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lmgch

lighting - please help ASAP

lmgch
9 years ago

electrician here to rough in as of this morning. GC pushed me off repeatedly from doing walk through to do mark outs. so of course, we're now doing mark out this morning while electrician is here waiting to get started.

i could really use some help. the attached image is the architect's plan. with the lights in the actual kitchen, rather than going down the center aisle, electrician suggests 30" off the wall. does this sound about right? I know it is suggested here to place about halfway off the edge of the counter top. right?

other changes to drawn plan:
1. island is now 87" and the aisles are 41".
2. there will be three pendants over the island
3. kitchen table is 72"x42" - definitely larger than the one he marked out

my questions are:
1. do you think six recessed lights around the kitchen "proper" (three on each side of island) are sufficient?
2. do you have any ideas for table placement. we tried to mark it out today on the sub-floor and it just all looked awkward. i can't tell if we should keep the orientation to match the direction of the island or flip it to be perpendicular. we are doing six seats, no benches. no matter where i saw the mark out on the floor, it seemed/felt like it might be tight to get around since it is sitting right in the middle of this space.

GC is suggesting that maybe we intentionally shift the table toward the stairs to the basement, eliminating a walkway (leaving space only for chairs to move out for sitting). and therefore open up the space in front and sort of direct traffic more intentionally. I'm not sure how i feel about that. I don't love that idea. KD says "no." but hasn't come up with a better idea yet.

I need to figure this out because it will determine the placement of the box for the over-table fixture. and will also affect the placement of other recessed lights.

I hope this all makes sense. I could really use some help ASAP as electrician returns tomorrow and has asked me to have a clearer sense of where they should be running things.

thanks so much

Comments (8)

  • a2gemini
    9 years ago

    If what I am seeing are your recessed lights, I don't think you will be happy. They are positioned behind you while at the counter so you will have shadows
    I also think you need more than 6 for the size of your kitchen. I would also put one or 2 over the sink on a separate switch. Sparky suggested that to me and love using my UCL with my single sink light.
    I am not an expert so talking from my "gut reaction".
    Your island has pendants, I think right side is ok. I would add one on each end and move the left ones closer to the counter but add the sink one.
    I would add one on each end as well.
    Check the lighting forum or search for lumen recommendations for size of kitchen.

  • Mags438
    9 years ago

    I'm not good with design so I got lots of help.

    Hope this helps... I read on here that recessed ceiling lighting should be 24-30" from wall. We have a small kitchen and couldn't have lights all over (meaning aisles and other lighting 'highlights'). We did 28" from wall and it was perfect. The light 'beam' covers the countertop edge and the aisle. We have under counter lighting.

  • huango
    9 years ago

    Hoping an expert will chime in, but I'll start.

    I thought there's a best practice on cans placements, meaning: not where you have them on the layout.
    Your head would cast a shadow because the cans are behind you, when you're standing at the countertop.

    I thought you want them about 1inch from the edge of your countertop.

    That's how I have mine, but I don't have upper cabs.

    Sorry, your layout is so hard to read that I don't know what rooms are where, ie. where do the stairs lead to...
    I don't think the table should be near the stairs, otherwise, you have to walk all around the table to get to/from stairs.

    Good luck,
    Amanda

  • DIY2Much2Do
    9 years ago

    I'm laying out lighting now as well... just another vote here that the recessed fixtures should be near the front edge of the counter, not centered on the aisle as shown. At least for your main working counters.

    The quantity and spacing of the fixtures largely depends on the specific fixture chosen, which all have different light spread and lumen output. What size fixtures are you using? 4", 5" and 6" cans are all commonly used, but would be spaced differently.

  • lmgch
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    thanks, guys and sorry about the bad quality of the photo.

    the architect had drawn in the lighting as centered in the aisle, but I am definitely not doing that. Electrician is suggesting we go 30" off the wall. but is that to far if counter tops are 24"??...will we end up casting shadows on the counter?

    cans are 6" or maybe even 7" - can't tell and of course, electrician s not here today. (ha - not sure how or why it manages to surprise me EVERY SINGLE TIME i'm told that someone will be back to "do" or "finish" something "tomorrow" and then they don't show.)

    anyway, cans are definitely larger than 4" or 5"

    my KD is cautioning against putting in too much lighting - says we don't want to look like we're in the circus.

    so if i've got 6 or 7" cans - are three good on each side, or should I add a fourth on each side?

    there is already a plan for a separate over sink light

    definitely having under cab lighting

    do you think i want / need an additional can on each short end of the island?

    i'm still totally flummoxed about what to do re: table placement and then lights in that area

    ugh.

  • GauchoGordo1993
    9 years ago

    > my KD is cautioning against putting in too much lighting - says we don't want to look like we're in the circus.

    Isn't that what dimmers are for?

    Don't rush this. Poor lighting can completely screw up an otherwise ideal kitchen.

  • laughablemoments
    9 years ago

    I'd try setting up cardboard boxes to approximate size of the table because I'd have a hard time judging it by tape on the floor. Drywall buckets could be placed around the boxes as stand ins for the chairs. Get a feel for it in 3d, and I think you'll then know where to do the dining lights. If it still feels too squishy then... A new, smaller table??

    I'm no help on the kitchen cans...sorry.

  • Honu3421
    9 years ago

    Hi Imgch: I am running out of the house but checked gw and saw your *please asap* request and thought you could use some support. I am not an expert but just finished my lighting plan and I can tell you it was the. hardest. part. of our new build to date....except now I am on paint but that's another post.

    I haven't read every post and skimmed your post as I am in a rush, but here are my thoughts. Ceiling height makes a difference. My ceiling is 9 feet and my kitchen is 15 x 13 l-shaped with an island. I used six 6-inch cans around the L and then one more can on the outside corner of the island. I also have 2 4-inch cans over the sink My architect was most unhappy and wanted me to only have four cans total. He thinks I am over lit. I couldn't get the link to work so please google *honu3421 please help with kitchen lighting plan* I ended up using the plan shown on July 1 at 2:11 pm of the thread.

    Due to framing, my cans are centered over the walkway. however, the cans over the sink along with under counter lights will provide good light at the counter. I also have a pendant in the corner of the L (no overhead cabinets there).

    For dining room, I have four 4-inch cans in the corners of the room. Not really a room as FR/DR and kitchen are open to each other. but the cans are basically centered on the outside of the dining table.

    1. I would center the cans on the outside of your dining table and consider 4-inch as they will only be for mood or augmented lighting. They will not light the table. Your chandy will be your main dining light.

    2. looking at traffic pattern, the way you have your dining table now looks like the best layout.

    3. Cans on the left side of your island look good. I would try to add cans to the right side of your island. I am not sure how to do that - play around with symmetry keeping in mind shadows.

    4. 3 pendants over island sounds like the ticket.

    I understand your angst but I think you have a pretty good plan. If you want the cans over the edge of your counter top, just be firm and without drama.

    Also, if you haven't already posted on the lighting forum you might do a cross post there. There are some really knowledgeable and generous folks over there.

    I hope I've been helpful. good luck!