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dlm2000

Nice chairs....but $1200?? ea?? USED??

DLM2000-GW
9 years ago

Am I that out of touch with the value of Baker?

Here is a link that might be useful: Nice chairs

Comments (61)

  • Olychick
    9 years ago

    These showed up when I searched for Baker on the Seattle CL, although they are in Victoria BC..they seem to be in the same ball park, but these are Canadian dollars, which today is .89 of the US dollar.
    Posted: 13 days ago
    Pair of Baker Oval X Back Arm Chairs Designed by Barbara Barry - $3200 (Victoria (Rockland) )


    A classic pair of arm chairs designed by Barbara Barry for Baker Furniture. The Barbara Barry collection is designed to coordinate seamlessly with your decor. The oval x back chairs are no exception. They are done in a mahogany with java finish and are upholstered in a rich cream broadcloth with minimal wear and no stains that will complement any decor. These chairs new retail for $2800 each thru decorators . Very good condition, Dimensions are 38" tall by 24" deep by 23" wide; seat height is 18", depth is 19" and width is 23"; arm height is 27".

  • My3dogs ME zone 5A
    9 years ago

    This Baker mahogany breakfront appeared on the Maine CL yesterday. Based on what kswl said above, it may be at 1/10 of its value.

    "Absolutely fabulous formal mahogany breakfront made by Baker. True divided glass panes on doors. Brass locks and latches. Fluted belt. Comes apart, top and bottom."

    Too bad the photos are dark.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Wonderful mahogany breakfront hutch - $1500

  • jjam
    9 years ago

    Baker is fabulous, but I often see it here on CL priced to sell.

    There are some chairs and other pieces priced higher that I see being re-listed repeatedly, so while they may be "worth" more, no one is buying them. Like Beverly said, you can ask any price but something is only worth what someone is willing to pay.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    I would guess that depends on the local market, my3dogs, but if it is in good condition that's an incredible buy. Our insurance appraisal was based on replacement cost for something comparable and new--- not something used by the same manufacturer.

    The style is not really similar:

    Ours is also very slim, designed for china storage and not serving pieces, so it doesn't take up a lot of floor space--- which, with smaller dining rooms, is one of the reasons people don't want or use break fronts as much nowadays.

    I don't know if I could even find a new piece of the same quality in similar dimensions, with a lighted interior, in near perfect condition, but that's what the insurance is meant to compensate.

  • gail618
    9 years ago

    I was curious so I checked my local CL and found this chair -- wish I had a spot for it. I have walked around my house trying to find a spot but there is no room for it!

    Here is a link that might be useful: CL Chair

  • deegw
    9 years ago

    Craigslist aficionados - do you check Craigslist each day or do you use some kind of notification app or program?

    99.9% of our Craigslist furniture is garbage but I know there must be some good stuff listed occasionally because we have many nice homes in our area.

  • Olychick
    9 years ago

    Gail618, I'd have to buy that chair just to say I got it from Witch Duck Point! What's with that name, do you know?

  • gail618
    9 years ago

    Olychick - it's named after the Witch of Pungo, which is a farming area of Virginia Beach -- they decided to "duck" her into the water and if she sunk she was a witch, if she floated she was not, I think. Seems like it should be Witch Dunk to me. She floated, so was sent to prison rather than killed, I believe. Virginia Beach has a lot of odd town/area/street names.

  • allison0704
    9 years ago

    Here is my parents breakfront, purchased in 1985. It's either Baker or Henredon. They have numerous pieces from both, and when the time comes, it's either going to take a long time to sell them for a decent price or we're just going to get what we can.

    The original chairs posted are pretty, and the sofa, even though I see it as a cat hair magnet.

    This post was edited by allison0704 on Mon, Oct 20, 14 at 11:57

  • jjam
    9 years ago

    Ahhhh, be still my heart....those Baker breakfronts are so gorgeous. I had a lighted china cabinet (American Drew, so definitely NOT Baker) and we decided it made the room too crowded. I do miss it sometimes. I don't think ours was so shallow in depth; that would have been better for sure.

    If I get another DH will surely have me committed!

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    Allison, that's a beautiful piece! Surely someone in your family would want it?

    Question: Where do people store their china and crystal if they don't have a cabinet for it all?

  • Boopadaboo
    9 years ago

    In the attic. :) both silver and china. I don't use it but have my mother's china and my great grandmothers silver.
    I used to have a cheaper set and had it in a kitchen cabinet, but I never really used it so I got rid of that too. and only have day to day fiestaware in my kitchen.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    Lol, Boop, I knew someone would have an answer!

    When our kids were little we didn't eat in the DR as much, but they had sweet little Beatrix Potter dishes they loved, and the youngest used my little silver toddler spoon, fork and pusher.

  • allison0704
    9 years ago

    Thanks. It is lovely, but I don't think my sister is interested either. I know it's not my children's style either. I'll take the Lenox china though! ;)

    I don't have a china cabinet, but I do have a sideboard. Place settings for 16 plus a ton of serving pieces. I'd love to sell since I've only used probably 10 times in 3 decades. I have a vitrine to hold vintage crystal that was my grandmothers and more purchased by me. I don't use it either, but bet I could sell it faster and at least get my money back.

    I have my parents every day silver and use it on the holidays.

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    My grandmother's house had a silver and china closet and my parent's house had built in cabinets. Their china cupboards held occasionally rotated display pieces.

    I am always surprised that there are enough people to buy pieces at some of these prices to keep the pieces in production. I try to buy furniture like this but I can't afford it new.

  • Olychick
    9 years ago

    Gail, thank you!

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    "I am always surprised that there are enough people to buy pieces at some of these prices to keep the pieces in production."

    I guess I am surprised, too, given the utter lack of interest in such furniture here on GW---where you'd expect to find people who buy them new, if anywhere. I was so happy my mother gave me her china cabinet when they sold their house and moved into a condominium, as it meant I didn't have to buy one for myself...it never once occurred to me to refuse it.

  • coll_123
    9 years ago

    "Question: Where do people store their china and crystal if they don't have a cabinet for it all?"

    If I had any china or crystal, that would be a real problem!

    And even if I did have some, I wouldn't have room in my DR for such a large piece. I do have some clients with large, formal DR's with pieces like those. So there are still some people left that don't need an open plan living/dining/kitchen space. But in general, it does seem like more and more people are going less formal and yeah, probably a lot of china collections are in the attic.

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    "I guess I am surprised, too, given the utter lack of interest in such furniture here on GW---where you'd expect to find people who buy them new, if anywhere"

    I think there has been a cultural shift that has affected most people who build houses. I think people used to build houses that they could afford to build and to furnish. Now people build houses that they can barely afford and can't afford to furnish very well. And I am not talking about people for whom it's a stretch to build.

    My employer in one office lives in a huge, (10K sq ft) expensive (~$3M) mediocre quality house, partially furnished with sorta average mediocre furniture.

    They could have easily built a smaller and better house and had a lot of money left over to buy furniture. They couldn't amortize the furniture maybe. (But sometimes you essentially can because stores have credit programs if you are buying a lot.)

    Most of my parents' friends built houses that are modest by today's standards (and these were doctors, lawyers, corporate higher ups), ---and the houses were pretty much fully, newly (unless they had antiques, too) furnished when they moved in

    Since furniture isn't an "investment" and a house supposedly is, people don't do this anymore.

  • porkandham
    9 years ago

    Jumping back in after a long break (not that I was a regular poster anyway!) Life got crazy there for a while. I think the breakfronts are lovely, but I always wonder what people do with them when they're using their china. Doesn't it look a little forlorn and empty during a dinner party?

    I use my china, crystal, and silver pretty reguarly, especially the silver. It's stored in cabinets, but it's not on display.

  • allison0704
    9 years ago

    I've never noticed it lacking dishes. Too busy enjoying the food and my family around the table.

    Pal, I haven't been in a "house poor" house in several years. Never understood that mindset.

    I had a china cabinet with my last DR table and chairs. I sold the sideboard to my BFF, my sister recently took the table out of my parents basement TV room and the china cabinet is still there holding various collections of my dad's instead of dishes.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    That's definitely an interesting explanation, Pal, as the emphasis in home trends has been on increased square footage instead of quality of build or furnishings. Homes in other parts of the country seem to be scaling back in size (a la the Not So Big House movement) but here in the south, bigger is perceived as unconditionally better. Ive seen quite a few large homes with paltry or poor quality furnishings or even none at all in some rooms. And from those large room sizes was born the "oversize" sofa, with rolled arms the size of a mastodon head, lol.

    I guess it's just change, and when houses get smaller maybe better case goods will come back en vogue again.

  • petepie
    9 years ago

    Someone has 8 baker Barbara Barry x back chairs for $640 on baltimore craigslist (location Laurel MD).

    Here is a link that might be useful: Link

  • marcolo
    9 years ago

    This stuff is now called "brown furniture," and young people no longer want it. They want wood that looks like it washed up down by the sewage treatment plant, its "rustic" appearance masking the fact that it was made in Asia by people with no skills.

  • vedazu
    9 years ago

    I use the upper part of my breakfront (which resides in the living room, by the way) for books with particularly handsome bindings. I use the bottom for china storage. Frankly, it is hard to know what the real purpose is in this case--there is a drop down door in the front that creates a desktop, lined in leather. I never knew if it was for convenience accessing the silver or something like that; or a desk.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    Is that really what it's called, "brown furniture"? Gosh, you'd think they would get tired of all that wenge and grayish finish, there's no character to it at all. I always thought that those finishes were used just to hide the fact that the wood was awful, but I guess considering where it is made, the lack of skilled craftsmanship is another factor. But with today's emphasis on natural materials, why isn't lovely stained and crafted wood more in demand? Or is just vintage MCM stuff, wood grained but not fussy, desirable now because it goes with that PB and RH junk? It's a mystery to me, and I am feeling increasingly like an old lady living in a furniture museum...

  • kitchendetective
    9 years ago

    "I think there has been a cultural shift that has affected most people who build houses. I think people used to build houses that they could afford to build and to furnish. Now people build houses that they can barely afford and can't afford to furnish very well. And I am not talking about people for whom it's a stretch to build."

    I noticed this phenomenon when I moved from Michigan to California as a child (but the child of a family of furniture store owners and designers). Homes in Michigan were well furnished and "completed," but not humongous (other than Grosse Pointe, etc.). Having fine furniture, bought once, was how it was done. In California, people bought the largest house they could possibly afford (or not), thinking it would appreciate, and the furnishings looked like temporary furniture, if there were any. Obviously there were exceptions to this, especially in certain neighborhoods.

    I think the "appreciation model" of home ownership spread from California to the rest of the country, and now you find large, shoddily built, kinda-sorta-furnished houses everywhere.

    My home has a lot of furniture that was handed down from parents and relatives, some of which would not be my first choice stylistically, but we are using it because it so well made compared to most of what is out there now. Henredon from the 1960s and Baker from the 1950s are still completely solid and in perfect condition. We have older Bernhardt pieces, too, and my father felt Bernhardt's work was quite underrated. It, too, is very solid with well done hand finishes.

    As for china and silver, my grandparents came from Europe, as did most of my aunts and uncles. China and silver was just what one used. The children did, too. So our children went from breast to (yes, kswl) those Beatrice Potter pieces and silver baby flatware, to our china. Friends sometimes came to eat with their kids and said, "You will not put that china and that glassware in front of my kids." So, I accommodated their wishes. They didn't know that when the kids were here without their parents, they ate the way we ate. It had never occurred to me to do it any differently.
    We still have china cabinets and also use antique armoires to store china, which is overflowing around here.

    This post was edited by kitchendetective on Tue, Oct 21, 14 at 9:27

  • coll_123
    9 years ago

    " But with today's emphasis on natural materials, why isn't lovely stained and crafted wood more in demand? Or is just vintage MCM stuff, wood grained but not fussy, desirable now because it goes with that PB and RH junk? It's a mystery to me, and I am feeling increasingly like an old lady living in a furniture museum..."

    I live in Maine, which is a state that has a lot of craftsmen and furniture makers. So someone wanting a well crafted piece, out of a nice quality wood could certainly find that here- but its expensive, as it should be. A lot of people simply can't afford that type of thing so they make do with lesser quality if "the look" works for them.

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    I am not sure that I would have wanted a lot of my parents furniture at age 27-30, and I couldn't have afforded new furniture like theirs at that age, either. My nieces had the opportunity to take some sofas which are pretty classic in a contemporary sense and they passed. They both bought sorta cheap looking sectionals in brown or grey microfiber, and spent more than they would have covering the good sofas in brown or grey microfiber.

    I think in our parents' generation maybe people didn't build until they were older, as well. My father was 44 when they started their house. He also got a part time job at another hospital specifically to pay for the furniture. (And our college accounts were pretty well established before they considered building). A lot of their friends seemed to build in their mid-forties or later after they were well-established as well.

    Now I think people build younger because if they are near a city they move further and further out and have to build. in a new development.

  • vedazu
    9 years ago

    Ah, let's blame it on football. Giant TV screens, beer, snack food--multiple nights a week. Can't do that sitting on a chic little settee.

  • Gooster
    9 years ago

    Ouch, my ears are burning. I feel like we are part of the problem -- it seems like we should be buying high end furniture but we don't. It seems we shudder at paying $1000 for side table, let alone $3700. How do you get over this hurdle?

    I do love Baker -- I even subscribe to the e-newsletter. The showroom is participating in the sample sale this weekend in SF Design Center, and I'm tempted to drop by.

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    gooster, I don't think it's the difference between $1000 table and a $3800 table. The vast majority of people who want nice furniture can't pay $3800.

    But I see a lot of $99 assembly-required tables in $750K-$1M houses.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    Booster, I wouldn't have bought that table if it weren't exactly what I wanted and needed--- and I mean exactly. When ID proposed it I thought he had lost his mind. But for the size and finish it was the best choice--- I looked for several days for something less expensive that ticked all the boxes, and he suggested others that I didn't like. And when I looked at all the lovely furniture we've been given or inherited, it was almost all Baker, so I felt that spending that much for a side table that would bring pleasure to people for fifty hears hence was very justifiable. If it makes any difference, in my living room I have a small antique Korean side table in red lacquer that I bought for $250 :-)

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    Someone just paid $183,750 for a Paul Evans Studio sideboard, and $46,000 for a Paul Evans sideboard from Directional (which was a furniture company, he didn't make it himself)--at Rago Auction...so I don't think anybody needs to apologize for or rationalize paying $3000 for a table :-)

  • Gooster
    9 years ago

    oh, @kswl I didn't mean to have you apologize or rationalize your own purchases. I just wondered how I could get "us" to step up our purchases.
    @pal -- still, ouch -- two properties in that price range and still $99 sounds tempting, rather than $1999 -- it was victory just to get a certain quality level recognized by all decision makers. I do know what you mean, however.

    And I had to Google Paul Evens Studio -- some of that work is great, some of it is "not for me", at any price.

    BTW, those eight Barry X-chairs above were a steal, stains and all.

  • DLM2000-GW
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    gooster I don't see it as a hurdle for you to get over or that you need to "step up" your purchases! It's a choice - maybe not an earth shattering life choice but still a choice about where you put your money. Do you feel your life is lacking in some way that will change by spending more on furniture even if it's of significantly better quality than what you usually buy? I'm not saying kswl or Pal or anyone else shouldn't spend whatever they choose (and can afford) on furniture - that's THEIR choice - freedom of purchase!! But is sounds like you are apologizing slightly for your choices and that's what I'm reacting to - if I'm mis-reading between the lines, never mind my butting in and carry on! I've gone through phases of that kind so I'm probably projecting my own insecurities on you. But that's the reason I started this whole thread in the first place - I was shocked at a price, others chimed in with explanations and educated me a bit. I personally STILL would be unlikely to spend $1200 on a used chair (very, very unlikely) but that does not mean it isn't worth that price and now I understand that better. But I know me and I would not get more enjoyment out of that $1200 chair than one I found at a garage sale, hunted for just the right fabric (on sale) then had it reupholstered or slipcovered. I'd get a little thrill every time I thought about my one of a kind piece that is a part of my nest. Been there done that and will go there do that all over again because that gives me pleasure.

  • kswl2
    9 years ago

    No worries, gooster, maybe I am still rationalizing it to myself ? When it was brand new DH would look at that 26" square table and I could see him mentally calculate the price per square inch. :-) He couldn't say too much as his mother gave us her pair of Hepplewhite demilune chests that are treasures and he knows the value of such things.

    I think whoever said things are worth whatever people will pay was correct, and the secondary market offers a very good path to acquiring fine stuff if that's what is wanted. Between Craig's List, ebay and Stenella, people in the tri state area up north have it made!

  • vedazu
    9 years ago

    dlm2000: This entire discussion--which has been very interesting, by the way--was about $1200 for a used chair. If you would never pay $1200 for any chair, used or otherwise, that's one thing. But--just to make my point more clearly--for roughly the same amount of money, you can buy something used that is heirloom quality, instead of a piece of (expletive deleted) that is new. That new chair will always be junk. The old piece of Baker will probably always be worth re-upholstering.

  • coll_123
    9 years ago

    I actually think you could get two new chairs for less than $2400 that wouldn't be junk...and what is junk, really? Are these chairs your teenage boys are going to conduct wrestling matches on top of, or sitting in 12 hours a day playing video games, while eating snacks? They strike me as chairs that would only get used when you have company over.

    But I agree with the posted that said the price depends on what someone is willing to spend. Think of used cars- you can find two cars...same year, mileage, and similar bells and whistles...yet the make of one could mean the price is much higher because the manufacturer has a certain reputation. You might get exactly the same performance out of both cars, but in the end, people pay for certain brands of things.

  • DLM2000-GW
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Vedazu I completely agree with you and that's why I love finding old furniture to make my own . I may not be searching out specific mak rs but I know quality and whether a piece is worth my time and/or money . A piece of (expletive deleted ) will never cross my door way .

  • Gooster
    9 years ago

    @dim2000 -- for me, it's finding stuff I really like and then have us balk at a price that we can readily afford (and then later being unhappy with a less costly item).

    back to the original topic, I find it interesting -- could you find a new chair for $1200 with the same quality of upholstery fabric, the construction details, the down seating, and the fine finishing details (like the casters)?

    BTW, here's a link to the Baker online sample/outlet shop. They list retail as well, so you can compute your wholesale or ID markup price. It's sortable by location.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Baker Odds and Ends

  • DLM2000-GW
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    *Could* I?. I'm sure I could. I have NO problem finding things of high quality that I'd love to own!! That goes for many things besides furniture, as well. I have spent what I consider to be a lot of money on things for our home over the years and we still have them but they are few and far between. There are always other places to consider putting money and more often than not those other places take on a greater importance in my financial considerations. We're lucky, I've inherited a number of beautiful things from my family, they've stood the test of time for 2 and 3 generations and whether they continue on to my sons for a 4th or to someone else if they have no interest, they will last and serve someone else. For me it's not about being able to afford something it's about choices, as I was saying above. But if you are making a choice to accept something other than what you really want and can afford and have buyer's remorse down the road, that's a different case. If I find a costly, quality piece of furniture that I want, I will make it happen. However that scenario isn't likely because I probably would not be seeking it out. What I want and what I need are very different. I don't begrudge anyone purchasing something that I would choose not or could not. The definitions of costly, quality, and value are very subjective and those definitions for each person are informed by any number of factors - finances of course, but also past experiences, ingrained beliefs ..... we all make our choices.

  • Boopadaboo
    9 years ago

    I wonder if this is really baker? and how hard it would be to repair the nick.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Baker dr table and chairs

  • Boopadaboo
    9 years ago

    I really like this one and did not get to talk to DH about it. I think it could work in my kitchen area and is more casual. I wonder what it goes for new....

    I love that the seats are done in leather.

    Here is a link that might be useful: baker set

  • palimpsest
    9 years ago

    As inexpensive as the first one is, it's only a good deal if you are willing to spend another couple thousand getting it refinished and the veneers repaired. Stylistically, I guess it's kind of Regency, but it seems a little stiff and commercial looking to me.

    The second one looks like Milling Road division of Baker which is more casual and maybe slightly less expensive. I like the second set a lot.

  • Boopadaboo
    9 years ago

    Me too Pal - I just sent them a question about the second one.

    It says best offer and I think has been on ebay for awhile, so once I get the answer I might make an offer. DH wants to buy a set he saw at raymor flannigan and It doesn't look that well made to me and I don't like the color ( a fake cherry color top and off white painted chairs and legs) of it so I have to get something in before he starts in on it again :)

    I was wondering about milling road. I have been searching for prices but I haven't found any yet except a few other things for sale on Ebay.

  • Gooster
    9 years ago

    @boopadoo: The second set is great. If you go to the site I linked to above, you can get an idea of pricing. I don't know if the full prices they show are MSRP, but if they are you can subtract roughly 25% and perhaps get the new, retail price. Or you can use the sample price as a gauge.

    @dim2000: I agree completely. I think I need to resume my pattern of "not looking", though. I did just receive delivery on a brand new chair (mid range) -- very pleased with the result though I still hear complaints in the house about the price (sigh).

    Here is a link that might be useful: Baker Milling Road

  • arcy_gw
    9 years ago

    To get back to the question about the chairs--used upholstered furniture is not that different than a used mattress--which no one would buy. IMHO I guess if you are purchasing them for the "frame"--but sorry I am not seeing that level of value.

  • Boopadaboo
    9 years ago

    Thanks gooster. Very helpful. I missed the ending of the auction, but I do think it has been listed a few times so I will keep my eye out. Seems like a pretty good deal.

    I agree, I would not buy a mattress, but I did just buy a used sectional arcy, and some people do buy used mattresses, so I guess it depends!

  • coll_123
    9 years ago

    Yeah, I don't see used upholstered furniture as quite the same as a mattress...which people have sex on and sometimes pee on, sorry to be crude. Not saying they coulndt have done that on a chair, but still! I have bought used upholstered pieces but I have always reupholstered them and replaced the seat cushions.

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