin brick backspash, we'll mix in some bricks that are more a red/pink color to provide texture and hopefully sufficently lighten it up.

    I'm hoping it won't be too dark since we have 20 foot windows on the wall opposite the kitchen, and the walls of the dining and living room are all painted white, and since the kithcen itself is so open with 11 foot ceilings and with only two walls (at 90 degrees and separated by the entry to the pantry room)... and that the lighter pinkish bricks will lighten it up. What do you think?

    Sorry for such long posts, but I how difficult it can be to offer commentors when the poster doesn't provide details. Thanks!

    I hope those images are big enough to read. If not, maybe these links help:

    Cabinet overhead:
    http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af140/canyonhome/CabinetFloorPlan.jpg

    Floor plan:
    http://i1001.photobucket.com/albums/af140/canyonhome/LastFloorPlan.jpg

  • canyonhome
    Original Author
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I think I figured it out:

  • huango
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    What a great space!

    I don't have any concerns about the dark colors. You have a spacious floorplan and lots of light/window.

    Where does the cook(s) prep the food?
    Just in case there's any room of changes, here's a few thoughts:
    - I would have definitely removed the skinny island; it'll just become a landing spot since it's too narrow for anything useful, like rolling out dough, etc.
    - I would switch the range with the fridge. I like to keep the MW near fridge, since you're usually warming up cold food. And the fridge is now closer to the dining room, instead of having to walk through the entire kitchen to get the ketchup/whatever.

    Do you have kids? I would not do a SHINY black countertop: shows too many fingerprints, etc (like a black Corvette). Maybe black honed granite, less daily maintenance.

    I'm drooling over your masterbathroom; my planned mbath is the size of your mbedroom closet!

    Amanda

  • desertsteph
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I don't know about the colors - I do think the shiny black counter top will show finger prints and dust very easily. and often.

    I would have liked to have the fridge maybe to the right of the range - closer to the DR and doorway in/out of kitchen. and moved the range more to the left on that wall (taking that the doorway by the pantries is not a major use doorway).

    the inner island doesn't seem any skinnier than normal to me if it at least 24" wide.

    do you have flooring sample, cab sample, tile sample you can post?

  • canyonhome
    Original Author
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for the comments!

    Hopefully these will ease a couple of concerns:

    No kids, and we're both very clean so I do like the stainless steel choice.

    The inner island is 30 inches wide, so while not perfect I hope it's still sufficient as what I vision as a main prep space, being right off the refrigerator and having a sink>workspace>trash-pullout configuration. I go through a ton of fruit and buy it by the cases so I've designed for this. Also, I'm thinking this prep area works well for access pantry and sink and then using the range.

    Oh, I see the point of having to walk all through the kitchen from living room to access the refrigerator, that's a good poin... but the cabinets are into production and the gas line is where it is.

    And huango, we actually are doing a small remodel to get that bathroom as you in the plan. The existing trhone faced sideways and had a full door. By turning it across and removing the door (we've only been married two years, I figure I'll be kicked out of the bathroom entirely within a couple of years, huh? -LOL), we were able to enlargen the closet by 33% :)

    I do have samples of the backsplash, cabinets, and tile (if we decide to stick with it)... but we haven't formally chosen granite yet (galaxy black?). I'll post tomorrow. Thanks!

  • bmorepanic
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    So, broke a request in below about the sinks- the fault of my strongly held inner belief that doing dishes really takes no time anymore vs as-shown in plan belief that cleanup takes precedence over all over kitchen activities.

    I started messing about because of a couple of things. First is not being able to open the dw and the trash at the same time. Second is the enlargement of an already large kitchen because it didn't do what you want it to do. Third is the traffic "hallway" running through in front of the range. Fourth is the ref doors and the island trash can collide. Fifth is that the cook is somewhat cutoff from company and family by the outer fortress island - altho this can be a benefit to some.

    {{gwi:1790217}}

  • canyonhome
    Original Author
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Wow, I like bmorepanic's design in many ways (especially how it solves many of the concerns voiced here). I think if the counter outcrop of the island is moved to the opposite length/half of the island it's even better (bringing counter and living room entertaining closer together). It does allow for two stations with sinks... but it does put one against a back wall instead of looking at the huge view and/or the tv above the fireplace (we're not huge tv viewers so there's no desire to put a tv in the kitchen, but I do watch a lot of sports so I do see myself looking up at a game while doing light kitchen activity), which was kind of a major rule I used in reviewing designs. So, there's the trade-off with the staions, a near optimal layout for functionality vs. focus on view positioning. That is, if we were to move the gas access and revise cabinet production mid-build.

    I'll offer some more details on our activity to make it easier for commenters to offer tips (and help us identify our designs shortcomings to best manage).

    We don't really do any baking. In fact, I don't think I've used an oven to cook something (other than broiler) but a couple times in the last year. Most of my cooking is in the wok, some saut and I hope indoor grilling in winter - using a 36inch BlueStar with a 1200CFM Wolf 42inch wall chimney hood with external blower.

    We don't use almost any frozen foods. I think anytime we sould rewarm leftovers in the microwave, the food would need a landing/prep spot inbetween. In our current place the microwave is on the counter next to the refrigerator, but that placement never seems to assist much in the flow (although I see my design has it a little bit too far away).

    We use a ton of counter top appliances, some that will never get put away due to every day or thru the day use (coffee grinder and coffee maker, juicer, smoothie blender, rice cooker) - so we wanted a design with a lot of counter space to not only allow for always out appliance but hopefully uncluttered work area.

    Last, you might be wondering about the large sinks. We're going with a 42" cabinet for cleaning as my wife doesn't use the dishwasher and hand washes almost everything (with just the two of us, we can go many days without DW use - can today's lower priced KA or Miele type DWs clean 3- or 4-day old dishes with light food crust?), so a large sink will allow a dish rack to be hidden down inside the larger sink of a double (she's requiring a double). Also, she cooks a lot of soups/stews, so a big sink is good for those large stock pots. Last, I want a large sink for cleaning the BS grates and bowls (and hood baffles?).

  • bmorepanic
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Have you considered a single dish drawer or an 18" miele? It sounds like smaller might work better on the dishes front... Removes the guilt of running the dw half-full.

    You might look at using the kohler full size stages sink as a prep sink for two and the occasional pot wash. It's always difficult to tell the difference between where something is a new great idea and a fashion, but that sink might be both. Let the other stuff pileup in the dishwasher.

    The other kind of configuration for the wall leading to the mudroom might be dish storage on the dining room side, then the ref, then the ovens with some counter beside. Possible the ovens are beside the ref or possibly beside the pantry entrance.

    The dish storage area could have a counter height work surface for coffee, juicer, toaster and convert to a bar for entertainment. Might have a little sink?

    If the ovens move, on the range wall keep a tall space and use the counter height part as an appliance garage, perhaps with a lift-up, slide in door covering the appliances. Keep it lifted most of the time, with the appliances plugged in and ready to use - but pull down the door to cover when you want.

  • canyonhome
    Original Author
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    When I do run the dishwasher, the run typically includes large/tall items (blender carafe, tall juicer mulch catch) so a shelve DW drawer probably wouldn't work... The not running the DW comes from my wife's background - until moving to the U.S. she never used items like a DW or A/C, and still doesn't make use of them.

    I should have joined up and posted earlier, over a month ago before I moved forward on the design, I know see. But, it took me a little time to find GW... so know I'm looking more for tips on how to best make the design work (along with pointing out flaws), as the cabinets are in production, and I'm traveling too much to be present to manage a redesign (and move in timeline doesn't allow, either).

    Regarding the colors, here's some photos of samples. This is the scraped and distressed walnut next to the kitchen tile (we're not dead set on the tile), as they will physically meet at two of the kitchen entrances. My GC thinks the best tile plan is to do a checkerboard with lines matching the wood lay (as opposed to diagnol), and to place the mosaic, if that's what it's called, at random corners. The tile comes in 20inch and 13inch squares, no rectangles, so I had thought to go either pinwheel cut and go that slate-type pattern (Ashford?), but given the narrow 36-48inch passes he thinks the pattern would be lost. I think I like his idea:

    And here's a photo of the cabinet door next to the backsplash and outer island bricking (those two darker bricks are from the same lot, they just have that much variance, and I'm thinking to mix those to the lighter/pinker one by at 3:1 or 4:1 brick ratio):

    While we are set on the cabinet wood and the bricks, and pretty set on the wood flooring, we aren't heart set on the tile floor... and we definitely haven't found our granite yet (wife does like galaxy black).

  • bmorepanic
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    You might want to repost the last photos only with a title like "looking for decorating help" then.

  • Buehl
    14 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    So...no changes possible? I agree, repost w/different title so as not to imply you're willing to make layout changes.