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nancyrph

Is Granite supposed to be smooth?

nancyrph
14 years ago

I just had New Venetian Gold granite installed today in the kitchen. I love the way it looks! Only problem is, when I run my hand across it, it feels gritty. Is this just the "natural-ness" of the stone? Or un-even resin? I guess I thought it would be smooth, like glass.

The installer had a little epoxy left on the countertop near the seam, which he just scraped off with a razor blade. He left us the razor blade in case we noticed any he may have missed. I did see a small spot which I was able to scrape off no problem. I'm pretty sure what I'm feeling is not epoxy.

The grittiness is over the entire slab. I washed it off using Ivory dish soap (per installer's instructions), and a microfiber cloth. The cloth would catch on the grits, kind of unpleasantly.

Also, when the sun shines on it, I can dull spots which look like fingerprints, but I think the are just the variations in the stones and how they absorbed the resin.

So, my question is, is this normal natural stone, so embrace the variation and beauty of it, or is it not sealed correctly, or none of the above?

Thanks for any advice!

Comments (29)

  • azstoneconsulting
    14 years ago

    what you're seeing is totally normal in NVG, Giallo Veneziano, Giallo Ven Fiorito,
    and many other Granites that come out of that particular region of Brazil.

    I am NOT a geologist - and hopefully VR James can chime in on this one - I can
    share with you what I have learned over the last 25+ years as a Fab-Ri-Mi-Cator...

    What I know of this activity is that it is (and please - Geologists correct me if
    I am wrong on this) that what you are seeing is silica crystals leaching
    out of the stone
    as a result of the quarrying/honing/polishing process. This is unique with these
    species of granites, as many other similar stones do NOT exhibit this kind
    of activity.

    the good news is that (as far as I know) this is NOT a health risk, and it will subside
    over time - usually within a few months the "grit" stops happening...

    again - I may me "off" on what it actually "is" but that's what I can share on
    the "true grit" of New Venetian Gold....

    Brother VR James - I hope you chime in on this thread!!!

    hth

    kevin

  • doraville
    14 years ago

    Thanks for asking this question. I had wondered too. When I look at eye level at my granite (river gold or aka wine river) which has plenty of movement, I see threads/lines of what appears to be unpolished stone. I think that this characteristic maybe that is what is causing the graininess. However, this graininess or sandy feeling seems to be growing less in the two weeks I've had it. I have cleaned with water and microcloth several times. Maybe that helped. Also, yesterday I sealed it twice because it was absorbing water and I thought that the sandiness may be indicating that it was a particularly absorbent stone.

  • nancyrph
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    Thanks for the follow-ups. Maybe with repeated cleanings and a little time, like azstone and doraville mentioned, the sandiness will get smoothed out a bit.

    I was wondering if sealing it would help. Doraville, you mentioned you sealed yours twice yesterday. Can I seal it as often as I want/need? Can granite get "over-sealed", or does it just absorb as much as it needs, and the rest gets wiped away?

  • stonedude
    14 years ago

    This is normal for this stone. Mica is a very soft mineral that is abundant throughout this stone as well as MANY other granites. There are lots of very small pits that are visible in direct, natural light.

    NO, you do NOT want to continously seal this stone. When done once, PROPERLY, it's enough for at least 3-5 years. With some sealers and/or fabricators, you may even get a lifetime warranty.

  • azstoneconsulting
    14 years ago

    I have had really great results with 511 Porous Plus - I had a stone that was from
    the same area as NVG in our last home - the sealer we used (511) lasted
    7 (seven) years without problems....

    Cameron's right (Stonedude) - too much sealer IS NOT a good thing....

    hth

    kevin

  • Sharon kilber
    14 years ago

    I, just read this. We just had New Venetian Gold countertops installed. The surface initially felt very gritty to the touch. The fabricator said it was dried up residue from the sealer. He subsequently came back to clean the surface, however, the surface still feels somewhat gritty and pitty. Any suggestions to help with this problem or is it normal for this particular stone.
    Without actually seeing your countertop I canÂt make any final comment. ThereÂs no final remedy, but you could minimize the surface roughness by rubbing a stick of paraffin wax on your countertop and then buffing it with a "00" steel-wool pad. ItÂs only a makeup, mind you, and as such you will have to repeat it every now and then, but it does work! Maurizio, Expert Panelist.

  • biochem101
    14 years ago

    There was this same grittiness on the surface of my quartz/resin counter. It too seemed to increase for a bit after install. It went away, but I think it did take several months. Not there any more anyway. :)

    Isn't it annoying?

  • doraville
    14 years ago

    Nancyrph, I'm no expert on sealing but my granite was soaking up water and from reading on the forum I knew that shouldn't be happening. That's why I sealed.

  • vrjames
    14 years ago

    Thank you Kevin for the compliment.

    To the OP, whay I can offer is only opinions about what it might be, as it is hard to tell without being there.

    What I am thinking you have is unresined NVG, this is my strongest hunch. What you are describing is THE reason resin technology was developed. Homeowners like yourself wanted the granite to be smooth as glass. Granite without resin has soft mica spots and silica crystals that do pop out naturally. The resin for the most part, but not entirely inhibits this from occurring, since it bonds everything on the surface together.

    Technically, nothing "wrong" with the stone, but if this is your case, and I strongly suspect it is, then you would want to seal once a year. DO NOT seal more frequently because you get suspicion number 2.

    Which is, you already have too much sealer on the stone and it is "beading" up and what you are feeling is the small gritty balls of silicone. So, how long has the stone been installed and how much sealer have you put on it?

    Blessings

  • nancyrph
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    Thanks for the input, VRJames. The granite was just installed yesterday, and I haven't sealed it. The installers gave me a little bottle of sealer and said to do the edges every 6-12 months, and the top of the granite maybe once a year, depending on how it absorbs water, etc. He said it may not need it for up to 5 years or so. It is not the Sensa granite 15yr seal stuff. Just normal granite. I was told it was sealed to begin with, though.

    The edges that they cut and polished do have that nice smooth finish, which makes me wonder why the surface would be so rough. I sat at the island today, and my sweater would snag on the surface. Not enough to pull the fibers out, but very annoying!

    I don't know whether to just be patient, as many have said it sort of works itself out, whether it is unresined (since there seems to be pits or divits in it), or whether there is too much sealer on it and it is beading up.

    Thanks for all the advice!
    Nancy

  • doraville
    14 years ago

    How strange. Do you have any spare pieces that you can examine to see if it was resined? I know mine was resined from the extra pieces I picked up. Your description of sweater snags made me run to put on a sweater and drag my elbow across the granite. Fortunately, I don't have that problem. I would have the fabricator come check it. Maybe it is just a bad sealing job.

  • kmgard
    14 years ago

    I'm not sure if you're still checking this post, but I thought I'd chime in since I had a similar issue with my granite. It's important to note that I am NOT and expert or fabricator like some who posted above, but this is my personal experience.

    We had coast green granite installed (a very light green shade - similar to if not the same as costa esmerelda) and I noticed that same, gritty feel afterwards. I called my fabricator and he returned to my house with some steel wool and GranQuartz 3-in-1 spray cleaner (I'm not sure, but I'm guessing it's a cleaner/polish similar to method, only not eco-friendly). He sprayed the entire counter and scrubbed with the steel wool and then repeated. Then he came back a few days later and did it again! My granite was smooth as glass after that. Now about 6 months later I'm noticing just a bit of the gritty feel again, so I'm going to use the steel wool he left me and go over it again. He said it should lessen with time.

    I'm not sure if this would work the same for your granite - ask your fabricator about the steel wool.

    Hope this helps!

    Katie

  • vrjames
    14 years ago

    KMgard,

    Your fabricator sealed the Coast Green. It is one of the denser stones that does not take a sealer. The grit you are feeling is from the silicone "beading" on the surface.

    Are you currently using a 3 in one sealer product? Or have you attempted to seal it yourself? If yes, then I would stop and the beading will stop.

    Blessings

  • loves2read
    11 years ago

    I am reopening this thread after starting one with same issue--
    gritty countertops--also VGold...
    problem is that the counters in the kitchen all 4 sections are very smooth and a microfiber cloth or paper towel glides over them w/o problem...
    but in master bath and counters in other rooms, the surface is gritty and catches tiny fibers from paper towels at times.
    the surface of the counters feels more "natural" like the granite is open to the touch...
    These counters were fabricated 3 yrs ago from slabs I picked and had fabricated by guy whose name/number I have lost...so can't contact him for followup...
    We are putting this house on the market--it has been rented for past 3 yrs--so they are not in my personal home...At the original installation I thought they did a good job...seams were very tight...they cut them to right length...and did a really good job with a long seamless L shaped counter top for the game room bar area...
    so did they forget to seal some of them?
    Will sealing provide that slick feel?
    I just don't think there is likely hood that the kitchen was cleaned less than the guest bathroom (which was rarely used/cleaned)...and that is why the finish is smoother...
    I know cause our son lived in the house by himself for most of the 3 yrs...and he wasn't that fond of cleaning anyway...
    The counters in my home's kitchen are St. Cecilia about 7 yrs old and glassy in their smoothness...and we bought the house 4 yrs ago...I though all granite counters were like them until I was cleaning this rental and noticed the differences between the different ones...

  • gr8daygw
    11 years ago

    I had the same problem with our granite, it was so rough it was horrible. Very disappointing as I was expecting a smooth as glass feeling to the touch. I could not even get a dishcloth over it without it making loud snagging sounds. I was devastated. After a lot of wiping it down/cleaning it and trying one thing and another and having the fabricators come back and clean it too I finally read online about the steel wool and that is what helped it the most. In time it has gotten so much better but sometimes still has those little peppery feeling bits on it. What I wanted was that under glass look/feel that I saw on the granite at the showroom. Not what I got. They took the island top back and re-polished it but it didn't do anything at all. Over time it has gotten much better but still not completely smooth as I would like it to be. The little dull places on our counter are large pieces of mica that just shine differently than the other minerals in the stone. I use a polisher/cleaner on it and that helps it look pretty. BTW, it is really pretty but would still like that under glass look instead it is quite pitted overall. Oh well....I did sooo much research before buying and my friend who simply went to Home Depot and bought some got exactly the look I was hoping for, LOL, joke's on me!!!

  • carolk318
    11 years ago

    We have Colonial Gold and it seems to be getting rougher to the touch, with more little tiny pock marks than it was when we had it installed just a few months ago. Should we be concerned? We paid for the 15 year sealant.

  • moqcca
    10 years ago

    @ carolk318: this has happened to my granite as well, after many years though. Have you found an answer to the problem? Is it the sealer or something else that was no longer filling in what are now little pits?

  • gr8daygw
    9 years ago

    bump

  • Phillip Carter
    8 years ago

    This post is old but I am having the same issue with the granite I purchased from home depot for the kitchen in my houseboat. It is very gritty and when I installed my sink I used 100% silicone and it has caused a very ugly black ring all the way around the border of the sink on the granite. The installers have been back out and said the granite didn't feel like it was sealed very well so he applied more sealer however it done nothing for the stain around my sink and it still feels very rough and is pitted enough to make a micro fiber sound like sand paper and you can see small holes or pits in the granite big enough to catch a finger nail. Just wondering if anyone that has posted in the past has found anything that works. The installers are coming back out next week.

  • gr8daygw
    8 years ago

    it has been quite awhile since I posted about my granite in this thread but as time has gone by it has gotten better but it still never has achieved the glass look and feel. It is loaded with mica and is a light granite called Ivory Silk. Peppery like deposits seem to leech from it daily, sometimes I run my hand over it expecting to see a handful of little peppery things but there is nothing on my hand, it just feels like it. It has some pits that must have been filled in at one time. It looks beautiful, is a very beautiful uncommon stone but I hated the feel of it. It was actually snagging my dish cloth that is if I barely could push it across the surface. ...Skip to 2016... It's so much better now, barely noticeable, I don't ever think about it. In retrospect, I am wondering if I had had it honed or leathered if it would have made a difference because I wondered if this slab had been kept outside and the resin was damaged or something like that. I did have some relief in the beginning using steel wool in a circular motion all over it a couple of times but really it is just time that will do the most for it. I even waxed it, did everything you can imagine to nearly zero results, time and daily use are the answer to it eventually feeling "normal".

  • javiwa
    8 years ago

    We had beautiful Calacatta Gold quartzite counters & island top installed weeks ago; DH didn't like the polished look, so we paid to have the surface honed. After installation, a coat of GranQuartz sealer (413S Impregnator, I believe) was applied and left to dry overnight. The next day, I ran my hands across the surface, hoping for as smooth a feel as we experienced with the honed sample. Instead, grit. The installer (not due back for a couple of days to put another coat down, since one coat still led to water absorption) told me it might just be surface dirt/dust, and to go ahead and wipe/rinse everything down with plain water and a lint free cloth. We did as instructed, and the grittiness got worse: just like throwing water onto unsealed wood/lumber and having the grain rise up! The installer is scratching his head.

    I contacted one of the technical experts at GranQuartz, and he said a different GQ product (353P specifically for porous surfaces) should have been used. He couldn't explain the grittiness, but said to definitely begin by using the correct product. The initial coat of sealer was stripped with some solvent (recommended by GQ) and left to dry 48 hours. After 24 hours, I could still feel the grit. Guys came back Wednesday with a stiff brush to loosen up whatever the grit was (not sure if it's old solvent, old sealer residue, or the quartzite itself); then wiped down with acetone. Even before they left, however, I had them feel the counters and they, too, could feel the bits. Oddly, most of the time our fingers picked up no particulate matter . But when we ran a razor over the surface, something was definitely 'powdering' up and onto the razor blade. Upper left photo is a clean razor -- white fragments on the other three, after scraping various areas of the counter:


    Just really floored what this might be.

    GQ said this might be one of the unintended consequences of honing a surface: opening up the pores and possibly loosening up natural particles or even resin that may have been applied in Brazil.

    I don't mind at all (in fact, love!) the natural fissures and grooves we can feel from the honed surface. We knew not to expect the glassy-smooth finish that a polished surface offers. However, this grit is throwing everyone for a loop.

    Installer will be by Tuesday to 'lay hands' on the counter and see what we're up against.

  • gr8daygw
    8 years ago

    I had forgotten that one of the things I did was take a razor blade in a scraper holder over the surface in hopes of leveling the bits and I still do this from time to time. I don't really know if it helps preventative wise but it somehow makes me feel better. I'm wondering if because you had yours honed in place if that could be part of the problem since it wasn't put through the machine and then polished over at the end of the process or maybe it wasn't honed down enough to remove the resin if there was any on it.. Gosh, and here I thought honing would have solved everything. Keep us posted on what transpires with the surface. This is good information to know.

  • javiwa
    8 years ago

    gr8: This may have been due to my post being a bit rambly (sorry: couldn't contain my excitement that I'd been going through this recently, and I saw this thread got resurrected! I'd been going back and forth on whether or not to start a new thread anyway, but this one popped back up.). I'd like to clarify that my stone was honed at the shop, not at my home.

    Regarding not getting enough of the resin off, my understanding of resining is that it's added to 'stabilize' (don't know if that's the technically correct word) the more brittle stones for transport, and that it isn't a surface application. The resin actually seeps downward into veins/fissures and fills all the little nook-and-cranny voids in the stone.

    The only reason I took a razor to the stone at all was that I felt a lot more grit than was coming off up in my hands (minimal, but there was a particle here and there that stuck to my fingers). I really hope we won't have to regularly razor blade my counters to keep them smooth. The honed sample our installer gave me (when we were deciding between polished vs honed vs leathered) was a smooth as can be -- textured, but smooth...no grit. Granted, the sample piece is a smaller surface area than my counters, and not every sq inch of my counters is gritty.

    I'll also add that the scrapings picture above were after I'd gone over the counter with a clean, lint-free cloth, so pictured is not either rag residue left by the workers nor general household dust. The particulate matter appears a bright white.



  • gr8daygw
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Oh gosh thanks for clearing that up, I totally misread that!! I agree that the honed and leathered surfaces I've been able to touch were just as smooth as could be. Yes, I too had residue even after just cleaning similar to your situation. I hope the razor blade won't be an ongoing thing. This is a stumper for sure!!!

  • ekscrunchy
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    All of the many honed surfaces I have felt, including some in my own home, have been velvety and lovely to touch. Yesterday my honed countertops were delivered for a new kitchen remodel in Florida. I was dismayed because, although they look pretty, they have a very gritty feel, and when the light shines on them a certain way, they look blotchy. I spoke to my kitchen person about this and he told me that because he is a small shop with very few calls for honed slabs, he used a (I think he said) floor sander and not the special machine that a large slab yard would have. I was pretty horrified when I heard that. He also told me that the stone has not yet been sealed. This was surprising because I thought a sealant was applied at the shop before delivery.

    He told me he would come to my home and bring the stain and apply a few coats. Can that really make this into a velvety, perfectly smooth stone? He also said (as I suggested after reading this) that he would bring some steel wool.

    My other quibble is that the granite is built up around the edges in order to appear thicker than its 2cm thickness. But now it looks like two slabs were sandwiched together with a horizontal white line running through the middle of the two slabs. Can this be sanded out?

    The granite runs up the backsplash and of course, I forgot to ask that it be bookended, but I do want to get a better finish and lose that line through the edges. Any ideas? The granite is black, white and gray, known as Salone at the yard I purchased, but also known as Silver Cloud. I cannot get a photo now but here is what the granite looks like:

    kitchen-countertops.jpg 320×218 pixels

  • javiwa
    8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Reporting back after my Tuesday visit. It's long and drawn out (sorry, but I think those who are information seeking may appreciate the detail). However, I'll start a new thread as my counters are quartzite and, so, a slightly different animal than granite(s). Fabricator re-stripped (following instructions meticulously) and left the counters to dry. We've followed up with several fresh water rinses and scrubbed w/ a brush (presumably to loosen whatever particulate matter might still be stuck), then allowed the surface to dry. Still grit...same as before. Similar results with white powdery residue accumulating on the razor's edge when scraped across the counter surface. Have also spoken to a technical expert at the Marble Institute of America, and will detail in my new thread. His recommendation is a bit of a doozy...stay tuned!

    (New thread posted here.)

  • sjhockeyfan325
    8 years ago

    eks, re "But now it looks like two slabs were sandwiched together with a horizontal white line running through the middle of the two slabs. Can this be sanded out?" If you want a built-up edge on 2 cm granite, you have two choices - the way it was done in our old kitchen, which was what you're describing, except that the line wasn't white and it was pretty invisible, or the way it was done in one of our current bathrooms, which was to miter the edge (and this one is truly invisible).

  • Rosalie Carter
    7 years ago

    I just had my granite counter-top installed in my master bath yesterday, (white Ice) and it looks beautiful, but as many of you are saying - it feels smooth in areas and not in other areas. I can feel my cloth catch slightly here an there.

    I am using a new fabricator as I just finished quartz bathroom with many issues, using a bad fabricator. I hope this is not going to be another problem. I bought a remnant and I chose, the entire job cost was $1,700.00 dollars. I hope I did not choose bad granite.

    The sales person said it is normal and to smooth it completely can cause the beautiful crystals to become damaged and create pits. It is beautiful and has many crystals, I do not see a lot of pits, but can feel I'm guessing raises or maybe they are small pits. I am not familiar with granite at all, (my mistake), I wish I would have done more research prior to installing my counter tops. When you google quarts or granite you only get the pro's and cons. It is only when you google problems (after the fact) that you get the information you need to make an educated decision. I thought you could count on the professionals.