It's fine.

Place windows where you want the views. Think next about building concerns, and exterior esthetic concerns. Don't think about the "uppers" on the wall inside the house, until later.

Your drawing shows everything as if 24" deep. Redrawing as if 27" or 30" deep will give you better idea of where you will want a deeper countertop. At least one run.

What are the wall dimensions? It's slow here, so I can do you up a rendering if you want to see what it will look like.

Thanks Davidro1. I'll sleep tonight! My contractor wants me to decide cabinetry soon (though we haven't started...expecting quite delayed permit tomorrow) as the cabinet guy is usually 12 weeks out. But you're right, it's easier to see once walls are in. I do have to finalize window placement as that affects foundation. The long wall view is okay, the better view is the left side and top left corner. But nothing dramatic.

Deeper countertops? I thought ALL counters were 24" deep. This forum is a wealth of infomation! The counter on right side that opens to dining room will be a little deeper as it's open on both sides. The whole kitchen/family room steps down, so that counter is 42" high in kitchen and 30" high in dining room. It'll serve as a buffet. I suppose I could deepen the left counter as it would serve as my baking area by just pulling out the ovens? I could line up lots of cookie pans!

Hi Cabinfo. That would be LOVELY! I've been banging my head against the computer trying to figure out how to do that and I positively cannot.

Left wall is 9 1/2 feet from top corner to end of oven/before door, top wall is 21 feet, and right side is 10 feet from top corner to end of fridge, then there's a 6 foot counter that opens to dining room.

You all are the best!

Too be blunt, this doesn't seem very functional to me. I don't understand why you want both sinks so close to the cooktop, especially because you've left yourself no workroom around the stove. Having the full height pantry only a ft from the adjacent counter will create a deep, dark corner counter, not a useful workspace. One of the big things my sister wanted to change in her kitchen remodel was such a corner 'cave' created by a fridge in the same location as your pantry.

As a quick suggestion: I would want the cooktop where you have the sink...Close to the prep sink and straight across from a great prep/workspace on the island. I would move the oven over by the pantry and fridge, and have the cleanup space and dish storage in its own area...which still wouldn't be at all far from the stove.

OR

I would at least spread the sink and stove so they more equitably shared the back wall with more room to the right of the stove, and hopefully give it more of an efficient relationship with the island.

Just my opinions...

Thanks much Rhome. Blunt is good! I too am concerned about that corner. I thought a long wall and lots of space would make the planning EASY, but no. And I also worry about the counter room on either side of the cooktop.

Here's the plan I had in November.

I really liked this until I lifesized it and pretended to carry a heavy dirty pan from the cooktop to the sink and it seemed far...11 feet. I also didn't like the step-in pantry once I created it with boards and chairs. I have a 36" gagg induction so this would be a really sleek (or too stark) look along that back run. Do you think a 45 degree pantry in the upper right corner would help things?

I do like how the clean up and dish storage is away from the action. It's far from the dining room, but we often eat outside and that door is right there.

I really appreciate your time and expertise!

Sorry, this is as far as I got. No Island, and I forgot the sink (forgot to put it in the base)

I run into the same trouble as you with big spaces; they're almost harder to fill effectively than small ones.

Here is a link that might be useful: ca_mom's layout... sort of

WOW!!!!

Cabinfo, that is a TREMENDOUS help. Totally gives me a visual as to the scope of the space. And looks like plenty of storage! Almost easier to see w/o island.

Now to ponder and ponder away.

My arch suggested windows UNDER the uppers. My view is the best looking down the hill, so something to consider.

Thank you so much!

Hi ca_mom. You're right about our kitchen spaces being very similar!

I also don't quite understand your plan at the top. I echo rhome's concerns. Those sinks are too close together for my taste. If you ask her pretty pretty please to help you, she might be able to arrange something more functional.

I haven't studied this, but my guess is that I go more from prep space to cleanup and from dining to cleanup than from stove to cleanup. Does
that make sense? You have a big kitchen so you are going to have appliance or area that seems far away. For me, I want the cleanup zone
separated from prep and cooking! No dirty dishes in the way, and someone can be doing the dishes while you're cooking!

BTW, many folks here have deeper counters than 24". Done in the right way, they can be of huge value. You might consider a deeper run with step-in pantry and regular depth fridge on it.

I gotta run to pick up DS for swimming, but keep working! I'll be following your progress too. Oh, I have a couple more drawings to post, but it'll have to wait until later tonight after yoga.

Wow Breezy, you have a great idea. What if I narrowed the island by 6" and deepened the right wall the same? Then I could do a deeper frig (three kids...would be nice) and make the pantry more of a step in with a 30 depth.

Then my November plan could work, huh?

You're right about someone doing dishes far away from the cook.

Thanks so much!

That 2nd plan is about exactly what I'd want (but the warming drawer seems far from the stove). I'm confused about your stove to cleanup sink concern, because at a straight shot, I see about a 6-7 ft walk (maybe 4 steps?) between your cooktop and the cleanup sink...maybe a little longer if you don't cut the angle or are standing at the far side of the cooktop.

Are these pots and pans that go in the dw or ones that you rinse and wipe out immediately to put away, like cast iron? If it's the latter, you might consider a larger prep sink to also use for your pots and pans. That's one thing I would do if I ever plan another kitchen.

Thank you Rhome. I think the 2nd (November) plan is more aesthetically pleasing. Corners are so troublesome! The pots and pans will often be Le Creusets. Great idea about having the prep sink be able to handle them. Time to measure the cast iron!

I put the WD there so it'd be below the buffet counter. Maybe it'd be better in the island? Or next to the cooktop?

You're right about the walk to the sink. I was counting squares in lines, not measuring a true diagonal.

Do you think the pantry would be workable? Or should I increase the depth of this whole right wall (and save money on a standard fridge) and make it more step-inable. Or "corner" it with door(s) on the diagonal.

Thanks SO much. This will probably be my one and only kitchen of my choosing...so the pressure's on!

Pantry: I wouldn't angle it, but extra depth sure wouldn't hurt. Remember you also need to figure wall structure depth in the measurements...That 4" needs to come from somewhere. I would try the plan with 12" added to that righthand wall...4" for the pantry/pocket door wall and 8" more for the pantry interior. Then recenter the rest of the kitchen in the shorter space.

I'm not an expert on warming drawers, having never had one, but I think I'd put it to the right of the cooktop...accessible from the aisle that runs in front of the fridge. Maybe right beside the pantry... So it's easy for you to reach from the stove, but also where others can get into it without coming into the work area. But if your plan is to use it only for buffet items when entertaining, maybe it's best where you had it.

I wonder if you could put the main sink and DW in the island and prep sink on the perimeter. I feel that the right leg might look heavy compared to the rest of the kitchen with the pantry, db. ovens, and frig all on one side. What if you were to put the frig where you now show the DW, then some counter, prep sink (or even a corner prep sink), the between the windows your cooktop. ON the right I'd consider the db ovens where you now show your frig, and then pantry? I'm just thinking off the top of my head and don't remember the specifics of any other of your posts.

If we're slow tomorrow (it doesn't look like it's going to be judging from emails, but who knows) I can dork around with it a bit more.
I don't think I can add anything that anyone else didn't in some form or another (I'd have to cut and paste everything into a document and print it off to soak it all in) but I don't like the range corner either. The hood (not sure how far yours will actually stick out) makes the wall corner a pain to get into i think.
The cooktop where the sink is makes more sense to me as well; you might make it a centerpiece (and it'd even be in the center of the wall) with a bigger hearth. One with the pullouts on either side?

Nothing else to add at the moment...

Thank you everyone. I was happy in November then over-thought the whole darn process. Sounds like I was on the right track then.

Cabinfo-your rendition made me think about going back to chasing symmetry and putting the cooktop back centered on that wall and spending time searching for a lovely framed backsplash tile thing. (Something new to agonize over!) The plan I posted at the top of this looked rather cabinet heavy in 3-D.

Remodelfla-I thought about islanding the sink a lot. I'm so excited to have a fairly large expanse of plain island, and searched island sinks on this forum, that I was dissuaded. I agree the right wall will be "heavy." Thankfully this isn't a sightline from anywhere but the other side of the kitchen. The rest of the house is below and to the left. I also tried the fridge on the other side. I like that as it keeps the fridge monsters out of my way, but thought it would be a pain to "get more milk/wine" for the dinner table.

Thanks again Rhome. I completely forgot walls are thicker then a pen line! How easy it would be if that were so... I think I need to mock something up again and see how accessible the back is. Cooking for ten and no warming drawer?! You're amazing! I'm really looking forward to being able relax about coordinating "done" times with that appliance.

Regards to all!

Warming Drawer....definitely place it near the cooktop. A couple of years ago there were a couple of threads here and, IIRC, on Appliances that discussed warming drawers. What was discovered was that those who placed their warming drawer very near the cooktop (under, right next to, or directly across from) used it frequently. Those who placed it far away and/or in the bottom of an oven stack rarely, if ever, used it and they regretted getting it. Those threads changed my plans (I had planned my WD to be under my ovens) and I placed mine right next to my cooktop...and I use it 6 or 7 times a week! My KD actually tried to discourage me from getting a WD b/c she said that most people use them to store paper cups & plates...now I know why...location, location, location!

Pantry...I like corner pantries, in fact, I have one after seeing it here...SharB's pantry. Some people like them, some don't. I think you have plenty of room for one if you want it, but I think the concern is that it will be on your window wall and may detract from the windows. Mine is also on an exterior/window wall, but it starts about 5' from my 6'10" bay window...so it doesn't compete with or detract from the window. A straight pantry is probably best in your case.

But, don't make your shelves too deep! Our old kitchen had a 6' wide x 3' deep pantry and it didn't work...mainly b/c it had 18" deep fixed shelves and wasted a lot of space. I do think that if I knew then what I know now that I could have made it work better, but I think the vast majority of pantry shelves should not be any more than 12" deep. That's deep enough for almost all small appliances. All my small appliances except my toaster oven fit on 12" deep shelves...blender, bread maker, waffle iron, toaster, food processor, slow cooker, coffeemaker (we don't drink coffee so it's stored most of the time), and even my KA stand mixer (although it's rarely stored in the pantry). It's also deep enough for almost all food...deep enough to line up cans 2 or 3 deep but not so deep that things get lost and forgotten (like they did all the time in my old pantry!)

Of all the layouts posted and linked to in this thread, I like your layout from the "Tue, Jan 25, 11 at 16:18" post the best...with a few tweaks, like moving the WD next to the cooktop, getting a prep sink at least 21" wide, deeper counters, and deeper pantry so you can access the corner better. If you made the pantry deeper, you might even be able to get a standard depth refrigerator (but I'd still make the refrigerator alcove at least 36" wide x 72" high).

HTH & Good luck!

BTW...you're probably not receiving emails of follow-up postings, even though you checked the box requesting them. This is b/c you don't have the email option turned on in your profile. See the "Read Me" thread for more information. Scroll down to the post with the subject "Getting Emails Sent To You...3-step Process".

Here is a link that might be useful: Read Me If You're New To GW Kitchens!

Hi all,

Thanks for responding Buehl. Your pantry is in my clippngs--it's lovely. I tried a corner layout, but agree with you that it makes the back wall not work so well.

Thanks also for the WD advice.

This next attempt cuts my island to 7.5 feet, but that still seems like a lot of space, right?

So, here's another try with new dimensions.

I hope everyone here realizes how invaluable you all are!

THANK YOU!

There you go. I think it looks great. I do think 7 1/2 ft is a lot of island and you won't notice the loss of the foot on top. Did you have specific plans for the storage underneath? You could put in a 30" sink cabinet and still have 2 banks of 30" wide drawers. Pretty nice.

This is the type of plan I've been working on for if we ever build again...Only I'd want twin pantries...Just like the one you've drawn, but another at the cleanup end.

Yipee! Layout blessed by Rhome and Buehl must mean the perfect kitchen!

Yeah, now on to the specifics of the cabinetry. Thanks to this forum, I'm all about drawers for the lowers. That sounds like lots of island storage. Plus the pantry. Does this mean my 4 pressure cookers, cast iron skillets and Dutch ovens, bread maker and popcorn popper won't have to live in the garage anymore?

One major decision down; thanks so much everyone.

Yes...I like this the one the best! It actually looks pretty close to "perfect"!

BTW...I'd put a 2-bin trash pullout in the island on the "west" end so it's accessible from the Cleanup Zone but in the Prep & Cooking Zones where the most trash & recyclables are generated. (Just trying to save you from my mistake of putting it next to the cleanup sink and across a 6' aisle from the Prep & Cooking Zones...my biggest regret in my new kitchen...but it's still better than my old kitchen!)