My mom is a country gal of humble origins, NOT fancy by any stretch of the imagination, and her dream is a utility room off the kitchen. Call it what you want, a mudroom, arriere cuisine, scullery, working pantry, spice kitchen, canning room or, as she does, a back porch (porches up here in NS are often enclosed), having a utilitarian room off the main kitchen is super practical and not necessarily just for the super rich. Just depends on your lifestyle. Now she has a back porch and she's scheming how to get my dad to agree to move the w/d out of there and back to the basement so she has more porch room!

My planned laundry/mud room will also be my potting room (and hosta storage if that addiction gets any more out of control!) whereas I would never, for example, do home canning or butcher a deer in a million years. So my utilitarian room is a bit different again.

Kalapointer, could you please share the dimensions of your pantry? Thanks! : ) I'd love to lock myself in there and follow a *whole recipe* without interruption!

LL, glad I could make you giggle. You could see reruns the same act around here with us looking for pencils, pens, scissors....even my slippers. I still haven't located one of them that wandered off on toddler toes never to be found again.

Laughable- Have you looked in the toybox? LOL I like Kala's pantry too...and she has aprons :)

Laughable, does your mil know Flylady? She suggests that very thing, just to keep the sink clear!

I like my pivot u-shape kitchen, but a little more counterspace and appliance storage would be nice. Maybe a pantry wider than 21", too.

What a great thread, because it calls into question the use of space, which I think has been lost in current kitchen design (outside of our GW forum). We try to incorporate all scenarios into our kitchens--massive islands, entertaining, and prep space--when, really, many average homeowners' day-to-day use is more narrowly defined. Yet, we want to consider scenarios that occur periodically when we might need extra space or storage beyond the standard daily kitchen use.

This thread also demonstrates that our use of space is dictated by our hobbies, climate and other general needs. For example, I don't have a pantry because I'm adverse to food storage. But my mudroom serves as a place to hide the stockpots and baking sheets that I use to prepare food for guests because my kitchen is visible to my entertaining area.

As important to me, I love to garden, and this same mudroom is my place to transition flowers and vegetables from my garden to my house. So, my ideal "scullery" would have a potting station, a storage area, a sink for extra kitchen clean-up, and a comfortable corner where my friendly but intimidating German Shepherd dog could curl up when I've booted her from the company she overwhelms. (poor thing... she has the best of intentions)

An astute homebuilder would present plans to his/her customers that included an open space between the kitchen and the garage that wouldn't be called a "mudroom" or a "laundry room" but a... scullery, and it would be a blank space with options that would be customized (probably at minimal cost) for how the homeowner would best use it.

Kala--I love your room! The rows of books (I assume they're cookbooks) are fantastic.

Laughable, I think you and your MIL should be consultants of how life works for the homebuilder I mention above. Thank you for sharing your examples!

Why not just enclose the kitchen?! *bewildered*

If the idea behind the open kitchen is to "be with family/company" while you work and the idea behind the scullery is that you don't want to offend them with the messes generated by a working kitchen, well, my dears, I hate to tell you this but you'll be tucked away in your scullery sorting out the scullery chores.

Unless you get that scullery maid to go with the scullery.

Yes, mindstorm! I love kalapointer's room, but the idea of YET another room to deal with gives me pause to wonder why. Of course, my home is not properly staffed at present!

Nancy

When I renovated my kitchen, I moved the kitchen itself to the former family room and bumped the family room into a big screened porch. That left the old kitchen, which I jokingly have called a scullery, for lack of a better word. It is like a passageway between the kitchen and the dining room. All the dishes reside there (not pots and pans) and glassware. We built a wall of storage on one side, and the other side houses a beverage refrigerator and two dishwashers (kosher kitchen) under the counter. I deliberately moved the two rather decorative sinks to the end of the counter run so that I could set up bar/hors d'oeuvres on the counter, and use the first sink, filled with ice, as a place to chill white wine or champagne. After dinner, all the dishes return here and go into the dishwasher. So, a double duty storage and clean-up area. I've tried to figure out how to do multiple pictures and can't find it. So, here's the first, and another to follow.

This is part of a wall of cabinets.

Laughable, too funny. I'm putting my kitchen together & imagining the same scenario for myself. Not as funny. Maybe we need two sets of all those utensils that might have made their way to the cleanup zone?

Laughable, my pantry is 8' x 20'.

Peony4, those are all cookbooks and I have more in my basement.

vedazu, I love your tablecloth storage, now where can I fit one of those?

Springroz, Yes, it is another room to clean up. I have this hanging next to the pantry sink.

I think all these different ideas are wonderful. So many creative possibilities....and great pictures!

A pantry, scullery, mudroom...whatever it's called, is not just for servants! I guess it could be, but for me, it's about working with an existing home and having some walls that will be difficult/expensive to remove. I don't want a small kitchen without a baking area....but I don't know that I want a large work area, either.

I think by dividing the two spaces, it gives you a main work area, where you do everyday chores...open or not, to the main living area. The back 'scullery' area could be utilitarian or 'cuter' than the main kitchen, depending on your taste. If you have a kitchen that's open to everything and has to be kind of neutral, the scullery could be a girly/baking area. Or not.

What I like is that there's an overflow/bonus space for storage and specialized activities that may not fit in a smaller kitchen. And even a larger kitchen, more on display, might benefit from a separate washing up/storage area. Again...it's not about budget...it's about function, design and/or working with the challenges of an existing floor plan :)

This post was edited by lavender_lass on Sun, Jan 12, 14 at 16:28

LL - I think this is a wonderful idea! If I could do it over again. I would seal off the back hallway and transform it to a scullery/mudroom. I have the latter used for laundry, storage of paper products, cleaning supplies & equipment, coats, shoes, etc.

Mrs. Stash reminds me of my mother. She always stashed dirty dishes in the oven. Her best friend told me that there was an incident when she forgot some in the broiler pan.

Motherof3sons- Your back hall sounds like a wonderful area...so glad you included that in your home :)

Mama Goose- Do you still have the picture of a scullery you posted on the Smaller Homes forum? I can't find it anywhere.

Lavender-lass, yes, you described it perfectly. It's a space separate from the kitchen--but wouldn't work in just a larger kitchen footprint. The scullery work is separate, but complementary. It's not that I would want to wall off my kitchen to incorporate a scullery. I would want the scullery separate for the tasks performed in it. We don't need to add more to the kitchen-great room space, or segregate the kitchen from the entertaining/dining area, just to get our desired scullery.

Many builders of new homes incorporate a "bonus room" that could feasibly be a home office, game room, workout room, additional bedroom, etc. Such a room could be added adjacent to the kitchen with equal flexibility.

Peony- I think that is a great idea! Your German Shepherd sounds adorable....I could just see her curled up back there.

I know the popular trend is bigger rooms, all open to each other, but so many times (in existing homes) it's so expensive...maybe a scullery could be a nice compromise. And, I am such a messy baker, it would be nice to have that space around the corner from unexpected company dropping by! LOL

Here's the scullery/pantry I have pinned on my pinterest board.

My current kitchen is a nice size but it doesn't have enough storage for my too-many-dishes, big pots, cake pans etc. I envision one of these in my next kitchen, :) and I want it directly behind the kitchen.

And I like the idea of venting it, too.

[

[Traditional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by Asheville Interior Designers & Decorators Kathryn Long, ASID

Here is a link that might be useful: [scullery/pantry I want[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/what-is-the-width-of-this-space-including-and-not-including-the-cabinets-very-nice-dsvw-vd~313913)

I HAVE a scullery, aka butler's pantry. It's a lovely little 8x9 room between dining room and kitchen proper.

It came with our relatively modest 1910 house, and it has the only remaining sink in the entire kitchen area. Being grumpy old-fashioned preservationistas who loathe the concept of "open space" or "great rooms", we celebrated it! Gorgeous wooden built-ins! Original slate countertops! Super cool linoleum floor! Cute little sink window! A swinging wooden door to swoon over (mind the cat)!

***forward 12 months***

.... now that I'm designing our kitchen, this scullery space utterly stymies me.

We are a 40-mumble-something couple with no children who entertain frequently, but in smaller dinner-party proportions. We're quite avid cooks with some serious & heavy utensilia. Do we seriously want/need to put a second dishwasher in?

If not, who is going to walk the 14 feet around the corner to put away the clean cast-iron pots and pans in the main kitchen? Conversely, if we unload and keep the clean dishes in the scullery, who is going to hike over around the corner from the stove when they need a spoon or bowl? Do we keep a second set of designated prep stuff in the main cooking area?

It's not unthinkable, but I'm finding it surprisingly difficult to mentally walk through a complicated dinner prep. (The fact that this kitchen has 6 indispensible doors contributes to the issue, of course, but that's another post.)

Mindstorm, as usual you've hit the nail on the head: it's one thing to imagine the space as aesthetically ideal, but quite another to actually envision functioning in it.

Thoughts & input from experienced scullery owners are warmly welcome!

LL, I just found your question. I've been having a computer issue--using a laptop with Windows Vista (grrrrr ...), so I can't access the pics or downloads on the other laptop. Was it from Apartment Therapy, with a window into the kitchen? I think that one was posted on this forum, too. I'll look around ...

Edited: Ooh, ooh, I think I found it!

Here is a link that might be useful: A kitchen in two parts

This post was edited by mama_goose on Sat, Jan 18, 14 at 21:54

Just found this, too.

I want to know when the stove stopped being dirty pan storage? Huh?

Or the place to come in dirty and clean up quit being a mudroom?

And why, like granite countertops, is an open concept soooo mandatory? After a fire, I had to FIGHT with several people not to NOT rebuild the internal walls. I know my habits and my then-DH's habits and knew the last thing I wanted was to walk in the door and 1) see the kitchen & its dishes, and 2) see the Den/TV room where DH lay on the couch (usually naked) and threw things on the floor when he was done with them.

Scullery sounds like an intermediate space between dirty, I'll get to it later, and where did I leave that pot or all my silverware...?

Oh, they're pretty and the pictures are lovely, but I fail to see the charm in having to clean up essentially 2 kitchens. Call me short-sighted, but truly, that's why God made stoves I never use. Or, once dinner is served, they're empty again, ready for dirty dishes.

I don't leave dirty dishes in the sink for more than a few minutes because it grosses me out, but I would love to have a counter in my pantry to help with prep. We have a helpful butler's pantry and a very large storage closet near the dining room for all my 3-tiered trays, platters, candelabras, etc.

I love DA's kitchen and all of the service rooms featured on the show. If love to have more in my house.

Mama Goose- That is it! Thank you :)

I think a butler's pantry is usually fancier than the kitchen, since it's closer to the formal dining room. I'm guessing a scullery would be a little less fancy and more utilitarian. This is what I was thinking of doing...but everyone has different needs, wants and layout.

This is working with existing rooms and adding on a bit in the back. While some people like kitchens completely open, I just need more storage than I can fit in a smaller space. And I'd rather sit by the fire and look through cookbooks, then have a huge kitchen, when I normally don't need all that space. But it will be great for baking weekends with the nieces/nephews and harvest time in the garden.

I'd have the dishwasher next to the kitchen sink, but big pots and pans, baking mess, etc. could be back in the 'scullery' until I can get to it. Most of my baking bowls and things get washed by hand, anyway...and plates, silverware etc. can be hidden in the kitchen sink. So, when I make a huge mess, I can enjoy dinner without thinking about it too much. Out of sight, out of mind, right? :) {{gwi:1589774}}From Lavender Lass farmhouse pictures

This post was edited by lavender_lass on Thu, Jan 16, 14 at 14:40

I thought for a moment I had stumbled onto an OLD thread....mama goose, circus peanut, CEFreeman???? Like the olden days!!!

LL, I think that is a lovely plan! We would have the multitude of muddy boots lining the cabinets, though. It is just the way we are. Whenever you see boots in some sort of organizer, they don't seem to be CAKED with mud like ours.

Nancy

LOL! Nancy- I have a mudroom/laundry planned for the other (top) side of the scullery. Right now, when I go outside, I get 3" taller, with all the mud stuck to my boots. Same thing every year :)

I love the design lavender lass. LOL I cant eat my dinner either if I can see dirty dishes in the sink, or anywhere in the kichen. Everything must be clean before I can eat. I am playing around with the idea of adding a walk in pantry. I am not sure if I will do it, but I admit I thought about putting a large sink in to hide the dirty dishes!

PS can I ask where you got the software to draw your plan?

Rocky- This is a revised plan that Summerfield drew for me...and the software was created by his/her niece. I think she was planning to try to market it, then changed to another career field. We all wanted to use it on the Building a Home forum!

I colored in the kitchen, using Picasa. I got the idea from Bmore and it makes it much easier to see the details. I'm glad you like it...I think it gives me all the non-kitchen functions I love, but still enough storage and work area I need for baking, etc.

Since I'm such a messy cook (and don't really want to change, because I LIKE making a mess LOL) I do need somewhere to stash my dirty dishes. This explains why I'm not allowed around oil paints...but I do love to paint walls! Only latex, easy to wash with soap and water, though. LOL

Seriously, I think a sink in your pantry sounds like a wonderful idea. It gives you the flexibility to have a clean up area, drinks area, veggie/flower space...or just fill with ice and have a party! :)

Does anyone have a glassed in courtyard? You know, building on three sides, glass on one and some skylights. Is that considered an atrium..or is that walls on all four sides?

Anyway, that's what I want to do with that little area off the dining room, against the garage. I REALLY want to grow a few climbing roses that wouldn't do well with our long zone 4 winters. So, a small patio/walkway with actual flower beds against the buildings...Is this possible? Inspiration pic...mainly of the rose :) {{gwi:1589776}}From Lavender Lass farmhouse pictures

This post was edited by lavender_lass on Fri, Jan 17, 14 at 17:29

@rococogurl - that's spelled Tardis. The Tardis likely has a few dozen sculleries inside. Everytime I go outdoors hoping I'm hearing the Tardis, it's the d_mn police helicopter.
:)

Here is a link that might be useful: Doctor Who (BBC USA)

I have a scullery. Unfortunately, the sink in the scullery is the ONLY sink. AND the scullery has the only built in cabinets in the kitchen. AND it's only 6x6. The rest of the kitchen is 12x13, has a fridge and range and no built in cabinetry. I really frickin' need to remodel.

cawaps, if I can do it, you sure can! Don't forget reuse centers if you haven't got much of a budget. I recently picked up 6, 36" tall natural cherry, beaded inset cabinets for only $150. Of course, they like me, but what a steal!

Somehow, you can keep your scullery!

Lavender Lass, the software developer is really talented. I would have bought it! I need to look into the picasso software for coloring. The other reason I want a clean up space is that I have two tiny messy parrots. Preparing dinner with them around and making their food for the next day ultimately means bird seed and food everywhere. They insist on "helping" and get into everything. It would be nice to have a place to take care of their food/dishes away from the main kitchen. I guess this makes me eccentric.

I have a mcm condo that I rent out. It has a courtyard bordered by glass on three sides. It is open above to the sky and the whole 2 floors of the condo embrace the courtyard, which opens on one side to a small yard. When I bought the place, where there was not glass, there was beautiful green vines growing up the walls with pink flowers (i dont know what it is called) everywhere. The previous owner had planted gorgeous flowers in pots all around the courtyard with an elaborate drip system. It looked just stunning. Unfortunately, the HOA made me remove the green vines and the flowers all died. I hear the tenant has a green thumb and I suspect it looks gorgeous again. I highly recommend this if you can do it.

Rocky- Thank you! That sounds like a lovely garden area. I hope it's grown back :)

Parrots...if they're anything like my cats they love to 'help' at the most inconvenient times! LOL I don't think that makes you eccentric at all, it just makes you a good owner. I plan out my kitty boxes, food for outdoor barn kitties and storage for horse grain in EVERY plan I consider.

Hi Lavender Lass,

I saw this scullery on houzz.com and thought of you. It's so bright and inviting.

[

[Traditional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by Weston Architects & Designers Oak Hill Architects

One more...glimpse of a cute scullery

[

[Farmhouse Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/farmhouse-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2114) by Wenham Kitchen & Bath Designers K.Marshall Design Inc.

Those are cute! Thanks for posting :)

That second kitchen (blue island) looks so familiar. Was that on Houzz, too?

Sure! The second pic is from houzz also. If you click on it, it will take you to more images, although there arent any great pics of the scullery.

In our new house we will have a small kitchen 11*10 but there will be a relatively generous pantry of 7 by 11. It will be vented, but have no sink or dishes. Instead, we will keep the majority of our small appliances except a stick blender, food processor and blender. Everything else : waffle maker, breville oven, mw and a freezer column will be in the pantry. This way we can have have a small fridge in the main galley kitchen which allows us to keep the area open, light filled.

Even after reading this thread The notion of seperated cleanup 14 ft away from the cooking puzzles me. Then again, a butler pantry without dishwasher, sink, bar and ice machine also puzzles me.

I do enjoy the pictures though :)

I am in the process of designing a scullery to add to a kitchen. The kitchen is very open to the rest of the house and flanked by walls of glass, so everything in the kitchen is visible. There is also not a lot of cabinet storage space. I dont think I will be adding a dw but I will be adding a large sink, counterspace, storage and a place to hang coats, as it will be near the carport entry. I will design at least one cabinet so that it can be removed to place a dw, but I already have two built in dw's in the main kitchen (Maybe I will remove one and place it in the scullery).. My space will be 6-6.5 ft. wide x 9.5 ft long.

Nashvillebuild42, why arent you adding a sink? If you have a dw in there, I would think a sink would be helpful?

Do you have pics of your design? WHen the architect is done with mine, I can post pics.

Rocky. I'm sorry I must have typed something misleading this morning. We're keeping the dishes in the kitchen so we only need the sink and DW drawers in the kitchen. In our pantry we will just have shelves of dried lentils,beans,grains, apples squashes etc. plus a freezer column and the breville toaster oven waffle maker crockpot, unwieldy pans or bakeware and the like.

I understand if you stored dishes in either a scullery or butlers pantry why you would need a DW and sink in there or if it's a spice kitchen.... But for the most part I have a hard time envisioning how some of the kitchens and sculleries are used. Then again I delegate cleanup to the husband and usually stand around with a drink and talk to him as he cleans. A scullery doesn't seem conducive to chatting, imo. Then again I can't imagine living in a 6000 sq ft home either so I'm not sure my opinion matters much on this :).

For example, looking on houzz I found a very open traditional colonial. The dining room was rather large I'd guess 15*18. The kitchen was even larger 18 by 21 or so? And then behind the kitchen was a long narrow scullery. But my confusion arose from the fact that the dining room had a huge display of china. Then the kitchen had cabinets of more casual dishes.. Then there was a 2 entry scullery with huge industrial sink and two more DW. But they didn't have any dishes in there and only the rather large staub and Stockpots. It just seemed like a very awkward design with tons of walking an gathering things to cook and put away. I would be pretty confused where I was supposed to clean what. I'd also dislike the really close off feeling of being in a room alone doing menial grunt work? :) I'd much rather sit on the counter with a glass of wine and talk to my DH as he does that? Although I guess I could do that in a scullery too...

Anyway, I was trying to understand the appeal. And I appreciate your answer.

Oh and we haven't finalized any plans yet. Probably another 4-6 weeks but once we have plans I'll be posting for a critique on kitchen and pantry.

Do post yours! I appreciate learning from others' designs.

This post was edited by NashvilleBuild42 on Sun, Feb 16, 14 at 12:42

I'm loving the Eye Candy on this thread!
Thanks! ;)

I think a scullery is like a kitchen (or any other room) they are not one size fits all :)

For me, a scullery sink would be for big pots and pans to soak, until I can get to them the next morning and the dishes would be done in the dishwasher in the kitchen....closer to the dining room.

Most of the scullery pictures I've really liked have a pantry/scullery close to the range. So handy and easy to keep the kitchen looking nicer during parties, etc. and still have a great place to clean up the 'big mess' that I have, when I cook! LOL

Thanks NashvilleBuild42! I think I misunderstood. You will have no dw in the scullery. I agree that the sink does seem redundant, but I have to agree with Lavender Lass also.

I'm still debating about the scullery thing. I hope Lavender Lass doesnt mind if I post a pic of what I came up with. It is the aisle where the boots are. I think I can get the walkway to 40" (52" where the boots/jackets go), but unfortunately, I'm limited on how wide it can be. The architect liked it and is working on refining it. My kitchen is small for this size of house, so I think the scullery will be a great place for clean-up, hang coats and put boots, storage, etc. I also have two dw drawers, but I'm thinking of moving one to the scullery.

Rockybird, your drawing made me laugh with those little boots in the scullery. How cute! I remember one of my kitchen iterations having little shoes sketched in it, too. : )

Are you going to put in some kind of pass through from the main kitchen to the counter behind it in the scullery area? I think that would work better than carrying everything around the wall. Of course, if you are in the kitchen in the midst of cooking and need something from the scullery...then you might still have to do the run-around. (For a full demo, see my post up-thread. Sigh.)

Thanks Laughable! LOL@the boots. I really appreciate your thoughts and I see your point in the post above.

If I am going to minimize the construction, I dont think I can make another access door. A lot of the food prep actually happens on the counterspace and not the island, partly because the island is solid walnut and I'm scared of damaging it, so the scullery might be more accessible. I think I either have to leave it as is or dont add a scullery at all. I havent completely decided. Maybe the architect will come up with something innovative.

I still like the idea of a scullery! Here is the download MamaGoose posted.

Such a great idea :)

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/pdf/IH013044.pdf

I love it! I also like how cheery the kitchen and scullery are! I really like the cabinet color, the sink and the shelves. Is this plan simliar to what you were thinking for your house?

I havent decided yet if I am doing a scullery. I decided to focus on landscaping instead for now. I cant believe it's been a year already since the first post!

Thanks for reposting the link to the original idea, LL. It's always a bummer to read an old entertaining thread and most of the pictures are gone and links broken.

I don't think I an organized enough to manage two spaces; I recognize the scenario laughable shared up thread! Too much running around when I try to cook in a hurry. Very intriguing idea, though. I hope to have a cleanup "zone" someday and I can't wait! So I understand wanting a separate area but I don't think I would want them in different rooms.

Looks like my pictures are gone...so I thought I'd post a few more. Some of these are more back porch rooms than scullery, but they all have a charm that may or may not fit with the decor of the rest of the house. Unless you live alone or have a LOT of sway with the rest of the household :)