My husband and I bought our first home this past fall knowing that we'd have to gut the kitchen. It not as bad as some that I've seen here, but it definitely needs some love. I'm looking forward to more storage and more counter space, and to having a built-in dishwasher that doesn't block a portion of our base cabinets!

I took the Sweeby test, and my wishes are to have a bright, comfortable space that I am happy to be working in. Not too elegant, but not too casual either. A little sparkle maybe (I would LOVE stainless hex tiles as a backsplash for the stove area). I like color, but I'd rather keep the permanent items neutral and bring in the color through accessories. Uncluttered, a little vintage, layers of texture to keep the whites/grays/blacks from getting boring.

I've met with a number of cabinet reps and have developed a layout (link below) that I think is working quite well. But you guys are the layout gurus, so I'm turning to you for advice. Do I have enough storage (we have a lot of stuff, but don't really use a lot of the bigger items on a regular basis, so it may be okay to store in the basement)? Do I have enough counter space? Anything glaring with the cabinet choices? I wanted everything to be balanced visually, particularly on both sides of the stove and the sink...am I achieving that? Is the flow of the kitchen reasonable?

As for finishes, we're definitely going white on the cabinets. Flat panel, Shaker-style. Full-overlay vs. inset is up for debate. When I look back at my inspiration pictures, 95% of them are inset, and we actually found a custom cabinet maker that will do them for the same price, which is fantastic. But there is a tiny piece of me that feels like they are only for large, beautiful kitchens in historic-type homes. Is it strange to put inset in a mid-size 50's ranch kitchen??

I'm thinking Virginia/Jet Mist on the perimeter and White Fantasy on the island. The base of the island will be white as well. I haven't come across any pictures with this configuration...can anyone think of a past kitchen that has it so I can see what it would look like?

I'm posting both our current layout and our proposed layout. The wall going to the breezeway will eventually come down to allow for a connected dining area and mudroom, so I don't want to have any cabinets along that wall. But for now, the door and window probably have to stay in their current positions. I am open to ideas for the living room wall, but I really love having the separation of space. I would be okay with changing the door location, but only if it really solved a huge flow issue. I know everyone loves open layouts right now, but I love my living room as is, and think I'll achieve the open-ness when we add the dining area.

Our budget has already increased at least three times, and now we really need to get it under control. So any expensive ideas need to have a really good reason behind them. I am trying to GC the job myself, which saves a bit of money, but who knew how much everything would cost once it's added all up? (Well maybe you guys knew, but certainly not me.)

Appliances:
30" SS electric range with 30" hood (I know it's recommended to go bigger, but we can't give up that cabinet space)
36" FD Fridge
Standard SS dishwasher (I found a Bosch locally on closeout, anyone have any thoughts? SHE55C05UC)
Cheap microwave that will sit in MW garage

Whew! I think that's all for now. I'd really appreciate any thoughts or suggestions on all of the above. I'm excited (and terrified) to finally start putting this plan in motion. Many thanks for all of your help!

Current Layout

Proposed Layout

(It's much easier to see & comment when the pic is posted directly into the message!)

If cabinet space is at a premium, consider changing your sink base to a 33" sink base. 6" in base cabinets is significantly more than 6" in upper cabinets (re: your reference to getting a 30" range hood instead of a 36"). Also, consider changing the 36" lazy/super susan to a 33" (33" on the window wall/36" on the range wall).

You'll add 6" on the left side of the sink and 3" on the right side of the sink, which also makes the layout more functional, because...

• Reduce the trash pullout to 18"...2 standard bins fit in an 18".


• Next, move the 9" tray cabinet to the other side of the sink.


• Change the 9" tray cab to a 12" drawer base
  OR make the 27" base cabinet 39"
  OR make them a 15" drawer base + 24" drawer base

This puts the tray cabinet storage closer to the range, which is where most of the items in it will be used.

Could you include the dimensions of the rooms on the proposed layout? It will make it easier to see if what you propose will work in your space.

What is the current size of the window over the sink? Will the 5'1" include trim?

According to your layout you have 24" + 18" = 42" inches of upper cabinets to the left of the window over the sink, and 27" + 18" = 45" to the right of the window over the sink. Without the dimensions of the wall it's hard to tell if the window in the layout is the 5'1" including trim. Either way, you will have unequal space between the window and the upper cabinets unless you center the new window over the sink.

Also, what type of cabinets are you using - framed or frameless? I don't see any fillers in your layout and depending on the cabinets you might need them in order for the doors and drawers to clear the walls next to them.

Will the upper cabinets be going up to the ceiling? How high are your ceilings?

If the wall between the breezeway and the kitchen will "eventually be coming down" will you be dong this before the cabinets go in? I would think this would have to be done before the cabinets are installed b/c you will need to have a finished end panel for the base and upper cabinets against that wall.

Are the walls you are removing load bearing? If so, are you going to be using a drop beam or putting a beam above where the walls are to support the house and the roof?

What are the dimensions of the breezeway? Will you be adding to this space or keeping it as is? From what I can tell the with length of the breezeway is 168.25" and the width is less than 159"?? Are you going to be using the current door to the driveway to enter the mud room? Would you consider moving the door to the right to allow for more space in the mud room?

How are you planning on fitting the mud room into the breezeway? Will you enter the house into the mud room and then go through the dining room? Or will you enter the house through the mud room and then the kitchen? What purpose do you want the mud room to serve? Storing coats, shoes, backpacks? A bench to sit and put on/remove shoes? How large do you want the mud room - this will impact the size of the dining area and the location of the door into the rest of the house from the mud room. If you keep the entry to the mud room the driveway door shown in your existing layout, you will have to change to door so the hinge is on the right or it will be difficult to enter/exit the mud room from the kitchen.

Are you consulting with an architect for your project? Since you are removing walls and reconfiguring rooms this would help you get what you want from these changes. It isn't inexpensive to move walls and create rooms, so I would want to make sure I do it right the first time. We are moving our kitchen, removing walls, etc. and cold not have done it without the architect. She was able to make suggestions we had never thought of which will lead to an even better use of our space (or so I hope - I am about 3 weeks from completion).

Especially in terms of budget, an architect will have a better idea of what is needed to do what you want, what you can do now and the parts of the project that can be done at a later time (you don't want to undo something now you will have to undo in phase 2).

Since you are going to be the GC for the project, have you consulted with a contractor to get an idea of the cost of the things you want to do? Are there ducts, plumbing, etc. in the walls you want to move? Which walls are load bearing, etc? This will also give you a better idea of a budget.

I did not know that the trash pull-outs came in 18" widths...that's very good news. I'm wondering about the corner cabinet with two different door sizes though-how does the super susan work if one dimension is larger? I haven't seen that before. I do like moving the tray divider cabinet.

With the section going to the counter (all the way to the right), I was trying to make it hutch-like (though there won't be glass in those uppers), which is why I was trying to line up the width of the top with the base. Does that make sense? I think the 12" drawer base to the left still allows this idea to work. Also, my concern with that cabinet is the microwave. I've been told that having an enclosed microwave is a bad idea...does anyone know anything about this? I was hoping to just get a cheap mw and hide it in the cabinet, but maybe there's a better way?

First, here's an updated layout with a few more dimensions. I will try to post an initial concept for the breezeway area tonight.

Basically, with that part, we're hoping to bump out the back about 5ft. The "mudroom" with be at the front, mainly just as an area to take off your shoes, put stuff down, etc. The door could certainly move, as we need to rip out the front and back walls anyway (they are just storm windows). I'm thinking a bench with cubbies, some hooks, and a half wall that allows the light through but keeps our yucky stuff slightly hidden. You would walk from this area into the "dining area", which I'm actually picturing as a little dining nook with a built-in bench pushed all the way against the back of the house. There would be a large opening from the kitchen into this area. BUT for now, we won't do anything to the kitchen wall.

Here's a few pics of the current breezeway (blech!), first looking toward driveway, then backyard:

The window over the sink is not set in stone by any means. I just want to make sure the new window is large enough to warrant the added cost, and that it overlaps the existing opening. And that it is centered over the sink. That said the window and the sink base can shift around as needed. In this drawing, I was imagining the 61" included trim.

We seem to be headed in the framed direction for cabinets. To be honest, I'm overwhelmed with the choices, and have gotten quotes on Medallion, Brookhaven, Schrock, Dynasty, Crown Point and a local custom place. Surprisingly, most of those were pretty similar in budget, with CP coming in at the high end and Schrock at the low. We're leaning towards the local place right now, as we won't have to do any modifications, and because they would give us inset at the same price as full overlay.

The upper cabinets will go to the ceiling. The height is 92.5 inches.

As for the wall that will eventually come down between the kitchen and the breezeway, this will not happen until our Phase 2, whatever that entails. We can really only do the kitchen right now, and that's why we're at least trying to think about what comes next. The future opening would not interfere with the end of that cabinet run, because we don't want the whole wall down, just a very large framed opening. Another thing I forgot to mention is that the breezeway is one step down from the kitchen, and we plan to keep it that way in the future.

We did have a consultation with an architect to discuss potential options for the breezeway. He gave us several concept drawings for how to use the space...I will try to post these ideas later tonight. I'm sure we will want to have someone more involved for Phase 2, but for Phase 1, I'm not totally convinced it's necessary.

The carpenter we're working with did talk to me about glue-lam (?), or the beam he needs to put up to replace the loadbearing wall between the living room and kitchen. There will be columns too, so hopefully it won't be a major issue. I have heard it might be necessary to hire a structural engineer.

As GC, I've gotten bids on electrical (we have to upgrade from 60amps), plumbing, construction and hardwood. I know there will be some unexpected expenses, but I'm hoping to get a handle on most of it before we start. We're putting holes in the walls, just to poke around, later this week.

Thanks so much for your help!

Trash Pullouts: I have an 18". As I recall, they also come in 15" & 12" widths. Check the Rev-A-Shelf site to see what they have to offer, they're a pretty good indicator of what's out there.

Super/Lazy Susan: The door isn't two doors, it's one door split into two sections and hinged together. So the sections would be different sizes...not a problem w/symmetry or balance b/c they're not on the same wall.

Hutch: Yes, I understand. Is there a reason you don't want glass in part of the hutch? I understand the MW will go in the bottom. I think glass might look nice above it...something to think about!

Do you think 25-1/2" would be wide enough for the MW/dish hutch (I think you said you're using a custom cabinetmaker)? I'm asking b/c if you only reduce the sink base by 3", then you don't have much to work with to make it symmetrical on both sides and still have that 12" cabinet. You have a couple of options.

(1) Reduce the hutch by 1-1/2" and it will allow you to add that 1-1/2" to the 1-1/2" from the sink base reduction...giving you back those 3"

(2) Keep the 9" tray cabinet on that side and use it for extra tray space or maybe another pullout (baking supplies?) If you keep the 9" and use it for a pullout, then I recommend getting a 9" filler pullout rather than cabinet w/pullout insert. (Rev-A-Shelf 9" Base Filler Organizer)

For the other side, change to a 15" trash pullout (Rev-A-Shelf Double 27 Quart Pullout) and a 10-1/2" tray cabinet.

BTW...if you reduce the window by 6" you could fit 21" cabinets on each side of the sink...giving you added storage space; if you reduced it by 12", you'd have room for 24" upper cabinets.

First, let me address the window issue. We currently have a double casement window that's 45-1/2" wide including trim. I think the RO is about 40" square. It's centered on the sink wall. It doesn't bring in a lot of light, so we were hoping to make it significantly larger...otherwise, it doesn't seem worth the expense. If it doesn't get bigger, then we definitely wouldn't want to shift it.

I'm going to do a little MW research to see if we could go smaller with that cabinet without running into any issues. I have a few worries about this cabinet in general. First, are there reasons not to put a microwave in an enclosed space, as long as it's open while in use? Also, I'm worried about the MW door swing. Is it going to be really awkward to get things in and out? I'm not sure how to account for the door swing when determining the width of the cabinet.

I would consider glass for the top of the hutch area, but I'm not sure I have enough pretty things to warrant so many glass cabinets! I was thinking of using that space for food, as I didn't really have another place designated as a pantry area. I would be okay with going back to wood fronts on the cabinets beside the window, and moving food there. It would be easy enough to put dishes/glasses in the hutch cabinet, as it's right next to the dishwasher. If that was the case, I would prefer to have the glass ceiling to counter, like Redroze's cabinet. Can you think of anywhere else for the microwave? We nixed OTR pretty early on, but it seems like I keep coming back to that as the best option, layout-wise.

As for the lazy/super susan...I get that that doors are hinged, and that they can be different sizes. My confusion is about how the insert actually spins. It still needs to be round, right? Does the different door size just give you extra space on the shelf on the stove run, not on the spinning insert?

I think the 9" baking filler pullout would be a great idea. The 12" drawers would definitely be useful too. Hmm...lots to think about.

BTW...I love your breezeway...and I'm jealous! It looks like it's big enough to make a decent mudroom + table area! [Or, maybe a mudroom + laundry and/or powder room]

Remember, I mentioned a 9" filler pullout...that way you don't lose space from the walls of another cabinet or the face frame...you get the full 9". FYI...Filler pullouts attach to the cabinets on either side of the opening and must be done at cabinet install time, not after the fact.

It turns out that two of the cabinets that were driving up costs were the MW garage and the apothecary drawers. After I shifted the stove a bit more toward the back wall, I felt like I had enough room to put the microwave in the island. Before, it felt like that may be very cramped, with the fridge, stove and mw doors all swinging into a small area, but now I think it works. The mw will just go on a shelf under the counter, so hopefully not a huge cost there.

This allowed us to keep a (cheaper) 12 inch depth on the ceiling to counter cabinet, and after your mention of that being glass, I really like the idea. I'm thinking of something just like Redroze's beautiful hutch. Ours would be 27-30" wide based on how much filler we need against the wall. Then I would go back to wood fronts on the cabinets beside the sink.

The sink cabinet is still bigger than absolutely necessary, as is the trash, but I can't seem to figure out a way around it without adding lots of tiny cabinets that cost a lot of money. I guess we could get the apothecary drawers back to the left of the sink (if the budget works out) and a 12 inch tray divider or other type of cabinet on the right. What would be most useful? Are the apothecary drawers worth the added expense?

We're still trying to figure out the kitchen window. I would love to have it come down to the counter. Do I have to buy a particular kind of window for that, or is it all about the mounting? It would be great to have something bigger and brighter than this (current, isn't the faux brick lovely?):

Also, here's an idea of how the kitchen will eventually open to the mudroom/dining area. I'm not positive we'd do the built-in bench, but it seems like there is plenty of room to work with once we bump 5 feet out the back.