This is not a very pleasant subject, but here goes.....
Our grand-daughter is almost 3 yrs old. Basically, her parents do not discipline her at all, & there is very little teaching her anything. I used to have her spend at least one day a week with me, & basically just did the best I could with her behavior. But, she still is not toilet trained, & at 2 1/2 this literally makes me gag. So...I have really limited the time I spend with her as I just cant face those dirty diapers. I have had some health problems, & for me to get sick to my stomache is not good.
My DIL whom I love dearly thinks that the lack of training my grand-daughter gets is ok. Am I really awful to avoid having her here with me because of dirty diapers? She knows about toilet training, & I have come to the conclusion that she messes her pants as a way to say: "I am in control, you are not!" Any feedback would be welcome, but please be gentle. LOL

If she is messing as a control issue, I believe it is because she is feeling "out of control" and too stressed. Try to make your home a safe haven for her and be gently encouraging, but leave the actual potty training to her parents.

If she is wearing disposable diapers, just keep a plastic bag nearby and immediately toss it in and tie up the bag and dispose of it. If you don't think you can wipe her off thoroughly, just put her in tub and rinse her off.

Please don't let her think that you disapprove of her in anyway because of this.

Actually, I think that it is pretty normal for a two and a half year old or even a three year old to not be trained yet. There is less of a push now to train at two.

I agree with bmma, your grand daughter is just going to feel dispproval because of this.

As Lynn stated, there is not a push now a days to potty train early. Most kids I know are not potty trained until after three. And, in fact, many "experts" say it is bad to "push" toilet training and can have very negative effects. This may be indirectly why your grandchild is not potty trained yet. Please don't hold it against the child (or the parents) just accept it as their (the parents) decision.

Not trying to be mean, but I can't believe you would choose not to see your granddaughter over getting a sick stomach. Granted, I don't know your medical condition but I know when I had bad morning sickness I still had to change my son and would never consider not watching him because of this. Again, I hate to judge and be wrong and I'll say sorry in advance, but it seems like you have more of a problem with the way your DIL chooses to parent than a real illness.

Regarding the problem of the smell from the diaper... have you mentioned your problem to the parents. They may have some ideas themselves or may be able to feed at different times, make sure to check diaper before they leave, etc..or they may even be able to rush the training process just for you. If you are just watching for a short time and the child doesn't have a problem with diaper rash, you can usually let the diaper go for a litlle while with no real harm done.

You need to mind your own basic health issues first. It's not 'right' or 'wrong' if you have special needs to avoid potential souces of bacteria or whatever. That's your reality, and you need to be in charge of maintaining your physical health.

Children do _not_ think like adults do. They are biochemically different in their brains and bodies. Basically, what that does is it creates a barrier to mutual accurate understanding. On the child side and on the adult side there is going to be interpretation from the brain/mind of someone who has is biochemically different. What that means is that when you ascribe motives and thoughts to a child, you're likely to be incorrect (and when a child ascribes thoughts and motives to the adult around them, they aare likely to be incorrect as well). But, because you're an adult you have huge advantages over the child in terms of life experience and development.

Try where possible to not interpret her motives or whatever because mostly, her life is her (at her age and development and experience level) and her own parents or people she sees on a day to day basis.

Now, if you have other problems with the idea of toilet training and her age and her not being trained. That is an issue to keep between the adults in charge of her. She is a preschooler. Her parents have been in charge of when and how she will be toilet trained. They are the ones who have created the situation, for reasons which may in fact be sound or for reasons which may be in the long term best for your grandchild. Who knows... only those parents do. This might not even be an issue if you choose to de-personalize it to make it a simple issue of your health. If you can bring yourself to be around your grand daughter and not do the diaper changing thing, that shouldn't be a problem. (If the whole situation is a problem for you, to the point where you really are feeling angry at the child, then you might all be better off kind of avoiding a lot of together time until she is toilet trained more completely. Basically, you may have to make the first move though if you want to change the pattern of contact though.)

both her parents created the situation, they are the adults in charge... _not_ the child; you might be able to build a situation where you and the child can have a better relationship and where you are not putting your personal health at risk;
-taylor

Yes, if you ask to spend time with her without her parents present you are wrong to refuse to change dirty diapers. She is a toddler and refusing to change her dirty diaper is no different than refusing to feed her if she were hungry. If they are asking for a favor by having you babysit, then why dont you just be honest and tell them that changing her gags you and you would prefer not to watch her until she is trained.

I'm wondering if this isnt more of a disapproval issue than a health issue with you?

I am not a grandparent, but I am a parent. I think it is appalling that a 2 1/2 year old is not toilet trained at least to tell you when she has to go! My daughter was going BY HERSELF to the toilet at the age of 2! It is the parent's responsibility to make sure that their kids know how to go to the bathroom or at least when to ask to be taken.

I do not think you are wrong at all to refuse to keep this child until she learns not to mess her pants. Her mom and dad need to get with it and get this kid trained. Do they ever intend for her to go to pre-school? Most of the ones where I live will not take a child over 3 years old who is not toilet trained.

You are not wrong! I don't blame you one bit.

I think "appalling" is a little strong for a 2 1/2 year old not potty trained. If you got your child to potty train at 2, then good for you. My son didn't train until he was 2 1/2. I am a Preschool Teacher, and my 4 year old students still had accidents. The question is why dirty diapers bother this grandmother so much, it is not the childs fault and we certainly don't know how difficult it may be to train this child. If this grandmother doesn't want to change diapers, so be it. But if I were the parents of the child, I would not ask her to babysit anymore. That would mean no alone time with the grandchild. A couple minutes of a stinky diaper would never keep me from having quality time with my grandchild. I'd wear nose plugs if I had to.

As any mother should know, potty training is easier said than done. My son wasn't potty trained until 2 1/2 either. I am a preschool teacher and even 4 and 5 year olds have accidents, so I think "appalling" is a strong word for an untrained toddler. If this grandmother doesn't want to change dirty diapers, then so be it. But if I were the parents, I wouldn't ask her to babysit either. That means no quality alone time with the grandchild. If it were my grandchild, a few minutes of a stinky diaper would not keep my from quality time with her. I'd wear nose plugs if I had to.

Sorry two posts went through. I thought the first one didn't go through. I appologize for giving my four cents instead of two!!

Read all the posts and I have to put in my two cents worth. I am going to brag. I am a grandmother, but I've also raised 4 girls and a son. My girls were all potty trained by 16 months. My son by age 2. I was a stay at home mom and took the time to do it. Its not impossibe to do, but I don't believe I could have done it if I had been a working mom. I wouldn't let anyone keep my kids while I was training them, that was my job. I have 4 grown wonderful children and one 13 year old. I have 2 grandchildren who will be ready for training in the summer. They are 7 months old now. I think children are smarter than they give them credit for. Mine trained as easily when I did it as other people who wait till their kids are 3 years old. I also disapline my grandchildren when they are at my house. My children have my values of raising children tho, so I don't have a big problem there either. I have 2 grandchildren ages 5 and 3 and they are very well behaved and taught to respect adults and things that don't belong to them.
I would go and visit your grandchild at your DIL's house and if she needs to be changed she can do it, and you will also be able to spend time with your grandchild. It isn't her fault, untill she's taught, she doesn't know any better.

I can't even respond to that. I am sick of Grandparents (not my own) telling the "younger" generation that we don't discipline our kids. Every generation blames the one before for everything. I think time clouds everyone's memories. You have to remember that what the Dr. told you about raising your child is not the same thing that the Dr.'s tell us now-a-days. Kids are not toilet trained as early as they used to be. My son was a late trainer, but when he learned we never had 1 accident. And I never let anyone change a dirty diaper on him. I hate to sound mean , but it's hard raising children now, and hearing how bad we are doing is no help. I am teaching my children
manners (dd says thankyou and she's 1) but it never seems enough, someone is always there saying that the kids today are brats. It's a shame. Sorry that post caused a vent.

Probably not the best way to post for the first time on a new forum, but ...

I just don't get the point of bragging about when kids are potty-trained. Surely your children have done things much more worthy of bragging than pooping in a toilet. They all learn, what difference does it really make when? Tooting your own horn over only comes of sounding like "I'm better than you are! Na na na na na na!" If you compare yourself to other parents over poop ... well, THAT'S appalling!

From the moms point of view, unless it was done very delicately from a person I loved anyway, I would be offended to be told by a grandparent that my child had to get potty-trained pronto or no more trips to Grandma's. I think I'd take my kid and go home ... for a very long time. So, it is my opinion that if you can make it a few more months, grin and bear it. If you hurt feelings you could cause a problem that would take a lot more than a few months to recover. The diapers are temporary, hurt relations with the child's parents might not be.

If you truly can't take it any longer for health reasons, not just because you disagree with them, then you need to approach this very carefully. And with both parents, not just the dil. Maybe ask if they have a plan or a timeline for potty-training and if there is anything you can do to help. If they are using a certain approach at home that you can help keep consistent at your house too. Choose your word carefully to let them know you are on their side, not trying to correct them. In the conversation you can mention to them that it is hard on your condition and it breaks your heart that you have a hard time caring for her, but YOU need help from them.

What seems like a really big deal today, might turn out to be silly a year from now when potty-training is done and just a memory. So, I would ask myself, will this matter 6 months from now? If you think that your health would truly be worse 6 months from now as a result of chaning diapers, bring it up but carefully. If you think it through and decide, no, when all is said and done, it won't matter, let it go because it will pass.

I'll go back where I came from now.

Ah, Stephanie, Thanks!!! You said it all for me!

This is a huge peeve with me - when parents brag about their little one being trained at 16 months, etc., well - sorry, Mommy - its not your child thats now potty-trained, its you! Most children don't have the muscle control for such things until they hit 2 - and thats if Mom is lucky! I watched some of my friends push the potty-training with their babies - heading off to the bathroom with baby in tow every half-hour. Give the baby a break - putting so much emphasis on something so UNIMPORTANT is just setting yourself up for problems later. In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't rate much importance in life (this, from a woman so squeamish about dirty diapers she thought she would wear rubber gloves when the time came).
Let your child decide when he/she is ready. You can encourage things once baby is ready, but please don't make the mistake of thinking a 16 month old is ready -- talk about stress!

Mizzy - think carefully about the real issue here. Is your grandchild's lack of toilet training whats really bothering you? Stop to imagine NO grandchild for a moment -how would you feel if you didn't get to see your grand-daughter anymore because of hard feelings you've caused between you and your children??? Sorry if I'm being harsh, but when I imagine never seeing my own grandson again over something as trivial as this, it brings tears to my eyes. Your grand-daughter WILL learn not to poop her pants, eventually, and you can be there to gently encourage her. There are plenty of things I don't agree with our grandbaby's parents about, but you know what? I keep it to myself - unless its something thats life-and-death, I don't offer my opinion unless its asked for.

- Sherrie

Sherrie, you made me giggle---I actually bought a box of latex gloves, anticipating the revolting diaper thing! Needless to say, I never used them for diapers (it wasn't as bad as I expected) and got used to being yakked on and slobbered on, and all the other fabulous baby things, so now I use the gloves to pick up dog poops (now that's gross---sorry :)

I shall brag that I have thoroughly "trained" my 2 1/2 yr old son to poop before noon on "Gramma Days"---just kidding, he usually does it on his own, and I feel bad when my Mom has to clean up a messy diaper. I have to admit, he's pretty foul there for a couple of minutes, but she never complains, just hoses him off. And he's worse if he's eaten something wierd, or drank bubble bath water or something. Mizzy, could this be the problem, something in her diet that's making for really messy diapers or is it the whole diaper thing in general?

BTW, I would love to know how someone trains a kid to peep and poop in the potty at 16 months. DS will peep, but he always holds out for a diaper to poop, and believe me, I've tried dragging my feet and waiting him out, making him sit on the potty, giving him a book (lol)---he can hold it forever!!!

Good luck, Mizzy---maybe mention the foul diapers if you think it's a food problem; she might have an allergy or something and the parents might have no idea---maybe you're getting all the yucky ones after "Chinese Night" or something.

Gayle, there's really no secret to early training, just a LOT of patience! When I trained my kids I was a stay at home mom. I couldn't have done it without being one. I have gotten a lot of nastiness in forums past my last letter so I haven't been on here. I should think someone should brag if they trained 5 kids early. You'd think I did a terrible sin! I don't know about anyone else on here but having 5 kids is a lot of money for diapers when you don't have it to waste. My first 2 were 11 months apart. 2 babies in bottles and diapers can be very expensive! My first born quit wetting the bed herself by 9 months old!! I noticed that when I got her up in the mornings she was still dry, so when I started training her early it helped a lot that she could control it all night. I just had to make sure to listen for that first sound that meant she was awake and get to her before she woke up all the way. It wasn't easy but if a child is old enough to tell you they have to go they are old enough to be put on a pot! I had better things to spend my time and money on than diapers. A lot of people feel like me, just not a lot of mothers on here I see. Thank goodness my kids feel the same way. Makes it easier to enjoy MY grandchildren!

Marcia, I wasn't attacking you, just saying that it's harder to potty train than I expected. It's true that if they can tell you they have to go, you can rush them to the bathroom. It's when they sneak off in a corner and DON'T tell you that's tough! :)

And who really wants to change (or buy) diapers one day longer than they have to? It's probably the implication that we who have had less success than you did are somehow impatient slackers that riled people up. Do you think we WANT our moms to deal with stinky diapers? Thank God my mom still loves my son, even though he sometimes stinks...