Oooh, big dog, like that idea. Can we make him a barker?

I would definitely make it a point to get a hold of the landscaper to pay him for last year's work. I would tell him that you would like to clear your account because you heard from the lady next door that you owed him money and in spite of your efforts to pay you never received an invoice or a statement. Tell him you do not want to be perceived as a deadbeat and that you *insist* on paying the bill. After paying him, never allow him to darken your door again.

Our former neighbor who was already insane like your neighbors up and cut down *one* mature tree of ours (he knew it was in our yard too-he was thinking that within a couple of years it *might* cramp the *dawn redwood* he planted 2 feet from his property line--I tell ya, he's nuts) and I was livid. I wish folks like that could move so they're next to each other and not torture the rest of us. When we got angry that he cut down our tree (a mature redbud), guess what: he had a party for the court on 7/4 and didn't invite us! And put his trashcans as *close* to the edge of our property as he could when we were selling. Lovely. So what you've got is SOP jerk behavior.

Fences. Cup was right. Even if it doesn't look right (we would have had to put a fence in the middle of a natural area, and would have done so, if we'd been staying, which we weren't), it's important to establish some *boundaries* with these unstable characters. Things can get *real* ugly if they're willing to dump on your property and cut down your trees and you haven't attempted to defend yourself yet...

Oh dear, what a nightmare!! I'd be inclined to stay as far away from these people as possible and have as little to do with them as possible. Which is truly a shame when you move into a new area.

And I thought it was bad when I got new neighbors who purchased the house next door on the heavily wooded lot - in the middle of a heavily wooded, ruralish neighborhood that has been such for over thirty years - who proceeded to cut down the woods and put in a turfgrass yard. I can't even speak to these people and it's really nothing compared to your outrageous and obnoxious neighbors.

I think you need to plant a living fence along the property line. Some evergreens grow to be impermeable without using a chainsaw. I would seriously consider that more than a few evergreens in thin areas. It wouldn't hurt to have a surveyor mark the property line every couple feet either. Then, never talk to the neighbors again.
And hunt down that landscaper, what ever it takes, and pay him his money.

We know very well where the line is. DH used to do surveying and we hired a surveyor to verify pin locations. All the pins are very clear.

We have spoken to the husband about the dumping, and he acted like he didn't really know where the property line was. See to me, if you don't know where it is you find out before you dump. But based on many posts I have seen on this issue, that is not how most people operate.

To do a fence we have to get permission from the architectural control committee. I don't think permission would be given (or should be) since the only fence in the entire neighborhood is around a pool. However, fence posts don't require permission.

I told DH that the next time I am home and the landscaper is next door I plan to have a conversation with him and finally settle up what we owe.

I guess I have trouble dealing with all these passive aggressive people.

Sorry, no dogs, I'm allergic. But that reminds me of something else they did. They had a cat who liked to come to our yard. No problem, I love cats. However, when the house was framed but no bulkhead was on (no stairs out of basement either), the cat must have walked over plastic keeping water out of the bulkead entrance and fell in. DH went down there one day and it scared the dickens out of him (hovering in a corner, glow in the dark eyes staring at him). He went next door and told them and the husband came over and got it (DH wanted his help in case the cat was upset). Ends up it was down there TWO days. They were like, "whatever". Didn't even care. idn't thank us, nothing. The cat died (or disappeared, not sure) several months later. For some reason the husband hated this cat (he told us several times).

I told DH that I wish we had the 40k to build a barn right now. I would put it smack on the 40' set back line (as close to their house as we can), with the rear facing their master bedroom. With one of those super bright, annoying barn lights that everyone seems to have.

Don't even get me started on rude neighbors!Of the three that surround me... one I really love,one I will never talk to ever again( she's really a landlord) with vacationers coming and going all summer dumping trash over the 8 ft. fence between us,and one is a nosey old goat/ pervert.The ones across the street,two older divorced single mothers, are total Mrs. Kravitz types that tell total strangers my personal business, information the glean from peering out their windows because they have"no life".

If you like to garden create a compost heap upwind of their open windows. I did this to the "landlord" neighbor that lives at the back of my property. I also keep my trashcans there,just feet from her front door, making her rental a lot less desirable , especially as the summer/compost heats up.Small revenge for the cigarette butts and discarded towels/clothes,beer cans ect... that I periodicly find her renters dropped on my camellias and hydrangeas.I tried to reason with her and she went straight to defensive/nasty, so now I just let the compost do my talking for me. I heard her once on the other side of the fence telling someone she really blew it with me,hehehe...if you're nice to me,I'm nice back, if you get nasty, hey that's your choice, but don't expect flowers and butterflies!I think I'm very reasonable.

Maybe you should have a holiday party this year and leave their name off the list!I know that's sort of immature,but who says we always have to be adults!

I've learned to NEVER hire a contractor a neighbor(I don't like) is using, and if my contractors work for someone I don't like, I stop using them, it's a shame when you find someone good,but it's really not worth the hassel of having that contractor talking about your business with a bad neighbor. If anyone remembers my mulch issues last summer, you'll understand what I'm talking about!

Cutting down other peoples trees, trees that have taken decades to mature is a real crime, and should be punishable by law, they should have to replace those trees and be given a hefty fine.Dumping is also criminal,I spent a fortune having trash cleared from my property, and most of it wasn't my stuff, people just felt like it was ok to dump.I've now fenced and gated my whole property, such a shame because I don't like fences...and now the neighborhood can't see my lovely garden.

My DH calls chiropractors "strip mall doctors" because most of them get their degrees from a school located in a strip mall.I prefer a good osteopath myself.

Two comments. First something my father used to tell me-- it's not worth it to get into an argument with people like that. They'll just drag you down to THEIR level, and then beat you with experience.

Secondly, you don't my any chance live on Wisteria Lane, do you? :-) Your neighbor sounds an AWFUL lot like (I forget her name) the hot single knockout talking to Susan!!

Bill,
You made me laugh with that one. No, she doesn't look that good. She looks like most runners, very skinny, no b...

The very first time we met them she asked me how old I was. Odd, but ok, I'll play along. I was 35 at the time and told her 35. She got a concerned look on her face. "When is your birthday?". Ah, February. "Oh good, I'm still the youngest in the neighborhood."

Oh, goody for you.

She may be the youngest (I assume she means adult!), but definitely not the most mature.

Sue, Labradoodles and Goldendoodles are supposedly non-shedding and hypo-allergenic.

So are little Bichons, but I mention big dogs because they might wander over to their property and you know big dogs = big poo! Just a little gift for the neighbors...

I just can't stand horrible neighbors. Sue, I'll tell you, I would find all of their trash, their old Christmas tree/s, etceteras and throw them back on their property. I would also consider getting an obnoxious hot pink sign made up facing their property that says, "NO DUMPING!" Hopefully, no one but your neighbor would be able to see it.

I think the best irritant is to ignore people. I will be nice and wave when I'm in my van, but I will not stop and chat. If I see this weird neighbor even walk near our home, I go inside for a few minutes.

Liberty and anyone else that remembers the wierd guy a couple of houses over that has a master's degree but hadn't worked in a couple of years since his wife died: well, he got a job right before Halloween. Guess where? He is working at a place called "Adventureland" or something like that. It sounds like a place where they can play games and during summer has a pool/slide (huge). He gravitates to kids. Thank the Lord the elementary school didn't hire him.

Back to your neighbors: I would make a point of finding out who that landscaper is and pay him. It's hard to believe, but sometimes I think people create situations when they gossip about others to put people in a bad light. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the landscaper has heard that you won't pay him. You just never know.

Try your best to ignore them. Their egos are energized by manipulating other people. They are trying their best to "put you in your place."

As for having the "biggest house" in a neighborhood. They also probably have the biggest tax bill, electric bill, etc. Good for them. Do they have many children? What's their story or do you want to even know? I hope they don't have children that your children would want to go over and play!

"Oh good, I'm still the youngest in the neighborhood."

Oh, so she's 15? Sheesh! And that's dreadful that the husband says to you that "I got what I wanted" after chopping down your trees! Do remind him that he's committed a felony and that he should be careful of him getting what you want on that score.

Good idea to hunt down and pay off that contractor. That's an expensive $300 bucks that its become.

I agree with Sweeby too - definately low class. I'm so sorry that you have to be stuck with them for neighbors, and I can't believe how nice you've been in the face of their outrageous rudeness.

I wouldn't worry about what they might say about you in town...if as you suspect, the wife has a bad reputation, chances are you're not the first people she's talked about, and I'm willing to bet there are more than a few people who would be happy to see them move far, far away.

Do you like to entertain? If so, I think you ought to have a "First Annual New Year's Day Open House Brunch" or something, and invite the neighborhood folks...including them. You know the thing...a big vat of chili, lots of french bread and easy appetizers, beer and bloody mary's..and a football game going on - nothing fussy, an easy, casual, fun and relaxing end to the holidays. If they come, be as nice as pie to the both of them. Ooze friendliness. After that, can you just see her trying to say anything bad about you in town? They'll think she's the biggest jerk of all time-if they don't already.

"First something my father used to tell me-- it's not worth it to get into an argument with people like that. They'll just drag you down to THEIR level, and then beat you with experience."

That is absolutely excellent advice and I'm always going to keep that in mind. Thank you Bill (and Bill's dad).

I agree that if you can't put up a fence, put up something like a line of close-knit cypress trees along the property line to clearly distinguish it.

Do you think the neighbor's did something to cause the plow guy to not do your driveway this time? Maybe said something about you so they can keep the landscaper all to themselves? I've seen that happen many times where people get possessive over their contractors.

I agree that if you can't put up a fence, put up something like a line of close-knit cypress trees along the property line to clearly distinguish it.

Maybe a line of pressure sensitive pads in the ground hooked up to an unbelieveably loud alarm? :-)

Nahhhh, that'd be too much-- just go with barbed wire. LOL

How about something with thorns? Trifoliate orange has huge thorns, nice flowers and fruit.

Clumping bamboo. The perfect natural fence.

I'm wondering HOW the neighbor knew you hadn't paid the contractor. Well, not really HOW as it's obvious he told them you hadn't paid, but didn't tell them that he hadn't bothered to send you a bill. We've had contractor issues kind of like this before and here's what I bet happened. After the contractor plowed for you but before he could send you a bill, Miss I'm-So-Hot told him a little fib, something like "They said they didn't like the job you did, blah, blah, blah", or something worse, so the guy figures if you're gonna talk behind his back and run him down then he doesn't want to work for you anymore nor does he want your money. No doubt Miss I'm-So-Hot just didn't want you using her contractor and also didn't want to miss a chance to make someone else look bad. Obviously she's beyond immature and doesn't care who she hurts. Sorry you've got them for neighbors. I'd go with the thorny plants and a poison ivy combo.

Tigerlily

Bamboo spreads fast, but it is not a native plant and could endanger other plants on the property.

I'd go with whatever Maleficent planted around Sleeping Beauty's castle. Nice big thorns. And maybe a dragon too.

cupofkindness, I just burst out laughing at that one!! Although perhaps the dragon already lives next door :)

Cup, There are two different kinds of bamboo (clumping and spreading). The clumping is more "tame" and really acts as a great screen. You definitely don't want to plant spreading bamboo unless you build a system to contain it.

Here is a link that might be useful: Clumping bamboo

You guys really cheered me up, thanks. The whole thing is so ridiculous. I don't really need a buffer between us, there already is one. There is thick woods between us with lots of evergreens. There is one spot where it is thin, and that is where they placed their kids' playset (which I have never seen the kids on). I had already told DH I want to add some fast growing white pine there to block it out completely.

I am sure the landscaping guy said something to her about needing to bill us or needing to talk to us about money. And I am betting she made a big thing of it and said it was awful that we hadn't paid that he shouldn't do more work for us until we did.

Sue, that's *exactly* what I was thinking. That *she* came up with the not doing any more work idea. I didn't type it because I didn't want to sound paranoid on your behalf--but it wouldn't surprise me at all. And of course the folks this morning went well beyond that, so I now feel safe with my little conjecture :)

"I told DH that I wish we had the 40k to build a barn right now" -- "He used to do surveying". No reason he can't Lay out the barn with survey sticks. It could serve as a reminder where the property line is and probably drive them nuts, wondering what you are doing>

eandhl,
I would do that, but they wouldn't even be able to see the survey sticks. The setbacks are 40', so a barn would be 80' from them at its closest point. Plus, part of those 80' is thick woods.

They thinned the woods on their side and we did not. As a result, they can see the property line from their house but we cannot because the woods on our side are thick. DH tied surveyor's tape (the bright fluorescent kind) onto the pins to make them more visible. They can see these flags (as they are called) while we cannot.

I think diligent policing of the property line this spring will be in order. No more leftover paving blocks, Christmas trees, lawn waste, etc.

Why aren't they disposing of their waste properly? What kind of people just throws it aside on their property (or someone elses?) Do they think a Christmas tree fairy is going to come pick the old tree up and take it away?

I have a VERY small lot (88x50) and my next door neighbor still doesn't know where the property line is. She mentioned once having her husband put a spotlight on a tree that is clearly our tree and clearly on our property. That is, if you aren't a ditz like her. Needless to say, my dh put a spotlight on that tree that very next weekend, hooked up to our malibu system, clearly distinguishing it as OUR tree. And you'd think that would be the end of it? No...many times after that she referred to is as a "community tree" and "our tree." Um, no. MY tree, woman. MY tree.

It sounds like with 4 acres you have plenty of room to avoid them.
Snookums - that gave me a giggle. I too have a small lot size 60 x 100 so there is no avoiding the neighbors. So when we first moved in our one neighbor told us we should really cut down this one tree because it is leaning on her roof and the roots ruined her patio. Well the tree is on her side of the fence. LOL!!!

Sue - I wouldn't waste another drop of your energy on this unless it has to do with your property line. Post your property. It's pointless to worry about her reputation and why her husband is coming home during the day. Life is too short.

If you can't put up a fence, land mines could be effective...

Seriously, Cup brought up a good point: you'll probably have problems with these people forever. You can't change them. They're jerks, and that's that. So do what you can to protect yourself. But don't stew about motives (jerks don't need them) or petty retorts (they never make you feel good about yourself). Minimize contact with them at all times. Cup's right about neutral non-answers and not owing them any explanation at all.

One thing I would do, and this one, I mean. Put up no trespassing signs on that side of your property. Otherwise you won't really be able to go after them if they screw up again.

"What kind of people just throws it aside on their property (or someone elses?)"

Snookums, In New England it is very common for people to have a "dump" area on their property where they put leaves, grass clipping, etc. If someone has enough land they might throw a Christmas tree there.

I am really hesitant to put up no trespassing signs. That seems to sort of ramp the whole thing up a notch. We put up signs, then they put up ugly signs, and it will just escalate from there. I think I am just going to ignore her for now and see what happens.

If someone has enough land they might throw a Christmas tree there.

My sister did something LIKE that for years down in Connecticut-- she and her (now ex) husband used to get Christmas trees with root balls on them every year, and then after Christmas, the tree would be put outside in a huge pot till spring time at which time it would get planted.

As for the signs, I thought of that, too, after I posted. Not only that, but your next door friend could use that to turn the neighbors against you-- "I don't know WHY she would do this! I've NEVER done anything to provoke it!!"

I smell a good sitcom. Or a really funny column in a local paper... Gladys Kravitz with a dash of Erika Kane! (or vice-versa!)

Pecan:

What wit! That is absolutely hilarious! Sue's neighbor is almost a Scarlett O'Hara and her home is like Tara. And that's all this neighbor will have in life (her home), given that her people skills are so immature. We'll see if Rhett hangs around.... Sue, you can be Melanie Wilkes and take the highest road of all: unconditional kindness. Who knows where this could lead!

I have a neighbor who is really, really crabby, angry and agressive. She swears a lot and gossips loudly about other neighbors. Although she was scary at first, I have somehow gotten on her good side (I delivered a couple of quarts of Blue Bell ice cream after she had a face lift to her when she got home from the hospital, because ice cream is so good after any surgery), and that seemed to help. In fact, she is terribly lonely and I feel sorry for her. And I truly like her, she's from New Jersey, and since we once lived out East, I can handle this woman who knows nothing of southern charm. But you always know where you stand with this woman, which is a good thing, I guess.

Anyway, Sue, stay open while you keep your distance. We all need our neighbors at some point, she may need you down the line. But when you need a neighbor, I hope another one is home!

"Sue, you can be Melanie Wilkes and take the highest road of all: unconditional kindness."

Doesn't Melanie die at the end? What are trying to say to me, Cup? :)

Hey SUe-- I know what we can do-- wanna get her spending big money? I'll come down there and we can rip out the paved driveway, and I'll do a sandbed interlocking patio block drive for you. She'll just HAVE to top it, and I guarantee you, it'll cost her HUGE money!!

Yes, I'm evil to the CORE!!

HeeHeeHee!!

Egads! Melanie does die at the end... But that's not what I meant, Sue, really! Do stay alive, don't teach your self-absorbed neighbor a lesson in virtue that way. Sorry!

Chinese Elm...Forms a dense screen in a hurry.

We have them and my DH just can't keep up with trimming them before they get to tall. It sounds like with all your land you can just let them grow.

Here is a link that might be useful: Grows to 50 feet

Actually Bill, we don't even have a paved drive! It is just gravel. Theirs was too, until this past year. Now theirs is paved with an apron of "cobblestones" (actually concrete formed to look like cobblestones) at the garage and at the street.

A sandbed interlocking patio block drive that is over 300 feet long? That would be a sight to behold!

Piece o' cake. :-) Heck, we could even see about doing one of my compass roses at the very end! Guaranteed, she'll be over before long BEGGING me to do HER driveway, too, and believe me-- she'd pay for BOTH of them.

Why Bill...gasp - I've never seen this side of you before! Who knew? LOL

I have a real problem with ANYONE who looks down their nose at others, especially when they get their superiority from their bank account.

I didn't have a chance to post the other night but I was torn between a nice, mellow, don't waste your energy even thinking about this skank (i mean, poor misguided soul) message of support. Or a delicious, evil, vengeful idea message. I see that both are appropriate, LOL.

So, really, even though her goal in life to get attention and we seem to be feeding into that - it is still too much fun to plot revenge. Just as long as you don't act on any of it!

Wouldn't it be fun to casually say to some neighbors and townspeople. "Did you see the latest episode of Desperate Housewives? (insert appropriate slutty, immature character name here)reminded me soooo much of DivaDebbie next door. Not looks, of course, just the ummm, ummm, ummm circumstances." Followed by a knowing look.

SKANK!?! ROTFLMAO

Skank? I thought you implied more that she was a 'ho!

'ho, 'ho, 'ho!

Seriously, I do wonder sometimes if people never progress past junior high?

"Seriously, I do wonder sometimes if people never progress past junior high? "

I know the answer to that one, and it's NO!
Some people stop right about there in their emotional development, and never make it any farther.

Some don't even get THAT far.

Speaking of which, and is totally OT - have you seen the Adam Carolla project on TV? I just saw for the first time this week and thought it was a riot. Those guys haven't made it past junior high for sure. The good news is they are generrally harmless and fun junior high, not petty and pretenious junior high. They remind me of several people I know and love.

Now, back on topic, when they dump stuff in your yard, have you considered calling and offering, very kindly and wide eyed, ''Oh, did you need the name of a junk or brush removal company to take away your xzy? I'm afraid our lot isn't zoned for dumping. So sorry.'' Maybe you or your dh would have to call her dh at his work. And leave a message with the receptionist. Might be the only way to keep a straight face.

I'm enjoying this way too much. Hope it isn't adding to your misery. Hmmm...did Stephen King write any books about neighbors?

I dont' know about Stephen King...but I've been plotting a couple of books myself, of which I'm sure would be best sellers with the story lines I would base on fact! One called, "The H.O.A." & "The Salon". This would most definitely be situated in the Northern VA/Washington DC area for the H.O.A., aka "Viper Pit" living.