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gbsim1

Get signature before giving your sink to fabricators

gbsim1
14 years ago

Learn from my mistake...

I inspected my stainless Elkay triple sink with GREAT care when it arrived two weeks ago. Brought it to the granite fabricator and showed them the template and we discussed the granite reveal, all the while gazing at the sink in the box. (This is what saved me, I think)

Yesterday when the granite was being installed, all was going well until time came to drill the holes for the faucets. I looked down at a big (to me) buckle/dent in the left side of the center disposal section!!! When they had put the "lifters" through the drains, I guess they put too much pressure on the center clamp and it bent in away from the pressure.

The rim for the disposal wouldn't have leaked, but it would have been off kilter and was very noticeable. To them this was a "small" dent and "perhaps" it had been there before and I just hadn't noticed it?? .... NO!!

When they left, they had agreed to order a new one so eventually I'll have running water again.... but there was a lot of hesitation about how they couldn't possibly have done it... this had never happened before.... etc

Lesson to be learned.... request that your granite fabricator sign something that says that they have inspected your sink and found it chip and dent free before you hand it over. If not a formal signature then at least have someone in charge look it over with you present and give you verbal assurance that they've accepted a perfect sink.

Comments (16)

  • bill_vincent
    14 years ago

    Take pictures of the sink, as well. In the several years I've been coming into this forum, I've heard more horror stories about this than anything else, about fabricators who ruined sinks and then claimed they were like that when they got them, or even some who claimed they never received the sink at all! Get pics AND a signature for receipt of the sink!

  • gbsim1
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    Yes, I wish I had snapped some pictures. Fortunately for me, a new sink is on order and should be here in a couple of days so there is a happy ending with no fuss or delay.
    To their credit the granite fabricators handled things professionally, quickly and without argument, but the way they handled it was to get Elkay (through the company I ordered from) to replace the sink because it was "defective".

    I can appreciate their confidence that they didn't cause the dent, but I also know that I could never have overlooked that buckle during my inspection.

  • colickyboy
    14 years ago

    Good to know. Thanks, gbsim!

  • beejay27
    14 years ago

    Wow...thanks for sharing this, gbsim. It comes at the perfect time for me--the granite people will be here on Monday.

  • dianne47
    14 years ago

    Thanks very much for this thread. I wouldn't have thought of this very important tip.

  • plumeriavine
    14 years ago

    Yay for happy endings, but sorry you had to go through the "What Happened" stage!

  • azstoneconsulting
    14 years ago

    Gbsim:

    In ALL the 25+ years I have been Fabricating - I have come to know that
    the three people's names most often associated with ANY kind of damage to
    a tradesman's finished work in these cases are:

    "It Wasn't Me", "Not Me" and "I don't know"

    Bill is correct in his recommendation to you -

    I would add to his remarks by saying that IF you are going to be supplying
    the sink to your Fabricator - have it there on the jobsite on the day of templating,
    open up the box and inspect it WHILE the Fabricator or templator IS THERE
    WITH YOU - take as many pictures of the sink unit from different angles and
    close ups of each bowl to show you that there is NO DAMAGE today.

    Then let the Templator or Fabricator take it with him when he goes back to his shop.

    Keep the pics for that "rainy day" when you happen to see either "Not Me",
    "I don't Know" or "It wasn't me" get out of the truck to do your install...... HA!

    HOWEVER -

    There IS another issue in what you have described that gives me cause to
    make another comment - you said that your Fabrocators used a "lifter" to
    hold the sink "up" when it was being installed......

    Question:

    Is your sink attached to the underside of the stone countertops with
    ONLY an adhesive - like silicone? No mechanical clips or supports were used?

    IF this is the case - the Fabricator has installed the sink INCORRECTLY and it
    should have some MECHANICAL means of supporting the sink, and the associated
    weight that is added to the downward pull on the silicone - like the 20 pounds
    of pressure being exerted on the sink and silicone from the garbage disposal,
    and the added weight of sink bowls being full of water - add to that - a turkey
    or big ham, and you'll have a failure - eventually.

    I have seen hundreds of sinks installed by "knuckleheads" that JUST use
    silicone to "glue" the sink flange to the underside of the stone - it's
    going to fail - it's not a matter of "IF" = but only a matter of "WHEN".......

    sorry to be an alarmist - but you need to check the finished work,

    Hopefully your Fabricator is one of the "good guys" that does his installs right -
    using mechanical support - clips or sink-setters / undercounter mounters....
    as well as sealing the flange with silicone

    When ANY undermount sink application is done CORRECTLY -
    the silicone that's used will ONLY be acting as a "seal" - NOT as an adhesive....

    hth

    kevin

  • jsweenc
    14 years ago

    Kevin, if you are still read ing, on a thread a while back one poster said this: (don't have the thread link but I copied this particular post into my own file):
    But my fabricator used wood strips for reinforcement. Clips, silicone for sealing and wood slats. Either Kevin or vrjames (I can't recall) has posted pics before of the proper way to secure an undermount sink. NOT just silicone! Not just silicone and clips. The wood bracing is what will keep your sink (and bathing baby or thawing turkey!!!) from falling into the cabinet! Search for those pics and ask you fabricator what his method is.


    I saw the recent thread on sink setters but didn't get whether this is the same kind of thing or not. What would be overkill?

    From what I've heard, I am expecting to hear "Never heard of it before". (I heard that yesterday from a fabricator about people wanting to come pick out their particular slab of whatever they are getting. Couldn't believe it. Won't be using that company,)

  • gbsim1
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    The silicone is just for seal. Definitely using clips and maybe building a cradle if they aren't happy with clip placement.

    I learned from gw to ask about that before I chose the granit co. and they answered all my questions correctly. But I never thought to ask them to sign off on the state of the sink.

    Glad I can possibly help somebody to avoid a problem!

  • jsweenc
    14 years ago

    Thanks so much for the warning, gbsim! That's the great thing about this forum, we use our mistakes to help others avoid the heartache. Hope it works out well for you!

    BTW, we were talking to our contractor Friday. DH asked when the sink was going in. I knew the answer... it goes with the fabricator. GC agreed, and said "Make sure you get him to sign a piece of paper, not only of the condition but of the receipt of the sink." So I was one step ahead, thanks to you!

  • azstoneconsulting
    14 years ago

    jsweenc:

    I ised to use the wooden cradle thingy = that is, before the "sink-setters"
    and the "undercounter-mounters" came on the scene.... now I use those
    and have NOT EVER had a problem....

    here is what the Braxton Bragg system looks like:

    The wooden home made cradle will work - but the manufactured ones
    offer WAY MORE control of height when installing the sink units - I would
    DEFINITELY run with the sink setter or undercounter mounter....

    hth

    kevin

  • boxerpups
    14 years ago

    Jsweenc,
    I remember that quote. I wish I could find that thread.
    I love the visual of a thawing turkey.
    ~boxer

    I learn so much on GW. I had no idea that sinks
    could get so damaged.


    Here are some pictures I have that might help.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Help my sink is falling off

  • jsweenc
    14 years ago

    Thanks boxerpups and Kevin. I am going to talk to a fabricator tomorrow and he will have to answer that question correctly to get my business.

    Again, gb, sorry to hijack your thread!

  • jsweenc
    14 years ago

    Boxerpups, here it is. Many of the missing threads are available again. I had this one bookmarked and just had to go thru my s;nk file to find it.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Keep your baby or turkey from falling into the cabinet

  • gbsim1
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    I prefer to think of it as expanding rather than hijacking!!! It's fine with me!

  • azstoneconsulting
    14 years ago

    Those epoxy clips are made by Chemical Concepts - They will have a video
    out featuring them sometime this month - I will post a link when it's
    ready for viewing...

    kevin

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