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Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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Posted by daffer (My Page) on Thu, Jun 5, 08 at 17:06
Just when I think I've got things figured out (with a lot of help from this forum),
I have another series of questions.
This is for a 5-ton HP in North Carolina, coupled with a 95% AFUE furnace (ICS-3-stage, 58MVC100), and a horizontal coil. I'd been comparing the "best" Carrier unit (Infinity 19) but have come to realize that the ARI certifications show quite a bit of info. When I input the Carrier Infinity 16 vs 19, the EER, SEER, and HSPF were very close. The biggest difference was EER (10.3 vs 10.7), not so great I admit. The cooling btuh figure is actually higher for the Infinity 16, at 59,000 vs 56,000.
Obviously the price of the Infinity 16 is lower. Is there something I'm missing in figuring out the differences? The warranty is the same and the literature is just about the same for the 16 and 19. The only thing different that I can see is that the Infinity 19 has scrolling 2-stage compressor; the 16 has a 2-stage compressor, but no scrolling. Is scrolling worth $1,000? Are there other differences I've missed?
I had been looking at a new, but previous model of the Lennox heat pump, XPXA19-060 configured with its high-end furnace. I'd get a good warranty on the heat pump, but it was manufactured 5 years ago. Performance figures are in the same range as the Lennox.
If I get the Carrier setup (using the Infinity 16) it would be even lower-priced than the Lennox setup I've mentioned.
Any comments to what was to be a short post would be appreciated. |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| I like the fact that the Infinity 16 runs at 50-60% of its capacity during low stage for more humidity removal and longer runtimes. However, the Infinity 16 has to stop to switch stages, whereas the Infinity 19 can switch stages on the fly (if that really matters). |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| What exact model numbers, indoor and outdoor units, are you considering? Do you have ARI #s? |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| daffer a high eff two stg HP paired with a 95% AFUE eff gas furnace is overkill for your area/climate. In fact, do you even get the low stg of the three stg in a dual fuel application? I would check to see what your other choices are as to Carrier var speed backup furnace. I would think a two stg would be more than adequate unless the price difference is negligible. IMO |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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Tigerdunes:
It may be overkill, but I think I might get some use out of the lower
stage(s) and I want the variable fan speeds that this furnace offers. I'll try to use the heat pump as much as possible (never had one) given that electric rates are relatively reasonable. Garyg:
Carrier HP: 25HNA660A30 or 25HNA960A30 with CNPH*6024A and furnace 58MVC100-20. ARI #1409574 and #1409827. Lennox is HPXA19 with CH33-62D-2F and furnace G71MPP-060-020.
(No ARI ref #) Ryanhughes: Is the stopping to switch stages likely to be a problem in your estimation? Thanks all.
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RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| In my area (Maryland, not too different from North Carolina), it doesn't seem like the 19 SEER is very popular. I do not think the stopping is a big deal at all--it should run in low stage most of the time and go to high stage only as needed. I prefer the bigger staging differential that the 16 SEER provides--helps with humidity and longer runtimes as I mentioned above. I assume you're getting the Infinity control, correct? All in all I think this combination would provide for a great system (I have no idea about furnace staging as mentioned above). |
Also
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| There is a 2-stage Infinity furnace that is in the 95% AFUE range. There's also a 80% AFUE 2-stage Infinity furnace. You may be able to save some money upfront and make a wiser investment since you're going with the heat pump (good idea). |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| The G71 is an overkill in this set up. Why pay for the newest, top of the line furnace with modulating input/output when you should be using the heat pump most of the year? The 2-stage, G61V is the much better choice or, if a chimney is available, depending on fuel costs, the G60V might even make sense (as could a variable speed air handler with resistance heat). All other things being equal (i.e. quality of installers), if it were up to just those two systems, you'd have to go with the Carrier. Its less expensive, brand new, and has an ARI certified rating. The Lennox is a 5 year old, discontinued unit, that wasn't nearly as efficient in heating. |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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| "Carrier HP: 25HNA660A30 or 25HNA960A30 with CNPH*6024A and furnace 58MVC100-20. ARI #1409574 and #1409827." Those ARI#s are for an Infinity 16 heat pump and coil. The numbers are weak for a "16": #1409574
- 59,000 btu cooling (almost a full 5 tons - OK), 10.3 EER (weak) 14.5 SEER (not 16), 59,000 btu heating at 47F outside (OK), 8.7 HSPF (OK). #1409827
- 56,000 btu cooling, 10.7 EER, 14.4 SEER, 60,000 btu heating at 47F, 8.7 HSPF. |
RE: Carrier Infinity 16 or 19 Heat Pump vs Lennox
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garyg:
These are the figures that led me to switch my buying preference from an Infinity 19 to a 16. The second ARI reference is for the Infinity 19. One would think that because one is a "19" and the other a "16" that the SEER for the 19 would be a lot higher. But it's actually 0.1 lower, at 14.4 compared with 14.5. I wonder how many people are mistakenly thinking they are buying a much more efficient unit than they really are (especially with the 5-ton units). I think the industry ought to require manufacturers to make their literature clearer in this respect, instead of referring to unattainable figures (or ones that are only achievable with a certain furnace and HP or AC tonnage). So given no real advantage to the Infinity 19 over the Infinity 16 that I can tell with my configuration, I'm going to choose the lower-priced Infinity 16 (a little lower EER but higher cooling capacity). |
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