>> "No form of vinegar changes body pH or has any effect on toxins. The body's natural processes, mediated largely through the liver and kidneys, eliminate waste products and toxic substances." It's as if you are still rejecting the efficacy of Cinchona bark for treating malaria because the Amazonian Indians haven't discovered the formula for the quinine it contains. Instead, they say that the bark of the Cinchona tree contains the spirit of the God Xohopichulato, which destroys the evil spirit that causes malaria. If you want to rest in your beliefs that there is no Xohopichulato and therefore Cinchona cannot help with malaria, fine. Just don't pretend it is science. It is arrogant ethnocentrism, not scientific empiricism. Your arguments are based on an arbitrary and artificial definition of the word 'toxin'. You are ignoring the fact that ordinary substances can build up to toxic levels under many conditions - for example, glucose can build up to toxic levels when there is insulin resistance. In such a case, anything that reduces insulin resistance or lowers glucose levels would in fact be a 'detoxification' process. Likewise, immune hormones like the interferons and interleukins are necessary under certain conditions, but at higher doses (ie when there is infection or chronic inflammation) they often cause side effects that range from unpleasant to lethal. In SARS, H5N1 bird flu, and other killer influenzas, the body's immune system destroys the body. Immune hormones that might sometimes be beneficial are produced at toxic levels. This is quite different from your idea of metabolic toxins that are normally handled by the kidneys and liver. The short chain fatty acids present in vinegar (acetate, proprionate, butyrate) have been repeatedly shown to lower inflammatory cytokines (which have been implicated as a contributor to migraines). These simple compounds also affect levels of leptin, adiponectin and other compounds that regulate glucose, and there is research implicating this in the pathogenesis of migraines. You have stooped to pseudoscience by refusing to look at the evidence that vinegar can dramatically change certain chemicals in the body. You seem to take comfort in linguistic tautologies about 'toxins' that have little bearing on the underlying facts of the matter. Here is a link that might be useful: Glucose, Adiponectin, Immune Hormones and Migraine.

lydia -- the 100+ food Elisa test sounds very interesting. I may give that a try, eventually. I'm convinced that I have quite a few food allergies. I used to throw up when I was given white milk as a child. Never drank any once my mother figured out the cause. Except in elementary school when I was forced by a teacher and I threw up. Funny how I was able to drink chocolate milk, though. I read later (as an adult) that in fact the chocolate in chocolate milk reduces the allergic reaction. Anyway, regarding food allergies, I know I'm sensitive to wheat though I'm not a celiac. I am also sensitive to dairy. (Ask me why I can't give up my goatsmilk yoghurt, this is the last frontier for me, hope to give it up eventually.) I subscribed to the test at http://www.enterolab.com/ which is where I got the results about wheat and dairly. The test was expensive. I think over $300.00. Glad I did it though. Sounds like the Elisa test may give you the same results plus some. This food allergy thing is tricky, I think. One of our dogs now it seems has food allergies. I asked the vet to test and she said that testing for food allergies is not very reliable (for dogs). I wonder if this is true for humans? A food elimination diet was the only thing she could recommend plus eating only a particular type of dog food that was "engineered to have a small enough molecule size so it doesn't trigger the allergic reactions" (her words). I was amazed and am wondering if raw food has "smaller molecules" than cooked food, HA, HA. Perhaps moite's methods that she got from her doctor about measuring her pulse rate may be the best way. I'm going the simple route with this raw food diet (for now) because it meets many other needs also. I had a great day yesterday. I went the whole day without the "wave of tiredness" that comes over me every day after lunch. I hope it wasn't an anomaly. Bad news is that with the raw food diet, there is a "detox phase" initially where some claim that you are ridding your system of toxins. The detox phase can produce acne which is what I just got yesterday. I haven't had a pimple on my face for many years but I have two now. Oh well. If my energy level stays good, I'll have to add that as one more reason why I'm glad I found this diet. I was craving cooked food day before yesterday but managed to get by without it. Hopefully those days will get less in number. This was kind of like craving a cigarette after quitting, as I remember it many years ago. Keep us posted about your food allergies. I'm becoming more and more convinced that for some of us, they are literally killing us or are reducing our quality of life (for some of us) to a very very large extent producing chronic problems and diseases that mainstream medicine doesn't have a clue. In my case, I definitely feel like I've become a guinea pig for trying out different "cures". I'm hoping that raw food will by my answer. I realize that because there is no definite proof, I could be wrong on this but as my DH says, it's gotta be better than being so overweight and hungry all the time. We were killing ourselves eating cooked food so how could this be any worse.

Laurie, we have not tried cyproheptadine with her as of yet. It is RX, right? She's gained or maintained her weight adequately over the 3 years, but she has short episodes where she doesn't eat well from time to time. She's having more problems since her brother passed away, but that was still less than a month ago. I've been using nutrical on her, which seems to work a bit like an appetite stimulant, or it settles her stomach enough to make her feel like eating. One of the biggest problems we are having of late is that she often wants to eat her dry food and not the wet we put out. Since she had her teeth pulled last fall, she just swallows the kibble pieces whole (she doesn't like them moistened or broken up though). When the dry kibble expands in her stomach, it is apparently too much for her and she throws it up. Almost worse than that, her new MO is to climb up on the bed at night when she is feeling sick and allbut throw up next to our heads. We wake up to her doing the nauseas, watery-mouth thing. She has thrown up a lot in her life with all her health problems, but never thrown up on the bed, and definitely not practically on one of us. We are getting to the point that we are going to have to lock her out of our bedroom at night. I feel terrible, but that's just too much. She's due to go into the vet, hopefully this week, but I'm sick today so will make the appointment tomorrow or when I feel well enough, and I'll talk to the vet about these things. I probably should have started a new thread for this, but gosh, she's really frustrating me lately. I feel bad and know that it's probably triggered by grief, but it gets to a point that she's driving me crazy too.

Msgirl: mineral oil is effective in controlling rose-scale pest. Khalid asked excellent questions in his thread "organic treatment ...", so I re-post some info. here. Johnson Baby oil is the same as mineral oil, except it reeks of perfume. Very effective against thrips and scale according to the New Zealand research (see Khalid's thread). http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/3453227/organic-treatment-against-pests-and-fungus-in-zone-9a?n=40 "Mineral oils sprayed onto citrus trees can control a wide range of pests, including mites, aphids, psyllids, leafminers and scale. The control effect of the oil is mainly by suffocation, when the oil moves into the spiracles (breathing holes) of the insects. Recently, it has been shown that the oil also controls insects by modifying their behavior. For example, female leafminers do not lay eggs on leaves where there are oil deposits. Mineral oil may also reduce the level of transmission of virus diseases by aphids Advantages of Oil Spray Oils have several advantages compared to chemical insecticides. Their main benefit is that they are broad-spectrum. They control a wide range of pests, as well as fungus diseases such as black spot and greasy spot. They are even effective against the eggs of aphids, mites and some moths. Furthermore, they are easy to handle and relatively safe to the grower applying them. They dissipate quickly after spraying. Mineral oils also kill any algae growing on the trees and fruit, leaving them clean." http://www.agnet.org/library.php?func=view&id=20110711110304