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HELP - contractor error.

Posted by Beth1406 (My Page) on
Thu, Mar 14, 13 at 8:36

Hi everyone - I am in the process of remodeling a kitchen in our newly purchased home. We purchased a KitchenAid 30" double wall oven and sent the specs to our contractor before our cabinets were ordered (this contractor managed the design AND work in-house). Well, the cabinets are now installed and our contractor has told us that the wrong cabinets were ordered and our 30" oven will NOT fit. He says the only option we have is to purchase the 27" double wall oven. The correct size cabinet that is needed for the 30" wall oven will not fit in our wall space.

I am extremely disappointed and frustrated that we are not able to install the oven that was a part of our original design through no fault of our own.

The Kitchen Aid 27" has 4.3 cubic feet of interior space and the 30" has 5.0 cubic feet. I am trying to "let it go" and move forward. Does anyone have any advice????


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: HELP - contractor error.

What size cabinet was purchased? A 30" oven WILL go into a 30" framed cabinet, but it is squeak tight. It has to be "carved" on a bit. We had to do that for our showroom and although the installer wasn't happy, it got done and looks OK. The clearances between the oven and the wall and the oven and the counter are TIGHT, but doable.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

live-wire-oak - Our contractor said that while they could SQUEEZE in the 30", they would need to carve out so much of the frame that the cabinet frame could crack. I don't know if the extra 3" is worth potentially damaging the cabinet.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I don't understand - if there isn't enough room on the wall, why couldn't he tell that when he did the design?

Could you squeeze in, with less carving, a different mid-range brand 30" oven? I think they do vary a bit. If it costs more, it seems to me he should pick up the difference. He made a big mistake, and it sounds like the design was his responsibility.

Many people are happy with a 27" oven, but will your largest pans fit in it?


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Ginny - Yes, he made a HUGE mistake. The design and measurements were 100% his responsibility. The only way to use the oven we purchased would be to rip out the whole section of cabinets, drywall, electrical - - EVERYTHING. And then we would lose either counter or pantry space to make room for the larger cabinet base (33" vs the 30" they installed). I don’t think I have it in me.

My cookie sheets are about 18" long, so they will fit in the 27" oven's interior space.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Well this really stinks.

You probably already know this, but the specs for the 30" KA double oven say that 28.5" cutout width is required. That means each vertical stile would have to be cut down to .75". My cabinet specs require 1" minimum for the vertical stiles, as yours might also. So .25" too narrow. I wonder if anyone has done this before and can comment on the structural integrity?

That said, I really like my KA 27" oven. A half sheet fits fine, or 6 loaves of bread, or a LARGE turkey, etc.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I just looked, and the 30" KA dimension guide says that it takes a 30" minimum cabinet width. The cutout is 28 1/2". Did you get a 30" cab, or was it smaller than that?

Other 30" units - GE, Elux - say they go in a minimum 30" cab with 28 1/2" cut out, as well.

I did notice that my 30" Elux has only 4.2 cu ft capacity, and the GE is 4.4 cu ft, so the 27" KA, assuming the capacity is usable, is no smaller. I wasn't able to find the actual interior dimensions to compare. The Elux interior is about 24 w x 16 1/2h x 18d, but those dimensions are always wall-to-wall, not necessarily what you can actually use. If the KA 27" really is about that big inside, then you should be fine. He should still pay for it.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Can your contractor "beef up" the (backside of) the vertical stiles while making them a little narrower to compensate for the "loss of strength?


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I'm sorry this happened to you. I suggest you think carefully about what you really want. From your original post I didn't get the impression that you were dead set on the 30" oven. If it isn't that important to you to have the 30" oven, then I would suggest you go along with the plan to buy the 27" version and live with it. Your contractor should pay the restocking fee for the 30" oven you already bought, and if there's any price difference (like you missed an opportunity to purchase the oven on sale, whatever) he should eat it and say thank you.

IF YOU REALLY WANT THE 30" OVEN: you should do it. Personally I couldn't live with a 27" oven and I would sacrifice the 3" of countertop space to get it. Your contractor is required to correct his mistake. Yes, it will be miserable. Yes, you will lose a couple of weeks. But you will be living with this kitchen for a long time.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Will you be able to return the oven and exchange for 27in? What is the cost impact? Will the contractor pick up the cost difference? I would not want to end up with weaker cabinets to accomodate this. I would rather correctly install what fits but make the contractor pay for the price difference.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Thank you so much everyone - - I really appreciate your thoughts. Given the usable interior space in the 27" KA (4.3 cu), and the fact that it can fit a large turkey/half baking sheet, we've decided to go with the 27" KA.

Our appliance supplier has been great - - I am able to return the 30" and exchange it for the 27" - - and will deduct the price difference, cost of the restocking fee and additional delivery from my final payment to my contractor.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Please post photos with measurements.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

>> and will deduct the price difference, cost of the restocking fee and additional delivery from my final payment to my contractor

make sure you get agreement on this from the contractor - you don't want him putting a lien on your house


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

"make sure you get agreement on this from the contractor - you don't want him putting a lien on your house"

In writing and signed.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

i would not worry about the lien.

however, surely he knows he's responsible for the diff.

is the 27" a lower cost?

can you take this time to take a deep breath and go over every inch with him asap? this was a big mistake, and from one who's GC was prone to these types of mistakes, you need to mitigate your risk asap. hopefully it was just an oops.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Thank you so much everyone - - I really appreciate your thoughts. Given the usable interior space in the 27" KA (4.3 cu), and the fact that it can fit a large turkey/half baking sheet, we've decided to go with the 27" KA.

Our appliance supplier has been great - - I am able to return the 30" and exchange it for the 27" - - and will deduct the price difference, cost of the restocking fee and additional delivery from my final payment to my contractor.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I agree with phylhl. We had a project manager who made countless errors. The first big one was framing our roof incorrectly (well, the framer did it wrong, but the project manager wanted us to live with an interior column instead of fixing the problem). Things were rough for the duration of our project; I don't believe our project manager ever really looked at our drawings or read our spec sheets.

Your GC has made an error. We all make mistakes. But you have an opportunity to go back over every detail with him to make sure there are no other problems waiting to bite you in the butt. Take the time to do this!


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I disagree with phylhl about not worrying about the lien. You'd be surprised what contractors will do when they don't get paid in full (and even when they do!) Better to deal with it professionally up front.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I'm just spitballing ideas here, but couldn't you cut out the cabinet to the necessary width and reinforce with metal as needed? It seems to me that 1/2" or 3/4" metal struts or even rebar would be more than enough to make up for any strength lost when shaving down the cabinet.


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

Crampon & Kirkall - - thanks for the suggestion re: reinforcing the back of the frame. I will ask!


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

How frustrating!

You absolutely must put in writing and have your contractor sign the deductions you plan to make from the final payment. You may even want to try negotiating a further reduction based on the fact that you are not getting the kitchen you paid for.

If you don't get this agreement in writing, you contractor can sue. You, of course, will countersue, but do you really want to go through this hassle? Draw up an agreement and have him sign.
] Good luck!


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RE: HELP - contractor error.

I've had a 27" inch oven after an 30" oven and never noticed a difference in the functional interior. It does preheat faster but I thought that was because it was a newer oven.I've never had a problem fitting my largest turkey (28 lb).


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