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jkmcem

decision time - Trane vs Carrier proposals

jkmcem
10 years ago

I have been haunting this site for the last two weeks as we gathered quotes for a new furnace and A/C system for our Northern Virginia home. The final decision is now between the following two and since I'm now the household authority on all things HVAC, I'm looking for your expert opinions. Proposals are as follows:

Carrier Proposal
58CCVA 110-1-20 Infinity 80 variable speed 2-stage furnace
24ACC636 A30 Performance 16 3 ton AC unit
CNP8P4821 ALA cooling coil

this proposal assumes using the current thermostat and does not include an humidifier add-on for the furnace.

Installed price of $5850

Trane Proposal
TUD2D120A9V5V XV80Variable Speed 2-stage furnace
4TTR6042 XR-16 Air conditioner 3.5 Ton
4TXCD050 Evaporator Coil

this proposal includes a Honeywell Model 6000 thermostat and an Aprilaire model 600M humidifier

Installed price of $7,854.

Both companies are highly rated for quality and price by our local consumer ratings sites.

There is a $2,000 difference between what appears to me to be similar systems. I imagine that the humidifier and thermostat would add no more than $700 so I'm still left with a huge price difference. Is there really a quality difference in these two quotes and between the Trane and Carrier brands?

Any help is appreciated.

Comments (9)

  • tigerdunes
    10 years ago

    For what size home?

    What size and eff furnace and AC are you replacing?

    Your residence is a single family home or perhaps a condo/ TH?

    Just several quick observations.

    I would never advise purchasing a Carrier Infinity furnace without the Infinity controller.

    And I really question the size of the Trane furnace quote.

    Post back with info.

    IMO

  • jkmcem
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    This is a west facing split level home with 2440 square feet above grade (two floors) and another 800 finished sq feet that is 1/2 below grade. We have two direct-vent fireplaces that provide a lot of heat in the winter. One is in the below grade large family room and the other is in the fist floor kitchen/great room.

    Our current equipment is 24 years old - a Rheem 3 ton 10 seer AC unit and the current furnace is a Rheem RGDE-12 ERAJI. I have no idea how many BTU's it is. This equipment was installed before we did a 800 square foot above grade (first floor) addition to the house. We were told at the time of the addition our current equipment was sufficient for the new space and we did not upgrade.

    Heating is not our problem in this house as we primarily use the two direct vent fireplaces. Air conditioning is an issue and we have great swing and variation in air conditioning from room to room. I was hoping the variable speed fan would help with this.

    Thanks for your interest and your help!

  • tigerdunes
    10 years ago

    Is there any specific reason you have been quoted 80% eff furnaces and not 95%+ high eff furnaces?

    I suspect you are undersized on existing AC.

    IMO

  • jkmcem
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    I think that the 80% furnace is because natural gas is really cheap in this area, and there may be an installation issue. One of the HVAC folks mentioned that we didn't have room for the larger vent piping required for some of the high efficiency models and that if we wanted that we would have to do a water heater replacement and move some pipes. So the real answer is - I have no idea.

    Two of the three estimates said a 3 ton unit for A/C and one says 3.5 tons. When I've talked to each of them the 3T people say better to have the unit slightly small than too big so that you get better humidity control. The 3.5 T man said that he thought we needed the 3.5T and that the variable speed fan would take care of the humidity problem. (As I've been without AC now for 2 weeks I can honestly say "it's not the heat, it's the humidity.")

    I did talk to the Carrier man and he now i including a Thermidistat TP-PR H01-A and a Carrier humidifier. The price for the thermidistat is $300 and the humidifier is $400. I'm amazed I was able to estimate the costs when I was doing my back of the envelope calculations!

    Your help and questions are invaluable in this process. I have another week to go before my low bid Carrier system can get installed and I have to know that it is worth the sweat.

    Thanks!

  • tigerdunes
    10 years ago

    You have decided on Carrier?

    I think the Carrier furnace is oversized! Go with 90 K size.

    I think the Carrier AC is undersized and I would move up to 3 1/2 ton Performance 16 or 4 ton two stage Performance 17. I don't see how the 3 ton is the correct size.

    I still would get an upgrade price from the Carrier thermidistat to the Infinity controller.

    I would get another opinion on the high eff furnace and venting issue. An 80% is really a dinosaur.

    IMO

  • jkmcem
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Haven't firmly decided on Carrier except based on price. Trane is still in the running if I understand why it is better or more expensive. And another plus for Trane is that I can have it installed this week. Do you think that the Trane is going to be a better system for our home? The 3.5 Ton sounds really good to me right now as the temps are around 90+. And the Trane furnace is the right size? About how much more money is a 90%+ efficient furnace than the 80% efficiency?

    Thanks so much!

  • ryanhughes
    10 years ago

    I'm biased but I like the Trane equipment quoted. Both are great systems though, and I too strongly advise getting the Infinity controller. With the Trane system, I would at least get the XL803 thermostat but preferably the XL900. I would inquire about the ComfortLink II communicating furnace and/or system. "XC" furnace and XL900 or XL950 thermostat. The furnaces are oversized as TD mentioned. I agree with 3.5 ton although here I am judging based on the info you provided and being not too far from you. Your duct system needs to be adequate for the proper airflow these units will require, especially if going with such large furnaces (which defeat the purpose of 2-stage operation and limit any comfort advantages). No load calculations done I'm assuming -- many size just by guessing and upsizing the furnaces to get the higher SEER/EER ratings due to the larger blower. What many homeowners don't understand until after the fact is their comfort is not where it could be and their equipment is loud due to an undersized duct system. Good luck & keep us posted as you hear back.

    This post was edited by ryanhughes on Mon, Aug 12, 13 at 17:48

  • mike_home
    10 years ago

    Get a quote for a 95%+ efficiency furnace from both contractors. The higher efficiency furnace may be eligible for a federal tax credit and local utility rebates. This will help with the higher cost. Some installations are difficult, but it does not hurt to find out the details.

    Ask the Carrier dealer if he will upgrade to the Infinity controller for the same price as the Thermidistat. It is not a big difference in equipment costs.

    I also think the furnaces are over sized, and the 3.5 ton AC seems right for a house your size. If you add the thermostat, humidifier, and extra 0.5 ton AC to the Carrier quote it will be close to that of the Trane. Both are very good equipment. Go with the contractor who you feel will do the best installation.

  • tigerdunes
    10 years ago

    Both very good systems.

    Final thoughts.

    Both 80% eff furnaces are oversized. Drop down to the 90 K for the Carrier, 80-100 K for Trane. However, I would prefer the 95% Infinity in 80 K size, also Trane XV95 in 80 K size.

    No lower than 3 1/2 ton AC condenser.

    Ductwork should be checked for size to handle extra cooling CFMs.

    I want the system to qualify for Fed Tax Credit.

    For thermostats, on the Carrier I prefer the Infinity controller over the thermidistat. You cheat the Infinity furnace whether 80% or 95% eff without the Infinity controller. For Trane the XL900 series or HW VP IAQ, second the 803 or HW Mdl 8321.

    Definitely a filter box cabinet for either system. Humidifier your choice.

    IMO