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elle3_gw

All gel stainers--foam brush, rag, or reg brush?

elle3
11 years ago

After admiring the beautiful gel stain projects on GW (for years!), I finally ordered General Finishes in Java. I was wondering what the consensus was as far as the tool you used to apply the stain. I would say I'm least comfortable with using a rag, because I'm not that good, LOL. But I will defer to the experts.

I am trying to breathe life into my 28 year old bedroom set!

I need all the tips I can get:)

Thanks!

Comments (19)

  • sloyder
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    How are you using the gel stain? If like a paint use a brush, if you are using it like a stain use a rag, and buff on.

  • celticmoon
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I did my (large) kitchen years ago and used old cotton athletic socks. Plastic glove, then the sock over it like a mitten. Scoop out a gob and wipe on. Repeat.

    I wrote the following detailed 'how to' for the Kitchen Forum. Ignore the kitchen specific content. The rest may help.

    SHOPPING LIST:
    -electric screwdriver or screw drill bits
    -mineral spirits to clean the years of gunk off the cabinet
    -miracle cloths (optional)
    -fine sandpaper
    -box-o-disposable gloves from Walgreen�s or the like
    -old socks or rags for wiping on coats
    -disposable small plastic bowls or plates, and plastic spoons or forks for stirring/dipping (optional)
    -General Finishes water base Espresso stain (pretty thick, but not quite a gel) NOTE: This one may not even be a needed step if the Java gets it dark enough.
    -General Finishes Java gel stain (poly based)
    -General Finishes clear top coat (poly based)
    -old sheets or plastic sheeting or newspaper

    Rockler woodworking stores are a good place to find the General Finish products. Or some larger hardware stores. Quart of each was more than enough for my 60 doors and drawer fronts and goes for $12-14 at Rockler. There are smaller sizes if your project is small.

    SETUP AND PLANNING:
    You will need a place to work and leave wet doors to dry overnight - I set up 2 spaces: garage for sanding/cleaning and basement for staining/sealing. Use newspaper or plastic to protect the surface and floor. Figure out how you will prop doors to dry. Plan blocks of 20-30-minutes for sanding/cleaning bundles of, say, 6 doors at a time. Then just 10-minute sessions to wipe on coats. The coats will need to dry for about 24 hours, so figure that each section of the kitchen will be doorless for 4 or 5 days. Divide the job up into manageable chunks.

    PREPARATION:
    Take off doors and drawer fronts. Try using screw drill bits on an electric drill if you don't have an electric screwdriver. Remove all the hardware. *Mark alike things so you know what goes back where.* Clean the doors thoroughly. Not with TSP but with something pretty strong and scrub well. There's years of grease there.
    Sand LIGHTLY, just a scuffing really. Just enough to break the finish and give it some tooth, no more than a minute a door. A miracle cloth is good for getting most of the dust off. Then wipe well with mineral spirits to clean and get the last of the gunk off.

    STAINING:
    In order, we're gonna put on:
    -General Finishes Espresso water based stain (1 coat) - optional
    -General Finishes Java gel stain (couple coats)
    -General Finishes Clear urethane gel topcoat in satin (couple coats)

    But first put on work clothes, tie up your hair and pop your phone into a baggie nearby (you know it will ring). Glove up.
    ***First do a trial on the back of a door and check if Java coats alone suffice. If the Java alone is to your liking, just skip the Espresso and return it.

    Open and stir up the Espresso stain, then spoon some into a plastic bowl. Close the tin so it doesn't get contaminated. Slide a sock over your hand, grab a gob of Espresso and smear it on. Wipe off the excess. Let it dry well - overnight is good. It will lighten as it dries, but then darken again with any other coat or sealer. A second coat might result in a deeper tone at the end - though it seemed like the second coat was just dissolving the first. YMMV.

    Repeat with Java gel. This is thicker and poly based (*not water cleanup!*= messier). Color is a rich dark reddish brown. Wait for the second coat to judge if the color is deep enough for you. I wanted a very deep dark color, like melted dark chocolate. So I went pretty heavy on these layers. I did not sand between coats.
    Repeat with clear gel topcoat. This will give you the strength you need in a kitchen.

    Do the same process with the cabinet sides, face and toe kick area. Might need to divide that up also, and stagger the work: doors/cabinets/doors/etc.

    NOTE: The cloth or socks used for the gels are very flammable! Collect and store them in a bucket of water as you go and then dispose of them all properly.

    FINISHING AND REASSEMBLY:
    I suggest you put the doors back up after one clear coat, then you can check everything over and darken an area with more Java if needed, followed by a clear coat. When it all looks right, go over it all again with another clear gel coat. Or two. (See my follow up notes below). Install your hardware.
    The feel of the finish should be wonderful, really smooth and satiny. Color deep and rich - way nicer than that faded, beat 80's oak color.

    FINAL THOUGHTS:
    Definitely experiment first with the back of a door or drawer front to be sure it is the look you want. Yes, this takes a couple days to coat, dry, recoat, dry, etc but you may discover that the Java alone does the trick and this will save you a LOT of work. Front-end patience is worth it.

    This is a pretty easy project to do. Hard to screw it up. The worst is the prep - relative to that, smearing on the coats is cake. I had over 60 pieces (big kitchen) AND island sides and book shelves, etc and I admit I lost steam partway through. Had to push myself through the last of it. But it was worth it. Folks think I got all new cabinets - it looks that good.

    Now the finish will not be as durable as factory finish - go at it with a Brillo pad and you WILL abrade it. But it has held up pretty well. And after a year of pretty heavy use, I had just a few nicks, easily repaired.
    (6/08 Add: I'm now (18 months later) seeing some wear near the pulls on the most used cabinets. Will add color with Java if it bugs me.)
    (9/09 Add: Never did bother to touch up those couple spots. Bugging me a bit more, and I will get to it soon. It is the drinking glass cabinet and the snack cabinet, LOL. And the garbage pull-out. The rest still looks perfect. Lesson: Use an extra coat or 2 of gel on the way frequently used cabinets.)
    (12/09 Add: I did finally touch up the spots that were worn. Used just Java to get the color right, then a bunch of top coats. Looks perfect again.)
    (7/2010 Add: Still looking great)
    (12/2010 Add: Replicated the staining process with LR entertainment wall cabinetry, some recycled and some new build, to house new flat screen (different shape than 15 yr old TV)... again very happy with the clean contemporary look vs old early 80s look. Guess bathrooms are next...)
    (7/2012 All still good. Some wear again on two spots: snack cabinet and cup/glass cabinet near the pulls. Will touch up when I get to it.)

    I added smashing hardware, raised my pass-through, resurfaced the Corian (also simple but messy and tedious) and replaced the DW and sink. It looks gorgeous to me and I really enjoy the space - how it sits all quiet, clean and serene, then gets all crazy with the food and folks du jour. I couldn't be happier, especially that I didn't have to work another year just to pay for the update!!

    Link to cabinets in progress: http://photobucket.com/albums/b45/celticm00n/kitchen%20cosmetic%20update%20project/kitchen%20during/

    Link to almost finished cabinet pix: http://s16.photobucket.com/albums/b45/celticm00n/kitchen%20cosmetic%20update%20project/finished%20bit%20by%20bit/?start=20

    Good luck! It was totally worth it for me.

  • elle3
    Original Author
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thank you all for your suggestions! Excellent diy instructions, Celtic! I remember references to this post over the years...this time I saved them and printed them out.
    I hadn't thought about using socks, LOL.
    I will test the sock method and the foam brush method on the sides of the nightstands that face the bed. I want a smooth finish--or as smooth as the oak grain will allow.
    I already cleaned using TSP and it did seem to clean and degloss the wood somewhat. I have used liquid sandpaper before on another project (painted furniture) with good luck, so I will finish the deglossing with that product.
    Can't wait for the gel stain to arrive.
    I will post before/after pics when I finish :)
    Thanks again!

  • beekeeperswife
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    this might sound crazy but for me, it depends on the item I'm using the gel stain on. Sometimes the sock worked. Sometimes a foam brush worked. I'm not sure about the whys, but it must have something to do with the surface. My dresser was all foam brush. The dining table base I just recently did was a sock only project. The foam brush did not get the stain on it.

    Just remember to be flexible with your options.

    good luck and have fun. Don't forget to allow a long time to dry between coats. A long time. very long. longer the better.

  • User
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I agree with beekeeperswife, it depends on the project. For big surfaces, I found that a brush worked best. It tended to get a little blotchy on big areas, so I dipped the brush in a little thinner and worked it until it was completely smooth. For the raised panel doors, I used a rag. I seemed to have more control. I stained something years ago and it was recommended to use panty hose. It worked really well and didn't have any lint.

  • shredbetty
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Go with what you are comfortable with. I prefer a foam brush. I "paint" on the gel stain over a base coat of paint in a thin layer and manipulate it while it's wet. I don't wipe off the stain like others do, as my whole goal is to "hide" how strong the oak grain is, not accentuate it. The gel stain over paint gives a depth to the cabinet that a painted cabinet lacks.

    {{gwi:1729951}}

    {{gwi:1497999}}

  • likewhatyoudo
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    shredbetty - Nice job in that bathroom. I also paint first and then apply the gel stain with a sock and for tricky areas a foam brush and do not wipe it off.

    It always amazes me what a difference color and hardware can make in a bathroom to update.

  • patty_cakes
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    No matter what you use to put on the gel, make sure to watch for drips and brush/wipe before they dry. Also lessen the amount of gel you're putting on to avoid them. More coats, using a lighter hand, seems to give the best overall finish. ;o)

  • ratherbesewing
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    shredbetty and rtwilliams: When you stated that you "paint first",do you mean with regular latex paint? If so, what color? What is the benefit of that method vs a few coats of gel stain?

  • fillagirl
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    shred and rtwilliams....do you just use a regular latex paint first or a primer? And do you use a brown paint or whatever paint you have at home? And applying gel stain with a sock, do you apply and wipe off?

  • shredbetty
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    ratherbesewing and fillagirl - I just use a latex paint in eggshell just because it is handy. When I use GF java gel, I use a brown paint about the color of a brown paper bag. I have used a tan paint with other gel stains that aren't as dark. It all depends on what the goal of the gel stain is. I apply with a foam brush and manipulate that layer while it is wet - if you do it right, the gel stain will be a little translucent until you get about 3 coats on. I don't usually wipe off when I am covering oak but I do wipe off when I am applying to a fibercore interior door or mdf; I never paint first when I am staining unfinished wood. And I do not use a sock, I prefer a staining pad for its strength and size. The benefit of the paint for me is to hide the strong and often open grain pattern of oak.

    You cannot go wrong if you practice on different types of wood and you will quickly find what applicator suits your speed and dexterity.

  • likewhatyoudo
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I stained 4 oak vanities in my previous home. I used cheap wal-mart brand brown spray paint - lightly sprayed not thick at all and let it dry at least 24 hours. I used a foam brush on the cabinets. I don't wipe it off.

    I didn't paint when using gel stain on unfinished wood on the staircase handrail and balusters in my garage it was raw wood and I used the sock method.

    I also finished a pine coffee table and used the sock to apply - no paint. It really is trial and error. Nice thing to know is that if you make a mistake with the gel stain - mineral spirits cleans it right up easily if you haven't let it dry for too long.

    I did attempt to gel stain my kitchen cabinets in the previous house. I tried to take a shortcut and not paint the oak first and it looked horrible and was simply more than I wanted to take on so I removed the stain on the doors i had worked on with mineral spirits and left good enough alone. I was only trying to update to sell the house. If I had planned on staying I probably would have painted the cabinets white.

  • jesse50
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    First post for me, I want to thank Celtic for the instructions. I used it as a guide when I stained my golden oak kitchen cabinets to java 2 weeks ago. I will be adding hardware and under cabinet lighting as well as a glass tile backsplash this weekend and will upload some before and after pics somewhere.
    I started with the sock method on the first coat. I ended up with a $7 brush and found for me, the brush got in the corners of the doors raised frame and was just much faster to work with. I stayed with the sock on the cabinet faces themselves.

  • lynninnewmexico
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    May I butt in and ask a quick question? Both of your cabs, Celticmoon and Shredbetty looked fantastic when you finished them. Truly beautiful and very professional. My question for all of you who've gel stained a cabinet in an area, like a bathroom or kitchen, is how well does this finish hold up after a few months? I'd love refinish the built-in buffet in my dining room and my bathroom cabs, but I worry that that I may end up with them chipping with daily use.
    Sorry, Elle, I hope you don't mind me hopping in here.
    Lynn

  • shredbetty
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I used 3 coats satin polyurethane in my laundry and the bath that is pictured. The bath is not even a month old, but if it lasts like the laundry room, I'm going on 2 years of finish without a problem. I use spray lacquer in a can when I want a more professional finish (i.e. kitchen cabinets, stair railings, banister, etc.).

  • lynninnewmexico
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks Betty!

  • nosoccermom
    11 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Has anyone ever tried gel stain on the fake "wood" kind of plastic-like sides of builder-grade oak cabinets. It's almost like a laminate (is it) or is it thermofoil?

  • krobic
    3 years ago

    How do I get brush marks out of my gel stain ? Can u sand gel stain between coats?