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venice_2008_gw

Only one without design software?

venice_2008
15 years ago

I've been searching and searching and searching for a way to draw my layouts on the computer, as I've gone through a forest of graph paper, and which necessitates redrawing every component again even if I want to sketch a minor change. Sigh. So, looked through here, and found only mention of Sketch Up, which I gave up on fairly quickly. Also, it doesn't seem to be what everyone else is using. So those of you who are able to draft layouts in the time that it has taken me to write this message, what do you use? I'm willing to pay, as long as it's user-friendly. On a Mac at work, PC at home.

TIA.

Comments (22)

  • mayland
    15 years ago

    Well, a free option is Microsoft Excel or even Powerpoint. Just draw yourself a grid big enough to cover your kitchen, so that 1 sq = 1 ft, draw in your walls/doors/windows, and then you can copy lots of this "template" for drawing new layouts onto. You can make cabs by just drawing a box. Obviously, you can't then look at this layout in 3-D. But its quick and easy.

  • remodelfla
    15 years ago

    I was so where you are now just a week ago. It was driving me absolutely crazy that I couldn't figure out how to draw a layout. Sketchup was just too sensitive (or something) for me. I downloaded LiveInterior for free and ended up purchasing it ($80) just so I can save one of my drawings. The easiest, cheapest, and most user friendly thing ended up being Excel. Just set the height and width range of the cells to something to resemble graph paper (I used .31 but could have gone a little larger I think). Make sure that whatever you set them , you set them the same size.

    After you draw and save; you then want to open up Powerpoint Presentation.
    Copy and paste your Excel drawing into powerpoint. Save in Powerpoint as a jpg. (will be on the pulldown menu asking what you want to save it as). Once you do that you can upload the image you create in Excel into photobucket from your Powerpoint Presentation slide. Once in photobucket, you can then imbed the image into a forum question or create a link for readers to click on.

    I drove myself mad till I got this and couldn't have done it without other forum members help. I really hope this helps you. I can actually feel your frustration. Good luck!... it will get easier.

  • boxiebabe
    15 years ago

    We purchased one, but didn't really use it. Just went to Home Depot and they did the drawings for us.
    (hehehe.. I am tickled that I now know how to insert a pic! so here's one of the views of the drawings that HD did - I did the writing on it)

  • imrainey
    15 years ago

    I couldn't find any that I could use on my Mac. So I relied on laying out everything new or significantly changed on the floor and the cabinet fronts with masking tape. I included the swing of any doors I was concerned about like a wider fridge/freezer and a new placement for a wider range replacing a wall oven and in-counter cooktop. My old kitchen was that way for a month or more and it was useful to move through it and see how it would actually work before I began working with a GC and a cabinetmaker.

    I also made my imagination work in very vivid pictures. This is not the way my imagination typically works but I didn't make a decision without making sure I had a real image I could "see" in my mind. There were several times when I told my GC he had to leave me alone to generate a picture before I'd make a decision or move any further.

    It may not be the ideal method but it worked for me and I really, really got the kitchen I was planning and visualizing. Most of the mistakes I made were minor and happened after the cabinet maker did his CAD drawings and I relied on them instead of my own internal pix. I wasn't as diligent about looking at every detail in the drawings and assumed some things were there like fully detailed as opposed to slab drawers that weren't.

  • rmkitchen
    15 years ago

    I've no solution but I do want to say I feel so validated reading I am not the only one who did not find Sketch Up intuitive. I love the Excel suggestion!

  • venice_2008
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    The Excel and PowerPoint suggestion sounds promising, at least for the 2-D rendering. I'll try it. Thanks!

  • pcjs
    15 years ago

    We didn't - I usually do, but got lazy - took the measurements, then cut out the sizes after making several copies from the Kraftmaid book and took it to the store and they did it. Worked well as they KD didn't know all the different cabinets as well as I did after studying the books for months.

  • Buehl
    15 years ago

    When I started drawing my kitchen up, I used graph paper. I drew up a floorplan that contained the permanent features that were staying w/the remodel (windows, doors).

    Then, on another sheet of graph paper using the same scale I used for the previous drawing, I drew "standard" size boxes....6"x24", 9"x24", 12"x24", 15"x24", 18"x24", 21"x24", 24"x24", 30"x24", etc. (for base cabinets). Then, 9"x12", 12"x12", 15"x12", etc. (for upper cabinets). I labeled them and cut them all out.

    Next, I drew all my appliances (Refrigerator, DW, etc.)--to the same scale as the cabinets. I labeled them and cut them all out.

    I now had a "board" and "pieces" to put on it. I worked out many different layouts playing around with these elements.


    Later, I made copies of the drawing w/the permanent features and then just drew on them.


    I took digital pictures of the drawings for posting here.


    Once you have the picture w/the permanent features in JPEG, you can paste it into MS PowerPoint and play around w/it there as well by using lines, circles, boxes to represent the various cabinet sizes, appliances, sink, etc. You can use text boxes to annotate your picture. Then, as was mentioned earlier, save your picture(s) as a JPEG image.


    HTH!

  • overlyoptimistic
    15 years ago

    Our KD uses paper and given that we're remodeling one side of our house, I've wanted to see computer mock ups. I use a PC, and I've tried SketchUp, Better Homes and Gardens (v7), and Plan3d. I uninstalled Sketchup, and got a refund on Plan3d. Both were totally unintuitive for me and getting a door in a wall was too hard. Better Homes and Gardens is okay-- I suspect that is the limitations of $60 software. The rendering on the screen is very pixelated. It also has a limited number of images-- I wanted to see different vent hoods, but they only had two wall mounted options and neither was what I wanted to see.

    One nice feature of Better Homes and Gardens v7 is that I was able to import a floor plan from our KD and then trace over that.

  • igloochic
    15 years ago

    I started on the graph paper, then moved to BH&G (the $60 program) then moved up to the BH&G Pro program (couple hundred bucks...way more options and it's easy to use) then that just wasn't fun anymore and I added Chief Architecht to the mix (ok that's all I use now). That program allows you to use just about any hood you can imagine...it's for professional architechts and designers. The cabinet options are endless and it does a great deck (which is why I needed it). But It's a bugger of a program computerwise. Unless you spent a blooming fortune on your laptop for 64bit and a huge video card...you can't use a laptop..so I had to buy a CPU to use it. And upgrade the video card and something else...the power supply.

    But if you do all of that heh heh you will be able to design a fabulous kitchen or 20 :oP

    All kidding aside...the chief architecht program is worthwile for us, given what I save on not having a KD design kitchens for us as well as being able to draw our decks and other changes to a remodel we're just starting. I don't regret the expense at all!

  • alku05
    15 years ago

    I used powerpoint, myself. I liked that I could move the items around as we brainstormed on my layout. I couldn't get the hang of SketchUp or KitchenDraw (the two free programs out there), but to be honest, I didn't try that hard. Our GC drew up our final layouts for renderings for us, so using a specialized program wasn't that important for us.

    BTW, just because I haven't heard it mentioned lately...you can download and use KitchenDraw for free for the first 30 hours of use. After that, there's a charge, but you can probably get a lot done before that kicks in.

    Here is a link that might be useful: KitchenDraw

  • solarpowered
    15 years ago

    There is a series of "Better Homes and Gardens" design packages that are very good at rendered 3D visuals, that are pretty well respected. They are derived from the Chief Architect professional CAD system.

    And there's always the gold standard, AutoCAD Architecture. It has a steep learning curve, and is quite expensive for the usual version, but pretty much everybody in the design community can work with the files. If you can qualify as a student, there are student versions available in the $180-$370 price range.

    Here is a link that might be useful: BH&G Software

  • venice_2008
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Dawn has broken. The gloom is gone. Remodelfla, can I just say that you have revolutionized my life. The Excel program works like a dream. I set the width/height to 0.25, with two squares equalling one inch, and away I went. It meant dinner last night was about three hours later than usual, as I couldn't tear myself away from it, but all in the name of the cause. It's sooo much easier than my ruler-and-rubber method, and I don't have to worry about being "green" in my kitchen materials, as this step alone has saved about 600 trees. Thank you!!

    Of course, this works only for 2-D renderings, but I can deal with that for now. Intrigued by your trajectory, igloochic ... sounds like something I would (and still might) do, starting with the BH&G package. It's like a self-given dare, isn't it?

    Solarpowered, thanks for the tip re. educational discount. In fact, I do work in an academic environment (medical research), so would qualify!

    Thanks to all for your help!

  • nuccia
    15 years ago

    Venice, I also have used many of the methods mentioned above and I thought I had the perfect combination on a 2-D layout. Wrong! I immediately saw flaws of my kitchen design when I looked at it in the 3-D view of the BH&G $60 program. While it is a PITA in many respects, once you have the layout figured out, you can change the properties on each individual component for materials, style, color, etc. It was far from perfect, but it was enough for me to make final decisions regarding refrigerator size, glass fronted cabinet locations, and cabinet depth combinations.

    I don't want to spend the money for Chief Architect because I have access to a CAD program. I've gotten impatient with the learning curves necessary to learn a new program because I'm no longer able to devote the huge blocks of time necessary. I still need to devote a HUGE amount of time to learning Photoshop better.

  • chefkev
    15 years ago

    venice_2008 - If you're still using the excel method, make sure you take advantage of the drawing tools (Click on view/toolbars/drawing). Check out "autoshapes" and within it "more autoshapes" You can actually insert your own little graphics and shapes and resize them and rotate them as needed. I used these to make correctly sized graphics of my toaster oven, microwave, and chairs. You can then move them around to see how they might fit in different places. It's not as good as 3D, but not bad in a pinch. Best wishes.

    Here is a link that might be useful:

  • jaymielo
    15 years ago

    Microsoft Visio's Architect Template is GREAT for drawing up plans. I've always used it for work for flow charts and such and after trying LOTS of different programs, it is what has worked best for me.

  • remodelfla
    15 years ago

    venice.... YEA!!!!! I can't tell you how glad I am that I was able to give something worthwhile back to someone after all the help I've received from this forum. I hated feeling like I was always asking and not helping enough.

    I wish the BH&G program was Mac compatible. Like I mentioned, I used Live Interior but think I wasted my $80 as there is very few options you can use in terms of appliances, tiles, etc. You can download from Google Warehouse; but haven't always found what I needed there. I guess I still have a learning curve there. Still, I was able to get a 3D rendering that I could save ONCE I paid for the program.

    When I started with all this about 3 weeks ago; I didn't even know how to get my Excel drawing into Photobucket and relied on the wisdom of Gwer's.

    Glad to help!!

  • overlyoptimistic
    15 years ago

    Thanks Igloochick. We're tempted to get Chief Architect-- even after spending plenty on a KD. We've already made some changes to our plan because of the 3d rendering.

    Cheers.

  • venice_2008
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Chefkev -- v. cool. I've used some of them and will continue to play around. The first layout I'm about to post does not have the uppers drawn in, though I've a good sense of what I want.

    Remodelfla, I don't think I realized BH&G wasn't Mac-friendly. That could be a problem for me, as we're poised to toss the remaining PCs and go fully Mac at home (and I'm a Mac user fully at work). In any event, I've made more progress in three days with Excel than triple that time with graph paper -- and, finally, I'm about to post a layout!

  • igloochic
    15 years ago

    Overly...You'd LOVE Chief Architecht :) But if you want to try it to see how fun it is...they have a free trial (I think an hour or two of time) on their website. I am just beginning to play in the program and whipped these two drawings up in less than half an hour...

    {{!gwi}}

    {{!gwi}}

    Venice...if you qualify for a student discount (academic) look at Chief Architect as well. They have an academic program...its a bit limited from the full version, but offers more than you'd get with the BH&G program (I have all of the BH&G and finally moved up to CA because I needed the deck capabilities and wanted the extra kitchen options). The lowest level BH&G program is pretty limited in the kitchen area...so at least go one level above that if you can.

  • venice_2008
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Thanks for the tip, Igloochic -- looks amazing. And I'd bet my not-yet-purchased marble counters that it's compatible with a Mac.

  • overlyoptimistic
    15 years ago

    One of the biggest things that I'm noticing with Igloochic's designs is the precision and level of detail. The BH&G base version has few details and very low precision.

    I tried to do red birch cabinets, but they looked awful because of the rendering (I suspect).

    Igloochick-- If I got CA, could I import my current plans from the base version into it?

    The one thing I am really frustrated with is the camera in 3-D. When I try to move the camera, it keeps the focal point the same and changes the camera location. I really want the opposite-- to stand in one place and rotate the camera. Any clue if that is possible???